The Saint Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 Gents, I have been reading the posts on this site for a few years now and love the site. I apologize for not finding my voice 'til now... As per my subject line, am i the only one who thinks we might lack some edge? I am talking about maniac energy guys who can dish out the pain (with little regard for his personal well-being) like Bégin and...and...well that's kinda my point. Am i missing something or are we building another Sen's team. Who else is there? Or is this "new league" so different we won't need this type of role player? Just wondering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33_ Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 Komisarek isn't afraid to throw his body around, and Rivet has always been a guy who stands up for his teammates. Among forwards though, we are pretty soft. Kovalev and big and strong, but isn't a bruising power forward. Bonk is also pretty big, but I don't think he's known for being a physical guy. I think this team should be fine though. As we always say, you can't check what you can't catch. BTW, welcome to HW! [Edited on 8-17-05 by Fanpuck33] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycing Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 Gainey signed Vandemeer. He seems to be a Begin type player. I'm looking forward to see how he plays. (You can also find the following link on HabsWorld homepage in the "Latest Links" list.) http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/Montr...1175563-ca.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortcat1 Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 And I saw Ivanans play in Hamilton. What a huge guy! I don't know if he has what it takes to make the team but he sure has the whoomp to knock people around. Also, welcome to the gang. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Saint Posted August 17, 2005 Author Share Posted August 17, 2005 Thanks guys! It's like i found a bunch of new brothas from different mothas! I agree with the Komi and Rivet views, and loved the article about Vandemeer. I have heard some good things about Ivanans, but he sounds like a potential lifer in the AHL. Here's hoping our speed is actually allowed to give us the edge we have been trying to build over the last several years. I like the energy guys though, ,they are super under-rated...and hard to come by... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLP Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 Latendresse is a hard-hitting mofo from what I've heard, if he impresses at training camp who knows what will happen -- anyone think he might start a few games? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortcat1 Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 Also, if we're looking down the road at prospects with a legitimate shot at the team, Maxime Lapierre will be another one who'll razz the opposition. Also, from what I've read, again if he makes the team, Alexei Yemelin will be another player in the mould of Darius Kasparaitis. Ryan O'Byrne is a defenseman who doesn't shy away from taking out the body. But then again, these are not for this coming season and not likely for the next or next two either. :ghg::ghg::ghg: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Saint Posted August 17, 2005 Author Share Posted August 17, 2005 I like what i've heard so far about Latendresse, but i just don't know which of our young guys will get good looks this year. The lines are almost set and some of the other guys are ahead on the depth chart. Remember too that Higgins was a very late cut at camp last year and should have a great shot at cracking the roster. I love the fact that we should have some good competition for some of the 2nd, 3rd and 4th line spots. If Hossa can't make something happen this season and early on, i am thinking hell be on a pretty short leash... Nevermind Higgins, Plekanec & Perezhogin (and Kostitsyn as a longshot). I'd love to see another young sniper or 2 given a shot with the big club. Why not take a chance once in a while? I guess we'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habmanonthepacific Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 I think we are not only too soft in general, but we have some serious shortcomings on defense and lack of ruggedness is only the beginning. But living on the west coast i see many Vancouver canucks games and one thing I notice with their team and that seems to bring them success is the ability to position a forward(ie. the much maligned Todd Bertuzzi) who is capable of taking some serious physical abuse in front of the net which the Habs dont do on a regular basis; and I think that the Habs emphasis on a speed/finesse game may be somewhat misguided. So yeah i wish we could tweak the system a little and become more of a physical force, especially when we will be playing so many games within our very physical and agressive division. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Saint Posted August 17, 2005 Author Share Posted August 17, 2005 I am not sure i agree with serious shortcomings on "D", I think between, Dandenault, Souray, Komisarek, Rivet, Markov, Bouillon and dare i say, Hainsey ( if he finally lives up to the hype) we should have a decent crew on the blue line. And we also signed Streit who could find a place here. Up front though, i fear we may end up with a Senators like crew, if ever Bégin is injured or simply can't cut it... Who else is there to dole out the pain? And to spark the team when we need a lift? BTW, Welcome to the World! From a fellow newby! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habscout Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 It looks to me that Gainey's recent signings of guys like Aitken & Vandemeer, as well as last off-season signing of Ivanans, is a way of adressing their lack of toughness. However, neither of these guys are likely to be starters, and will likely only be used when it necessary,against a team with a known enforcer or perhaps in the 2nd half of back-to-back games when the first game has resulted in some bad blood between the Habs and the other team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PB Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 The regulation pertaining to the use of the hockey sticks between players as changed but the physical contact between them remain unchanged. Actually with the new format, (more games between same division), games themselves ought to get even more physical than they used to be. Is the Ch too soft ? The best team for me will be one that possesses the highest numbers of talented players that are the least affected by how physical a game can sometime get. The important thing, is not to provoque per se but to respond well to provocation in order to win games. Our Ch as done extremelly well against the Big Bad Bruins during the last series and except for Langdon, the departure of Juneau, Dackell, Dowd and Brisebois shouldnt be considered as a drop in toughfness for our team. I certainlly would be inconfortable to have more than 1 agitator type players in my team. They do get the other team penalysed with their retribution (good) but they do get them excited and prowned at double hitting our important players and elevate our risk of loosing players du to injurys throughout the long season (not good). Regular shift players that are known to drop their gloves to defend players are really good to have ( Vandermeer, Souray, Komisarek, Rivet) and if BG feel this team ought to also had a part-timed elite enforcer, he will fix that, as he did last year by acquiring Langdon. So I wouldnt worry about the Ch being to soft. Are we to soft ? In some ways, there is 4 type of players using their body out there. A)The ones that never bodycheck solidly. B)The ones that use it to circomstances. C)The ones that use it very often. D)The one that go out of their way to do it. Personelly I think that a team composed with to many A type players will in the end offer the other team to much confort to get out of trouble and thus, minimised their chances in having the other teams make mistakes......not good. On the other hand I think that a team that as to many D type players will count to many injurys in their 82 matchs season. Not just for the crunchers themselves, which get injured more often, but their teamates as well, which becomes targets of retribution.....not good either. I wouldnt want more than one, maybe two D type players, which is what the Ch have with Begin and Vandermeer. C type are important mostly on defence like Komy, Souray, Rivet and Bouillon. The B type should out-do the type A by a large meisure, here a B+ for Koivu, Pletanek, Higgins and Markov and a B- for Zednick, Ryder, Bonk, Kovalev, Ribeiro, Perezhogin, Hossa, Hainsey. Type A are Sundstrom, Bulis, Dagenais (Dagenais cant hit well because lack speed and balance). Since there is only 3 type A players for the Ch, I would say Montreal is not a soft team. They certainly showed it against the BigBadBruins during the last play-off. I feel confortable with the caractere they have shown when required but.....during the regulard season I might have liked them to have the luxury to use and play on occasion an elite enforcer....mostly against Toronto...but althought 8 time is significant, I wonder if its worth the trouble. Olliwa would be a waiver type catch from Gainey if New Jersey decided on keeping Langdon and letting Olliwa go. Our Ivanans could be our man too but I dont know much about his Hamilton performances. But as I said, I am not shure about the relevance of it all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PB Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 Sorry about my previous answer to your question. There is some repetition, computor malfonction had me thinking that the second part of the texte as chowed, had been lost last night. The first part was a re-writing today on the same topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony_ Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 I don't really have a direct response to this but I will admit a little more hitting will do more good to the team (legal hits to be precised) but on the other hand don't expect everyone to go nuts and body check anything moving on the ice. The first two lines are meant to score. Sure they can hit but that would be mainly in the sense of finishing their checks. This would be another scenario if the whole team consisted of power forwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexstream Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 BG knows his players, knows his team's strenghts and weaknesses. He openly said that he didn't wanna waste big money on a big name goon... he preferred to have unproven guys for that position and guys who contest for that position, so that they always give their all out. This season will be a career hightlight for both Vandermeer and Aitken. They've been waiting forever to get a chance to prove themselves. I prefer that to the Shannon and Chiconne signings some years ago... Don't forget that we might make some trades during the season too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Saint Posted August 18, 2005 Author Share Posted August 18, 2005 I agree with the decision to go with unproven guys, as a rule. I am far more interested in some of these uproven guys and some of our young guys than any of our former dead-wood. A guy like Bégin was more or less unproven right up until he got a shot with the Habs. I guess i am just hoping for a team with a lot of heart and very high energy. Seems like BG and the ganag are on the right track. 49 days until the season starts...Any word on when the rookie camp and tourney will be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 No, but the Habs usually dominate in the pre-season games. Yeah, the unproven guys are good. Bégin was key last year. Our second and fourth lines are trying to prove themselves and I suspect most of them will. As for the trade, the only habs I won't be mad to lose is Rivet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy10 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 We have got to make some trades....the team is too soft. Not enough size upfront.....we will not be able to compete with some of the teams if we don't make some moves...this has been a very un-inspiring start to the season...we need a shake -up! [Edited on 2005/8/18 by Guy10] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 I thought about what you said and this is what I think. We don't really have that big, tough, hard hitting guy that you think we need. We do have some tough, strong players. Players that may not dish out the pain but who reflect the pain. Koivu - the guy plays like he is 500 lbs. Zed - have you seen his legs? Powerful guy who can skate and direct himself even if a big bastard is trying to move him. Kovalev - Obviously not a tough guy but his size makes it difficult to move him around. He is a master at holding off a defender while moving the puck. Begin - A seriously tough guy in a small body. His energy and work habits make him equal to any other player in his role. Bonk - He is not the largest in the league but he is tough. He has good size and is powerful. Hockey smarts more than make up for any negatives you can think of. The only hole in this catagory is the second line. My hope is that they can put in more goals than they allow. That is why I keep posting the need to get rid of Dags and/or Ribs. Ryder at this point is too valuable to move. Let's wait and see what he does this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natural Mystic Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 Hmmm, we might be soft but that doesn't matter! We have skill and speed. Sure a power foward might be nice.. but I'm pretty happy with the group of guys we have going into training camp! I'm really exicted to see who is going to make the cut in training camp!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habhoser Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 I agree with The Saint When he says we need another Begin! A player of this energy and intensity becomes infectious to a whole team. As far as being too soft let us watch our defense with Mike Komisarek and Sheldon Souray light up the opposing forwards with good solid body contact. Nothing says look out like a great open ice hit and I believe the way Komisarek plays he reminds me a lot of Larry Robinson. Go Habs Go only 48 days can't wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortcat1 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 I agree with you, habhoser. Another Bégin would be great to have, especially one who can put it in the net too. Welcome to the gang. I trust you'll enjoy the discussions, the info, the banter. :ghg::ghg::ghg: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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