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Faith In Ribeiro


KoZed

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Since everyone seems to hate Ribs and want him gone, I'll take upon myself to defend everyone's favorite scapegoat.

Just for the record, I'm not Ribeiro's #1 fan. He's not really my type of player. I prefer fast, well-rounded guys with some character who seems to get better when the stakes are higher, like Plekanec for example. One trait I like about Ribs though is his creativity. With so many one-dimensionnal and predictable players out there, I found it refreshing and fun to watch a player who can still pull moves that surprises you.

But that's irrelevant. The real point I wanted to make by starting this thread was to say that I think, unlike most, that Ribs still can be useful to the Habs and earn a place on the roster.

For all his flaws, Ribs is still developing. People still forget that last year was only his 3rd as a full-time regular. The season before he lead the team in points, taking over the team's offensive responsabilities when Koivu was in and out of the lineup with various injuries. Last year he had a nice start, then a prolonged slump like basically everyone on the team; but once he got paired with Kovalev (who was doing nothing along with Saku), Ribs got going again. And in the playoffs he certainly could have produced more offense; but he admitted it himself as the series was going that he missed too many chances. Despite that, he played with more dedication than he ever displayed in his NHL career until then. At least, on that front, there is a definite progression.

Ribs will never be mistaken with the popular well-rounded, all-purpose, low-profile guys like Higgins or Chipchura or the gritty warriors like Bouillon or Begin. Still doesn't mean the Ribs can't find a puprose and use with the Habs.

If Ribs still has some work ethics issues to adjust, most people tend to forget how far he has come from the self-absorbed, talently lazy prick he was in juniors about 5-6 years ago. Unlike some jerks whose bad attitude has crystallized and could never be reversed, Ribs has been faced with several events that forced him to change his bad habits. His attitude adjustment has not happened overnight, but its still there and still in progress.

In some ways, Ribs' attitude is sometimes reminescent of a very young Carbonneau. The big difference is that Carbo came in an Habs organization still loaded with players and staff from that 70's dynasty. Carbo was exposed very early to the "Team-First" philosophy and channeled his attitude toward winning. However beneath it there was still some of the same old Carbo. Anyone remembers Carbo's antics when the Habs would face the Nords; or how he came to get the boot out of town for flipping journalists the bird? Same sort of analogies could be made with other notoriously "attitude" guys like Chelios or Yzerman; who were all somewhat "wild" when they were young but got around turning it into win-first mentalities. In the end, attitude is just attitude. Its only "bad" if its misguided. However when its channeled properly, it can give very good results. Personnally I'll take some guy with an unpredictable attitude over any blend and flat attitude.

That is why I think Carbo can really get to Ribs and shape him into a better player; more than any of the Habs' previous coaches. That alone makes me want to see how Ribs will fare in Montreal next season.

That and the additionnal fact that no one can predict how Koivu will comeback from his eye injury. Saku was already having a subpar season by his own standards statistically (same PPG avg in a season where the league as a whole went up) and in his overall style (often invisible or struggling to make plays). There's also the fact that Plekanec will be a sophomore and -- although he showed great promises -- should not be relied upon too much yet.

Ribs is just 26. He barely just entered the "Breakout Threshold" of most forwards (25-28), and given some of the unknowns at center for the Habs, Ribs could get a "make or break" chance at the start of next season. I'd be more concerned about getting Kovalev and Ribs a good LW (something that dragged that line down last season) than try to get rid of Ribs right now. There's still some untapped potential in that kid and it would be regretful if some other team got to it before the Habs could; like it happened too often in the past.

Ok, I'm done. You can call me crazy now. :P

Edited by KoZed
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Sorry, but picking fights with the captain, calling out the captain's obvious leadership, and blaming others for his poor season don't exactly point to him growing up recently.

Ribs did all of that last season?

I must have missed it. Would you be as so kind as to direct me to his quotes or something?

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Well, Ribiero is a talented player who definitely can be of use to Montreal. But that's only when he plays with effort and focus...I hope you're right and Carbonneau can wring some good work outta him. The Habs need everyone on the current roster to play as well as they can if playoff success is going to happen.

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I must have missed it. Would you be as so kind as to direct me to his quotes or something?

The fight with Koivu was the season before the lockout.

The comment about Koivu's leadership came after the Olympics, when he said something to the effect of "Too bad Saku uses all his leadership while playing for Finland. http://forums.habsworld.net/index.php?showtopic=5781

And the comment about blaming other for his lack of points came midseason, where he said something to the effect of "I'd have more assists if Ryder finished more of my passes." Couldn't find it offhand, and I don't want to waste my time by looking for it.

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Ribs did all of that last season?

I must have missed it. Would you be as so kind as to direct me to his quotes or something?

well before you try to pick up for a guy, you might want to look at his past actions. :?-

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The fight with Koivu was the season before the lockout.

The comment about Koivu's leadership came after the Olympics, when he said something to the effect of "Too bad Saku uses all his leadership while playing for Finland. http://forums.habsworld.net/index.php?showtopic=5781

And the comment about blaming other for his lack of points came midseason, where he said something to the effect of "I'd have more assists if Ryder finished more of my passes." Couldn't find it offhand, and I don't want to waste my time by looking for it.

The fight with Koivu was in practice after a scrum along the board, if I recall. Both players just went at it. Happens regularly. I dont see how that's a bid deal. Or is there an unwritten law somewhere that says you can't touch your captain in pratice? I guess if Ribs just skated away to avoid the fight there'd still someone to accuse him of being a coward pussy.

The comments about Koivu's leadership were denied by Ribeiro in La Presse. He said he never spoke with that guy and dont know where that article comes from. The story died right then and there, it seems.

I dont recall the comments about Ryder last season. However, for some vague reason I'm inclined to believe it goes along with the other little snippets of quotes that somehow get blown up out of proportions.

well before you try to pick up for a guy, you might want to look at his past actions. :?-

Look up at my previous post.

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Perhaps because of his reputation as an attitude problem inclines me to think the quotes are true, and he recanted because he knew what he said was stupid and didn't want to admit it.

Before the 2003-04 season, I was a big supporter of giving Ribs his last shot at the NHL and was pleased with his season. He disappeared in the playoffs, but I fel confident we had a 2nd line center for the long haul. I envisioned a line of Kosty-Ribs-Ryder for the next 10 years.

This season, however, changed my mind. He had a terrible season and again was invisible in the playoffs, making it twice that he did nothing when it really matters. Watching the playoff games, I don't see the creativity people say he has. I saw very little effort out of him. That is not a type of player that plays the #2 center on a winning team.

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Ever since the center ice flopping against Boston I am just embarrased to say he is on the team I root for. Plus he gets man handled, knocked down, checked and is a horrible defensive player. I know he is an offensive forward, however he should at least try to be a little better with his defence.

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Before the 2003-04 season, I was a big supporter of giving Ribs his last shot at the NHL and was pleased with his season. He disappeared in the playoffs, but I fel confident we had a 2nd line center for the long haul. I envisioned a line of Kosty-Ribs-Ryder for the next 10 years.

To be fair, both Ribs and Ryder dissapear in those playoffs. Their inexperience really showed back then, but it is common for guys who get their first good regular seasons to struggle in the playoffs.

This season, however, changed my mind. He had a terrible season and again was invisible in the playoffs, making it twice that he did nothing when it really matters. Watching the playoff games, I don't see the creativity people say he has. I saw very little effort out of him. That is not a type of player that plays the #2 center on a winning team.

He had an horrible first half, but he turned in a good 2nd half, especially toward the end when Theo was gone and the chemistry with Kovalev was developing.

I'm somewhat surprised that you see little effort out of him in the playoffs. I saw him try more than what is usually known of him. Where he failed was at converting many scoring chances and he admitted it himself during the series. But he was there for those chances, involved in the play. He's had a dozen shots (like most forwards on the team) and finished +1 in a losing series ( only Habs to finish the playoffs in the pluses with Plekanec); in just his second playoffs experience. That's not really a dissapearing act. Drawing definitive conclusions on his contribution after 2 playoffs is somewhat hasty, considering many bigger names only start performing after 3, 4 or even more experiences in the playoffs.

That being said, I never hinted that Ribs could even dream to become a 2nd-center such as some winning teams' had. If you want to go that way, you could also wonder if the Habs have the type of 1st center, 1st LW, top 4 d-men or goalie that plays on winning teams.

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Amen KoZed!

I've been building a similar arguement for days now.

Some seems to let their dislike for what they see the guy as hide the progress that Ribeiro has made and what he can still make.

Ribeiro can be a great compliment to Kovelov, we saw that at the last quarter of the season.

If Ribs has a 90 point season, even tho its just one season, next year this time, everyone will find another guy to pounce on.

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Ribiero will only get my respect when i see deditcation in his game and i hope its not with the habs, and that thing about age, look at crosby and ovechking diffrent talet level but they 18 and 20 and did fantastic.

And Koivu slumping it happens to all players like you said about Ribero also, and Kovalev never really showed up to his expectations yes a point per game but a player with that talent should get a lot more points and hes very lazy,Thats the biggest thing i hate about kovalevs game.

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This is Canadiens fan in a nutshell.

I like Ribeiro, but since "everybody" was calling for his head I tought that it was set. But maybe it's not.

On the top of my wishlist is a top six winger. Not a center to replace Ribs. Maybe it will come true?

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I completely agree about not having any respect for him after the flopping incident... and as far as young players comonly dissapearing in the playoffs.... Plex, Perogie and Higgs did great this past playoffs... then there are also guys like Wolski, Winchester, Penner, etc, etc, who did great. I dunno... id just rather package him away for someone better and get Carter in to be our 2nd line center... look at what he did between the Sedins last year.

:hlogo:

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I completely agree about not having any respect for him after the flopping incident... and as far as young players comonly dissapearing in the playoffs.... Plex, Perogie and Higgs did great this past playoffs... then there are also guys like Wolski, Winchester, Penner, etc, etc, who did great. I dunno... id just rather package him away for someone better and get Carter in to be our 2nd line center... look at what he did between the Sedins last year.

:hlogo:

Carter wasn't between them, Hendrik was between him and brother Daniel.

Did you see what Carter did the two seasons prior to that?? Was his season only a product of the Sedins finally jelling at the NHL level?

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A comment about young players in the playoffs:

There is a lot of differences betwen rookies who play on lower lines and a guy on a top line. The other team doesnt plan their strategies around shutting down your 3rd line's rookie LW or your 4th line's young budding poweforward.

The other teams circles in on your top players on your top lines. That meant Koivu's line and Ribs' line. And after Koivu's injury, Higgins & Ryder were much less of a threat so Ribs' line became the #1 target. It partially explains why Plekanec's line got to sneak in and be so dangerous.

Inversely, its much easier to look good when you're not expected to do much; ie. when nobody's putting any pressure on you to lead the offense, especially if you're considered a rookie. Call that the Kid Line factor (anyone remembers Graves-Gelinas-Murphy back in 1990?)

Crosby/Ovechkin are in a league of their own. They did fantastic in regular seasons, but let's hope they do better in the postseason than a guy like Joe Thornton, another phenomenon who'd rack the points in regular season but has been below expectations in the playoffs for about 6 times now.

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I like posts of this kind. I get to express my 'see a lot of different sides of the question' attitude really easily. :)

As far as Ribeiro is concerned, I don't see him leaving Montreal this year.

Even if Gainey/Carbonneau were dissatisfied with him, they're not going to ship him off for the proverbial 'bag of pucks' even if it's part of a package deal.

So, for those of this community who are negative towards him :puke: , we're stuck with him... for those in this community who are hopeful about him :rolleyes: , there is still to be hoped for... for those in this community who are positive about him :) , he'll be with us for at least another year and will be able to be guided, nurtured and allowed to grow into what he can be for the team.

:king: :hlogo: :king:

Edited by shortcat1
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get Carter in to be our 2nd line center... look at what he did between the Sedins last year.

Carter is a winger, Henrik Sedin centered the line. I think his production was more a case of the Sedins fulfilling their potential and taking him along for the ride.

As for Ribs, I suppose he gets another shot with the Habs. I sincerely hope he puts up a solid season and makes us all sound like idiots.

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I like posts of this kind. I get to express my 'see a lot of different sides of the question' attitude really easily. :)

Sometimes its hard though. Ribeiro falls into that category of players against which so many bad things are said, the momentum of public opinion tends to swing a little too far off.

Happens a lot in Habsland. Roy brings two Cups and people jeer him because he allows 9 goals one night.

But some prefer to think its all about the medias... <_<

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Funny how many people have come to support Ribeiro now that it appears we are stuck with him for another season. I couldn't smell a Ribeiro supporter for 100 miles when everyone thought we were going to get a FA to replace him.

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Funny how many people have come to support Ribeiro now that it appears we are stuck with him for another season. I couldn't smell a Ribeiro supporter for 100 miles when everyone thought we were going to get a FA to replace him.

Can't say that I am a very big fan, and within a few months we'll all be demanding a trade when his poor skating and work ethic have us frustrated as all hell.

I just hope he doesn't take ice time away from Thomas Plekanec and stunt his development

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I've always supported Ribeiro even though he has struggled, and even though he has had me frustrated with his play.

I think next season he will still be with the Habs, and it will be a very important season for him to prove that he can stay with his hometown team. Personally, I think Ribs can rebound and show us his true form...I would hate to see Bob force a trade and get hardly anything in return. I know Ribeiro is worth more than a coupon to Mcdonalds.

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Funny how many people have come to support Ribeiro now that it appears we are stuck with him for another season. I couldn't smell a Ribeiro supporter for 100 miles when everyone thought we were going to get a FA to replace him.

I dont feel targetted by the above statement, but I'll justify myself anyway: what I wrote in the first post of this thread is merely just a collection of things I've already stated in other threads for a while now.

Though I dont want to get labeled a Ribs fan. If he doesnt show signs of improvement after some months into next season, I'll probably be hoping for a trade too.

In short, I just want the Habs to squeeze all they can from Ribs, which you can't say has been done yet with only 2 full seasons in the NHL. For all his flaws, Ribs' offensive upside is too good to give up on him this early in his career.

Its a different case because they were forced to do it, but Calgary fans probably dont look back on that Marc Savard for Ruslan Zainullin trade thinking they got a great deal. Since Ribs' not holding out for a trade or being an extreme bitch, there's not really any rush to dump him at the first occasion.

Some fans might never get around to like him, like some never got around to like Bobby Smith or Stephane Richer; or like I never got around to like Shayne Corson; but from a strictly pragmatic point of view I think its better to hold unto Ribs for now and give Carbonneau a shot at doing something with the guy; than dump him for a Zainullin and watch him pan out elsewhere.

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