johnnyhasbeen Posted December 24, 2006 Share Posted December 24, 2006 Seems alot of us, me included at times look at the Habs ssecond line as coming up short due to poor goal production. I have to say that although this line isn't putting up the figures it could or probably should be, they are very effective in another way. They are wearing down the checkers on the opposing teams. They are creating chances although not capitalizing, which wears on both the opposing goalies and team moral. They end most shifts it seems with the puck in the opposing zone. These add up to chances for our top and 4th line. I think most teams would happily have our 2nd line. It is a great line and if the gaols start to go in, look out league. Take the 2nd period feed from Kovalev to Plekenec vs Boston. It was a sure goal that he hesitated for a second on, resulting in a save. When these start to click, look out. Looking forward to the playoff run. We are serious contenders this year. Get use to it ! Merry Christmas to all, and special wishes to the Gainey family this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Harry Posted December 24, 2006 Share Posted December 24, 2006 Seems alot of us, me included at times look at the Habs ssecond line as coming up short due to poor goal production. I have to say that although this line isn't putting up the figures it could or probably should be, they are very effective in another way. They are wearing down the checkers on the opposing teams. They are creating chances although not capitalizing, which wears on both the opposing goalies and team moral. They end most shifts it seems with the puck in the opposing zone. These add up to chances for our top and 4th line. I think most teams would happily have our 2nd line. It is a great line and if the gaols start to go in, look out league. Take the 2nd period feed from Kovalev to Plekenec vs Boston. It was a sure goal that he hesitated for a second on, resulting in a save. When these start to click, look out. Looking forward to the playoff run. We are serious contenders this year. Get use to it ! Merry Christmas to all, and special wishes to the Gainey family this year. Seems to me like they are getting tons of chances (and often in spectacular ways) but are hard luck line that isnt getting many breaks. Look at Kovalev's goal getting called back (and being served a minor) for getting pushed over the goalie, and Samsonov's beauty getting robbed by a sprawling Thomas. If those 2 had counted it would've been a much different game. Anyways, I've got no probs with their play, and the breaks will come, maybe Carbo could try throwing different guys into Plekanic's position tho, if there's anything dragging down that line its his ciment hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortcat1 Posted December 24, 2006 Share Posted December 24, 2006 Seems alot of us, me included at times look at the Habs ssecond line as coming up short due to poor goal production. I have to say that although this line isn't putting up the figures it could or probably should be, they are very effective in another way. They are wearing down the checkers on the opposing teams. They are creating chances although not capitalizing, which wears on both the opposing goalies and team moral. They end most shifts it seems with the puck in the opposing zone. These add up to chances for our top and 4th line. I think most teams would happily have our 2nd line. It is a great line and if the gaols start to go in, look out league. Take the 2nd period feed from Kovalev to Plekenec vs Boston. It was a sure goal that he hesitated for a second on, resulting in a save. When these start to click, look out. Looking forward to the playoff run. We are serious contenders this year. Get use to it ! Merry Christmas to all, and special wishes to the Gainey family this year. very interesting perspective... i never thought of that... kind of like it too... GO :hlogo: GO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted December 24, 2006 Share Posted December 24, 2006 Interesting but let me play devils advocate for a moment. I could say that because they are not scoring it makes their teammates believe the goalie is really on his game and will be next to impossible to beat on this particular evening. Also big saves and shutting down big chances usually shifts momentum to the opposing team as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbhatt Posted December 24, 2006 Share Posted December 24, 2006 Carbo could try throwing different guys into Plekanic's position tho, if there's anything dragging down that line its his ciment hands. Amen! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortcat1 Posted December 24, 2006 Share Posted December 24, 2006 Amen! hmmmmm........... sbhatt... do i get a suble hint of you not particularly liking plekanec??? that's two posts on two different but related topics where you make disparaging comments... hmmmmm............ GO :hlogo: GO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbhatt Posted December 24, 2006 Share Posted December 24, 2006 hmmmmm........... sbhatt... do i get a suble hint of you not particularly liking plekanec??? that's two posts on two different but related topics where you make disparaging comments... hmmmmm............ GO :hlogo: GO! Hmmm....perceptive, you are. Strong in the ways of the force, are you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted December 25, 2006 Share Posted December 25, 2006 Amen! If "cement hands" means he's a bad stickhandler, that's not true. If cement hands means he isn't good at playmaking, that's wrong. If cement hands means he doesn't have a bullet of a shot, that's wrong. If cement hands means he doesn't hustle both ways every night, then that's wrong. If cement hands means he isn't a strong defensive player, then that's wrong. Give him a break, it's only his second season and people are expecting so much of him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chips Posted December 25, 2006 Share Posted December 25, 2006 I'm a fan of Plex's; I do think he is young and needs sometime and would be better suited to playing with finishers, sammy and kovy are playmakers who work hard most of the time. Plex could use a scorer on his wing like higgins with a crasher banger like Lats as well; All I'm saying is he's young and has proven to me and to the coaching staff that he can play many different roles. If his faceoffs improve and the pucks go into the net on his shorthanded / breakaway chances that he seems to be in many times then this would be a different calibre player in our minds. Nevertheless. I've always considered him as being a possible trade bait type of player. He can offer many teams options. And could be part of a package deal; Needless to say as long as he plays for us he will be in my good books. And I'm happy with his contributions thus far. merry xmas all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Harry Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 (edited) If "cement hands" means he's a bad stickhandler, that's not true. If cement hands means he isn't good at playmaking, that's wrong. If cement hands means he doesn't have a bullet of a shot, that's wrong. If cement hands means he doesn't hustle both ways every night, then that's wrong. If cement hands means he isn't a strong defensive player, then that's wrong. Give him a break, it's only his second season and people are expecting so much of him. Actually, by cement hands I mean a lack of finish. I agree he is a good player in all the ways you mention, but he isn't making the most of the opportinities that he is getting playing with two of the most spectacular players in the league. He is missing passes and other setups, and worst of all he has mike ribeiro/jan bulis miss the open net syndrome. MIke Ryder may be lacking in some of the fundamentals of the game, but nobody can argue with his 25-30 goal seasons, he can bury the puck when he gets the chance. I just dont think pleks can keep pace with kovalev/samsonov in the offensive zone and its dragging down their production, Carbo needs to either bring a guy up from 1st line to play with them (and replace him with guillaume) or maybe try bonk as the 2nd line centre. Either way I think the 2nd line could crank it up with a guy with steadier hands who knows how to find the back of the net and is more comfortable with those two. Plexkanics would be better suited to a 3rd or 4th line role. Edited December 26, 2006 by Dirty Harry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbhatt Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 If "cement hands" means he's a bad stickhandler, that's not true. If cement hands means he isn't good at playmaking, that's wrong. If cement hands means he doesn't have a bullet of a shot, that's wrong. If cement hands means he doesn't hustle both ways every night, then that's wrong. If cement hands means he isn't a strong defensive player, then that's wrong. Give him a break, it's only his second season and people are expecting so much of him. He's an average setup man at best, and he can't score for beans. This guy puts the puck right into the middle of the goalie's chest at least 9/10 times. Second year or not, he's just not a scorer...and he isn't a good enough playmaker to warrant second line status. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs_25th Posted December 29, 2006 Share Posted December 29, 2006 I wonder how the second line would have performed if Ribeiro were still with the team and on a line with Kovy and Samsonov. Think they would have been better offensively and much better at controlling the puck, but would they have shot at the net more and scored more goals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Petrov Posted December 29, 2006 Share Posted December 29, 2006 I had been wondering how much Kovalev is still pissed that they traded Ribeiro after he had said he was happy to finally have found a centreman that worked well with him. I can't imagine that Plekanec's task in gelling with Kovy was made very easy by that aspect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShortHanded Posted December 29, 2006 Share Posted December 29, 2006 Actually, by cement hands I mean a lack of finish. I agree he is a good player in all the ways you mention, but he isn't making the most of the opportinities that he is getting playing with two of the most spectacular players in the league. He is missing passes and other setups, and worst of all he has mike ribeiro/jan bulis miss the open net syndrome. MIke Ryder may be lacking in some of the fundamentals of the game, but nobody can argue with his 25-30 goal seasons, he can bury the puck when he gets the chance. I just dont think pleks can keep pace with kovalev/samsonov in the offensive zone and its dragging down their production, Carbo needs to either bring a guy up from 1st line to play with them (and replace him with guillaume) or maybe try bonk as the 2nd line centre. Either way I think the 2nd line could crank it up with a guy with steadier hands who knows how to find the back of the net and is more comfortable with those two. Plexkanics would be better suited to a 3rd or 4th line role. I think I agree about the 3rd or 4th line role for Plex, and also with whoever said they saw him as trade bait. I think Plex is one of those players who's a jack of most trades, but in the role he's in right now with the team, I don't really think it's a matter of being more patient with him, I just don't think he has the skillset to play with these two... I'd be tempted to try Bonk on that line and push Plex into the third line centre role, although at the same time, the third line is golden, why break them up, right??? Maybe just try this switch up for a game or two and see what happens? I mean, remember, Bonk had all his high-scoring seasons in Ottawa playing with offensive linemates. He'd fit there, and if it didn't work, just switch it back. I know a lot of ppl want to see Higgins on the 2nd line. That would be my second option after trying Bonk there first, for all the reasons we've all seen in other threads: higgins is a better winger than centre, etc, etc. I also want to see the first line gelling with Higgins Koivu Ryder again and I think they need a few more games to get totally re-acquainted (not that they haven't played well since he returned from the injury, just that they haven't been totally dominant like they can be). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 He's an average setup man at best, and he can't score for beans. This guy puts the puck right into the middle of the goalie's chest at least 9/10 times. Second year or not, he's just not a scorer...and he isn't a good enough playmaker to warrant second line status. I don't think he really belongs on a 2nd line either. But he is a good playmaker. He's got a decent shot too but he doesn't use it much, it kinda comes out in bursts. Anywa, point is that even if he belongs onthe 3rd or 4th line, he still in't "useless" or a "piece of shit" like people have been calling him. He's a decent young player, and a hardworking one. For the amount he currently gets paid, you won't find much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 Pleks is the second coming of Jan Bulis. And as with Bulis, there will always be those who expect him to 'break out' or grow into the role of a top-6 forward. But I doubt that he'll ever be more than a useful all-around player without any overriding strengths - a player of greater benefit to bad teams looking for respectability than to contenders. Don't be too surprised if he's dealt as part of a package...hopefully to get a bona-fide second-line C. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smon Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 I have to agree. Plekanec may be a bargain and a hard worker, but he's hopelessly out of his element on the second line. The parallels with Bulis are too strong to ignore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoRvInA Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 I care to differ on that! Pleks has a better shot than Bulis... but unlike Bulis he has poor positioning... Bulius had way more chances... he placed himself well... only that he Sucked SO badly at putting it in the net Pleks was playing awesomely before his goal and got even better afterwards... it shows you how in need we are of a good centreman on the second line... if Pleks can do half of what he did last night in every game we could guarantee at least one point from the second line per game and I can live with that night after night! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Petrov Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Also, unlike Bulis, Plekanec is not the ugliest human on the planet. But seriously, folks, Plekanec is also a lot easier to have on the team. Carbo was talking about him last night and saying how he always works hard and never complains about what Carbo does with him. A big reason why Bulis isn't back in Montreal is because he decided 2/3rds of the way through last season that he would no longer accept Gainey putting him in a checking role, and would only play on a scoring line...hence his benchings late last season. If I were a coach, it would annoy me to no end to have to deal with a player pulling that nonsense during a playoff run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MFT77 Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Agreed, look at what Bulis is doing in VAN, can't even earn a spot on their top two lines and they are having trouble scoring goals. As a 3rd line checker being paid accordingly he is worth it, but definitely not a top 6 forward on a strong team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullsmith Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 The Pleks/Bulis comparisons are just wrong. Pleks works his ass off, Bulis didn't and that is everything in this league. I also have to say the idea that we'd be better with Ribiero is also just wrong. Clearly the Habs are a better team this year than last, and it ain't cause Samsonov is lighting it up. If Ribiero was on the 2nd line they'd probably have more points, but they'd likely be a minus fifty by now. Pleks is a valuable player. He's got no finish and he isn't exactly helping the 2nd line light it up, but he's also looking after the defensive zone in a way Samsonov and Kovalev just can't. Nothing against either of them, I frankly think they've worked hard this year and haven't blamed Carbo or Pleks for their lack of production as a line, which is to their credit. All that said, Pleks isn't anyone's dream 2nd line center. He's a solid 3rd liner and makes a 4th line dangerous as hell. He can kill penalites and I sometimes think he's more likely to score shorthanded than at even strength. If we do pick up a name center he could well be part of the deal, as any smart GM would be happy to have him on their team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smon Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 They're similar in the sense that they can't finish. Not in terms of work ethic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShortHanded Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 They're similar in the sense that they can't finish. Not in terms of work ethic. I think the Bulis-bashing is acceptable in terms of his whining about being a top-six forward in the middle of a playoff race, and all that whole ego bit, but I don't think it's fair to say bulis had low work-ethic. I thought most times on the ice he was working pretty hard. All said, I'd rather have Plex on the team than Bulis, but I liked Bulis... Except for the top six forward thing, he wasn't a prima-donna... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoZed Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Plex is already a better 2-way player than Bulis ever was, and he's also got a much better head for hockey, and is a much better puckhandler. The "can't finish" label is unfair, and its dissapointing to see fans jumping to conclusions so quickly and close the door on a young player that way. Plex's just got 1 less goal than Samsonov. Both did'nt shoot enough so far this season and have been snake-bitten because they lacked confidence in their offensive game. That's completely different than a Bulis who missed chances season after season. Plex just 24 and is in his 2nd NHL season. He's already a reliable 2-way C and an excellent penalty killer. He's playing a position which has a lot of responsabilities and he hasn't been paired with the two easiest winger to get along with. Even Koivu had his trouble with Kovy last season. The offense will come as Plex grows into his role and gets a little more experience under his belt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smon Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Well KoZed, to be fair Plekanec hardly put any impressive offensive numbers in the AHL or in the Czech leagues. He wasn't drafted to be or has ever thought to have been an offensively capable player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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