What Does North Korea Have That George Bush Wants?

[Killer Carlson]

Now i dont agree with them using nuclear missiles (korea) as i dont think anyone should have them. But why is he so threatened by the Koreans? or what doe they have that he wants? It aint oil. What baffles me the most is Russia, China, France, USA and United Kingdom are all designated Nuclear states- how is it fair to say who can and who cant have em? If its on the basis of whoever has must be responsible in using em then surely the USA shouldnthave em- little georgie boy cant wait for his finger to push the button.

Whats your opinions on it? End of rant.........

[Fanpuck33]

Yep, I'm sure Bush really wants to use a nuke, so another country can respond by nuking us, then us nuking them back, until we have MADD. Seriously, it's silly that people think Bush just wants to go around nuking his enemies. I mean, even if the US wouldn't be nuked back in retaliation, they would lose all remaining support they have from the rest of the world. I know people think he isn't the brightest, but he's not an idiot.

[Killer Carlson]

Yep, I'm sure Bush really wants to use a nuke, so another country can respond by nuking us, then us nuking them back, until we have MADD. Seriously, it's silly that people think Bush just wants to go around nuking his enemies. I mean, even if the US wouldn't be nuked back in retaliation, they would lose all remaining support they have from the rest of the world. I know people think he isn't the brightest, but he's not an idiot.

you irish? he aint the brightest but he aint an idiot? he would blow up every middle east state that has oil in it if he could- so they can go in with their nice big engineering contracts for firms he has shares in. how can a guy who averaged a d in college be president of your country?

[Fanpuck33]

you irish? he aint the brightest but he aint an idiot? he would blow up every middle east state that has oil in it if he could- so they can go in with their nice big engineering contracts for firms he has shares in. how can a guy who averaged a d in college be president of your country?

How is that contradictory? Not the brightest = idiot or average intelligence. Not being an idiot leaves average.

Anyways, Bush averaged high C average, not a D average. A better question would be why was Kerry portrayed as being an intellectual guy when his college average was a point worse than Bush's? A poor move by the Democrats to back him in the Presidential run. When one of your campaign strategies is to portray the oppostion as an idiot, you should run someone smarter than the opponent.

[MAK]

one of the reasons beside that north korea has nuclear is that there's some oil in this area and he would love to have it.

bush shouldn't be to worried if the missiles are made by hyundai

[simonus]

id like to think my undergraduate marks inacurately reflect my intelligence.

What does Bush want from NK? I imagine he wants what we all want - for them to not have nukes! NK is a vicious and capricious dictatorship led by a sociopath. Kim having a red button in his own office is a hell of a lot scarier than Chirac or even Bush (regardless of your political affiliation).

Bush isn't about to bomb every middle east country - were you being hyperbolic? Iraq had a mangled military force. Iran, Saudi Arabia - Americans would die during an invasion (unless you really mean just randomly doing aerial bombings).

NK has a well armed, large, possibly nuclear military. They probably have ambitions outside their own borders. They are terribly frightening and I have no earthly idea how to contain/eliminate NK and I think Bush is of much the same opinion as I (omg... I can't believe I just said that). Bush is not a bad leader for invading another country, he is a bad leader for invading the wrong country. There are times when war is a necessary and eficient manner of exacting positive change (see Yugoslavia). Can we invade NK? Is it worth the surely large number of american lives that it would cost? Once(if?) we won, how much more rebuilding would it require than Iraq? Are American troups too overdistributed to form the necessary force? Has Bush so damaged diplomatic relationships with other country that we would have to go it alone against this obviously dangerous foe? Do we want China and/or Russia to help us? People are disturbed at Bush's apparent disrespect for the Geneva Convention and the law of nations - can you imagine what the People's Army would do?

The North Korean missile crisis is not an emergency because Mr. Bush says it is, it is a crisis because it really is. The real crisis is whether Mr. Bush can solve it.

Edited October 10, 2006 by simonus

[Killer Carlson]

id like to think my undergraduate marks inacurately reflect my intelligence.

What does Bush want from NK? I imagine he wants what we all want - for them to not have nukes! NK is a vicious and capricious dictatorship led by a sociopath. Kim having a red button in his own office is a hell of a lot scarier than Chirac or even Bush (regardless of your political affiliation).

Bush isn't about to bomb every middle east country - were you being hyperbolic? Iraq had a mangled military force. Iran, Saudi Arabia - Americans would die during an invasion (unless you really mean just randomly doing aerial bombings).

NK has a well armed, large, possibly nuclear military. They probably have ambitions outside their own borders. They are terribly frightening and I have no earthly idea how to contain/eliminate NK and I think Bush is of much the same opinion as I (omg... I can't believe I just said that). Bush is not a bad leader for invading another country, he is a bad leader for invading the wrong country. There are times when war is a necessary and eficient manner of exacting positive change (see Yugoslavia). Can we invade NK? Is it worth the surely large number of american lives that it would cost? Once(if?) we won, how much more rebuilding would it require than Iraq? Are American troups too overdistributed to form the necessary force? Has Bush so damaged diplomatic relationships with other country that we would have to go it alone against this obviously dangerous foe? Do we want China and/or Russia to help us? People are disturbed at Bush's apparent disrespect for the Geneva Convention and the law of nations - can you imagine what the People's Army would do?

The North Korean missile crisis is not an emergency because Mr. Bush says it is, it is a crisis because it really is. The real crisis is whether Mr. Bush can solve it.

some very god points their but where is the proof that kim yong is trigger happy so to speak? so he tested a few missiles-until he declares a war on us (the west0 what is their to worry about?

[Pierre the Great]

North Korea is in the business to attract attention. Thats how they get food and money. Because if they didn't attract attention they'd fall apart because they've isolated themselves way too much. Kin Yong Il would not pull the trigger because first they need to downsize the nuclear weapon to fit on a missile and so far they have neither shown they can do both. They aren't going to put a nuke on a missile today and shoot it up into space only to have it come down 50 seconds later on them.

Did I say they were attention whores? They also like to black mail. If North Korea so shoots a missile at the US, South Korea or Japan. The US could turn that place into a nuclear waste land in 5 minutes. They know this thats why the nukes are for show and bribing only.

Next, this is China's problem. China is North Korea's last friend. China has so much influence or NK that they could with certain actions cause the regime in Pyeungyang to collapse. China is very angry at NK and feel betrayed. Just look at the Chinese Newspapers today. They're pissed.

NK is digging its own grave on this one. Its like the republican party, just sit back, relax, make some popcorn and watch the event unfold. Because the US and everyone else has no real influence. Its all China. And right now China's very very mad.

[Killer Carlson]

North Korea is in the business to attract attention. Thats how they get food and money. Because if they didn't attract attention they'd fall apart because they've isolated themselves way too much. Kin Yong Il would not pull the trigger because first they need to downsize the nuclear weapon to fit on a missile and so far they have neither shown they can do both. They aren't going to put a nuke on a missile today and shoot it up into space only to have it come down 50 seconds later on them.

Did I say they were attention whores? They also like to black mail. If North Korea so shoots a missile at the US, South Korea or Japan. The US could turn that place into a nuclear waste land in 5 minutes. They know this thats why the nukes are for show and bribing only.

Next, this is China's problem. China is North Korea's last friend. China has so much influence or NK that they could with certain actions cause the regime in Pyeungyang to collapse. China is very angry at NK and feel betrayed. Just look at the Chinese Newspapers today. They're pissed.

NK is digging its own grave on this one. Its like the republican party, just sit back, relax, make some popcorn and watch the event unfold. Because the US and everyone else has no real influence. Its all China. And right now China's very very mad.

sound fun where do i buy the 3d glasses?

[KoZed]

iBush is not a bad leader for invading another country, he is a bad leader for invading the wrong country. There are times when war is a necessary and eficient manner of exacting positive change (see Yugoslavia).

That is utter BS.

Sovereignty is sacrosanct. In terms of international laws, invasion is rape. War's only legitimate in two cases: self-defense when you've been invaded yourself or defense of another invaded country. Iraq dont fit either cases.

I dont think anyone on HW can peg me as a Bush basher. However in the particular case of Iraq I have to break it to you: Bush's administration royaly screwed up and, yes, became the bad guys. They simply had, and still dont have to this day, a legitimate cause for that invasion. Its all been dissected, analyzed and proven again and again by international experts that, of all the possible courses of actions available, that so-called "pre-emptive war" was the worst, most unethical and counter-productive plan possible. Every reason given to invade Iraq was shattered and destroyed.

A leader is always faced with a dilemma: pragmatic, realistic results; and moral, ethical ideals. For taking the worst pragmatic decision AND the least moral decision; Bush and Co. screwed up on both sides. Lose-lose decision. And yes, that makes him a bad leader.

Edited October 10, 2006 by KoZed

[simonus]

That is utter BS.

Sovereignty is sacrosanct. In terms of international laws, invasion is rape. War's only legitimate in two cases: self-defense when you've been invaded yourself or defense of another invaded country. Iraq dont fit either cases.

OK... where is my BS? I say Bush's sin was entering into an unjustified war, you say that Bush's sin was entering into an unjustified war. We both believe that war is at times justified. I cite Yugoslavia - while the Kosovars did not live in a separate country, I think they certainly fall under the protection of your 2nd criterion.

I am against Mr. Bush's government. He is a bad president, for both domestic and foreign policy reasons.

NK is getting more and more dangerous and I don't think that invasion is a practical or plausible solution. Would it be morally justified? Well, they do terrorize their neighbours, but I am not sure that rises to the requisite level of aggression to justify pre-emptive action. However, if you see an army massing at your border , you dont wait for them to come in (I am not stating that NK is assuming this posture).

Edited October 10, 2006 by simonus

[KoZed]

OK... where is my BS? I say Bush's sin was entering into an unjustified war, you say that Bush's sin was entering into an unjustified war.

Ooooops. Yeah I see it now.

Note to self: dont post before 2nd cup of coffee.

[Killer Carlson]

Ooooops. Yeah I see it now.

Note to self: dont post before 2nd cup of coffee.

i rekon arnie should be the new president - they should make a 61st ammendmnet so he can become the first foreign president.

[huzer]

Holy paranoia, conspiracy theory crap. NK has nukes, the bulk of the international community would rather they not have them. Maybe George just wants some good kimchi....yeah, I think that's it. Invade Korea and get the US the kimchi it deserves! Woohoooooooooo!!!!!!!

[House11]

I think the people who should be the most worried about North Korea is SOUTH KOREA.

[Pierre the Great]

If anyone invades Korea thats a suicide mission. Million man army versus what a few 100 thousand? Plus we'd be plucked like turkeys trying to get across the dmv because there's about a million mines buried there.

If I here anyone say lets ivade I'm going to go crazy. Chicken war hawks are absolutely the worse kind of people.

My generation is absurd. This isn't a video game. This is real life. Stop being blood thirsty kids. But of course they would never sign up. Heck I don't even think they've seen a gun before or shot one.

[KoZed]

Holy paranoia, conspiracy theory crap. NK has nukes, the bulk of the international community would rather they not have them. Maybe George just wants some good kimchi....yeah, I think that's it. Invade Korea and get the US the kimchi it deserves! Woohoooooooooo!!!!!!!

Time to start a Kimchi for Oil program...

I think the people who should be the most worried about North Korea is SOUTH KOREA.

No shit... and China's crapping their pants too. War means refugees, and China dont want to have to deal with North Koreans flooding their borders.

[simonus]

If anyone invades Korea thats a suicide mission. Million man army versus what a few 100 thousand? Plus we'd be plucked like turkeys trying to get across the dmv because there's about a million mines buried there.

If I here anyone say lets ivade I'm going to go crazy. Chicken war hawks are absolutely the worse kind of people.

My generation is absurd. This isn't a video game. This is real life. Stop being blood thirsty kids. But of course they would never sign up. Heck I don't even think they've seen a gun before or shot one.

and pierre erects another strawman.

[Pierre the Great]

China's crapping their pants too. War means refugees, and China dont want to have to deal with North Koreans flooding their borders.

Thats why this is and always will be China's problem. China is the only country NK will listen to, without China NK will fall apart. Kozed is right, China could really pull the plug on the NK but that would mean refugees fleeing into China. China doesn't want that of course but now they might not have any choice. NK is an embarassment to China. They are not happy. This has been and always will be China's problem.

and pierre erects another strawman.

huh?

I was in high school during the invasion. Everyone wanted the army to kill some 'a-rabs'. They were giddy with the war. I called them sick humans. They wanted Washington to nuke the entire middle east. Because they were 'varmits' and not human beings. My uncle thinks 'turbin heads' are in his back yard in the middle of nowhere in the country side and are going to come out of the corn fields one night and burn his house down.

[simonus]

huh?

I was in high school during the invasion. Everyone wanted the army to kill some 'a-rabs'. They were giddy with the war. I called them sick humans. They wanted Washington to nuke the entire middle east. Because they were 'varmits' and not human beings. My uncle thinks 'turbin heads' are in his back yard in the middle of nowhere in the country side and are going to come out of the corn fields one night and burn his house down.

who in this thread attended your high school? Who in this thread made this argument?

I care very little about what random St. Louis high school students had to say about Arabs. Especially when I am getting their opinions secondhand and we are talking about NK, not the middle east.

It is far more interesting to argue against the person in front of you instead of against memories of ignorance past.

[Pierre the Great]

People around here will say the same thing about NK except use a racial slur.

North Korea is just black mailing the world in order to get there way. There's nothing much we as the rest of the world can do. Its all in China's court. If they pull the plug on North Korea, NK will fall apart.

[simonus]

People around here will say the same thing about NK except use a racial slur.

still has little to do with this discussion.

[Pierre the Great]

I was talking about people I'll here on the radio and tv and the US ambassador to the UN saying military action is not out of the question.

Are you kidding me, Bolton? lol.

Thats what I was talking about.

[huzer]

It's all about kimchi, I'm telling ya. Just you wait until the US invades, and kimchi prices start rising here in the states. There will be a backlash like you wouldn't believe. News stories about kimchi price gouging, etc. Look for it to be an election year topic next year.

In all seriousness, why is it that the world condemns North Korea for the tests it conducted, and somehow, it's a hidden agenda for Bush to go in and grab something that he "wants" from them. I am not a Bush supporter, but really people, why is everything under the sun involving this administration a conspiracy? You guys have watched too many Austin Powers movies and have confused him for Dr. Evil. Wow, I'm glad I don't live in consant paranoia and fear about what my evil, horrible government is going to do to me!

[bbr93]

Sexy women.