Athlétique.Canadien Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 (edited) I will defend Bob all day. Heck, we don't know what really goes on. What if Guerin had an NTC? Guerin didn't have a NTC but it was reported he was ecstatic about going to SJ. Big Joe was delighted. They played together in Boston. They're friends. It's very possible that he has the power to approve a trade. Some players say they just won't go to certain cities. Many rumours and reports had SL trying to sign Guerin. Edited February 28, 2007 by ATHLÉTIQUE.CANADIEN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 I will defend Bob all day. Heck, we don't know what really goes on. What if Guerin had an NTC? Guerin didn't have a NTC but it was reported he was ecstatic about going to SJ. Big Joe was delighted. They played together in Boston. They're friends. It's very possible that he has the power to approve a trade. Some players say they just won't go to certain cities. Many rumours and reports had SL trying to sign Guerin. Yep. Samsonov had a clause in his contract that said he could only be traded to one of 10 specific teams. Yet it's not considered a no-trade clause so nobody knows about it. Just like any player in the league could have one of those clauses. Maybe Souray did and none of those teams were willing to pay up for him (LA, SJ, Phoenix, ...) so Bob had to keep him. there are jus tso many intangibles that we don't know about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smon Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 Well, it's not like we'll know - but trust me, if Souray had that kind of a clause, the media would figure it out somehow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 Well, it's not like we'll know - but trust me, if Souray had that kind of a clause, the media would figure it out somehow. would these be the same yo yos that had K27 on waivers? Really some of these guys can't figure out whick sock is their left or right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 would these be the same yo yos that had K27 on waivers? Really some of these guys can't figure out whick sock is their left or right. ...I thought socks were interchangeable...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobby Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 I'm pleased with myself if I manage to get two the same color, on my feet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLP Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 I'm pleased with myself if I manage to get two the same color, on my feet... I don't match socks by color, I go by thickness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trizzak Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 I don't match socks by color, I go by thickness. /Stephen Wright fixed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobby Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 Everyone seems to be moaning about what Gainey didn't do...roughly half because he didn't trade Souray and build for the future, the other half because he didn't add a couple more rentals to try to salvage the present. But if you look what he did do, it is more helpful. He dealt with a potential dressing room problem, and future financial problem by trading Craig Rivet. I'm a big fan of Rivet, but obviously Guy Carbonneau is not so much. If Craig returned from his injury and wasn't considered to be a top 4 defenseman on the team, there would have been a lot of angst. He is one of the leaders for sure, and if he was a healthy scratch, or playing 10 minutes a game, there would have been a lot of tension I think. Not to mention the field day the Franco press in Montreal would have with the situation. For the future, it is one less UFA for Gainey to have to deal with next year. He can now better focus his attention, and budget, on Markov and Souray. In addition to divesting the team of a potential distraction, he cut the budget by a million and a half dollars and acquired a good young prospect in Josh Gorges, and a first round pick in the upcoming entry draft. In a normal year, a 22 year old NHL player and a first round pick would be the price for the very best of the rental players. Then he brought in some extra insurance and competition at a problem spot in the form of Michael Leighton. At 25, Leighton still qualifies as a budding prospect, especially at his position, while having sufficient NHL experience to be considered a reliable backup. I think Bob came as close as possible to giving something to both extremes of the fan base, an upgrade to the present team and a potential top 20 draft pick for the futurists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHice Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 Everyone seems to be moaning about what Gainey didn't do...roughly half because he didn't trade Souray and build for the future, the other half because he didn't add a couple more rentals to try to salvage the present. But if you look what he did do, it is more helpful. He dealt with a potential dressing room problem, and future financial problem by trading Craig Rivet. I'm a big fan of Rivet, but obviously Guy Carbonneau is not so much. If Craig returned from his injury and wasn't considered to be a top 4 defenseman on the team, there would have been a lot of angst. He is one of the leaders for sure, and if he was a healthy scratch, or playing 10 minutes a game, there would have been a lot of tension I think. Not to mention the field day the Franco press in Montreal would have with the situation. For the future, it is one less UFA for Gainey to have to deal with next year. He can now better focus his attention, and budget, on Markov and Souray. In addition to divesting the team of a potential distraction, he cut the budget by a million and a half dollars and acquired a good young prospect in Josh Gorges, and a first round pick in the upcoming entry draft. In a normal year, a 22 year old NHL player and a first round pick would be the price for the very best of the rental players. Then he brought in some extra insurance and competition at a problem spot in the form of Michael Leighton. At 25, Leighton still qualifies as a budding prospect, especially at his position, while having sufficient NHL experience to be considered a reliable backup. I think Bob came as close as possible to giving something to both extremes of the fan base, an upgrade to the present team and a potential top 20 draft pick for the futurists. i hope you are not saying craig rivet was a dressing room problem? good lord man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobby Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 I'm saying that if Carbonneau lost his trust in Rivet and played Streit ahead of him it could have been a problem. Craig is a pretty proud guy and didn't take the last benching too well. Rivet was a tremendous asset in the room while he was a regular and taking a lot of responsibility on the ice, but I don't think that would be the case if he was watching from the stands or sitting at the end of the bench. He has some strong alliances with senior members of the team and the potential was definitely there for controversy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MFT77 Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 Agreed that it probably would not go over too well if Carbo was to keep scratching Rivet. But over the last while I believe Streit is a much better fit with Souray on the back end. Boullion is the next one I would like to see out of the lineup whether it's to look at Gorges or put Ninimaa back in the lineup. Was hopin Boullion would be shipped out for anything. Too small, and makes alot of crappy passes. For 2 million, i see him as no better than a 6th or 7th d-man. Love the deal for Rivet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafikz Posted February 28, 2007 Author Share Posted February 28, 2007 Again, great job Habs organisation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habitforming Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 Come on, there is no way Ryder is worth more than Nilsson and O'Marra. Ryder is a 60 point player, he's not some kind of great player. Not only that, but from most accounts, his effort level is extremely inconsistent. Nilsson is going through the same stuggles as Kostitsyn, adapting to North American hockey. Not saying either one is better, but Kostitsyn was taken 5 picks before Nilsson and hasn't proven himself yet. O'Marra isn't even 20 years old, it's a bit early to be writing him off. And on top of it, Ryder will be a RFA at season's end and he has a history of being difficult to sign. We are gonna have to just agree to disagree on this one I guess. Lowe would have loved to add a 30 goal scorer instead of 2 kids tht IF they make it, might come close to that total. Kosty's adapting to the N.A game is over (see AHL stats) and Nilsson has never had an issue with the playing styles or language barriers. They just aren't comparable at all. For the record, I'm not writing O'marra off already. i thought in his draft year he was a Smyth type player...I was wrong. He is at best a Radek Bonk defensive centre who can chip in a few ala Chipchura. this deal is not worth ryan Smyth. But the rumored offer from the habs (Milroy etc ) is surely not enough either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaos Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 At 25, Leighton still qualifies as a budding prospect A guy who is on his 4th or 5th team, and that you picked up off the waiver wire is not a budding prospect. He's a failed prospect and what you might call a journeyman....but thats really a term for a guy who has played alot for different teams. This guy has just been claimed by alot of different teams. He will end up in Hamilton and is just insurance incase Aebischer, Halak and Danis get injured....in that order Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobby Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 Regards to Leighton, I don't think his waiver wire moves necessarily are a negative thing. Most of that has happened within the past year, once he reached the age and contract status that teams HAD TO subject him to waivers to bring him up from the minor leagues. Hell, Montreal lost Ron Hainsey that way, and Hainsey is the #2 defenseman in Columbus at the moment. He is the same age as Leighton. I think you have to consider Mathieu Biron as part of the Rivet deal as well, even though he was acquired from the Sharks back in December. I'm pretty sure that is what started the ball rolling. It was speculated at the time that Biron was acquired as insurance to cover the potential loss of one or more of the Habs looming UFA defensemen. Also it was such an apparent overpayment by the Sharks (26 year old Biron for 32 year old Traverse who hasn't played in NHL for 4 years.. ), you had to think there was a nudge and a wink between Gainey and Doug Wilson regarding future negotiations. Looking at it from that POV, Habs get a big 26 year old right side rearguard in Biron to cover what they lose in Rivet, and a 22 year old utility guy in Gorges to fill in as necessary. Along with the draft pick of course, which is currently at about the same spot as they took David Fisher last summer. In exchange they give up two 32 year old defensemen, both of whom wanted out of the organization. Both are free agents at the end of the season, and the odds of either resigning in Montreal were probably between slim and none. Traverse is done, in any case, barring a team plane crash somewhere, or an entire NHL roster coming down with bird flu at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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