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Ranking GMs Post Serge Savard


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3 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Lemieux was on the outs with Burns, if memory serves. I forget who we got back - it was a classic case of trading a guy at his lowest value, and he was a terrible guy to trade - but if your coach really despises a guy, it's tough to keep him around.

 

The LeClair trade was a product of desperation to make the playoffs, a casualty of the now-obsolete idea - which was a sacred cow at the time - that the Montreal Canadiens don't rebuild, they contend every year. They got back a legit all-star in Recchi and gave up promising young players to get him. Unfortunately, LeClair, who had been frustratingly inconsistent in Montreal, landed in the best possible situation playing with Lindros. I still think it's questionable whether he would have become the scoring machine he became without that beast of a centreman. Nevertheless, it was a historically bad trade. Perhaps the worst part about it was the inclusion of Desjardins. Unlike LeClair, who kept teasing but not "putting it all together," Desjardins was very clearly evolving into a stud top-pairing d-man. Savard wanted the Flyers to take back Brisebois instead, but Bobby Clobbers held out and got his way. Tragically for the Habs.

 

Good that you mention Damphousse, Bellows, Courtnall, and - especially - Muller. As bad as those other deals were, Savard turned that basket case Richer into a stud #1C in Muller. Savard constructed a bona-fide #1 line in two seasons entirely via trades, shedding only 2nd-liner Corson and grinder Glichrist, neurotic Richer, and a guy who wanted out in Courtnall. That was pretty nifty.

 

It seems amazing in retrospect that we managed to win a Cup even after trading away a #1 defenceman like Chelios in return for a rapidly-declining Savard. That shows what a deep team we had, and also what Patrick Roy could do when he was in the zone.

Sylvie Turgeon for Lemieux. Horrible trade. Burns told Lemieux he was a cancer. Lemieux replied he is a cancer (Astro sign). Frankly, I would have preferred to dump Burns over Lemieux. Courtnall was the other guy Butns wanted to dump. At least the return for him was better, even though Courtnall had a much longer career. 
 

Richer-Muller was a steal.

muller for Turgeon was a steal and thanks to Mario he was dumped by Houle. 
Damphousse for Corson was a steal. Another guy that Houle gave away.

 

Savard was never able to draft a superstar centre (Koivu might have become that guy if he didn’t blow out his knee), but it was mind boggling how many stud D men were drafted and/or developed under his watch and how many solid NHL’ers were developed. When you compare Savard’s drafting and development alone, he makes Bergevin look like dog shit.

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8 hours ago, BCHabnut said:

I think a rank with a letter grade might be more accurate. None were good. A couple were adequate.

 

1. Gainey. C+ Drafted the only hall of famer the team has seen in 3 decades. 

2. MB. C. Good at trades. Bad at managing. 

3. Savard. C-

4. Goat D.

5 Houle F. Seems like a nice guy. Just incompetent. Trade the Mario or arguably Gretzky of goaltenders. Complete idiocy. I still have ptsd from that night. Remember exactly what I was doing. It's a traumatic core memory. Haha.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

PTSD is right. 
 

I was in between classes at Concordia. 
 

Had a habit of hanging out at Publimag or whatever that magazine shop was called that was on the corner of deMaisonneuve and Guy. 
 

They announced the breaking news on the radio. 
 

I remember trying to justify the value and potential of Jocelyn. 
 

Talk about a core memory. 

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2 hours ago, Helmethead said:

PTSD is right. 
 

I was in between classes at Concordia. 
 

Had a habit of hanging out at Publimag or whatever that magazine shop was called that was on the corner of deMaisonneuve and Guy. 
 

They announced the breaking news on the radio. 
 

I remember trying to justify the value and potential of Jocelyn. 
 

Talk about a core memory. 

 

Ha ha, yeah, I remember telling myself, “well, Roy is in his 30s, Thibault is highly-regarded, Ruscinsky and Kovalenko are promising young players…”

 

A pathetic attempt at hoping our new “brain trust” (both words need scare quotes) knew what they were doing.

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  • 2 weeks later...
38 minutes ago, Prime Minister Koivu said:

Bergevin working 1980 style - shame it was 2020!

 

 

FD970F35-863E-4D23-B4FE-607170D9E761.jpeg

Not sure why that would be a surprise from a GM who hired a baboon like MT (with apologies to baboons everywhere) to coach the habs, and Lefebve to Fxck up the AHL team.

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4 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Not sure why that would be a surprise from a GM who hired a baboon like MT (with apologies to baboons everywhere) to coach the habs, and Lefebve to Fxck up the AHL team.

 

I still find it upsetting info. I knew he was a dinosaur, but come ON. 

 

MB was all about surrounding himself with cronies - foxhole buddies. That was the sum total of his organizational vision. It’s a great mindset to have if you’re a blood-and-guts grinder of a hockey player (as he was). It’s an absolutely abysmal mindset to have as GM.

 

Incredible that guys like Subban and Gally managed to excel despite organizational negligence. But no wonder player development was a disaster (Galy, KK). 

 

 

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11 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

I still find it upsetting info. I knew he was a dinosaur, but come ON. 

 

MB was all about surrounding himself with cronies - foxhole buddies. That was the sum total of his organizational vision. It’s a great mindset to have if you’re a blood-and-guts grinder of a hockey player (as he was). It’s an absolutely abysmal mindset to have as GM.

 

Incredible that guys like Subban and Gally managed to excel despite organizational negligence. But no wonder player development was a disaster (Galy, KK). 

 

 

11 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Both Subban and Gallagher spent time in the minors prior to making the jump. Both were also extremely driven players. Subban start d his development before MB took over - I can’t remember if Gallagher was in the minors prior to MB joining the habs or not.

 

not all players are ready at 18. Galchenyuk missed way too much time in the juniors to have been rushed in. I absolutely hated that move. He had short term success, but was a flop in the end (much like Yakapov). KK had size when he got drafted, but did not have the strength to be an NHL player. He was still falling down like Bambi learning to walk during his first two years. He did not belong in the NHL.

 

The only thing I’m critical of HuGO is keeping Slavkovsky in the NHL more than 9 games - and they definitely should have sent him to the WJH tournament. hopefully it’s not going to bite us in the ass, and hopefully they made the right move!

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21 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

 

Both Subban and Gallagher spent time in the minors prior to making the jump. Both were also extremely driven players. Subban start d his development before MB took over - I can’t remember if Gallagher was in the minors prior to MB joining the habs or not.

 

not all players are ready at 18. Galchenyuk missed way too much time in the juniors to have been rushed in. I absolutely hated that move. He had short term success, but was a flop in the end (much like Yakapov). KK had size when he got drafted, but did not have the strength to be an NHL player. He was still falling down like Bambi learning to walk during his first two years. He did not belong in the NHL.

 

The only thing I’m critical of HuGO is keeping Slavkovsky in the NHL more than 9 games - and they definitely should have sent him to the WJH tournament. hopefully it’s not going to bite us in the ass, and hopefully they made the right move!

 

I’ve been critical of the Slafkovsky decision from Day One. But would love to be proven wrong on that. The early returns suggest I/we were not wrong.

 

Not only did MB bring KK and Galy up way too soon, but he did not supply them with the kind of support system (e.g., skills coaches, FFS) that might have helped them learn the game properly. Appalling. 

 

Subban thrived *despite* both this standard organizational negligence and the active hostility of coaches and management. That just shows what an impressive and strong-willed young man he was. #character. 

 

The Habs seem to have been behind, organizationally speaking, for a long time. Remember Gainey having Price in the NHL at 20, a kid from Anahim Lake (!) living by himself in a condo in the Old Port? 😮 Contrast that with Pittsburgh, who billeted Crosby with Mario Lemieux - the perfect mentor. Thank God Price pulled through, but it was a near thing. 

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19 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

I’ve been critical of the Slafkovsky decision from Day One. But would love to be proven wrong on that. The early returns suggest I/we were not wrong.

 

Not only did MB bring KK and Galy up way too soon, but he did not supply them with the kind of support system (e.g., skills coaches, FFS) that might have helped them learn the game properly. Appalling.

At least the support system is there now. Whether that will prove to have been enough for Slafkovsky's success is something we'll see in the next year or two.

 

Like you, I think he should have been in the AHL (or even OHL). I am skeptical and concerned, but I do recognize that the Habs' management and skills teams have way more expertise and information than I do.

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6 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

The only thing I’m critical of HuGO is keeping Slavkovsky in the NHL more than 9 games - and they definitely should have sent him to the WJH tournament. 

I dont know enough to be critical of keeping the kid up or not, i would tend to agree though.

 

World juniors is insignificant and not important in long run to loose any sleep over skipping both the 2022 & 2023 ones. Might of been fun to see how he stacks up vs peers, but just a fan thing.

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