xXx..CK..xXx

Muzzin makes sense but I’m not believing any of these rumors. The more people (fans/media) talk about it, however, the more Pacioretty may simply have to be dealt, once again for non-hockey related reasons.

O’Reilly for Pacioretty = bad trade by Buffalo O’Reilly + 31st for 3rd = bad trade by Montreal O’Reilly for Pacioretty & 2nd = bad trade by Buffalo

My reasoning for being alright with Danault being dealt is a bad one. I’m tired of seeing him in the top 6. I admit it’s not the greatest reason nor do I think the team will actually move him.

I’ve been thinking about trade proposals involving Danault the past few days, such as one that I came up with involving King’s prospect/3rd line center Kempe coming back the other way. The problem is that right now he’s the only legitimate “pure” center we have who is capable of playing in the top 6. If we trade him, it should be for a center but we lose one going the other way as well.

My top 10 picks since I have nothing other than free time... 1) Buffalo Sabres: Dahlin 2) Carolina Hurricanes: Svechnikov 3) Montreal Canadiens: Zadina 4) Ottawa Senators: Hughes 5) Arizona Coyotes: Tkachuk 6) Detroit Red Wings: Boqvist 7) Vancouver Canucks: Kotkaniemi 8) Chicago Blackhawks: Wahlstrom 9) New York Rangers: Dobson 10) Edmonton Oilers: Ty Smith

Another fun fact from that 1997 draft is that Ottawa was also immediately behind us there as well. 11th overall - Montreal Canadiens : Jason Ward 12th overall - Ottawa Senators - Marian Hossa

It’s actually a great comparable as Jokinen was drafted 3rd overall and had 21 points in his first two NHL seasons. I had Kotkaniemi getting 22 points last year in the NHL. That being said, times have changed and point structures amongst leagues have likely changed in value. I think Jokinen was the player with slightly more potential (going to be tough for Kotkaniemi to outproduce Jokinen’s 91 point season) but that doesn’t mean Kotkaniemi can’t be a better player than Jokinen was in terms of consistency. There were many seasons he underperformed and one has to think it was slightly mental on his part rather than skill.

It’s hard not to imagine that the reason we would be picking him is simply because he is the best center available rather than him actually being the best player available at the 3rd pick. In any mock I’ve seen, we either pick Zadina, or Ottawa 100% picks Zadina after we choose not to. Switch our draft position with any team in the league and is Kotkaniemi in the discussion for 3rd overall? I like Kotkaniemi because I like the fact that he has size and can still be an average to above average skater. If he is indeed an Anze Kopitar, then that’s good enough for me. I’m just not sure he is. I understand the thought, and I even caught myself mentioning in another thread that I would rather simply draft Kotkaniemi than trade Pacioretty for another prospect center who has even less upside, but that reasoning also worries me after having gone through a dismal season in order to get a top 3 pick. I’m no expert but I still think it’s clear, unlike some experts, that Zadina is the slightly better player at 3. Hughes is the next closest thing as there is nothing wrong with being the second best defenseman in a draft behind Dahlin. Only then does Kotkaniemi come into the conversation and while I understand the thought, I think people’s blood starts rushing with excitement when they think that we may actually be able to draft a center with great potential. For me, the rational mind thinks that that’s not good enough of a reason to pass up on a player with even more potential, despite being a winger.

Going by that website that averages points by league and transfers them to what production would be at the NHL level.... (Last Year) Svechnikov - 40.25 points Zadina - 33.03 points Dahlin (D) - 23.6 points Kotkaniemi - 22.52 points Hughes (D) - 21.2 points Tkachuk - 20.97 points Boqvist isn’t a great point getter. (Since playing with men) I don’t mind Tkachuk but based on last year’s projected NHL points, he does seem quite close with Kotkaniemi. I also think Zadina is still the pick at 3. Hughes would be my second choice. Kotkaniemi would be my 3rd, and Tkachuk would be my 4th.

84th in the league amongst forwards in points is “fine” for a 1st line player. Stastny is 86th. May as well sign him to be a “fine” first line center as well.

Obviously Drouin would be the best option, but he can’t play 1st line left wing, center and right wing. Lehkonen isn’t a true first liner. The only 3 first liners we have are Pacioretty, Drouin and Gallagher. Even Gallagher is a stretch as a top line player but he’s fine. Sign a center as a free agent, and keep Pacioretty. Keep Drouin at center for another year if need be. Some answers are already on the team. I’d even draft Kotkaniemi over trading Pacioretty, and I want Zadina.

Exactly.

Yes, because Drouin played so much left wing last year and I’m sure both those “??” will simply be magically filled.

We’re comparing goal scoring here. I know you’ve been one of the few on Pacioretty’s side as well but we’re seriously undervaluing Pacioretty if we think any of Drouin, Lehkonen, Hudon, Byron or Carr can keep up with Pacioretty’s goal scoring. That’s the problem. If we trade Pacioretty, Byron would be the best choice as first line left wing.

I viewed it more as Galchenyuk and Pacioretty both being left hand shots who can play left wing. If we trade Pacioretty, we don’t have a top line caliber goal scoring left wing. Galchenyuk had that potential. Whether or not he would have been played there in replacement of Pacioretty is a whole other question and a moot point at this point in time.

There’s no one who doesn’t fit that description given the right circumstance. As for captains, Kopitar floats, Getzlaf floats, Landeskog floats, Koivu floats, Wheeler floats... Not every night but they all do. In my opinion, despite all the negative remarks I read about him during game day threads, this is the wrong reason to trade him. Worrying about paying him is also a wrong reason to trade him. This happened already with Markov and Radulov, although admittedly trading them would have been much better than the alternative. The best reasons to move him are to make sure he doesn’t walk for nothing (re: extension) or because you think he can no longer score 30-50 goals. Who cares that he “floats” if he still is capable of being one of the primary goal scorers in the league and puts up 70+ points.

I personally agree that signing Pacioretty to an extension is the best course of action. What I don’t see is that Bergevin would be thinking like you in terms of signing him with the intention of trading him as a result of now having him locked up for more years. Maybe trade him in a few years but if you sign him to an extension my personal vision gets a little blurry as to why it’s necessary to trade him at all. The fan base has been crying for needs to be filled via trade and the last two biggest trades we’ve made have been trading away those very needs. Sergachev is a LD and NHL.com has Galchenyuk screaming center. I know it’s a completely different discussion altogether but why are we so sure that trading Pacioretty will fill a need in our lineup. Of course it should but the GM’s brainwaves don’t seem to be connecting with the fan base and their line of thinking. I don’t see us getting a Ryan Johanssen or even a trade involving a Cam Fowler/Jake Muzzin/ ick Leddy for Pacioretty; even if he were signed long term.

If you trade him in the summer, you’re pretty much guaranteeing a lost season next year, unless the return includes some immediate help in addition to futures. I understand everyone cares so much about our team 3 years down the line but for me, that’s a major con against trading him this summer. Galchenyuk was literally the only player who could replace Pacioretty’s scoring and so even though I’m in the minority, if Pacioretty also gets traded, “I’m done*”. *depending on the return

Can’t see Washington repeating next year. You heard it here first. It all started when Trotz resigned.

I agree and thought about it but while I can see Kotkaniemi flourishing into a solid NHLer within 5 years, I don’t see any particular reason why Zadina would progress at any lesser of a rate in those 5 years. It’s possible, but all these things seem like wishful/crystal ball thinking, even on a scout’s part.

I’ll ignore the second part of this comment but here’s to hoping Domi is our new playoff Cammalleri. #13

What incentive does Bergevin have for being honest in this situation?

Assuming those charts are accurate, Kotkaniemi would have had 22 points over an 82 game NHL season last year and Zadina would have had 33 points. Kotkaniemi Math 29 points/57 games .508 poins per game .508x82 games 41.71 points Finnish league is worth .54 of NHL statistics 41.71x0.54 = 22.52 NHL points Zadina Math 82 points/57 games 1.438 points per game 1.438x82 games 117.96 points QMJHL is worth .28 of NHL points 117.96x0.28 = 33.03 NHL points

I still think Zadina is the best player available at 3. Kotkaniemi had 29 points (57 games) in an adult league last year and while that’s not bad, one has to assume the NHL is that much tougher. Zadina is more NHL ready production wise in my own opinion despite Kotkaniemi already having played with grown men. Unlike many, I’ll be surprised if we don’t take Zadina but at this point I just want the draft to be here already.

The problem I have with that plan is that there is no reason that this should have been an option in the first place.