Bad Blood Between Savard And Gainey?

[lazy26]

Original link: http://www.cyberpresse.ca/article/20060901...1006/CPSPORTS01

translated link: http://translate.google.com/translate?u=ht...Flanguage_tools

Basically, it says that the reason Andre Savard left the team earlier this summer to become an assistant coach with the Pens was that he believed Bob was ignoring his scouting advice.

[Mr. Nasty]

yeah, there had to be somthing up. I also read on spectors that it is believed that Savard and Timmins also dis-agreed about drafting Price instead of Stall...and that Gainey agreed with Timmins instead.

Edited September 3, 2006 by Mr. Nasty

[KoZed]

Kinda sucks that it ended up that way. I can understand Savard, since he's the one that hired Timmins and the one who recommended Gainey to Boivin (he agreed to step down from the GM position, he wasn't put aside as the articles says), but the GM is the guy with the last word. Only future can tell weither or not Gainey did a good thing ignoring AS' advices.

[KidRock]

That's the difference between Savard and Gainey. In a similar situation, Gainey would have kept his mouth shut. What purpose does it serve to spill the beans once you leave the team? No class on Savard's part. Who is Andre Savard to bad mouth Gainey? Savard is just an overhyped scout at best.

[KoZed]

Savard is just an overhyped scout at best.

Eeeh, AS was instrumental in building up the Avs & Sens. Soon enough the Habs will be added to that list. Saying he lacked class is one thing (even though no one knows if what he said was "on the record" or if someone just leaked it), but saying he's an overhyped scout is a gross misjudgement of his worth and contribution to the organizations he worked for.

[Psycing]

Maybe Gainey knew he wasn't going to keep Theo for long and wanted to get a top-notch goalie prospect when he could?

I have a lot of respect for Savard, and obviously he felt he could be of better service to the Penguins than Habs at this time, which sort of indicates that he likely didn't play a huge part in the Gainey's more recent decisions.

[The-Habby2919]

We couldve had a Staal? Oh wait nevermind.. he went to The Rags.

:hlogo:

[MAK]

yeah, there had to be somthing up. I also read on spectors that it is believed that Savard and Timmins also dis-agreed about drafting Price instead of Stall...and that Gainey agreed with Timmins instead.

can't say I disagree with gainey and timmins on that one. great DMen come more often then great goalies

now maybe in 3-4 year i'll be proven wrong but right now, I think that price we be a more important player on this team then staal.

[shortcat1]

An interesting add-on to the article by its author is that Savard was 'pushed out' to make way for Gainey to become GM.

I suppose that this is possible. If so, that might help a bit to understand the relationship between them.

As to Savard's being unprofessional, if he was pushed out, he certainly did keep a upper public face when he was interviewed about Gainey's arrival when he said that he voluntarily moved over because he didn't feel like he really belonged in that position.

Ah... to be a fly on the wall. NOT! I wouldn't want to be lilstening in on everybody's business. TMI, TMI.

:king: :hlogo: :king:

[Athlétique.Canadien]

Maybe Gainey knew he wasn't going to keep Theo for long and wanted to get a top-notch goalie prospect when he could?

I have a lot of respect for Savard, and obviously he felt he could be of better service to the Penguins than Habs at this time, which sort of indicates that he likely didn't play a huge part in the Gainey's more recent decisions.

It wouldn't surprise me at all to hear (if true) that when Gainey arrived in Montreal he sized up the team and over time Gainey started to think, "Uh oh, Jose is a great goalie, but I don't like the attitude" Or, "Jose is going to become a problem down the road, we'd better draft a future blue chip goalie before this blows up in our faces".

I've had enough of defending the Price pick or hearing about how it was dumb.

Toronto has Pogge. Buffalo has Miller and on and on. This was a draft pick which was purely and simply - Keeping up with the Jones' IMO.

In this league you'd better "Keep up with the Jones'" or else you're in trouble.

[KoZed]

I've had enough of defending the Price pick or hearing about how it was dumb.

What's funny is that most people (fans/experts) were clamoring for Brulé, yet now we learn that Staal was the other Habs pick after Price. Funny how far off we can be sometimes.

As for Price: I think BPA is the key here, regardless of the position. However the problem is that you've already got guys in the system like Danis or Halak who have a reasonable claim to a #1 job someday. Can't really say we are that deep in D-men.

[MAK]

What's funny is that most people (fans/experts) were clamoring for Brulé, yet now we learn that Staal was the other Habs pick after Price. Funny how far off we can be sometimes.

staal at the 5th position was a bit early. funny, although he was picked 3rd Dman in the draft, I think he'll become top of his class in front of bourdon and Lee.

I've read a rumour that the vancouver giants would love to have carey price in nets since they'll be hosts of the memorial cup...I would love to see him there just to see how he works under pressure

[kaos]

Andre Savard has one of the best eyes for talent in the game and will be sorely missed by Montreal in the near and distant future. If Gainey wasn't listening to him thats a shame. Savard knows what he's talking about. However, Savard should have shown more class and kept his mouth shut much like Gainey would have and has done so far.

[smon]

It's not much of a surprise, is it?

I mean truly, Savard was demoted to make way for Gainey. Obviously he couldn't really expect to be taken seriously by the organization anymore.

And as for the whole Price-Staal-Brule thing, well hey none of the three have contributed anything to the NHL, so who can judge?

[Colin]

Andre Savard has one of the best eyes for talent in the game and will be sorely missed by Montreal in the near and distant future. If Gainey wasn't listening to him thats a shame. Savard knows what he's talking about. However, Savard should have shown more class and kept his mouth shut much like Gainey would have and has done so far.

While I whole-heartedly agree that he has one of the best eyes for talent in the game today, Savard isn't necessarily all that and a bag of chips. Remember, in the Ottawa days he also had this fellow named Trevor Timmins aiding him. That Trevor fellow now heads Montreal's scouting department. If Gainey wasn't really listening to Savard, maybe that's because Timmins actually has the better eye in Gainey's opinion (an opinion, I might add, that should have significant weight behind it considering Gainey's resume).

[RobRock]

There's a difference between listening to someone and agreeing with their point of view. He's got Savard and Timmins advising him, who each have scouts reporting to them. They may get very different opinions from two or three scouts on the same guy. One guy says he skates well, but doesn't shoot very well. Another says he's a great skater, but doesn't play well defensively. A third says he's great in his own zone, but doesn't do something else very well. All may be valid points at the times when a particular scout sees a player over a period of time, and that has to be factored in. If Timmins and Savard happen to disagree on a particular player, then Gainey has to make a particular choice, either at the expense of one or both of them. Maybe Bob was not agreeing with Savard as much as before, or as much as he did with Timmins, and seeing that Savard decided that he didn't to want to remain in that position anymore. If he had stuck it out for the '07 draft, maybe the pendulum would have swung the other way. But he chose to leave now. It was apparently his choice to make though.

[TheMaxDaddy]

AS went to the pens because there is huge growth opportunity there.

I can't see Therrien lasting more than 2 months (He'll bench either/both Sid and Malky for being too soft and get his ass chased/kicked out of town). Who better to take over than a guy with a record of developing young players.

In Mtl, AS was stuck in a position where 5 or 6 guys will get credit for the team's success ahead of him. In Pitts, he'll be the head coach by December.

[Athlétique.Canadien]

What's funny is that most people (fans/experts) were clamoring for Brulé, yet now we learn that Staal was the other Habs pick after Price. Funny how far off we can be sometimes.

As for Price: I think BPA is the key here, regardless of the position. However the problem is that you've already got guys in the system like Danis or Halak who have a reasonable claim to a #1 job someday. Can't really say we are that deep in D-men.

Could be Danis or Halak are trades too. Not that I wish for them to be traded. But, Danis, Halek and Price are all good for a team upgrade trade. Center comes to mind.

I didn't mind the Price pick at the time an another level because his stock is big enough for Gainey to flip him and bring in a BOMB. Bob got Kovalev for Balej???

Prospects. You want them to all play for Les Glorieux but some will be trade cash

THE BEAUTY OF DEPTH! :hlogo:

THAT'S HOW IT'S DONE! BOB :hlogo:

Go HABS! :king:

Edited September 7, 2006 by ATHLÉTIQUE.CANADIEN

[CoRvInA]

related to bad blood ... in rds one blogger stated that there seems to be some blad brewing between Carbonneau and Markov ( due to game style discrep.) which would imply Markov now more unlikely to sign next year therefor the option of putting Markov in a trade that we've been hearing about.

[MAK]

related to bad blood ... in rds one blogger stated that there seems to be some blad brewing between Carbonneau and Markov

please don't use RDS bloggers as reference. I never read that much crap anywhere else. most of the bloogers don't even care to write properly and it often reflects the quality of the comment.

thats why I switched to HW where evreybody seems to make an effort to properly spell words. it also reflects the quality of the comments that you fine people at habs world post.

mersi baucout

[KoZed]

If I can just add one thing:

Savard and Gainey have totally different philosophies when it comes to what is more important in a player. Savard put a prime on speed and the ability to play a more high-tempo type of game. Gainey comes more from the character/hockey sense school of thought. Could explain why they didn't get along too well.

[PMAC]

If I can just add one thing:

Savard and Gainey have totally different philosophies when it comes to what is more important in a player. Savard put a prime on speed and the ability to play a more high-tempo type of game. Gainey comes more from the character/hockey sense school of thought. Could explain why they didn't get along too well.

For myself, I prefer the Habs stock up on character guys with great hockey sense who can skate like the wind Seriously though, every player has a mixture of these characteristics. For example Chipchura is touted as a character player, but is also a strong skater.

[KoZed]

For myself, I prefer the Habs stock up on character guys with great hockey sense who can skate like the wind Seriously though, every player has a mixture of these characteristics. For example Chipchura is touted as a character player, but is also a strong skater.

Heee... maybe some have a mixture of this, but Higgins-type dont run the streets. From where we fans stands, but down at the ice-level the little differences we dont notices are amplified.

I'll give you the Zednik/Johnson example. Zednik would be the Savard type: a speedy guy who is good off the rush and likes to uses his skating to create chances. Johnson would be the Gainey type: a guy that's well-rounded and can do a lot of little things right. That's on the pro side. When it comes to drafting, I doubt Savard would have go for a guy like, say, Ryan White; or would have signed a guy like Stewart.

[Tony]

Who do you think Gainey would have picked when Andrei Kostitsyn was drafted?

If I remember right, Savard made the pick for Kostitsyn since Gainey asked him to since Savard was still in charge.

[KoZed]

Who do you think Gainey would have picked when Andrei Kostitsyn was drafted?

If I remember right, Savard made the pick for Kostitsyn since Gainey asked him to since Savard was still in charge.

Anyone can guess but I doubt anyone could get it close. Who could have guessed Marc Staal was next after Carey Price on the Habs list? Carter? Brown? Getzlaf? Burns? Jessiman? Stuart? Kesler? Seabrook?