Habsfan89
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Posts posted by Habsfan89
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On 11/4/2019 at 12:48 PM, Commandant said:
So you agree with CC's point then... if Price has the most wins in Habs history, that means he is the best goalie in Habs history.
Cause you can't have it both ways.... either Wins are the most important goalie stat, and so that makes Price the best Habs goalie ever.
Or
Wins are based on a number of factors, a majority of which are not in the goalies control, and thus should be a team stat. (How many shots the team gives up, how hard they are, how many goals the team scores, how many games played, etc.... none of these are in the goalies control).
This has been recognized in baseball as
Felix Hernandez won the 2010 CY Young with a 13-12 record; andJacob DeGrom won the 2018 CY Young with a 10-9 record.
People in baseball are recognizing that judging the best pitcher as the one with the most wins is silly.
Recognizing that the same applies to goalies in the NHL... that using advanced stats like High Danger Save Percentage, medium Danger save percentage, Goals Saved Above Average, WAR, and other advanced metrics are better for judging the quality of goalies than simple win-loss records. John Gibson was probably the best goalie in the NHL last season, but based on the fact the team in front of him was a dumpster fire, people look at wins and losses and GAA and other traditional stats don't recognize that.
The sooner we use stats that isolate individual performance and take out the variations that come from the team in front of the goalie, the better we will be able to judge which goalies are better than others, by how much, and what they should be worth, and trust me, every team in the NHL is working towards figuring these things out.
When comparing wins for goaltenders on habs when it comes to Price would you take out S/O wins, since their wasn't any back then? Price's S/O wins should be marked as ties.
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Won't surprise me if Byron gets traded. If he doesn't this year for sure next year he will. Is this the first year or 2nd year of his new deal
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13 minutes ago, BCHabnut said:
I never saw this. He made great defensive plays. Great work the stick. Excellent positioning. Didn't crush guys but that wasn't his game.
Didn't hit a lot . He would always go for the stick lift rather than the body check.
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3 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:
Koivu was a savard pick and could have been a top 10 player if he hadn’t blown out his knee - he was either leading the league or top 3 at the time.
I thought he was, wasn't sure didn't feel like looking it up.
But that tells you how bad drafting and player development was under Houle.
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1 hour ago, BCHabnut said:
I always looked at markov as a poor man's lindstrom. He was already in the right place and made the right choice. My favourite defenseman since chelios.
He was great offensively but on the D side he was too soft. Which is why I think he always got over look.
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1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:
I loved Koivu, but he was far from a superstar. The very fact that you identify him as our best FW of the post-Houle era shows how far Montreal has been from having any really top-end talent other than Price.
That's because we got lucky and pick 5th over all that year. Top five picks are usually elite players. Galchenyuk was supposed to be that but we didn't develop him properly.
Our drafting was so bad those years under Houle I think Markov and Koivu were the only player that came out of it.
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3 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:
Price is the only legitimate superstar the Habs have had since Roy. And Roy was the only legit one they had since Lafleur.
No other Hab in the post-Houle era belongs in that company.
In net or just as a player in general? I agree with you if you're talking about in net. But I would put Koivu up their as a superstar.
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23 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:
This thread makes me long for arguments over downvotes
Could you imagine the sea of red you would of been seeing right now if the downvotes were still here.
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Oh I hate those plays in EA NHL, everyone does them and you can't stop them.
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2 minutes ago, Trizzak said:
Gonna be a long time til Cousins is a healthy scratch again.
He's been looking good . Once Weal gets back who sits? Byron?
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6 minutes ago, sbhatt said:
My bet looks solid. I always go with the team that has the 2 best starters, based on 4 starts for those 2 pitchers in a 7 game series.
Washington did it
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Down to the last 3 outs for Houston
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Any baseball fans Washington is up 4-2 in the 9th
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Just now, Trizzak said:
There have been multiple big hits this game by Habs D.
Missed the first but so far in the 2nd haven't noticed any.
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How come we don't hit anyone when we're in our zone?
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Did Weber drink from the fountain of youth? Man what a difference without the beard, not use to it at all lol.
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2 minutes ago, Trizzak said:
I wonder if he's one of those players that is a bit daunted by the big contract he's signed. Every year before this he was playing on a "show me why you should get more" contract, but now he's in the first year of his first "okay, you earned it" contract. He wouldn't be the first player to get an increase in his paycheque and suddenly forget how to play the hockey that got him that increase.
Could be the concussion he had, maybe he isn't fully recovered from it.
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Need to get Byron going he seems lost out there.
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20 minutes ago, Commandant said:
Yes, and thats why I say that its mostly luck when you get hall of fame players in the 6th and 7th round. No one knew they would turn out to be that good.
I agree but still say it's more than just Luck it's a lot of really good scouting.
But on that note it was a very good discussion that didn't get out of hand so I think we can end it on that note.
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6 minutes ago, Commandant said:
If you know they are that good... you would never take the chance that another team might draft them.
Sure you could wait til the third round if you think they are a sleeper. You don't wait til rounds 6 and 7 and give other teams multiple shots at them if you think they are franchise guys. It shows you got lucky and they are better than you even thought.I agree on some of that( yes I do agree with people). Which is why you see gm's trade up and down in the draft to try and get guys they want. But franchise guys are usually 1st overall picks. I think guys fall for different reasons. It all depends on what your team is looking for in players. That's the hard part you really don't know what a 18 year old player will turn into.
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3 minutes ago, Habber31 said:
Lol, is that Metallica? Dejaview
Why because we're having a conversation on this topic?
Is everyone just suppose to agree and be one big happy family 🤔
Its a discussion forum for a reason.
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33 minutes ago, IN THE HEARTS OF MEN said:
Nobody said that all actually. They said he was lucky to get Zetterberg and Daytsuk in hindsight and rightfully so. Even pointing out how we were lucky to get Gallagher and Markov in latter rounds the same way.
with that said,
Lidstrom was a 3rd rounder
Fedorov a 4th rounder.
datsyuk 6th round
zetterbeg 7th round
anybody can draft stevie Y in the top 5. But those 4 picks really set Detroit up for years. Personally it is a little lucky to land such high end talent in those late rounds but the one thing that can be said is clearly Detroit had high quality scouting coming out of Sweden and Russia to take flyers on 4 players from sweden and Russia and all of them turned out to be all time greats. Sh*t wasnt Lidstrom and Fedorov drafted the same year?? Id be interested to know if the same scouts were on the payroll in 89 that drafted zetterberg and datsuk 10 years later!
Is it lucky or over site by other gm's at the time?
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11 minutes ago, BCHabnut said:
I don't think he's saying that bergevin is amazing gm or player development expert. The assertion is that the hall of famers lidstrom yzerman Fedorov were not drafted by Holland. If his drafting and development prowess was so great, why wait until 5th and 7th round to draft zett and dat? Wouldn't you use your superior knowledge to bag them in the first round? They were never developed in the wings system. I didnt read Holland bad. Bergevin good.
He is saying lucky ....... I am saying scouting and player development not luck.
Just using Bergevin as a example to point this out , again since this is a habs forum.
Not saying one is better than the other or ripping on anyone.
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21 minutes ago, tomh009 said:
Is Galchenyuk (2012) not playing in the NHL any more? And Lehkonen (2013) was at least still playing on Saturday.
My bad so according to commandant theory , Bergevin got lucky 3 times and all his other picks were unlucky. Had nothing to do with scouting and development in the organization.
Again just using Bergevin as an example since this is a habs forum. Not trying to rip him.
Do fans and management rely on Price too much to hide team weaknesses???
in Habs & Hockey Talk
Posted
Well geese captain obvious you think.
But the team has gotten a tie.
You're a habs fan you out of all people should know how important a goaltender is when it comes to wins and losses. Our team's were built around goaltending.
Without strong goaltending we don't get as much wins as we do.