Wild Trade Idea

[Fanpuck33]

Easy Theo lovers

Theo lovers? Where? I can't find them. The fact that I say Theo was an excellent goalie for five years has nothing to do with me liking him. Who didn't love Theo before the lockout? He carried the team on his back, they'd have been almost nothing without him. That being said, the post-lockout Theo was atrocious. Sure, I was disappointed he stunk up the place, especially since I had just bought his McFarlane figure at a local store, I bought it since I was so surprised to see hockey memorabilia. But when he showed no signs of turning things around, I was thrilled he was going to Colorado. Do I like him still, no, not really. Do I think he is a talented goalie? Of course. You don't win the Vezina on luck. As I pointed out, though, that Theo is gone. Like many goalies before him and many closers in baseball, something in his head just snapped, and he doesn't have "it" anymore, whatever "it" may be.

[lazy26]

Yeah we should have kept him, what the heck was Gainey thinking when he moved him? :puke:

And who exactly said we should have kept him? You're not allowed to reply until you find a post in this thread in which one of us said we should have kept him.

No Theo wasnt a flash in the pan at all, he was a solid goalie way back when and is still one today thanks mostly to his solid positio...errr good rebound cont...ummm prominant hairline?

I agree. It's funny how you could look back at Theo's record and tell when he was on the juice. Easy Theo lovers we've been through this before ....it was just a wise-A$$ Crack.No pun intended. Oh wait that was Grant Fuhr.

I still attest that it was BLOW, and not steroids that made Theo an MVP. For no particular reason.

[BTH]

Wow, some ridiculous posts in this thread. Theo is now awful but he was, in his prime, one of the most outstanding players in the league.

[SAKS-AVENUE]

Easy Theo lovers

Theo lovers? Where? I can't find them. The fact that I say Theo was an excellent goalie for five years has nothing to do with me liking him. Who didn't love Theo before the lockout? He carried the team on his back, they'd have been almost nothing without him. That being said, the post-lockout Theo was atrocious. Sure, I was disappointed he stunk up the place, especially since I had just bought his McFarlane figure at a local store, I bought it since I was so surprised to see hockey memorabilia. But when he showed no signs of turning things around, I was thrilled he was going to Colorado. Do I like him still, no, not really. Do I think he is a talented goalie? Of course. You don't win the Vezina on luck. As I pointed out, though, that Theo is gone. Like many goalies before him and many closers in baseball, something in his head just snapped, and he doesn't have "it" anymore, whatever "it" may be.

No offense Fanpuck, I wasn't directing that at you. I just thought my wise crack would bring on the juice fighters. Ya Theo was great and then he wasn't, and then he was great, and then he wasn't......too bad...so sad.

Wow, some ridiculous posts in this thread. Theo is now awful but he was, in his prime, one of the most outstanding players in the league.

Ya...........we are not talking about someone that got old. How do you lose Vezina staus to complete crap in a matter of 2or 3 years?

[Fanpuck33]

Ya...........we are not talking about someone that got old. How do you lose Vezina staus to complete crap in a matter of 2or 3 years?

To repeat an example I've already used, the same way that closers dominate in baseball for a few years, then can't throw strikes. Brad Lidge was perhaps the best closer in the National League for two years, then Albert Pujols takes him deep in the playoffs and Lidge hasn't been the same since. Mark Wohlers was an excellent closer for the Braves for three years, then all of a sudden he could barely get an out. John Rocker is another example. Rick Ankiel, though not a closer, is another guy who was a good player who during the course of a single game lost the ability to put the ball over the plate. Same thing happens with goalies.

[alexstream]

Wow, some ridiculous posts in this thread. Theo is now awful but he was, in his prime, one of the most outstanding players in the league.

Ya...........we are not talking about someone that got old. How do you lose Vezina staus to complete crap in a matter of 2or 3 years?

When you start thinking you are too important, and you head becomes too big, etc...

First year, you saw Theo focused, etc...

Then, you'd see him with his bling bling and supa'sta' gangsta' style saying he was more focused than ever... but goddamn, he wouldn't stop a beachball in intrasquad scrimmage...

And then on, it was all a question of confidence, he's lost it.

Being a goalie is a big mental game.

To sum it up:

Theo jr - Small quick footed goalie, working hard to make it to NHL

Theo AHL - working even harder, seeing Rollie, getting weekly positioning classes

Theo 2000 - Hackett's backup, must prove that is able to do #1 job. Working hard, listening to Rollie

Theo 2001 - Kicks Hackett's ass and gains confidence

Theo 2002 - Wins some hardware, is Montreal's true #1, no question about that.

Summer - misses part of training camp because of contract dispute. Signs 2-3yrs # 6M per year, is seen in every possible TV ads.

2003 - Starship raise to the head, no more ads for Theo, so says he. So-so season. Blames everyone but himself. Is a supa'sta'

2004 - Somewhat comes back to shape, beats the bruins again.

2005 - Lockout, too much time to think about how big he is, not enough time to think about how to goalkeep in NHL.

2005 - Signs a new Supa'sta' contract after the lockout, The king is back, removes braces, has two new diamond earrings. Gangsta attitude with Ribeiro. Sharking Paris Hilton... Somehow CATCHES ALEX DAIGLE'S Syndrome... Is bigger than the team, is more important than the team, NEVER his fault, he is in the best shape of his life, says he. Can't stop a beach ball, start worrying about his capacities, thinks too much... way too much. Brain is wrecked, Confidence is lost. Jim Carey = Jose Theodore.

That's all in his head. He WAS a legitimate good goalie, when he was on his game. That's the truest you can get. But when was he on his game? Since when hasn't he been on his game?

[Wamsley01]

Wow, some ridiculous posts in this thread. Theo is now awful but he was, in his prime, one of the most outstanding players in the league.

Ya...........we are not talking about someone that got old. How do you lose Vezina staus to complete crap in a matter of 2or 3 years?

When you start thinking you are too important, and you head becomes too big, etc...

First year, you saw Theo focused, etc...

Then, you'd see him with his bling bling and supa'sta' gangsta' style saying he was more focused than ever... but goddamn, he wouldn't stop a beachball in intrasquad scrimmage...

And then on, it was all a question of confidence, he's lost it.

Being a goalie is a big mental game.

To sum it up:

Theo jr - Small quick footed goalie, working hard to make it to NHL

Theo AHL - working even harder, seeing Rollie, getting weekly positioning classes

Theo 2000 - Hackett's backup, must prove that is able to do #1 job. Working hard, listening to Rollie

Theo 2001 - Kicks Hackett's ass and gains confidence

Theo 2002 - Wins some hardware, is Montreal's true #1, no question about that.

Summer - misses part of training camp because of contract dispute. Signs 2-3yrs # 6M per year, is seen in every possible TV ads.

2003 - Starship raise to the head, no more ads for Theo, so says he. So-so season. Blames everyone but himself. Is a supa'sta'

2004 - Somewhat comes back to shape, beats the bruins again.

2005 - Lockout, too much time to think about how big he is, not enough time to think about how to goalkeep in NHL.

2005 - Signs a new Supa'sta' contract after the lockout, The king is back, removes braces, has two new diamond earrings. Gangsta attitude with Ribeiro. Sharking Paris Hilton... Somehow CATCHES ALEX DAIGLE'S Syndrome... Is bigger than the team, is more important than the team, NEVER his fault, he is in the best shape of his life, says he. Can't stop a beach ball, start worrying about his capacities, thinks too much... way too much. Brain is wrecked, Confidence is lost. Jim Carey = Jose Theodore.

That's all in his head. He WAS a legitimate good goalie, when he was on his game. That's the truest you can get. But when was he on his game? Since when hasn't he been on his game?

BINGO

[SAKS-AVENUE]

Ya...........we are not talking about someone that got old. How do you lose Vezina staus to complete crap in a matter of 2or 3 years?

To repeat an example I've already used, the same way that closers dominate in baseball for a few years, then can't throw strikes. Brad Lidge was perhaps the best closer in the National League for two years, then Albert Pujols takes him deep in the playoffs and Lidge hasn't been the same since. Mark Wohlers was an excellent closer for the Braves for three years, then all of a sudden he could barely get an out. John Rocker is another example. Rick Ankiel, though not a closer, is another guy who was a good player who during the course of a single game lost the ability to put the ball over the plate. Same thing happens with goalies.

Ya both alexstream and yourself do raise good points on how the human brain can self destruct. It is a shame.

For some crazy reason when I heard The Avs aren't going buy out Theo( give him one more chance) I felt he just might come back and have a great year. The thing is if he became great again I would probably be the 1st to say test him again.

All that bullcrap aside.....It's not like anyone could drop some roids and be an NHL player.Surely you must be enhancing a talent or skill that is already there. I wish him luck this year and hope he doesn't get caught again.

[Fanpuck33]

All that bullcrap aside.....It's not like anyone could drop some roids and be an NHL player.Surely you must be enhancing a talent or skill that is already there. I wish him luck this year and hope he doesn't get caught again.

I don't buy the steroids theory, because it doesn't really hold water. The likely reason he would have taken steroids would be to recover between games. That's why pitchers in baseball are said to have been even worse steroids users than home run hitters. In terms of helping him stop pucks, steroids wouldn't have helped him at all. Steroids don't improve your reflexes, quickness, lateral mobility, or flexibility. If anything, they hurt those areas, since bulking up keeps your muscles tighter and they have less room to give. The way steroids would benefit a goalie would be to get their stamina back more quickly between games. So while steroid use would have helped him play a full season, it would have had no effect on his goalie skills. Thus, stopping the use of steroids would have affected his durability only. In this case, he would still be a good goalie, he just wouldn't be able to play as often. Last year in Colorado disproved that idea. Thus, I don't think steroid use had any real effect on his demise, but some other cause is responsible.

[Zowpeb]

I am actually shocked that someone is actually saying that Theodore had poor positioning and rebound control...

Now, that may be true of the past couple seasons...I haven't really seen many Avs games so I won't comment on his time since he left the Habs.

However, during his tenure with the Habs he was literally KNOWN for his quick lateral movement and great overall positioning.

I think this guy hasn't watched many Habs games over the years.

[Wamsley01]

I am actually shocked that someone is actually saying that Theodore had poor positioning and rebound control...

Now, that may be true of the past couple seasons...I haven't really seen many Avs games so I won't comment on his time since he left the Habs.

However, during his tenure with the Habs he was literally KNOWN for his quick lateral movement and great overall positioning.

I think this guy hasn't watched many Habs games over the years.

Everybody is entitled to an opinion.

But take it for what it is worth. An uninformed opinion who is talking shit. Probably just trying to get everybody going.

[SAKS-AVENUE]

I am actually shocked that someone is actually saying that Theodore had poor positioning and rebound control...

Now, that may be true of the past couple seasons...I haven't really seen many Avs games so I won't comment on his time since he left the Habs.

However, during his tenure with the Habs he was literally KNOWN for his quick lateral movement and great overall positioning.

I think this guy hasn't watched many Habs games over the years.

Everybody is entitled to an opinion.

But take it for what it is worth. An uninformed opinion who is talking shit. Probably just trying to get everybody going.

I think Theo's positioning sucked, but he was quick. His rebound control was great especially if you compare it to ABBY, but very average if you compare it to Huet. I'm also very impressed with Halaks re-bound control.

Over-all I think Theo is still a better goalie then Abby and should find himself this year. I'm glad that he's not a habs anymore and we don't have to worry about it.

[Wamsley01]

I am actually shocked that someone is actually saying that Theodore had poor positioning and rebound control...

Now, that may be true of the past couple seasons...I haven't really seen many Avs games so I won't comment on his time since he left the Habs.

However, during his tenure with the Habs he was literally KNOWN for his quick lateral movement and great overall positioning.

I think this guy hasn't watched many Habs games over the years.

Everybody is entitled to an opinion.

But take it for what it is worth. An uninformed opinion who is talking shit. Probably just trying to get everybody going.

I think Theo's positioning sucked, but he was quick. His rebound control was great especially if you compare it to ABBY, but very average if you compare it to Huet. I'm also very impressed with Halaks re-bound control.

Over-all I think Theo is still a better goalie then Abby and should find himself this year. I'm glad that he's not a habs anymore and we don't have to worry about it.

In 2002 his positioning and footwork was the focus of almost every goalie publication I picked up, as well as every sports report. His reflexes were outrageous on top of it and it made him unbeatable for that year. Most of the talk focused on his first step that allowed him to move across the crease so quickly as well as Melanson's work on getting him to straighten up his butterfly to make his smaller frame much larger in the net allowing him to cover much larger portions of the net. His technique that year was superb.

But since then his play has regressed to where he is today. I will never fully write him off because guys like Sean Burke and Felix Potvin. Guys who reinvented themselves later in their career. But I doubt he will ever regain that form.

Edited July 13, 2007 by Wamsley01

[BTH]

Steroids would not help a goalie, especially not a goalie that relies solely on reflexes. Also, if he used steroids, he would have weighed much more than 175 pounds or so. From what I've seen of him, he really isn't that built.