Butterface Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 11 minutes ago, tomh009 said: It's a good point: much depends on how much Evans wants to get. His career earnings are relatively low at about $6M so he may want more/longer than the Habs are willing to pay--although 3x$2.67M would already more than double his career earnings. Armia, on the other hand, has already earned $20M so maybe he would be willing to sign a team-friendly deal with the Habs. He doesn't seem to have an extravagant lifestyle ... Three years is a bit scary. More comfortable with two. But if he stays at the level he is at, we could still trade him after a year or two. I think Beck, Kapanen and Hage have better ceilings than Evans…… and Kapanen and Beck are pretty much there now (or soon)… I think management is doing amazing… I don’t want to come out of the rebuild to early though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 Saying Anderson should become the team's fighter is some of the dumbest shit I've ever read. And that's in a post saying we need to get rid of all the vets on the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 18 minutes ago, Butterface said: Three years is a bit scary. More comfortable with two. But if he stays at the level he is at, we could still trade him after a year or two. I think Beck, Kapanen and Hage have better ceilings than Evans…… and Kapanen and Beck are pretty much there now (or soon)… I think management is doing amazing… I don’t want to come out of the rebuild to early though. I agree that Kapanen, Beck and Hage have higher offensive ceilings than Evans perhaps too high for a 4th line center so there may be room for Evans to continue as a 4th line center. It depends on the cost/term. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 It's interesting when you talk about veterans. A guy like Suzuki is in his 6th NHL season. If he is not a veteran then he is on the verge. Where did the time go? LOL It seems like yesterday when he and Caulfield combined for the OT winner against the Leafs. That was a wonderful night. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 58 minutes ago, Butterface said: We only started drafting low a few years back. Some of our better picks are a year or two away from being on the team. Three years of top-five picks. But from the three years preceding that, we do have Caufield, Dach, Newhook, Guhle and Mailloux, almost all of them top-16 picks, even if the Habs didn't pick high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 34 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said: I agree that Kapanen, Beck and Hage have higher offensive ceilings than Evans perhaps too high for a 4th line center so there may be room for Evans to continue as a 4th line center. It depends on the cost/term. Right. Evans contributes more than just offence. And we talk about ceilings for Kapanen, Beck and Hage, but Evans is a known quantity already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 1 hour ago, Butterface said: The Sheriff can’t do this alone. Unless 'The Sheriff' starts consistently defending better, he will soon be battling AHL goons for a living. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 8 minutes ago, tomh009 said: Right. Evans contributes more than just offence. And we talk about ceilings for Kapanen, Beck and Hage, but Evans is a known quantity already. Evans has 29 goals in 277 games, at that rate he has to contribute more than offence which he does. Let's not get too excited about his offence because he has scored in back to back games which is great to see. I don't think it's going out on the limb to suggest the guys mentioned will likely contribute more than Evans offensively but would they be happy in a 4th line role which Evans seems to enjoy. I think there is still room for Evans in a 4th line role if the cost is not too prohibitive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCHabnut Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 1 hour ago, Butterface said: I agree you need vets, but good ones. We only started drafting low a few years back. Some of our better picks are a year or two away So you get rid of all those stable defensive players who are playing in bottom 6 and bottom pair roles to make room for who? Beck is on his first year in the AHL. Savard is the only good defensive right handed defenseman on the entire team or in the system. All the rest are what ifs. If all the vets leave, how qualified are the core vets, Suzuki, caufield... at insulating mistakes of all of these rookies. Montreal biggest issue in the last 2 seasons is defensively. It's not the right time to get rid of all of the good defensive players on the team in hopes that rookies on etc can fill the gap. Asset management be damned. The team has assets. Time to start winning. Balance the team with players suited to their station. Find an RD. Pay players according to where they fit in the lineup. That's my idea of asset management going forward. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 25 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said: Evans has 29 goals in 277 games, at that rate he has to contribute more than offence which he does. Let's not get too excited about his offence because he has scored in back to back games which is great to see. I don't think it's going out on the limb to suggest the guys mentioned will likely contribute more than Evans offensively but would they be happy in a 4th line role which Evans seems to enjoy. I think there is still room for Evans in a 4th line role if the cost is not too prohibitive. Would the extra offence be offset by losing his contribution to the PK and 5v5 defense though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCHabnut Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 8 minutes ago, Commandant said: Would the extra offence be offset by losing his contribution to the PK and 5v5 defense though? Exactly. The goal of playing hockey is to win. There are 2 elements to do that. Fighting is not one of them. Score goals and stop goals from being scored on you. Fortunately the stopping goal part is much cheaper usually. Unless you get a Datsyuk Kopitar Bergeron Barkov unicorn. Players that excel defensively and are paid accordingly, are not a problem on this team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 17 minutes ago, Commandant said: Would the extra offence be offset by losing his contribution to the PK and 5v5 defense though? I am not saying it would. Like I said in the last line of my post, there is room for Evans on the 4th line if the cost is not too prohibitive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted October 28 Share Posted October 28 41 minutes ago, BCHabnut said: So you get rid of all those stable defensive players who are playing in bottom 6 and bottom pair roles to make room for who? Beck is on his first year in the AHL. Savard is the only good defensive right handed defenseman on the entire team or in the system. All the rest are what ifs. If all the vets leave, how qualified are the core vets, Suzuki, caufield... at insulating mistakes of all of these rookies. Montreal biggest issue in the last 2 seasons is defensively. It's not the right time to get rid of all of the good defensive players on the team in hopes that rookies on etc can fill the gap. Asset management be damned. The team has assets. Time to start winning. Balance the team with players suited to their station. Find an RD. Pay players according to where they fit in the lineup. That's my idea of asset management going forward. I don't think anyone here (including Butterface) doesn't think we need some good veteran players. At some point a guy like Savard will be taking up space, players age out, it happens. We need some good veterans that can still play while hoping the younger players mature and step up. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted October 29 Share Posted October 29 1 hour ago, BCHabnut said: So you get rid of all those stable defensive players who are playing in bottom 6 and bottom pair roles to make room for who? Beck is on his first year in the AHL. Savard is the only good defensive right handed defenseman on the entire team or in the system. All the rest are what ifs. If all the vets leave, how qualified are the core vets, Suzuki, caufield... at insulating mistakes of all of these rookies. Montreal biggest issue in the last 2 seasons is defensively. It's not the right time to get rid of all of the good defensive players on the team in hopes that rookies on etc can fill the gap. Asset management be damned. The team has assets. Time to start winning. Balance the team with players suited to their station. Find an RD. Pay players according to where they fit in the lineup. That's my idea of asset management going forward. Agree with you with vets like Evans. Disagree on Savard. He is a UFA and unless he is willing to sign for a significant home town discount we have to move him. Dvorak, I will be happy to get rid of, and Armia I would want back unless it was for less than. 50% of his salary. We need more defensively responsible veterans - ideally ones who bring some speed. But the only one from our current lineup I'd want to keep is Evans - we are stuck with the Anderson and Gallagher cap hits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted October 29 Author Share Posted October 29 47 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said: Agree with you with vets like Evans. Disagree on Savard. He is a UFA and unless he is willing to sign for a significant home town discount we have to move him. Dvorak, I will be happy to get rid of, and Armia I would want back unless it was for less than. 50% of his salary. We need more defensively responsible veterans - ideally ones who bring some speed. But the only one from our current lineup I'd want to keep is Evans - we are stuck with the Anderson and Gallagher cap hits. Savard is perhaps the only pending UFA that I could see possibly returning if traded at the deadline ... but I agree that it would have to be for a significant home town discount ... 3rd pairing money I-M-O, for 2 years max ... OR ... maybe 4 years at a buriable AAV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted October 29 Share Posted October 29 49 minutes ago, GHT120 said: Savard is perhaps the only pending UFA that I could see possibly returning if traded at the deadline ... but I agree that it would have to be for a significant home town discount ... 3rd pairing money I-M-O, for 2 years max ... OR ... maybe 4 years at a buriable AAV. I think there might be mutual interest between Hughes and Savard. If it happens then I agree with you that two years max. I do think Savard will be traded at the deadline Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCHabnut Posted October 29 Share Posted October 29 1 hour ago, Prime Minister Koivu said: I think there might be mutual interest between Hughes and Savard. If it happens then I agree with you that two years max. I do think Savard will be traded at the deadline I think he will as well. I'm just not sure it's a good idea unless Hughes can find an upgrade or the return is an overpay. There is nobody to fill his role at the moment. Right defense is the next challenge for Hughes for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted October 29 Share Posted October 29 9 hours ago, BCHabnut said: Right defense is the next challenge for Hughes for sure. How big a challenge that will be is greatly dependent on how Reinbacher and Mailloux (and, to a lesser extent, Barron) turn out. In the best case we have our three RD but that's not the most likely scenario. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butterface Posted October 29 Share Posted October 29 I suspect we will try to get a RHD at draft. Either trade up or down for him. Potentially we already have our core players going forward. Demidov, Hage, Slafkovsky, Caufield, Hutson, Guhle, Fowler, maybe Reinbacher. Then the rest are here for as long as we can keep them (cap issues) … Suzuki, Mailloux, Newhook, Dach Then the guys who we hopefully get on cheaper deals…Beck, Kapanen, Barron, Roy, Heineman, Struble, Xhekaj ? We will lose some of the above guys and sign veteran UFAs…. Try to keep some of our low draft picks and not trade them away because you always need good players on ELCs or RFA bridge contracts to keep your Cap low. There is a lot of time that will pass before we get the Cap balance right. Money on Forward core and Defensive core needs to be balanced. Top heavy teams have failed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted October 29 Share Posted October 29 25 minutes ago, Butterface said: I suspect we will try to get a RHD at draft. Either trade up or down for him. Potentially we already have our core players going forward. Demidov, Hage, Slafkovsky, Caufield, Hutson, Guhle, Fowler, maybe Reinbacher. Then the rest are here for as long as we can keep them (cap issues) … Suzuki, Mailloux, Newhook, Dach Then the guys who we hopefully get on cheaper deals…Beck, Kapanen, Barron, Roy, Heineman, Struble, Xhekaj ? We will lose some of the above guys and sign veteran UFAs…. Try to keep some of our low draft picks and not trade them away because you always need good players on ELCs or RFA bridge contracts to keep your Cap low. There is a lot of time that will pass before we get the Cap balance right. Money on Forward core and Defensive core needs to be balanced. Top heavy teams have failed. Suzuki is part of the core and I don’t see that changing anytime soon. Someone gotta play centre and besides, Suzuki is really good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butterface Posted October 29 Share Posted October 29 19 minutes ago, Prime Minister Koivu said: Suzuki is part of the core and I don’t see that changing anytime soon. Someone gotta play centre and besides, Suzuki is really good Yes… for as long as we can pay him. Ideally he is a number 2 center. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted October 29 Share Posted October 29 14 minutes ago, Butterface said: Yes… for as long as we can pay him. Ideally he is a number 2 center. Suzuki signed a long term very reasonable contract. Sure he is not McDavid but he is pretty darn good. If you had a couple Suzuki's as your #1 and #2 centers then you would be in great shape. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted October 29 Share Posted October 29 33 minutes ago, Butterface said: Ideally he is a number 2 center. Ideally we get McDavid, MacKinnon and Draisatl all signing up with the Habs on team-friendly UFA contracts. In the real world, though, Suzuki is a very good 1C, and will not be a roadblock for us being able to contend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted October 29 Share Posted October 29 Here we go again…”Suzuki is not a true #1” 🙄 The comparable for him is not Connor McDavid but rather Patrice Bergeron. He has a higher offensive ceiling, and a slightly less prodigious defensive acumen, but he’s in that ballpark. 18 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said: It's interesting when you talk about veterans. A guy like Suzuki is in his 6th NHL season. If he is not a veteran then he is on the verge. Where did the time go? LOL It seems like yesterday when he and Caulfield combined for the OT winner against the Leafs. That was a wonderful night. I often refer to the need to contend within Suzuki’s window. And (to mix metaphors) I do worry that we might run out of runway. He is about to entire his prime years (26-30, for the sake of argument). We’re nowhere near contending. And you need to allow a few seasons for the process of “learning how to win” even if your team is strong. This is less a criticism than an observation that you can’t keep Waiting for Godot. If we don’t make a jump - ideally next season - we could be left finding ourselves surprised at how it all slipped away. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butterface Posted October 29 Share Posted October 29 I think Suzuki is great. Just because I didn’t put him on my Tier 1 core doesn’t mean I don’t think he is a great player. I would like to carry the 4 guys on my second row as long as it makes sense… Suzuki being the most valuable of those. In a cap world we likely won’t be able to keep all the players on my core. Certainly if Suzuki keeps his contract wishes reasonable, we could lose a core player and retain Suzuki because we are able to stay under the cap that way. If you guys think that once salary demands of Demidov, Hutson, Fowler, Hage, Reinbacher come out of their respective ELCs and we still have contracts paying Caufield, Slafkovsky, Guhle, Montembeault, Mailloux, Dach and Newhook and Sukuki….(considering some of these contracts will be set to renew inbetween) and you think we can afford all these guys…. I got news for you. WE CAN’T. Start picking a core we can afford in 5 years. Don’t get all teary over a player. The cap is not your friend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.