BlueKross
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Posts posted by BlueKross
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I don't think there are any easy answers to our cap problems. However, there's no question that Gill, Hamrlik, and Spacek - although I love the first two - are all past their prime and command a pile of dough. Of these, only Hamrlik will be truly hard to replace with feasible, cheaper alternatives. E.g., a Subban could probably do more for us - allowing for growth pains - next season than the Spacek we've so far seen; and O'Bryne can reasonably be asked to play a role equivalent to Gill's next season. Mara is, of course, gonzo no matter what happens. So I agree: I'd rather see Gauthier take a chance on a younger, cheaper defensive unit than try to make cap room by disposing of either of our goalies (or Andrei Kostitysn, for that matter). When in doubt, keep the young talent.
We have a glut of young talent waiting to be moved up. We would like to go the way were you move the old out and the new in as much as possible. You have to strike a balance between veterans and youth unless you are prepared to conceed the next couple of years. You will have to move some YOUTH or risk losing them. As I have said before, I see prospects being moved to top up deals with defensemen. The big problem is what are you getting in return.
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GO DOGS GO!!!
Lammy> What's the extent of the Masse injury? Has there been any sign of Fortier? When does the Clear Day roster come out? Thanx Lammy!
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The reason is, it'd be silly, unless team trading for him overpays a lot. Price is due to make say what... 1mil prolly based on his play? Halak is going to seek 4m most likely based on other goalie signings around the league. Simple math, unless they dump other players they cannot re-sign both Plek and Halak, trading Prices' 1mil salary will not be enough to balance the scales. I'm not expert at the cap, but just from what I looked at numbers, someone who's more familiar may be able to say if I'm right or not.
Both goalies are Rfa's come the end of June. I have my doubts that if management were to keep both goalies that they could get away with paying one goalie more than the other. What their cap hits were this past year are irrelevant. What is important is their cap hit in subsequent years, starting in 2010-2011. I don't have a feel for what our GM might be up to, but if the purpose is just to gain cap space, my guess would be they would move defensemen.
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Bluekross, signing Price is not going to prevent signing Plek, the way Price has played since season doesn't see him to getting a huge, if any raise. Another thing, you realize how trades are won and lost right? Sell high, buy low? Trading Price, if that's that they wanted to do, would net you very little.
Instead of attacking my, why not try to attack my post, would you sign Halak at the expense of Plek? The habs had trouble with goal scoring this year, you think they would be a better or worse team in that department without Plek?
Quite frankly, I am just using your statement. I am signing Plekanec first. As for the goaltenders, I don't care if they move both of them. It would appear to me that you are know saying that Halak is of superior value, because his contract may prevent the signing of Plekanac, and Price's would not. Although I disagree with the premise, if you follow that logic and had the thought to keep a goalie, why wouldn't you keep the better goalie? I am sorry you feel that I am attacking you. I AM NOT. I am just trying to get some sense of your progression of LOGIC.
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My thoughts to trade Halak is if signing him comes at the cost of losing Plek is not something the habs can afford. They have a player in Price that can tend goal decently, he has in the past, but they have no one in the minors that do the role of a #1/#2 centre. This really hinges on how Halak and his agent plays it, if they want too much, it could be his ticket out of here.
Gee Bar > You would trade Halak if it meant you could keep Plekanec but you wouldn't trade Price to accomplish the same thing. But you haven't crowned anyone King yet?
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Actually the ultimate bonehead trade was one year wonder Denis Savard at the end of his career for Chris Chelios who was a defense machine for about twenty years after the trade.
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Miller played well. Canada had all kinds of opportunies. Brodeur, Pronger, Niedermayer and Crosby were the suspects. I think 95% of the shots from the point either missed the net or were blocked. I cut down on the big slappers and get the shots through to the net. Release the puck quicker from point would probably been the difference. Forwards realize that puck is coming as soon as it is in defensemans stick.
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I do not disagree with anything you have said, however, it takes willing partners to have a meaningful dance. I do not see a lot of general managers jumping at Gomez, especially Gomez and the others mentioned, well you have equal quality elsewhere. Tough to be any GM in this economy.
I also agree. I would sign Plekanec before the deadline to multiple years if possible or move him for equal assets that we can control. I don't have a problem with a lateral move if it brings new energy and perhaps some size up front. I would like to see our top two lines healthy, because they have been showing promise when healthy.
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I haven't crowned Price anything, I'm pointing out the fact that you want to base that Halak outplayed Price this year, but what about last year when Price outplayed Halak? They both haven't proven anything in the NHL, Price has the potential I don't see in Halak. All this is silly really, you, nor I, nor anyone on this board is going to make the decision.
That's all well and good but regardless of his age and his alleged potential unless he starts playing like a number one goalie, he is goimg to get eaten alive. Losses are just not going to play in Montreal.
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Because he is playing over his head. Period.
Apparently Bar you have already crowned Price king. There are many of us who believe that Halak has out played Price. I for one believe, neither one will become an elite goalie a la Brodeur. Good goalies are a dime a dozen, or I better say that next level. We could move both and it wouldn't hurt my feelings.
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Lammy> Was Masse hurt or was he a healthy scratch?
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I understand that, but do you really think a 33 year old journeyman AHL'er (Darche) or a former 1st rounder (Belle) whose been dealt 3 times in what, 4 years is going to provide any sort of extra incentive in a deal? Heck, a lot of teams are near the 50-contract limit, some would find tacking on a minor leaguer a disincentive to a trade. These are dime a dozen players that can be found anywhere in the offseason; a lot of teams already have these types of depth players already.
Good to hear from you Dlbair. Your point is well taken. I thought Belle was really close. Most clubs have to fill out their rosters with cheap labour to compensate for the high end guys. Darche, yea, I going to give you that one.
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Actually my comment was that you could use some of your pending RFA and UFA' s that are currently in Hamilton to compliment a package with a defenseman. I never said anyone of those guys would be the centerpiece. I was asked to name some of them. I sent most of the list. There is obviously names that aren't going to make the cut. I would add Darche, Wyman and Belle to aleast get consideration.
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Quick...name those prospects...
Desharnais,Russel,Wyman,Trotter,Stewart,Johansson,Belle,Benoit,Carle,Darche,Pyat
t,Glumac,Henry and Busto ---- If your premise is correct, none of them will be resigned by the Canadians. My guess would be that five,six, seven of those players would be useful in a trade scenerio.
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Bulldogs getting trounced 5-0 late in the 3rd, ouch. Desjardins gets yanked for the 2nd straight start, not a good sign. Nor is the fact that Pacioretty once again is a no-go, wonder what his injury is?
How about this for a conspiracy theory. The rumored Frolov trade has legs. Pax man has some feigned injury to keep him out of line-up coupled with the mystery early departure of Weber. D'agostini is covered off because he wasn't playing anyway. The earliest harbingers of a trade are usually manifest in the movements of the players involved. That ought to start something!
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Spacek> I seem to remember a guy who was brought into Toronto because of his credentials, late in his career; who struggled mightly. That same player went to Detroit and had pretty damn good success. I believe with all the injuries Spacek was put into a position which has not been in his comfort zone. I still believe he is a good player.
HOLY MURPHY
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Gill and Spacek are signed for 2011 so I have no idea. Who is seriously going to want Hamrlik at the deadline? Only Phoenix, Colorado and LA could realistically take Hamrlik back and why would they want to?
I will put a little different spin on it Dlbair. I do believe that Gill and Spacek
are moveable. My best guess is that they will not be moved because we are still under the illusion that this team is going someplace. Having said that, you can count on management moving Subban up to entertain that illusion. You can also count on Subban being one of those RED Knights headed back to Hamilton when Montreal has been eliminated.
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We have a number of prospects in Hamilton whose future will have to be dealt with this year. If you package some of these players with say a defenseman you may be able to balance out the cost to a buyer and get some value back.
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Lammy> was Wyman playing defense? Why was Weber let go early to Vancouver? Isn't Busto still available to us? I believe that anyone could have been signed from the ECHL and brought in, even players from Cinci. You even see players loaned from other franchises. Why would we play short?
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Weber is in Vancouver with the Switzerland hockey team for the Olympics.
Thanx Lammy! I kind of wondered why the Dogs would let him go. He may have been the difference in that game. Secondly, I believe the dogs are running pretty thin on bodies. Is the Swiss team trying to get a head start?
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Given all the talk about the Frolov deal, where was Weber tonight? Was he on the bus?
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I am in the camp that you don't toss away picks for nothing. If this is the value of a 2nd round pick, then why trade Huet to get one in a year where you have a legit shot at going deep.
This doesn't make or break PG as a GM, but it is not a good start, imo. This is the kind of move that does nothing but reduce our options at the deadline. We no longer have a 2nd round pick to package up for a real boost to the team. Unless he makes some more moves, this is just a trade for the sake of a trade, but we come out with one less asset.
AGREED
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Basing arguments over non-facts is not arguing. It's trying to know everything.
You shoot yourself in the foot here, arguing that Bob screwed up because you expect that Lou did something that Bob didn't. And Bob was in a playoff hunt. I don't see how 8th is less of a playoff run than 2nd or 4th.
I get the distinct impression here that I am breaking up concrete without a jack hammer.
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By that reasoning, Lou Lamiorello is a horrible GM: he let Gionta, Gomez, and Rafalski walk for 'nada, nothing, zilch.' I agree that we should have traded Souray at the deadline under those circumstances, but then again he was replaced by Hamrlik. Specific examples aside, if you just take the blanket position that you *must* unload all UFAs at the deadline you will be forever blowing up your team for the stretch drive. As for the 2008-09 UFAs, the 100th anniversary season was always going to be a 'go for it year' and shipping the core of the team out would have been unacceptable to everyone in the organization. I've said it before and I'll say it again: the big problem in the Gainey era was not in losing these guys but in our inability to replace them from within with cheap young players. That's a whole other kettle of fish.
I would suggest to you that in the cases of Gionta, Gomez and Rafalski that Lou did make every endeavour to re-sign them. I expect that Lou even tried to move them when he realized he was not going to be able to sign them. You have not made the case that this didn't happen. Secondly, all three of the foremention, had contracts expire when the Devils where in legitimate play-off runs. The Devils were 2nd in conference with Gomez and Rafalski contracts expiring and 4th in the case of Gionta. Do you want to engage in a discussion of the Canadiens playoff prowlness over the last few years? Obviously Lou would have been hung for moving those keys assets pre play-offs.
I didn't say that it would work out every time, but we should have got more in return for the eight names I mentioned.
What it will take to resign Pleks/Halak/Price et el?
in Habs & Hockey Talk
Posted
You have idiots in management making stupid payroll decisions and then the league will go to war with the players and probably have another work stoppage. What the hell is the point??? When these morons continue to shoot themselves in the foot???
The good news is that the GM's don't have to make too many mistakes before they become EX-GM'S.
Bad Gm's are quickly exposed.