BTH Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 What Makes Saku Koivu so much better? I dont care if hes a small guy... Ok...so hes small..is that why people like him? He cant stickhandle like kovalev...he cant hold people off like kovalev..hell..Kovalev just stepped into the circle and his win percentage is greater then koivu's. Kovalev has single handedly helped Montreal win games last season, and with the hopes of even standing a chance in a few this season (Comeback against the leafs). How can you say Kovalev has a black heart? Dont you idiots read Canadiens.com...Who just took over Theodore's box for sick children...KOVALEV did..so dont give me that rubbish that he doesn't give back to the community. I will defend Alex Kovalev...Saku Koivu took a lot of stupid penalties in the offensive zone, restricting scoring chances last year. If the guy used his head, I would cheer for him, but I am Anti Saku Koivu...Yes I said it Habsworld...I am Anti Saku Koivu....And some of you idiots blew this way out of proportion when the topic was specifically who would you like to see as the captain when Koivu. Its an opinion...Live with it. And as for those who sympathize with koivu's cancer and eye injury, that just as easily could have happened to anyone else on the Habs, and anyone else in the NHL at that! Its called reality. Is it that hard to accept that both are great and extremely valuable players. Why do you keep on repeating how skilled Kovalev is, I don't think anyone here even thinks for a second that Koivu is as talented a stickhandler or player. Anyway, if you want Kovalev to be our next captain then so be it, I listed him as one of the candidates in my post, as well, but no reason to bash Koivu while you're at it (and call everyone who disagrees with you an idiot). ...by the way, someone brought up the point that Koivu captained a national team. Kovalev was captain of Team Russia. Not making an argument, just stating the facts... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smon Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 Justin, you're just borderline silly right now. Calling other people idiots isn't going to get you anywhere. Simply put, people like Koivu because he actually tries hard every single game, unlike Kovalev who sulks and coasts from time to time. Oh and by the way, Kovalev's win percentage at faceoffs is 52. Koivu is 54. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cataclaw Posted November 3, 2006 Author Share Posted November 3, 2006 (edited) Alright, justinb, i'm taking you on. You've crossed the line. (Black = your post, red = my reply) What Makes Saku Koivu so much better? I dont care if hes a small guy... Ok...so hes small..is that why people like him? People like Koivu because he's a veteran player with huge intensity, motivation, drive, passion and leadership. His battle with cancer is a good example of his determination. He's an inspiration to his fellow players. I'm not making this up, just listen to the interviews and see what other Habs have to say about their captain. He's a small guy, he knows he's outmuscled, but what he lacks in size he makes up for threefold in sheer drive and skill. He cant stickhandle like kovalev...he cant hold people off like kovalev..hell..Kovalev just stepped into the circle and his win percentage is greater then koivu's. Wrong. Do your homework first. I just crunched the numbers myself and here they are: Koivu 48.7% after 59 face offs Kovalev 47.6% after 23 face-offs Also Kovalev gets called often for missing his face-offs and he ends up leaving them to Perezhogin or Samsonov Kovalev has single handedly helped Montreal win games last season, and with the hopes of even standing a chance in a few this season (Comeback against the leafs). True, Kovalev can single handedly help Montreal win games during the season. Not taking that away from him. Koivu however, can and does single handedly lift his team to wins (or at least close games) night after night. If Kovalev wins games, Koivu wins seasons. How can you say Kovalev has a black heart? Dont you idiots read Canadiens.com...Who just took over Theodore's box for sick children...KOVALEV did..so dont give me that rubbish that he doesn't give back to the community. No one ever said Kovalev had a "black heart". I challenge you to indicate where in this thread you see mention of such an accusation, on my part or anyone else's. Kovalev is a kind man and we love him for it. Calling your fellow Canadiens fans "idiots" however, for merely stating their opinion, is not a kind thing indeed. I will defend Alex Kovalev...Saku Koivu took a lot of stupid penalties in the offensive zone, restricting scoring chances last year. If the guy used his head, I would cheer for him, but I am Anti Saku Koivu...Yes I said it Habsworld...I am Anti Saku Koivu.... Koivu is guilty of taking silly hooking penalties, but again, i would just like to point out that Koivu has 10 PIM whereas Kovalev has 30. Try backing up your claims with facts next time. And some of you idiots blew this way out of proportion when the topic was specifically who would you like to see as the captain when Koivu. Its an opinion...Live with it. And as for those who sympathize with koivu's cancer and eye injury, that just as easily could have happened to anyone else on the Habs, and anyone else in the NHL at that! Its called reality. Perhaps, but i doubt if they'd all have hung in there with the same determination Koivu demonstrated. Again, calling us idiots, why? The fact is, you're trying to turn this into a Kovalev-Koivu competition. Both players are very talented and both are quite respected. You're calling us idiots, you're insulting members of the team, and your only claims regarding Kovalev have no supporting arguments. Your post was frankly a waste of kilobytes. If i were an admin, i'd ban you. Edited November 3, 2006 by Cataclaw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortcat1 Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 not to bash justintb but it's interesting that he has the same name and last initial of my nephew who has a short fuse. GO :hlogo: GO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habsfan88 Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 Also, about Justin's post about how Kovalev has his sick children foundation, well Koivu has his own foundation called The Saku Koivu Foundation, to help raise money for a PET scan machine to discover the early signs of cancer, so they can get rid of it before it truly starts... And yea, you need to chill out with the name-calling buddy, go back to preschool, u dont call someone an idiot when you disagree with them , shove a damn lollipop in your mouth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seb Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 Anyone remember how old Stevie Y was when he was named captain of the wings? How old is Higgins now? I'll let you guys do the math. Besides, Higgins reminds me of Yzerman in the way he plays and what kind of person he is. If koivu were to suffer a career-ending injury, we would play out the season without a captain, and next year Higgins would be wearing it without a doubt. Lovin' the Habs this year, and I hope Koivu sticks around as long as he can cause he's a wicked player! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koivu-11 Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 If you ant a young guy it will be higgins over Chipchura as he been there long, If you want a medium guy it could be Perezhogin kinda hard to say... but he has so much heart. also could be someone like begin if hes there for a while...hes like that hype type Captain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbhatt Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 I'm hoping it's Higgins. He keeps playing like he has been, and Bob should lock him into a good long contract. He works hard every shift, he scores, he kills penalties...seldom takes penalties. I think he'd be a great lead-by-example captain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justintb Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 Okay....Saku Koivu played a decent game tonight...but so did Kovalev. I am just trying to state that Alex Kovalev is very skilled and talented person, who in the case of Koivu's absence or departure, can take over his leadership role. That is all i was trying to state. He does beat Saku in numbers...sure but I never said Koivu didnt play with heart out there. There are times where he takes irresponsible penalties and doesnt show the leadership role that he should be showing....but there are also times where kovalev takes a few shifts off. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion...im sorry for offending so many of you with this topic. I never would have expected to many Koivu supporters to have stepped up for their beloved captain. We are all entitled to our own opinion on here...I am just a "rookie" in Posts, but I know hockey much better then some of you think (for I have played at the Junior level)...as some of you have been here forever it seems and have time to discuss all day/night long....I am taking 7 courses this year in university in Toronto. And dont ever get me wrong...I am probably one of the most dedicated Canadiens fans alive. I will always wear my kovalev jersey to every game... i will always wear my Canadiens hat in the middle of Leafs Nation...because I am a true fan...I will be the one fan yelling go habs go in a room full of leafs fans...I dont care...You guys may have thought that something was accomplished here by ganging up on me in my defence for Alex Kovalev...but for future...please give the guy some credit that he deserves..and quit calling him a whiner, a diver, etc etc...for he is just as big of an asset to the Canadiens as Koivu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozhab Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 I never would have expected to many Koivu supporters to have stepped up for their beloved captain. I wouldn't really say it's about being a Koivu supporter but rather about the confidence he instills and the inspiration he provides. The guy has been the backbone of club for the better part of six/seven years. Forget the couple of seasons Theo stole for the club - leaders stand up when it counts. Leaders are accountable on AND off the ice. Koivu was voted captain by the squad as a sign of solidarity and stability in a time of turmoil for the club. Why? Because the players respected the heart, effort and drive he brought to the team. Look at how Kovalev's skill inspires you and you can appreciate why Koivu inspires (through so many intangibles beyond skill) not only his squad, but Canadiens fans as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HABBER-oooooKNOWS Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 That is a hard question to answer. So many things go into it. If you choose to live in the moment, I would have to say no-one right now. Koivu hopefully isn't going anywhere untill at least we win a cup for him. but if I had to choose it would be Gary Leeman. hahahahahahahahahahahahazhahahahahahahahah!!!!!!!!!! No really I can't ,but I wouldn't be surprised if Rivet got it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 That is a hard question to answer. So many things go into it. If you choose to live in the moment, I would have to say no-one right now. Koivu hopefully isn't going anywhere untill at least we win a cup for him. but if I had to choose it would be Gary Leeman. hahahahahahahahahahahahazhahahahahahahahah!!!!!!!!!! No really I can't ,but I wouldn't be surprised if Rivet got it. Rivet and Koivu are the same age and I would expect that would retire around the same time. It is possible that he will recieve the Captancy if Koivu retires before him but I do not see that as a realistic possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanny Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 If you ant a young guy it will be higgins over Chipchura as he been there long, If you want a medium guy it could be Perezhogin kinda hard to say... but he has so much heart. also could be someone like begin if hes there for a while...hes like that hype type Captain. Sorry, Perezhogin and Higgins have been here the exact same amount of time. I agree the Perogie shows heart, but I think he hasn't been here any longer than Higgs and I would give it to Higgs first. They're about the same age too, non? So if Higgs is too young, Perogie is too young. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athlétique.Canadien Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 Rule number 1: The Captian isn't always the best player. When Lemieux was injured back in 1991 and 1992, Randy Gilhen was Captain. Randy Gilhen was not a star. He was a utility penalty kill faceoff winning center. Comparing Kovy and Koivu is silly. Koivu is more of a playmaker and Kovalev is more a sniper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfposi Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 Okay....Saku Koivu played a decent game tonight...but so did Kovalev. I am just trying to state that Alex Kovalev is very skilled and talented person, who in the case of Koivu's absence or departure, can take over his leadership role. That is all i was trying to state. He does beat Saku in numbers...sure but I never said Koivu didnt play with heart out there. ....................... You guys may have thought that something was accomplished here by ganging up on me in my defence for Alex Kovalev...but for future...please give the guy some credit that he deserves..and quit calling him a whiner, a diver, etc etc...for he is just as big of an asset to the Canadiens as Koivu. No one...least of all me, said that Kovalev doesn't deserve credit. You are the one who brought up this competition. The only thing that was accomplished here was that a clear message was sent showing the respect fans have for Koivu. No one is debating numbers (although I believe Cataclaw made a good point about your stats), but you were seriously neglecting a major aspect of leadership. I think the point has been sufficiently made. This is the last I will discuss on this issue, but I will end by challenging your premise of being a die hard habs fan... Saku Koivu is the heart and soul of this team. He puts more drive, determination and loyalty into this club that most players in the Canadien's long history. By declaring yourself Anti-Koivu, you prove that you are not truly a habs fan. Justinb, you are a Kovalev fan...so don't pretend to love the habs if you dont respect their leader. JMO, but I am sure you are otherwise a nice guy...just misinformed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shu Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 Prediction based 5 years in future- Higgins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoRvInA Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 Caps: Youppie, then Perogy after that Huet and Abby .... and why can't a goalie wear a C again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfposi Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 They use to be able to, but the main reason is because the C's and A's are the only player who can formally talk to the refs while on the ice. It is not possible for the Goalie to leave the net to discuss issues with the ref and since the Goalies are on the ice for the whole game, they cannot consider the coach's in game strategy and therefore should not talk to the refs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoRvInA Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 They use to be able to, but the main reason is because the C's and A's are the only player who can formally talk to the refs while on the ice. It is not possible for the Goalie to leave the net to discuss issues with the ref and since the Goalies are on the ice for the whole game, they cannot consider the coach's in game strategy and therefore should not talk to the refs. So still... its a rule today that a Goalie cannot wear the C? There are three Letter bearing players.... do we always need 3 to talk between the coach and the Ref... As I'm writing this I'm thinking and I guess I'm answering myself with this... If a Goalie is the Cap and the two Assitant caps are in the penalty box... then what happens... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dark_faerie87 Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 So still... its a rule today that a Goalie cannot wear the C? There are three Letter bearing players.... do we always need 3 to talk between the coach and the Ref... As I'm writing this I'm thinking and I guess I'm answering myself with this... If a Goalie is the Cap and the two Assitant caps are in the penalty box... then what happens... That's probably why goalies can't be the captain, or at least one of the reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 Rule number 1: The Captian isn't always the best player. When Lemieux was injured back in 1991 and 1992, Randy Gilhen was Captain. Randy Gilhen was not a star. He was a utility penalty kill faceoff winning center. Comparing Kovy and Koivu is silly. Koivu is more of a playmaker and Kovalev is more a sniper. Look at Washington - their captain is Chris Clark. Though that<s a bit of an exception because 1) Kolzig would be their captain if he were allowed and 2) They offered the posiiton to Ovechkin but turned it down saying he wasn't ready for the responsibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dark_faerie87 Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 Look at Washington - their captain is Chris Clark. Though that<s a bit of an exception because 1) Kolzig would be their captain if he were allowed and 2) They offered the posiiton to Ovechkin but turned it down saying he wasn't ready for the responsibility. Kolzig is awesome! I love that guy! B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 Kolzig is awesome! I love that guy! B) But he isn't Finnish! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dark_faerie87 Posted November 3, 2006 Share Posted November 3, 2006 But he isn't Finnish! So? Neither is Natalie Portman or Brian Molko... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justintb Posted November 4, 2006 Share Posted November 4, 2006 Saku Koivu is the heart and soul of this team. He puts more drive, determination and loyalty into this club that most players in the Canadien's long history. By declaring yourself Anti-Koivu, you prove that you are not truly a habs fan. Justinb, you are a Kovalev fan...so don't pretend to love the habs if you dont respect their leader. You couldnt be more wrong. I have one of two things to speak of here. One, you can say I am not a habs fan...I will laugh that one off, since Im willing to pay 500 dollars to go and see them live, in fact tomorrow night I'll be at the Bell Centre when New Jerseys in town. I have been a habs fan since i was born. And I always will be....I will never change my faith...I will only cheer for one team..and that is the Montreal Canadiens. Also, with regards to you saying that I am Anti-Koivu....I am going to tell you right now that all teams fans have likes and dislikes...You think ottawa fans like alfredsson?...just another example. Just because you specifically dont like one player, doesnt mean that you dont have good intentions hoping that they will someday lead the team to a Stanley Cup. This argument can go on forever...its like one of those...its either your for us or against us ones. And Franquilly I dont care much about saku Koivu...sure I'll cheer for him...because he's in a Canadiens jersey. Hell...if darcy tucker got traded to montreal id cheer for him...because Montreal is my team. Just because you like the team doesnt necessarily mean you like all of the players on the roster. Second of all, I am an alex kovalev fan and always will be, but I think that the C or A and the others dont matter. In order to win a stanley cup, EVERYBODY has to be a leader, not just saku koivu...Agreed? If I was a Kovalev fan only, I would have been a rangers fan...and a penguins fan before. But no, I just think the guy has phenomenal talent and is one of the greatest players to ever step foot on the ice. I am disgusted that you even dared to question my faith and the Habs. I'm trying to say that the whole Montreal shouldnt revolve around Koivu....And you say all of this community stuff and yada yada yada...sure he can be a great guy off the ice, but its what happens on the ice that really matters. And this coming from you "He puts more drive, determination and loyalty into this club that most players in the Canadien's long history" is a very bold statement. He is no Rocket, he is no Cournoyer, he is no Moore, he is no Dryden, he is no Roy, he is no Carbo, he is no Lafleur. Saku Koivu is nowhere near the top...he might have done a few things, but until a Stanley Cup goes onto his finger, you dont deserve to even speak of that. Thats like mockerizing this teams history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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