dark_faerie87 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 I'm kinda pissed, as I like Toskala and hate the idea of a Finn playing for the Leafs. That aside however, I don't think this is a very good deal for Toronto. I believe Toskala will be turning 30 this season, so he's no spring chicken. Once again, we see the Leafs trade youth for a quick fix. I can't wait to see this attempt fail just as miserably as every other one. The impression I get from this move is that Ferguson is pulling a Wadell and knows that if he misses the playoffs this season, he will be fired. I wouldn't be surprised to see Tlusty gone by the deadline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Most Leaf fans are raging! Trading any chance at youth again and they could have had Espo or Cherry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InsaneHABSfan Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 (edited) Most Leaf fans are raging! Trading any chance at youth again and they could have had Espo or Cherry. Well lets look at this realistically. Leafs in the last two years gave up two #1's and a #2. You cannot keep doing this for a quick fix. They have not learned that it is a new NHL and really have to draft well. Leafs have quite a few defencemen in their organization and some of them are not bad. In fact they have too many defenceman since the signings last year. They will probably trade one of their better prospects for an aging scoring winger. But that will not work and they will trade their #1 and #2 next year for another goalie. It is only logical. Edited June 23, 2007 by InsaneAVSfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 Well lets look at this realistically. Leafs in the last two years gave up two #1's and a #2. You cannot keep doing this for a quick fix. They have not learned that it is a new NHL and really have to draft well. Leafs have quite a few defencemen in their organization and some of them are not bad. In fact they have too many defenceman since the signings last year. They will probably trade one of their better prospects for an aging scoring winger. But that will not work and they will trade their #1 and #2 next year for another goalie. It is only logical. I think Pogge will be with the Leafs by then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athlétique.Canadien Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 (edited) I think Pogge will be with the Leafs by then. Pogge had better do it this season. His season with the Marlies was inconsistent and it has cast a dark shaddow on what was a richer prospect. He still has that level to make a major NHL impact, but this season will tell the story on him. Could it be a bad tale? Toronto just threw the 2007 draft away. They might get 1 or 2 players out of it at best. I'm sure the players they took have some upside. But any organization that wants to gamble all picks available on late rounds only is playing with fire. Late steals are rare. It's a bad move. And, for what? Bell and Toskala? Yes, Toskala does legitmize the Leafs in goal more and Bell adds size and yes, they are both still young. My question is, why did JFJ blow the picks for these players? This could have been addressed alot better via roster player trade. It wasn't necessary. They have also managed to handcuff their cap more. Was that their UFA move? It's silly. Maybe JFJ will prove me wrong and move out some players and get some picks back. If he doesn't, this is a garbage trade. This might be a good trade for a struggling expansion team, not one that NEEDS QUANTITY in their youth depth. They have none of that. Some quality yes, but quantity reveals diamonds in the rough. Leafs dumb dumb dumb Edited June 24, 2007 by ATHLÉTIQUE.CANADIEN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 The Leafs prospect pool has to be in the bottom 5 in the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athlétique.Canadien Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 (edited) The pattern is clear. Look at the quantity and I'll use Montreal as an example for a comparison. 2003 57 D John Doherty 91 L Martin Sagat 125 R Konstantin Volkov 158 C John Mitchell 220 C Jeremy Williams 237 C Shaun Landolt 2004 90 G Justin Pogge 113 F Roman Kukumberg 157 D Dmitry Vorobiev 187 L Robbie Earl 220 D Maxim Semenov 252 C Jan Steber 285 R Pierce Norton 2005 21 G Tuukka Rask Bruins 82 D Phil Oreskovic 153 R Alex Berry 173 W Johan Dahlberg 216 D Anton Stralman 228 C Chad Rau 2006 13 C Jiri Tlusty 44 W Nikolai Kulemin 99 G James Reimer 111 D Korbinian Holzer 161 L Viktor Stahlberg 166 C Tyler Ruegsegger 180 C Leo Komarov --------------------------------------- 2003 10 W Andrei Kostitsyn 40 C Cory Urquhart 61 C Maxim Lapierre 79 D Ryan O'Byrne 113 C Corey Locke 123 L Danny Stewart 177 G Christopher Heino-Lind 188 D Mark Flood 217 Oskari Korpikari 241 L Jimmy Bonneau 271 G Jaroslav Halak 2004 18 C Kyle Chipchura 84 D Alexei Yemelin 100 R J.T. Wyman 150 C Mikhail Grabovsky 181 G Loic Lacasse 212 D Jon Gleed 246 R Greg Stewart 262 D Mark Streit 278 D Alexandre Dulac-Lemeli 2005 5 G Carey Price 45 R Guillaume Latendresse 121 C Juraj Mikus Not signed 130 C Mathieu Aubin 190 R Matt D'Agostini 200 R Sergei Kostitsyn 229 D Philippe Paquet 2006 20 D David Fischer 49 C Ben Maxwell 53 D Mathieu Carle 66 C Ryan White 139 D Pavel Valentenko 199 D Cameron Cepek I could use other teams besides Montreal as an example and you'd still see it time after time. No quantity. Edited June 24, 2007 by ATHLÉTIQUE.CANADIEN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InsaneHABSfan Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 Pogge had better do it this season. His season with the Marlies was inconsistent and it has cast a dark shaddow on what was a richer prospect. He still has that level to make a major NHL impact, but this season will tell the story on him. Could it be a bad tale? A.C. hope you don't mind me hilighting one point from your post. What you said is correct that Poggie was more of a disappearing act than a good goaltender. JFjr is really defending this guy right now telling the flock faithful that he had a great second half of the season and the team was not good in front of him. Personally I like Poggie and hope he has a good career, however I believe that JFjr really screwed up trading Rask for mr. Red Light 37 game winner. Rask and Poggie on the same club would have pushed each other to be better. With no quality goaltending on the Marlies playing with Poggie, he is the best by default and MAY slip in his development. Plus Leafs have no patience with young players so he will eventually be traded... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsniper Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 A.C. hope you don't mind me hilighting one point from your post. What you said is correct that Poggie was more of a disappearing act than a good goaltender. JFjr is really defending this guy right now telling the flock faithful that he had a great second half of the season and the team was not good in front of him. Personally I like Poggie and hope he has a good career, however I believe that JFjr really screwed up trading Rask for mr. Red Light 37 game winner. Rask and Poggie on the same club would have pushed each other to be better. With no quality goaltending on the Marlies playing with Poggie, he is the best by default and MAY slip in his development. Plus Leafs have no patience with young players so he will eventually be traded... Good, Pogge, as an all-star Hitmen, is one of my favorite players. I'd hate to have to cheer for him as a Leaf. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habsfan24 Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Toskala has only played 115 NHL games as well.......and this past year was the most games he's played (38) And Bell has underachieved to date...and I could have got more than 20+ points playing with Marleau and Thorton....... So I think (on paper) that SJ won this trade..... I think this is a really good point about Toskala. Montreal was in a similar situation with Huet with a goalie that proved at times he could steal games and was amazing, but this past season was the only time when he was made a #1 and tried to play the whole season in his NHL career. Now I think Huet is a fine goalie but it is hard for a goalie thats never done it before to do it....they seem to get burnt out and tend to get injured. We will see how Toskala does but don't be surprised if something similar to this happens to him this year....Esp since Toronto's defence is pretty weak and he won't be getting much help. Oh yeah and I hope Saku or Lahti knows some of his secrets and can share them with everyone on the Habs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathieu30 Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 I hope Saku or Lahti knows some of his secrets and can share them with everyone on the Habs I think we have scouts for that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InsaneHABSfan Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Oh yeah and I hope Saku or Lahti knows some of his secrets and can share them with everyone on the Habs I bet they have a good idea on where his weakness is. No doubt Toskala is now under the T-DOT media gun and it will be shamefull to see the flock turn on him if he does not work out. Sharks coaching staff were really high on his abilities so this just may work out for JFjr. Problem is if you trade away or don't draft anybody good, then who is going to score the goals for the Leafs? Tucker, Sundin???? Thats way too many question marks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsniper Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 I bet they have a good idea on where his weakness is. No doubt Toskala is now under the T-DOT media gun and it will be shamefull to see the flock turn on him if he does not work out. Sharks coaching staff were really high on his abilities so this just may work out for JFjr. Problem is if you trade away or don't draft anybody good, then who is going to score the goals for the Leafs? Tucker, Sundin???? Thats way too many question marks! Come on! They re-signed Antropov! Duh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathieu30 Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Come on! They re-signed Antropov! Duh! Simon Gamache!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Antropov is a good example on why JFJ decided to spend so much money into scouting. Then again, he traded his top 2 picks the day before the draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InsaneHABSfan Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 (edited) Antropov is a good example on why JFJ decided to spend so much money into scouting. Then again, he traded his top 2 picks the day before the draft. The usual Toronto mouthpieces (Raptors play by play mouth :puke: ) is already drooling over their new smurf! He even admitted he knows nothing about the kids. Shows you that the experts in T-Dot :puke: are really only experts in their own minds. By 20 games in the season, JFjr just might have to have multiple botles of something for an upset stomach. :puke: Real men cheer for :hlogo: Edited June 26, 2007 by InsaneAVSfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 If the Leafs get off to a rough start JFJ will be fired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habsfan24 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 If the Leafs get off to a rough start JFJ will be fired. I agree he has really stuck his neck out and taken another big risk on this trade. His neck is already sticking way to far out there...bad start = goodbye JFJ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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