2025-26 projected lineup discussion

[Prime Minister Koivu]

I would be happy giving Tavares 8 million a season for 4 years

 

PPG centre with great skating and two way play. 
 

Tavares would bring stability and mentorship to that second line

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

Just now, Prime Minister Koivu said:

I would be happy giving Tavares 8 million a season for 4 years

 

PPG centre with great skating and two way play. 
 

Tavares would bring stability and mentorship to that second line

 

Not a great skater but does everything else well. Would prefer 3 years but if he becomes a free agent then teams will be lining up so you might have to do 4. 

[Prime Minister Koivu]

2 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

Not a great skater but does everything else well. Would prefer 3 years but if he becomes a free agent then teams will be lining up so you might have to do 4. 

I agree three years would be ideal. 
 

I didn’t think he would be available and I really hope the leafs lose him just by trying to lowball him. 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

4 X 8 is fine for Tavares. It'll look dubious on the back end, but good value in UFA terms.

 

Suter would be a good signing - a Dvorak replacement but with greater potential to play up the lineup. But I worry more about overpaying in term and salary for middle-roster guys than for someone like Tavares, who still produces at elite or near-elite levels. 

 

[hab29RETIRED]

1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

I do not want Tavares, looser mentality there.

 

Pius has had better numbers than any of the Habs’ recent  2C/3C

the outlier year means to ma that he could fill-in for short periods at the 2C spot but would be better suited as a 3C

 

He would fit better between Anderson and Gallagher than Granlund.

With Granlund, it would be nice to see a finish line of Laine-Granlund-Heineman  or Demidov in RW there. He would be my 2C choice until any prospects proves they can do better 

Loser mentality? How? I'd take him in a hearbeat. He is coming off a poorly contstructed team and grow up cheering for a loser franchise. But loser mentality? Really??

 

You want Suter over Tavares??? thank god you arne't the GM That sounds the type of dumb move that Bergevin would have made.

[BCHabnut]

Is another patience year needed? If there isn't a reasonable fit at 2C and PK RD, would you rather plug a hole and lose prospects of unknown ability, or give those prospects this year to see what you actually have? I would hate to see the emergence of Hutson and the Habs surprise playoff appearance (where they were dominated by a beatable team) interrupt a rebuild. Its a tough year to be a Habs gm.

[alfredoh2009]

55 minutes ago, dlbalr said:

 

What 2C trade options are out there?  Everything I've seen suggests otherwise.  That's why the bidding is going to go crazy for the few UFAs that are out there, so much so that signing Granlund and Suter is going to probably cost more than you might think.

this is not the trade proposal thread. So,  no, I am not proposing a trade yet.

For the Dvorak 3C spot, if they do not resign Dvo, Suter would be good: better offensive numbers.

If Granlund can be had on a reasonable term, I would prefer him over Stamkos. He is not elite, but would probably have shorter term and be a good fit between Laine and Dach/Heineman/Demidov

 

the pair being Laine-Granlund not Granlund-Demidov

 

Finding the right center for Demidov should be the next step

[dlbalr]

1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

this is not the trade proposal thread. So,  no, I am not proposing a trade yet.

For the Dvorak 3C spot, if they do not resign Dvo, Suter would be good: better offensive numbers.

 

I'm not saying make a trade proposal, I'm just asking who you think is available when all I've read the last week is GMs bemoaning the lack of available 2Cs beyond Marco Rossi who it has been established that the Habs don't want.  I don't think there's a viable trade for a 2C out there at the moment.

 

This year, yes, Suter had more points with an unsustainable shooting percentage.  But over a five-year sample, he has 162 points in 364 games (0.45 PPG).  Dvorak over that same time is 103 in 232 (0.44 PPG). So, is Suter really that much better offensively?  He's much more durable (which is noteworthy) but I'm not necessarily buying the offensive upgrade.

[hab29RETIRED]

50 minutes ago, dlbalr said:

 

I'm not saying make a trade proposal, I'm just asking who you think is available when all I've read the last week is GMs bemoaning the lack of available 2Cs beyond Marco Rossi who it has been established that the Habs don't want.  I don't think there's a viable trade for a 2C out there at the moment.

 

This year, yes, Suter had more points with an unsustainable shooting percentage.  But over a five-year sample, he has 162 points in 364 games (0.45 PPG).  Dvorak over that same time is 103 in 232 (0.44 PPG). So, is Suter really that much better offensively?  He's much more durable (which is noteworthy) but I'm not necessarily buying the offensive upgrade.

Yeah. Sutwr

is is not the answer. If we can’t get a centre,

it would be great to get Robertson (doubt it -

would cost to much), or Ehlers.

[DON]

The Mind Numbingly Complex Considerations Facing The Habs’ Jeff Gorton and Kent Hughes – HabsWorld.net

...

– Decide who goes and who stays within 50-man roster limit, given that their cupboards will be overflowing.
– Determine what proactive steps they should take concerning prospects if there indeed is potential expansion in Atlanta in the near future.
– Trade up in the draft using either prospects and/or Montreal’s numerous picks – which most of the media seems to believe will happen.
– Trade some of these picks, plus prospects to immediately shore up the lineup by landing a quality second-line centre and right-hand shooting defenceman – all without somehow breaking the bank. This, too, is a favourite talking point with those covering the Canadiens.

...

 

Maple Leafs Linked To Mikael Granlund, Pius Suter

Maple Leafs Linked To Mikael Granlund, Pius Suter

 

[alfredoh2009]

1 hour ago, dlbalr said:

 

I'm not saying make a trade proposal, I'm just asking who you think is available when all I've read the last week is GMs bemoaning the lack of available 2Cs beyond Marco Rossi who it has been established that the Habs don't want.  I don't think there's a viable trade for a 2C out there at the moment.

 

This year, yes, Suter had more points with an unsustainable shooting percentage.  But over a five-year sample, he has 162 points in 364 games (0.45 PPG).  Dvorak over that same time is 103 in 232 (0.44 PPG). So, is Suter really that much better offensively?  He's much more durable (which is noteworthy) but I'm not necessarily buying the offensive upgrade.

 

I disagree that Suter may not be abel to replace Dvorak. He has been a consistent 15 goal, 30 point center shooting a bit over 100x /yr. Dvorak has been declining to being maybe a 10 goal, 25 point center on the decline. Suter's ATOI has been going up while Dvorak's has been going down. Suter is an upgrade, not significant, but better.

 

Or, if I put it another way, Suter would not be a step down from what we could get from Dvorak. It fills a whole that we hoe can be filled by Beck or Kapanen once they get their 200 games of NHL experience under their belts.

 

 

 

 

 

[alfredoh2009]

32 minutes ago, DON said:

[...]

 

Maple Leafs Linked To Mikael Granlund, Pius Suter

Maple Leafs Linked To Mikael Granlund, Pius Suter

 

 

Interesting article. Granlund only .19 less PPG than Tavares, eh! And would probably sign for less (I have him pegged at $5M)

 

what a deal!

[tomh009]

2 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Interesting article. Granlund only .19 less PPG than Tavares, eh! And would probably sign for less (I have him pegged at $5M)

The big difference is in the number of goals: Granlund is likely 15-20 goals, Tavares likely 30-35.

 

I personally expect the Granlund price tag to be at least $6M, Tavares probably $8M.

[alfredoh2009]

1 minute ago, tomh009 said:

The big difference is in the number of goals: Granlund is likely 15-20 goals, Tavares likely 30-35.

 

I personally expect the Granlund price tag to be at least $6M, Tavares probably $8M.

If HugGort give $6M a shorter term, sure. I had him at $5Mx4years $6.3mX3yrs would be fine for me.

 

[Commandant]

16 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

 

Interesting article. Granlund only .19 less PPG than Tavares, eh! And would probably sign for less (I have him pegged at $5M)

 

what a deal!

 

there is almost no chance that Granlund takes 5m AAV. 

His last contract was 5m

 

With the cap rising, and being one of 2 UFA top 6Cs in a market desperate for Cs, why is he taking the same money?  Makes no sense.

[DON]

Are Canadiens buying or selling? Plus, ranking the defence and Kirby Dach’s future: Mailbag - The Athletic

 

One thing is certain: Jeff Gorton and Kent Hughes are working hard in this less-than-ideal market. The Canadiens’ decision-makers are leaving no stone unturned and are aggressively trying to work this market, a league source said. But there’s a difference between being aggressive and being stupid, and the Canadiens are not willing to be stupid.

[alfredoh2009]

9 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

The big difference is in the number of goals: Granlund is likely 15-20 goals, Tavares likely 30-35.

[…]

ah , I forgot to mention. I prefer a passer to play with Demidov and Laine, or other wingers we may develop/get

 

IMHO, fits better the Habs’ puzzle

[Commandant]

5 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

If HugGort give $6M a shorter term, sure. I had him at $5Mx4years $6.3mX3yrs would be fine for me.

 

 

So you are cool with 20m, but whether its 3 or 4 years makes no difference? 

 

Why is the player taking 20m over 4 years, when he can get the same money over 3 and sign another contract for year 4?

 

Make it make sense!!!!!!

[Commandant]

1 minute ago, alfredoh2009 said:

ah , I forgot to mention. I prefer a passer to play with Demidov and Laine, or other wingers we may develop/get

 

IMHO, fits better the Habs’ puzzle

 

Demidov is a good passer and playmaker.  thats his appeal, he can do both. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

3 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

Suter would be a good signing - a Dvorak replacement but with greater potential to play up the lineup. But I worry more about overpaying in term and salary for middle-roster guys than for someone like Tavares, who still produces at elite or near-elite levels. 

 

 

Overpaying for a middle roster guy is not a good idea especially when you have guys like Beck or Kapanen who MIGHT be able to fill that role. Spend your money on a high end guy like Tavares who has been tremendously consistent over his career. You know what you are getting. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

22 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

 

Interesting article. Granlund only .19 less PPG than Tavares, eh! And would probably sign for less (I have him pegged at $5M)

 

what a deal!

 

Yeah, $5M would be a great deal for the Habs but it's not happening. Granlund will almost certainly get more than $5M, especially with a rising cap. 

[GHT120]

16 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

If HugGort give $6M a shorter term, sure. I had him at $5Mx4years $6.3mX3yrs would be fine for me.

Given the shortage of UFA centres, and also on the trade market, I'd bet $6.3MX4yrs is closer ... and likely a tad low.

[alfredoh2009]

4 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

Yeah, $5M would be a great deal for the Habs but it's not happening. Granlund will almost certainly get more than $5M, especially with a rising cap. 

it depends on the term. He is 33

[alfredoh2009]

1 minute ago, GHT120 said:

Given the shortage of UFA centres, and also on the trade market, I'd bet $6.3MX4yrs is closer ... and likely a tad low.

Fair point

[dlbalr]

1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

I disagree that Suter may not be abel to replace Dvorak. He has been a consistent 15 goal, 30 point center shooting a bit over 100x /yr. Dvorak has been declining to being maybe a 10 goal, 25 point center on the decline. Suter's ATOI has been going up while Dvorak's has been going down. Suter is an upgrade, not significant, but better.

 

Or, if I put it another way, Suter would not be a step down from what we could get from Dvorak. It fills a whole that we hoe can be filled by Beck or Kapanen once they get their 200 games of NHL experience under their belts.

 

A consistent 15-goal, 30-point player?  He's reached both of those marks twice in five years.  He's a guy who got more ice time in Vancouver with their centre troubles and shot at a whopping 18.1%, 5% higher than his career average.  It's extremely likely that it's not repeatable which is going to drag that goal total down.  He's also probably not playing 17 minutes a game with most teams so that has to be factored in.  If Dvorak played 17 minutes a game, he'd have more points to.

 

Don't get me wrong.  I like Suter.  He's a Swiss Army type of player that's useful to have.  If he was willing to sign for 3C money, I'd be happy if he signed with the Habs.  I have no reason to think he'll accept 3C money as Vancouver has already offered that and had it turned down.  I don't want the Habs to overpay based on the outlier, unlikely to be repeated year and because the centre market is so weak, someone's going to.  Based on your evaluation of Granlund's cost, I'm also guessing you have Suter's price tag much lower than it's going to be.