The Chicoutimi Cucumber
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Posts posted by The Chicoutimi Cucumber
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Obviously, Boucher is a good coach. He also has some seriously high-end talent to work with, which helps. None of that means that JM is not a good coach. That's the false logic of this whole debate. I don't hear anybody arguing that the Habs should have had much better results this season; the general assessment is that we got everything we could have gotten from our injury-decimated lineup. Indeed, Martin has delivered all you could ask for in terms of results for two years running. So whatever Boucher is doing has no bearing on whatever we're doing or did.
I too hate Tampa Bay - I despise teams that suck ass for years and years, accumulate no-brainer draft-picks and then get endless unwarranted praise for their suppsoedly brilliant management. I also hate the French factor on that team which leads to Quebec media love-ins (like this is the team the Habs really 'should' be). Boston, meanwhile, is at least a real franchise with a real fanbase that has truly paid its dues. I hope they win.
EDIT: I'd also like to know how the media squares its assessment of the Habs as mediocre with the fact that we took the Prunes to OT in Game Seven while the Flyers couldn't even make a series of it. Hmm....which team sucks again?
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This is something that's been on my mind since the final buzzer of MTL / Bos game 7.
Most of the year I've been thinking " if we just had Markov " or " what if Georges wasn't injured " and at the end " what would the playoffs been like with Pacioretty "
- basically, had we not had so many injuries how much better could the Habs have been?
If next year we have Markov, Georges and Patches in the line up and get the luxury of not too many injuries, how dominant could the Habs be in 2011 / 2012?
Obviously, just a speculative - best case scenario - type of question, which also assumes that the team is more or less the same as this year.
But there will be other injuries.
This is one reason why I keep saying we need a Wiz or equivalent. You have to have that kind of depth if you want to contend. The cap issues are another question.
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lets try and keep to the topic, we got wiz for a 2nd rnd draft pick. You think we can get top 4 d for a 2nd rnd draft pick? they must be in great abundance. The reason he could and repeat I said COULD command 5 mill is because of what he did for us this year. It sure as hell was not his +- rating when he got here(look it up). That is how Mark streight got his money oh and Komisarek oh and souray ( we can souray tommorrow if you want an offensive defenceman who costs too musch money) I agree that we would have been screwed if he had not been here however let us remember that when PG picked him up it was a gamble and nobody was offering anything for him and we were desperate. On the one hand you guys say balls to wall sign him and on the other apparently it is impossible to find a big scoring forward. And yes you are crazy if barely scraping into the playoffs (albeit after a stanley cup) and going out in the first round is your idea of a contender cause we already have that (minus the cup) Chicago are no more a contender right now than we are. Their problem is due entirely to their bad cap management. And we never will be a true contender without more offence. Sign wiz at 3.75 mill and I am a happy guy. Sign him at 4.5 to 5 mill and I think it is a mistake. I usually agrre with c/con most hings but not to be rude I am done with this topic I really cannot explain myself any clearer.
I'm glad you're done because your logic is faulty. Wiz was an impending UFA (i.e., a rental). Those guys generally don't command full market value. Also the Islanders are not exactly masters of the brilliant deal. As for his +/- he was a plus player with us (i.e., on a good team). Anyway, what you think is irrelevant. Wiz is a top-4 d-man and will rightly get paid like one. The end.
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What goon hockey are you referring to?
They have 0 fights in 9 playoff games.
The issue with the Bruins is cheap shots and deliberate attempts to injure: c.f. Chara on Patches, Lucic on Spacek, and whathisname on Halpern. Their recipe is to be a good team that gives itself an extra advantage by taking out key opponents, all unpunished by the NHL. Philly's the same way. Doesn't matter, though, because as we all know diving and yapping are FAR more terrible sins than ending careers and crippling people.
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Picking between Philly and Boston is like choosing between Darth Vader and Emperor Palpatine.
However, I *do* think that if it turns out that we lost in Game 7 OT to the eventual Cup champs, it makes our team look good in retrospect. Because I get irrationally frustrated with what I see as the media's dismissive attitude of a team I regard as pretty good, I see that as a nice outcome in those terms. Plus, at the end of the day, I don't really hate Boston. They've been a worthy opponent over the years, they're Original Six - a real hockey franchise/city, not like Tampa Bay - and they're due. I wouldn't begrudge it to them THAT much.
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I agree with the CC - the Wiz is most certainly top 4. And I want him. Here's the trouble: he'll want to cash in with a nice long contract after a top 5 dman points season. So, say $4.5M for 4 years rather than $5M for less. I can't imagine PG going for it or the Wiz settling for less than 3-4 years. PG doesn't like to buy high. Because the Wiz has weaknesses, there's a chance he could be a bust if he doesn't continue to produce. The Habs would be in deep doo doo if they ended up with an untradeable $4.5M contract.
It's a very risky situation. If management jumps and it works out, they're geniuses and the Wiz is a hero. If they jump and Markov's knee turns out to be shot, they look smart for covering the offensive d angle with the Wiz. But if they jump and the Wiz disappoints, ouchy.
On the other hand, habs rule and others keep talking about big tough scoring forwards as if there is a magic tree out there that they grow on. Unfortunately they are very very hard to come by. So maybe we should go with what we know is good and take a chance on the Wiz...
Time, and the size of Gorges and Markov's contracts, will tell.
A wise post. Yeah, and again, I don't have some obsession with Wiz per se. I just maintain that we need either Wiz or somebody like him - an impact top-4 d-man - if we want to build on this season and maybe make the jump to contender. Without that guy, there is no way it happens IMHO.
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actually the hawks screwed themselves not tendering Q/O's to i forget if it was 3 or 4 rfa's. This cost them huge cap space and they were in trouble after that. It cost the GM his job as I recall. So yes it was bad cap management. The only thing we are discussing really is whether the habs can afford to sign Wiz At 5 million. My answer is no. We will not win a cup without more offence up front and that is the real problem we have. Our defence is pretty good but we were the worst goals for team that made the playoffs. Unless price is going to start scoring we will be in trouble. I want to sign Wiz but A. I do not believe he is a top 4 def. B. I think all you have to do is look at the trade where we got him. We gave up virtually nothing. Nobody in the league apparently thinks he is a top 4 d. Our defence this year played very well. do they need improving of course but at what cost. I want to see a bigger tougher forward who will score goals cause gomez sure the hell ain't going to. A great defence means you lose 1-0. We need goals and Wiz as much as Ithink he is a gamer, playing huge minutes through some awfull injuries is worth 3,5 mill to 3.75 mill. Hell who knows Spacek could have a great year next year
ok that is a little crazy but we have good offensive defencemen Markov Subban and Weber how many do we need? I am sorry CC that you are not getting my point but hey that is why we call it discussionIf nobody in the league thinks he is a top-4 defenceman, then how come you think he will command $5 mil on the open market? Sorry, but Wiz was an absolute key to saving our season - without him we had no PP - and the idea that he is not a top-4 defenceman is simply ridiculous. As for team-building, look, this team is BUILT on Price and a defensive system - the New Jersey Devils model - and you can't execute that without excellent D. Finally, call me crazy, but I'd rather have bad cap management AND A STANLEY CUP CONTENDER (the Chicago model) than loads of cap space and a bubble team. Some fans seem to think that Cap Space is the name of the Art Ross and Conn Smythe trophy winners. I don't. Just the way I roll, I guess.
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Well, I think Markov, Gorges and Subban are all unquestionably top 4 d-men, so we're really just arguing over one spot.
Gorges is a slight stretch. I think of him as the best #5 d-man in hockey, although TOI would favour your interpretation, I'll admit. Anyway, surely we can all agree that
Markov-Subban
Gorges-Spacek
Gill-Weber
is a lot less impressive/Cup-worthy than
Markov-Subban
Wisniewski/Bieksa- Gorges
Gill-Weber
Spacek
and that the latter is what we should aspire to. The cap may be an obstacle but not an insuperable one. habsrule cites Chicago as a lesson in poor cap mgt. I say the opposite - they went after the guys they wanted, cap be damned, and they were rewarded with a Cup. We've got a window. Let's make the most of it.
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I don't know when Wiz became the saviour, but let's be honest defensively he lacks a lot. to me he is not worth more than 3.5 or maybe 3.75 and that is only cause he is making that now. My point is simply we have markov ( i hope) subban spacek gorges ( i hope) and Weber who can replace wiz's offence and we can pick and choose from who we have left from this year. Whether we like it or not the cap does dictate what we can pay guys, see chicago, We are going to have a very expensive defence core as it is and gauthier has to be careful. We need more size and scoring up front. Without that we will never contend. So we must be cautious on how much we spend on what I think is a 5th or 6th defenceman. So no I am not shrugging my shoulders and saying we can't build a contender, I am saying we have to be smart about it and in my opinion 5 mill for wiz in not in the plans. But it is only my opinion.
Well, just to be clear I'm not saying Wiz is the 'saviour.' He is, however, one of the top offensive defencemen in hockey, a huge boon on the PP, and not all that terrible in his own end. Having said that I've consistently said I don't care if it's Wiz or Bieksa or some other comparable top-4 horse. But my real point is that we should build from the back end out, and that doing so requires that we NOT cross our fingers on a D containing only two incontestably top-4 defencemen. You obviously don't share that wider philosophy of team-building. Fair enough.
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gomez should retire this off season.. nulling his contract
than resign with the habs at half price or less.
Ha ha, that's a great idea! But it'd probably be cancelled by the league office as a violation of the spirit of the CBA - c.f. the Kovalchuk imbrolgio.
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i am not sure whatis wrong about having subban and markov on the points. They are both better than wiz. I like wiz but at a reasonable price. Hey we could have signed komi for 5 million like burk did. thank god we didn't. We have a good nucleus on defence, we have to option pick who we will keep and who we will let go. i say we are in good shape but have to make tough choices. The salary cap sez so.
Look, if you want to contend, you need quality depth. Two excellent D + Gorges does not cut it because it assumes that everything is going to go just right. But one serious injury to Subban or Markov and your season is shot (or else you pull another rabbit out of your ass by trading draft picks for a Wiz type yet again). Remember, Hammer of next year is not the Hammer of three years ago - he is seriously miscast as more than a 4th-5th defenceman at this point. So in terms of the structure of the team, you're basically substituting PK for the role Hammer played circa 2009. That is an upgrade, but not enough of an upgrade to elevate us permanently above 'bubble team' status. Rather than shrug and say the cap does not allow us to build a contender, we should be bound and determined to do WHATEVER it takes.
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Habs29, there is a reason Moen and Darche get PP time. They are the ONLY guys who drive to the net during the regular season. That's a personnel issue, not a coaching issue.
As for Malkin for Cammy, hey, I'd do that in a split second, but I'd also trade my Corolla for a Mercedes. Ain't gonna happen.
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The choice is EITHER to re-sign Wiz OR sign another top-4 defenceman. Ever since Streit left, we have been left scrambling mid-season to try to shore up the power play. This has cost us picks and is also a gamble you cannot keep running year after year - sooner or later your luck will run out. Make the investment and be done with it.
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I believe the perception around Muller was created by media reports last spring, identifying him as a huge factor in the playoff run. How well-founded those reports are is another question. It's also received wisdom that he is much-loved by the players. However, the idea that the sky will fall without him does seem pretty implausible. The Habs are a very solid organization with good management, a highly respected head coach (except among fans) and a bright future. They will be attractive to top candidates. And I trust the wily Martin and the intelligent Gauthier to make a strong choice.
As for Gomez: the analogy with Price fails, because Price was a kid figuring things out, while Gomez is a veteran. The only consolation is that if you look at Gomez's history, he has hit peaks and valleys before. He went from 70 and 63 points in his first two seasons to 48 and 55; then he spiked up to 70 and 84; then he settled in at between 60-70 points per season for four years. There is, therefore, some precedent to him pulling his game out of the doldums and coming back strong after awful seasons.
So what do we do? Well, he may be unmoveable, in which case we make a virtue of necessity and give him 'one more chance.' (The Habs seem to take a gentlemanly approach to their players, and Gomez is clearly good for team chemistry, so this may be the organization's preferred option in any case). He may in fact be moveable, but we might choose to keep him anyway for lack of any better option at the 2nd line C position. (Remember, you don't want to sign anyone to a contract of more than 1-2 years, given the likelihood of Eller's emergence in that window; so it would take a very specific player profile to replace Gomer). Or maybe Gauthier will move boldly and dump or deal Gomer with no plan B ready to hand. This isn't his typical pattern, though - except when events/contracts force his hand, as with Halak. The smart money has Gomez returning in the fall.
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I can almost guarantee this. Gomez will be around for one more year. His cap hit savings for a team looking to reach the cap floor are not good enough. Next year, there will be a savings and could see him go somewhere.
One of Markov or Wiz will be signed. Not both. One of Hammer or Gill will be signed. Not both.
I am in favour of signing Pyatt. I love teams with shutdown lines, and while I know that we don't have a shutdown centre, having Moen and Pyatt on a line with a Paullson, Madden, Malhotra type would be huge. Just look at the gains the Canucks had during the season by freeing Kessler from all of the defensive duties, contrasted with his post season performance when drawing regular duties against Toews. Yes, he is playing well, but think of how well he would do without those minutes. I think Halpern could very well be that guy, but he needs to stay on the line and not have to move up all the time. The same can be said for Moen and Darche. They are not top sixers, but due to lack of top six depth and size on wing, they are being moved up too much and are miss cast.
While many want to see Wiz signed, I would much rather see that money go toward an impact top sixer. I think the depth at defense will look a little better just with a healthy roster
Gio/Gomez/Patch
Impact guy/Plek/Cammie
Kosty/Eller/Desharnais (not ideal because Desharnais is a good centre)
Moen/Halpern/Pyatt
Darche
White
Markov/Gorges
Hammer or Gill/Subban (I know he is great on the PK, but I preffer Hammer for a few years because of versatility)
Yemilin??? insert signed denseman here/Weber
Spacek
Interesting. But I think this team is built from the net out, and that changing that philosophy would be unwise. Beyond that, it has always been my belief that championships are most often won from the back end (c.f. Chicago last season) - the first thing I look at when assessing a team is the blueline. So my preference is to invest in the absolute best blueline we can; you're better off crossing your fingers on Pacioretty or Kostitsyn than on the patchy blueline you propose.
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I think they've been remarkably consistent. Bruins don't get suspended. The end.
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This post disgusts me.
Going out to injury a player intentionally is so far away from Les Canadiens hockey its not funny.
If our team starts signing guys who can 'be relied upon to injure opposing players' we are just compounding the problem.
We need to be leaders on this, we shouldn't fight fire with fire.
The headshots and injuries will no doubt continue until the NHL old boys are broken up, but in the short term it doesn't help to further promote this kind of play.
We are better than this.
I wouldn't want to win if we had taken Chara out with a dirty play.
Although I was happy to see a more measured response from you later in the thread, and while I do agree with a lot of what your saying, I felt I had to take you to task on this.
Fair enough. As you point out, I did moderate my original assertion somewhat; and in the end I waver on this. The problem is, by not having guys like this, you're basically conceding 1-2 injuries to the opposition in any given playoff run as a result of deliberate injuries. That's why it may not be as simple as saying 'we're above all that.' But I hear where you're coming from and 'sort of' agree.
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Unfortunately we are stuck with his contract for still a long time. Can't believe we had to give a bluechip prospect and a young gun for him. At least we got Pyatt in that trade. Oh yeah, and we were able to land Gionta and Cammalleri. Wow, big deal. Bad timing to have money to spend.
That said we don't have the choice to keep them. We have to upgrade Moen and A.K. on the top 2 lines. We can't go far with that current setup, we all know it. Taking for granted that Max Pax will start on Gomez's line, we need to find a huge upgrade on A.K. That's the only thing we can do. None of the remaining top 6 are tradable.
I hate this 'we're stuck with him' logic. Not that the argument is unsound. But again, I look to the Chicagos and Philadelphias - teams that don't give a rat's ass about anything except winning. Worse comes to worst, you bury Gomer Pyle's contract in the minors and the Molson's bottom line be damned.
However, I don't think he's completely unmoveable. There were rumours of Pheonix being interested at the deadline. Some cap-floor-challenged team might look at his speed and passing and think that, freed of JM's system, this guy could help. Gauthier should be turning every stone to see if it can be made to happen.
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Nobody is suggesting a 1A backup, but Auld is barely an NHL goaltender. Playing excuses are not legit, he had the easiest workload possible with the Leafs/Isles/Panters etc. The only playoff team he faced won 1 playoff game. .914 SV% is not impressive when you are playing teams that probably have an expected save percentage of about .915. They need a guy who can bridge a gap should Price get injured, I am not convinced that Auld could do that for even 5-6 games like a guy like Enroth did for the Sabres.
As for Eller, he doesn't need to be a star, teams don't have 3-4 stars today, if they do they become top heavy and capped out with little depth. The Habs are in a good position because they have two stars locked in for next season at about $4M and legit support players like Eller, Pacioretty, Desharnais, White and Weber who will get better and outperform their contracts over the next 2-3 seasons. Hockey is about elite players and depth. The Hawks won last season because they had Kane, Toews and Keith, but they also relied heavily on Byfuglien, Ladd, Bolland etc.
The albatross for this team is Gomez. Not in the sense in which they can provide this type of season again, but in the sense that he eats up the advantage gained by PK and Price's cheap cap hits. If you tell the league you have Gomez/Price and Subban locked up for $11M combined they say not bad, but when the majority of that is wrapped up in the worst of the 3 it becomes a problem. Gomez becomes the thing keeping this team from becoming a Cup contender. Right now he is eating the Superstar savings in 3rd line production. The Habs can maintain what they are right now with him, but if they actually had a $7M player's production this team is among the top 5-6 in the league.
As always fans are looking at this team from the perspective of today.
This is what happened in the shortsighted prism of October 2010. Is Price better than Halak? Is Subban ready for the NHL? Is Pacioretty a bust? Is Desharnais too small? etc. etc.
What if Eller makes the Pacioretty leap in 2011-12? What if DD is the player we saw in Game 6? What if Weber morphs into Mark Streit 2.0?
The positives outweigh the negatives moving forward and if Gauthier pulls the right strings this team will have a nice Cup window in the next 2-3 years.
I agree with you. However, we should note that Tampa and Boston are also teams with considerable young talent, not to mention Crosby-Malkin and a Washington team that may be good for years. We have a 'Cup window' opening but that is not even remotely close to a guarantee of even making the semi-finals. (I feel the need to sound notes of caution on this front, because the last two times I bought into this sort of narrative - 1996 and 2008 - all we got was ashes). Optimism is appropriate, but we'll still need a great deal to go right.
As for Gomez: I haven't read a single defence of him over the last few months and I've been as vocal as anyone in condemning his crapulence. But Wamsley, what would you do? Would you bury him in the minors or deal him this summer? If so, what do you do for a 2nd-line C? Try a platoon approach with Eller, Desharnais, and maybe a Halpern-type? Go out and sign an Arnott as a stop-gap? Just asking, because it's time we move beyond the 'dump Gomez' argument, which is convincing, but will only be truly realistic if we have some clue about how to fill his roster spot.
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Two things I'm surprised about:
1. A number of Bruins fans have posted on various Habs' sites expressing great respect for the heart and character of our team. That shows some class. They're not ALL crass turds like Ference. A series like this really should end with a deep mutual respect underneath all the surface animosity. Notwithstanding Bruins' disgusting cheap shots on Spacek and Halpern, these two teams brought the best out of each other, and that's what sport is about.
2. A number of commentators - most prominently Boone - have expressed the view that the Bruins are crap. I can't accept that, partly because it suggests that the Habs are even worse, but also because I think it's an injustice to what is in fact an all-around strong hockey club. They really miss Marc Savard, but still, they are a team with good depth, effective team D, physical toughness, big, scoring forwards - a very fine opponent who showed real mental resiliency in this series (they could easily have wilted when confronted with the Habs' never-say-die ferocity). I agree that Philly has a more impressive roster, but goaltending counts. Myself, I believe that Washington will destroy all comers regardless. But credit where due. We got beat by a genuinely good team.
I'm not so sure that our future is way brighter than theirs, either. Bergeron, Kreiji, Lucic, Marchand, Horton, Rask, and let's not forget Seguin, are all under 25 and likely to get better. (Thank God they wasted their extra first-round pick on Kaberle, who did not impress me this round.) We could be looking at another 7-8 years of chasing each other as powers in the east.
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I completely understand your opinion, but as fans of a team that lost an important player, I can't imagine why we would want a goon - specifically to injure or end careers.
A bit more toughness is maybe a case that can be argued, but that's about it.
Boston's season is most likely over in the next 4-6 games.
Montreal is in a much better spot to grow and be the powerhouse we all hope for next year.
I can't say the same for the Bruins. They've got what they've got and I can't imagine it betting that much better.
Well, I wasn't asking for a goon. I was asking for a Matt Cooke type: the dirty bastard who can take a regular shift and occasionally take someone's head off. However, on reflection this may have been sour grapes...I just waver on this question. On the one hand, I'm tired of other teams (specifically but not exclusively Boston) doing it and getting away with it. We were just lucky that Spacek and Halpern weren't more seriously damaged, and Chara's attempted murder arguably made a difference in this series. And this leads to the logical conclusion that WE need to be doing it, too. They take out Patches? Fine, Cook/Torres/whoever takes out Bergeron. If we'd done that, we'd quite possibly be the team heading off to the second round. Injuring the opponent works because the NHL wants it to work. Beyond that, we had a lot of success with guys like Corson, Ludwig and Chelios in the late '80s. The Habs team of my youth was just as likely to be the aggressor as the victim.
On the other hand, there's the case that the Habs have stood and continue to stand for something better than that, just as we stood for something better than goonery in the 1970s (see toward the end): http://habsloyalist.blogspot.com/2011/04/aftermath-over.html
I'll settle for adding a bit of physical robustness, I suppose. A Hartnell type would be great. I know that Gauthier wants to add size; whether he can manage to add quality size is another question.
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One thing I'll add is I would like to see us add at least one physically dangerous player to our roster - a Ference/Torres/Cooke type who can be relied upon to injure opposing players. It is clear that the NHL has no interest in protecting players, and we cannot be the only team to meekly accept being on the losing end of cheap-shots all season/playoff long. It's not that I think these type of guys have much of a deterrent effect; it's that we might have won the series had, say, someone put out a Bruin in the way that Chara put out Pacioretty. In short, we are at a competitive disadvantage because we do not have a player or two of this type, as we can rely on the opposition to deliberately try to injure us.
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How can anybody be upset with this season?
A little perspective is all it takes to realize what a success this season was. In September the fans booed Price, had no idea who Eller was, had half written off Pacioretty because he wasnt an instant star and were hoping the Habs could weather the storm until Markov returned. DD who? Subban was to be nurtured as the 6th defenseman and eased into the league.
Here we are in April after Price had a huge year, Subban made the transition that few 21 year olds can make on D, the Habs played the whole season without Markov, etc. Etc.
They provided a glimpse this season. This wasn't a statistical fluke with paper OT wins, improbable 50 save wins and a high shooting percentage with no injuries. This was the beginning of a new era. A system, two legit superstars under the age of 23 and leadership that refuses to acknowledge defeat in the eyes of long odds.
Subban and Price are not a mirage. They are the two best players this franchise has had in over a decade. I can handle playoff defeats when I understand limitations and limit expectation. Everything after the playoffs was gravy. The Bruins fans have been conned into thinking they are a Cup contender so this series was everything to them, I will take playoff defeats over the next 5 years more heavily than this.
There can be no question that Price and Subban are the nucleus of the next 5-10 years (assuming we can lock 'em up), and that they are an elite nucleus. It's been 15 years since we saw a rookie of PK's calibre (the pre-injury Koivu). I'm with you - this team is much, much closer than all the 'experts' who will predict a 10th place finish for us next season think. A lot hinges on whether Patches can come back strong, come to think of it. If he does, and if we can re-sign or replace Wiz, then look out. Could be a memorable season ahead.
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To me, he looked either like the best player on the ice or the worst player on the ice.....would of been nice if he buried one in the clutch
Some erraticism but Kosty's given me reason for cautious, muted hope that the best may be yet to come. As some will recall, though, I don't trust him ever to become more than he's been. But he did seem to hit another level at times down the stretch. He doesn't have to be a superstar, but if he can become more reliable, it'd really help.
Having trouble going off-line...it's only 8:30 in vancouver and I don't feel like letting the season go! (Also, other Habs boards seem to be full of angry people spouting off about JM and god knows what else. This seems to be the only sane place).
Next season for the Habs
in Habs & Hockey Talk
Posted
If the Habs tie up money in the back end, it would have the virtue of FORCING them to boot out Gomez in order to be able to lock up Price and Subban when the time comes. That's how the Phillys, Bostons, and Chicagos of the world do things. And that's what we should do. Like I keep saying: sign the guys you want, deal with future cap implications when that future arrives. If Gomer has a good year next year, then you should be able to trade him to a low-salary club looking for a boost. If he has a bad year, then you cannot justify keeping him around anyway.
I agree, though, PK and Price should absolutely be locked up loooong term. None of this 3-year-deal stuff.