Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 5 minutes ago, DON said: Roy being cut. Was it more for him to get more experience on PP with lots of icetime and not so much a demotion for piss-poor pre-season? I think it's pretty simple, he just didn't earn it but he just turned 21 in August so he has lots of time left. Marinating in the AHL a little longer won't hurt him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 36 minutes ago, DON said: Roy being cut. Was it more for him to get more experience on PP with lots of icetime and not so much a demotion for piss-poor pre-season? If he had played better than Kapanen the latter would be on a plane to Sweden right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir_Boagalott Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 55 minutes ago, tomh009 said: If he had played better than Kapanen the latter would be on a plane to Sweden right now. I'm not 100% sure on that. I think if even if Roy had played better than Kappy they might have still gone with Kappy. If Kappy is sent back he's gone for the entire year, but with Roy and most of the others they can be called up at any time. Plus, Kappy is also a C so he is more versatile in that sense. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 13 hours ago, dlbalr said: The irrelevance of the location of the hospital in which a player was born in notwithstanding, I'm not sure that it's a good thing the Habs are trying a 5'9 player who has failed several times in a bottom-six role before in a bottom-six role and hoping for a different result. Don't get me wrong, Barre-Boulet absolutely earned a spot but I'm expecting more of the same from him - basically, the same level of performance that had him on waivers several times in recent years. regardless of his past performance in other team, I prefer having a Barre-Boulet than a Condotta in the bottom-6. From my youth living in Montreal, I still believe that it makes a difference for most players with Quebec root. I have posted here how I do not believe HughGort care about that, but IMHO players do. I do not expect much from him, but I am still happy to see him make the cut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 12 hours ago, tomh009 said: If he had played better than Kapanen the latter would be on a plane to Sweden right now. Canadiens Notebook: On Roy, Armia, starting roster and St. Louis' confidence (sportsnet.ca) Roy; “I think that it’s probably a combination of his camp and other players’ camps. At the end of the day, it’s an internal competition,” added St. Louis. “Josh knows how I feel about him, he knows I like him as a player. He’s got a few things that he didn’t really show us in this camp that I would like him to come back and show us.” Armia on 2nd line; “I think it’s the way he’s comported himself,” said St. Louis. “His comportment over the last two months, what he did last year when he came back and what he did in this camp showed he’s a player who deserves this opportunity.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted October 8 Author Share Posted October 8 36 minutes ago, DON said: Canadiens Notebook: On Roy, Armia, starting roster and St. Louis' confidence (sportsnet.ca) Roy; “I think that it’s probably a combination of his camp and other players’ camps. At the end of the day, it’s an internal competition,” added St. Louis. “Josh knows how I feel about him, he knows I like him as a player. He’s got a few things that he didn’t really show us in this camp that I would like him to come back and show us.” Armia on 2nd line; “I think it’s the way he’s comported himself,” said St. Louis. “His comportment over the last two months, what he did last year when he came back and what he did in this camp showed he’s a player who deserves this opportunity.” I'm okay with Armia getting a shot at the second line. A fully engaged Armia is a pretty solid player. Let’s just hope that Armia is fully engaged the whole season. I hope the demotion has the same positive effect on Roy that it had on Armia being demoted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 40 minutes ago, DON said: Canadiens Notebook: On Roy, Armia, starting roster and St. Louis' confidence (sportsnet.ca) Roy; “I think that it’s probably a combination of his camp and other players’ camps. At the end of the day, it’s an internal competition,” added St. Louis. “Josh knows how I feel about him, he knows I like him as a player. He’s got a few things that he didn’t really show us in this camp that I would like him to come back and show us.” Armia on 2nd line; “I think it’s the way he’s comported himself,” said St. Louis. “His comportment over the last two months, what he did last year when he came back and what he did in this camp showed he’s a player who deserves this opportunity.” Sounds to me like Roy simply did not come to camp prepared. I wonder if he fell prey to the classic Alfie Turcotte Disease of revelling in his status as a local Habs hero over the summer and thinking he had it made, rather than putting in the work. 🤷♂️ If so, that’s a little bit worrisome; you can imagine an attitude of entitlement impeding his development such that he fritters away his potential. However the kid is only 21, so there is lots of time to course-correct. Re: Armia, it’s just possible that he’s overcome the mental health and concussion issues that were holding him back and is now ready to give us some damned good minutes, which he always had the potential to do. Let’s hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 3 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said: regardless of his past performance in other team, I prefer having a Barre-Boulet than a Condotta in the bottom-6. From my youth living in Montreal, I still believe that it makes a difference for most players with Quebec root. I have posted here how I do not believe HughGort care about that, but IMHO players do. I think the notion of most players caring about playing at home is largely overstated. It's nice PR fluff but I'd posit that about as many consider it a negative than a positive. (Not just in Montreal, league-wide. Some like the idea of playing close to home, some do their best to avoid it and the extra challenges associated with it.) I don't think Barre-Boulet is going to play any better/try any harder now that he has a Montreal jersey on. He's still going to be the flawed player who doesn't fit the role he has been given. He should more or less be a placeholder until someone better fits that spot which hopefully doesn't take too long. Personally, I prefer the best possible players in the lineup regardless of where they were born. That's what all 32 management teams should be doing and if any of them are eschewing better players in favour of filling arbitrary quotas that don't actually make the team better, they need to be replaced. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 15 minutes ago, dlbalr said: I think the notion of most players caring about playing at home is largely overstated. It's nice PR fluff but I'd posit that about as many consider it a negative than a positive. (Not just in Montreal, league-wide. Some like the idea of playing close to home, some do their best to avoid it and the extra challenges associated with it.) I don't think Barre-Boulet is going to play any better/try any harder now that he has a Montreal jersey on. He's still going to be the flawed player who doesn't fit the role he has been given. He should more or less be a placeholder until someone better fits that spot which hopefully doesn't take too long. Personally, I prefer the best possible players in the lineup regardless of where they were born. That's what all 32 management teams should be doing and if any of them are eschewing better players in favour of filling arbitrary quotas that don't actually make the team better, they need to be replaced. Great post. I agree completely, but the shibboleth that 'local boys' will somehow mutate into better players when they put the CH refuses to die despite busloads of empirical evidence to the contrary. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 I respect opinions different than mine, I just feel that it still matters. No logic, no statistics, just my feeling = $0.02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir_Boagalott Posted October 9 Share Posted October 9 12 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said: egardless of his past performance in other team, I prefer having a Barre-Boulet than a Condotta in the bottom-6. From my youth living in Montreal, I still believe that it makes a difference for most players with Quebec root. I have posted here how I do not believe HughGort care about that, but IMHO players do. I do not expect much from him, but I am still happy to see him make the cut. I agree but I'd say its more so for the fans. i.e. the Quebecois want players that speak their language. They want to see players they can relate to and are like them. I don't hear people banging a drum to stop the only hire French speaking GM's or Coaches rule. Besides, the mere suggestion of having French players doesn't mean the worst French players in the league. ex: nobody is advocating that Deslauriers should be on the team and on the top line and have the C because he's more French than Suzuki. Have any of you ever seen the Habs win a Cup without having French players? No, you have not. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted October 9 Share Posted October 9 9 minutes ago, Sir_Boagalott said: I don't hear people banging a drum to stop the only hire French speaking GM's or Coaches rule. Have any of you ever seen the Habs win a Cup without having French players? No, you have not. Quite a few of us on here have been banging that drum for a long time. I've always been an advocate for get the best player/coach/manager available regardless of languages spoken. And just because it hasn't happened yet doesn't mean it can't. Most of Montreal's Cups came when there were fewer teams and a higher concentration of French-speaking players back in the days when the league was filled predominantly with Canadian players. But the demographics of the league are so much different now and if I was to go back to find a team that won a Cup without a Quebec-born player, I wouldn't have to go very far...just a few months, actually. In theory, that means it could one day happen in Montreal. (I wouldn't put money on it happening but it's not unfathomable to me with fewer Quebec-born players each year and the QMJHL continuing to struggle as a development league.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted October 9 Share Posted October 9 Nobody, but nobody, is saying that if two players are of equal ability, the Habs should not take the French guy. This has always been habs philosophy, even in the glory days. The error is in thinking that being French somehow means you magically become a better player when you put on the CH. It’s also an error to say that French players work harder because they care more. Both are sheer nonsense IMHO. And yes, fans want francophone players. So what? I want a winner, not a PR machine that makes bad personnel decisions ‘for the fans.’ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted October 9 Share Posted October 9 2 hours ago, Sir_Boagalott said: I agree but I'd say its more so for the fans. i.e. the Quebecois want players that speak their language. They want to see players they can relate to and are like them. I don't hear people banging a drum to stop the only hire French speaking GM's or Coaches rule. Besides, the mere suggestion of having French players doesn't mean the worst French players in the league. ex: nobody is advocating that Deslauriers should be on the team and on the top line and have the C because he's more French than Suzuki. Have any of you ever seen the Habs win a Cup without having French players? No, you have not. I've been banging that drum since Tremblay/Houle and then after a string of minor league coaches were hired as well as when we rehired that jackass Therrien and than recycled Julien and than again when they replaced him with DD. I also wanted Nill as GM and apparently the Habs did tech out to him, but I think his wife was dealing with some illness at the time. Who now if he had a legit chance though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir_Boagalott Posted October 9 Share Posted October 9 3 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: Nobody, but nobody, is saying that if two players are of equal ability, the Habs should not take the French guy. This has always been habs philosophy, even in the glory days. The error is in thinking that being French somehow means you magically become a better player when you put on the CH. It’s also an error to say that French players work harder because they care more. Both are sheer nonsense IMHO. And yes, fans want francophone players. So what? I want a winner, not a PR machine that makes bad personnel decisions ‘for the fans.’ Nobody is gifting French players roster spots based solely on their place of birth though. Thats my point. I disagree with the comment that some French players play better in Montreal is sure nonsense though. It is unarguable that there is an effect on some French players performing awesomely in front of their home crowd. ex: Brodeur, MA Fleury, MSL, Lacavalier, etc. There are quite a few French players that do great in Montreal. It is true that it doesn't work for all French players, but the ones it doesn't work for you wouldn't want anyway. Luckily, most of those players don't want to play in Montreal. ex: Huby, Chabot, and any other player that publicly speaks out about not wanting to play for Montreal. i.e. players that don't want to be held accountable for their poor play. Plus, most French players are from Quebec, so they spend their summers in Quebec. If they play like crap they will hear about it from the fans that see them every time they leave their house. Players not from Quebec go home for their summers. I'm not French, but I want them to have French players. Why? It's their history. I can't help but feel that saying French players aren't important is the equivalent of suggesting their 24 Cup wins aren't important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted October 9 Share Posted October 9 Would Matheson & Hutson, with #1 forward line be worth a try if PP sucks again this year? I know 4 forwards is 'all the rage' but cant be worse than has been with 4 forwards. Matheson did better than i thought on a horrible PP. As Canadiens kick off the season, a reminder to resist premature outrage - The Athletic (nytimes.com) "Again, only seven NHL defencemen had more points on the power play last season than Matheson..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted October 9 Share Posted October 9 5 minutes ago, DON said: Would Matheson & Hutson, with #1 forward line be worth a try if PP sucks again this year? I know 4 forwards is 'all the rage' but cant be worse than has been with 4 forwards. Matheson did better than i thought on a horrible PP. As Canadiens kick off the season, a reminder to resist premature outrage - The Athletic (nytimes.com) "Again, only seven NHL defencemen had more points on the power play last season than Matheson..." Couldn't hurt ... could it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted October 9 Share Posted October 9 12 hours ago, Sir_Boagalott said: Nobody is gifting French players roster spots based solely on their place of birth though. Thats my point. I disagree with the comment that some French players play better in Montreal is sure nonsense though. It is unarguable that there is an effect on some French players performing awesomely in front of their home crowd. ex: Brodeur, MA Fleury, MSL, Lacavalier, etc. There are quite a few French players that do great in Montreal. It is true that it doesn't work for all French players, but the ones it doesn't work for you wouldn't want anyway. Luckily, most of those players don't want to play in Montreal. ex: Huby, Chabot, and any other player that publicly speaks out about not wanting to play for Montreal. i.e. players that don't want to be held accountable for their poor play. Plus, most French players are from Quebec, so they spend their summers in Quebec. If they play like crap they will hear about it from the fans that see them every time they leave their house. Players not from Quebec go home for their summers. I'm not French, but I want them to have French players. Why? It's their history. I can't help but feel that saying French players aren't important is the equivalent of suggesting their 24 Cup wins aren't important. I want them to have French stars too. But that's different from saying that there is some magical pixie dust that makes French players better when they play here. Yes, maybe some local kids can raise their games against the Habs for a handful of games per season. The idea that they would do that for 82 games in a Habs jersey is much harder to support. A player is, fundamentally, what he is. Of course, a player can find himself in better and worse situations (linemates, chemistry with coaches and team systems, etc.). But he's not going to get better just because of the jersey, any more than hometown boy Tavares suddenly got better when he signed with TO. They hear about it all summer...guys like Shea Weber, Nick Suzuki, Brendan Gallagher, etc. don't need to hear about it all summer. They are strong players who bring it, period. That's what we need on our team. Conversely, some bum who happens to be French is still going to be a bum whether he lives in Montreal or not. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted October 9 Share Posted October 9 12 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: I want them to have French stars too. But that's different from saying that there is some magical pixie dust that makes French players better when they play here. Yes, maybe some local kids can raise their games against the Habs for a handful of games per season. The idea that they would do that for 82 games in a Habs jersey is much harder to support. A player is, fundamentally, what he is. Of course, a player can find himself in better and worse situations (linemates, chemistry with coaches and team systems, etc.). But he's not going to get better just because of the jersey, any more than hometown boy Tavares suddenly got better when he signed with TO. They hear about it all summer...guys like Shea Weber, Nick Suzuki, Brendan Gallagher, etc. don't need to hear about it all summer. They are strong players who bring it, period. That's what we need on our team. Conversely, some bum who happens to be French is still going to be a bum whether he lives in Montreal or not. Well said, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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