Mini-GDT: Thrashers vs Habs, Jan. 2

[BCHabnut]

I'm having a good laugh at the media and their treatment of Martin and Price today. I guess it's boring to write that the Canadiens are starting to feel the effects of playing without their best defenseman and another top 4. Gorges has been hurt for a while, and really their issues started when he started playing poorly. In my opinion, the first bad game Price had was yesterday. Take any team in the NHL and remove two of their top 4 defensemen and see how they do.

[BTH]

LOL. I could see confusing that. The Habs have been rotating that centre position for years.

Not to mention that they wear the same number and are pretty similar players.

I'm having a good laugh at the media and their treatment of Martin and Price today. I guess it's boring to write that the Canadiens are starting to feel the effects of playing without their best defenseman and another top 4. Gorges has been hurt for a while, and really their issues started when he started playing poorly. In my opinion, the first bad game Price had was yesterday. Take any team in the NHL and remove two of their top 4 defensemen and see how they do.

I don't think he's had a bad game yet. A few average ones though like last night. Had it been say, Alex Auld in net, people would probably be saying that it was a decent performance. He definitely seems less dominant than he was at the start of the season, even if the team is worse in front of him.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

That's two games in a row where the Habs have unloaded 40+ shots at the opposition.

This is how slumps work - you claw your way out of them, but usually you don't get fully rewarded for better play. Expect the team to string off a few Ws fairly soon.

[Chris]

Well sure, even a broken clock is right 2 times a day.

[Wamsley01]

Well sure, even a broken clock is right 2 times a day.

This is kind of disingenuous. THe Habs have been outshooting their opposition fairly regularly this season.

On the season they have outshot their opponents 1295-1177. You have to go back to the 1990's to find the Habs on

the positive side of the shot clock over the season.

[Chris]

I meant the winning games as CC pointed out.

They do get alot of shots, unfortunatley most of them are from very far out with very few screens.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

So much of what goes on on this board is deductive reasoning. We start from an axiomatic first principle (usually either 'the Habs suck' or 'the Habs are good') and all subsequent analysis flows from that. If our first principle is that the Habs suck, then when they outshoot the hell out of the opposition, it doesn't count. (But I'll bet when the Pens and Caps were outshooting us, that was a sign of a crap team being carried by its goalie, right?). Same thing with Price, or Jacques Martin - when there are struggles it 'proves' they stink, when things go well it proves nothing.

The fact is that this team is nowhere near as bad as it's shown over December. Slumps happen. The last two games indicate a team that is getting its mojo back. While this doesn't mean that we're the Detroit Red Wings, I don't see how anyone who has watched a lot of hockey can fail to see the pattern. The odds are about 90% that, barring further injuries or a mutiny against Martin, the ship is about to right itself. Of course having written that I probably just jinxed it

Edited January 4, 2011 by The Chicoutimi Cucumber

[hab29RETIRED]

So much of what goes on on this board is deductive reasoning. We start from an axiomatic first principle (usually either 'the Habs suck' or 'the Habs are good') and all subsequent analysis flows from that. If our first principle is that the Habs suck, then when they outshoot the hell out of the opposition, it doesn't count. (But I'll bet when the Pens and Caps were outshooting us, that was a sign of a crap team being carried by its goalie, right?). Same thing with Price, or Jacques Martin - when there are struggles it 'proves' they stink, when things go well it proves nothing.

The fact is that this team is nowhere near as bad as it's shown over December. Slumps happen. The last two games indicate a team that is getting its mojo back. While this doesn't mean that we're the Detroit Red Wings, I don't see how anyone who has watched a lot of hockey can fail to see the pattern. The odds are about 90% that, barring further injuries or a mutiny against Martin, the ship is about to right itself. Of course having written that I probably just jinxed it

I don't a lot of stock in the number of shots the Habs are getting - it's not indicitive of the number of scoring chances. We aren't getting much traffic and going hard to the net and have been doing a good job of making the other goalie look better then have been. There have been far too many shots from the outside and even when we are shooting from in close, we aren't making it difficult on the oppositions goalies. The positive is that guys that NEVER seem to shoot like Gomez are actually starting to take some shots and aren't as predictable, as they were earlier in the season.

[Wamsley01]

I don't a lot of stock in the number of shots the Habs are getting - it's not indicitive of the number of scoring chances. We aren't getting much traffic and going hard to the net and have been doing a good job of making the other goalie look better then have been. There have been far too many shots from the outside and even when we are shooting from in close, we aren't making it difficult on the oppositions goalies. The positive is that guys that NEVER seem to shoot like Gomez are actually starting to take some shots and aren't as predictable, as they were earlier in the season.

This is exactly what CC is talking about. Reasoning based on bias.

http://enattendantlesnordiques.blogspot.co...ntreal-3-p.html

Olivier's blog tracks individual scoring chances per game. He has been doing it for two seasons and the Habs outchanced the

Thrashers by 26-18 on Sunday. Since their slump began against the Wings they are even up at 190-190 in scoring chances

against their opposition. Not exactly a team that is struggling terribly.

You tend to thrive on the negative and hence will try to downplay shot significance. THe Habs have outshot their opponents

by almost 100 shots during that time and some of it can be written off to score affect, but they have been deserving of a better

fate than 3-8-1.

The Canadiens opposition has been extremely opportunistic over the last dozen games. If they play like this for the remainder

of the season they will battle for the 3rd-8th seed.

[JoeLassister]

This is exactly what CC is talking about. Reasoning based on bias.

http://enattendantlesnordiques.blogspot.co...ntreal-3-p.html

Olivier's blog tracks individual scoring chances per game. He has been doing it for two seasons and the Habs outchanced the

Thrashers by 26-18 on Sunday. Since their slump began against the Wings they are even up at 190-190 in scoring chances

against their opposition. Not exactly a team that is struggling terribly.

You tend to thrive on the negative and hence will try to downplay shot significance. THe Habs have outshot their opponents

by almost 100 shots during that time and some of it can be written off to score affect, but they have been deserving of a better

fate than 3-8-1.

The Canadiens opposition has been extremely opportunistic over the last dozen games. If they play like this for the remainder

of the season they will battle for the 3rd-8th seed.

What exactly makes you think that habs29RETIRED have a bias ???

[hab29RETIRED]

This is exactly what CC is talking about. Reasoning based on bias.

http://enattendantlesnordiques.blogspot.co...ntreal-3-p.html

Olivier's blog tracks individual scoring chances per game. He has been doing it for two seasons and the Habs outchanced the

Thrashers by 26-18 on Sunday. Since their slump began against the Wings they are even up at 190-190 in scoring chances

against their opposition. Not exactly a team that is struggling terribly.

You tend to thrive on the negative and hence will try to downplay shot significance. THe Habs have outshot their opponents

by almost 100 shots during that time and some of it can be written off to score affect, but they have been deserving of a better

fate than 3-8-1.

The Canadiens opposition has been extremely opportunistic over the last dozen games. If they play like this for the remainder

of the season they will battle for the 3rd-8th seed.

Can't read french so the link wasn't all that useful to me, but stats really don't tell the whole story. Stats count chances, they don't evaluate the quality of the chances or rate the chances. Yes the habs outshot and out chanced the opposition the last few games, but the don't tell what is visible to anyone who watched the games.

How many of the habs shots are taken without a decent screen or without the forwards putting any kind of pressure on the goalie by driving hard to the net?? With the exception of MaxPax, Gionta and Darche, the forwards really haven't been driving to the net on a regular basis and creating any semblance of havoc in front of the goalie. The habs rarely make life difficult for the opposition's goalie and the goalie's usually have a clear line of sight to the puck.

In Darche's case, he has been in front of the net, but has blocked more shots then he has deflected and has been pretty useless with his hands of stone. Why he is on the power play is beyond me. It's one thing to not put one of your best shooter on the PP (AK46), because of a clear dislike for him by JM, but why call up Desharnais and have Darche on the PP????

I love how the statisticians chalk up to pure luck when the stats don't support the results. Bottom line is the habs haven't a guy regulary drive hard to the net regularly for even an ENTIRE SEASON, since Zednik - and that was put to a stop once he nearly got his head taken off by McClaren.

Getting shots on goal, without players creating net pressure or going to the net for and BATTLING for loose pucks, makes life fairly easy for a goalie and that should be clear to anyone who has watched the habs with any sort of regularity. How many times have our goalies been run over, or at least bumped and screened with guys having their assess in the goalie's face and how many times have the habs forwards returned the favour??? Is any of this reflected in stats or CORSI ratings????