Kovalev stirring the pot again

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Well I'll defend Carbo a bit. He is right, a dumb penalty cost them the game. I don't know if anyone has noticed, the more he calls people out or gets mad with a loss the closer they play to a 60 minute game. When was the last time the Habs played such a great hard working game. It's been years.

He trusts certain people on the ice in certain situations, just because the fans don't like it doesn't mean it's a bad decision.

Whne was the last time the habs outshot 4 out of 6 opponants? Years i'm guessing.

Carbo brings what i said the team needs, hard work and dicipline. That's what he is delivering.

Young teams lose close games, they learn from them and they get better. Sure the scoring stinks right now but the D zone looks very good, so does the effort, shots on goal and transition game.

I actually like this team, they are way better then the years past. If you guys want them getting outshot every night 40 to 20, and hope they win 1 nothing it's not going to happen. Perhaps you all enjoyed them playing in there own end all night, I don't.

So they lost a tough game, get over it, they are playing way better then in the past.

By the way, Kovalev should kep his yap shut, he had a chance to put one away and didn't.

You make good points here. While I think the verdict should still be considered officially 'out' on Carbo, you're right that we risk losing sight of the forest for the trees when we concentrate on this or that specific 'mistake.' The fact is that, the Carolina game aside, this team has looked significantly better than last year's in the ways you state. And the game in question was easily their best performance in years. Carbo should get credit for that - just as he might bear some (not all) of the blame for the loss (and let's not go nuts - a time out might well have made no difference in the outcome). If the overall direction is upward, then I think Guy will ultimately be judged a success. Too soon to say for sure, though.

[OneSharpMarble]

Everyone is frustrated because they all know they should have won that game maybe this will make them a little hungrier. K rex took a stupid penalty and I think he would tell you that. Carbo could have called for a time out if there was a face off, but I did not notice a whole lot of those in the last 2 minutes. As to what Carbo said he is trying to not get a big fight going with Kovy he is trying to diffuse the issue, but Osm let's be honest you have been calling for him to get fired since the day he got hired so i really don't think it matters to you what he said, he is wrong in your opinion.

Not since he got hired, since he started being a "my way or the highway" coach. Face it he messed up Perezhogin, almost ruined kostitsyn, breaks up good lines, alienates non french players, plays favorites, doesnt learn from mistakes, never admits his own faults, scapegoats players and forces gifted players into roles they arent suited for.

Doesnt sound like sound coaching to me, if he doesnt change then yes he deserves to be fired.

[BTH]

Game thread for Ottawa not up yet, so I didn't know where else to put this so... lineup from practice today via habsinsideout.com:

Higgins-Koivu-Ryder

Kostitsyn-Grabovski-Kovalev

Latendresse-Plekanec-Kostopoulos

Bégin/Chipchura-Smolisnski-Dandenault

If this is what we're going to Ottawa with, I really really don't like the 3rd line. I don't understand why Carbo insists on playing Plex with 2 slow players. I actually didn't mind the third line last game and heaven forbid leaving the line up the same for 2 games in a row (or almost the same - one or two changes wouldn't be a big deal but the 2nd, 3rd and 4th have all been altered) and let the players find some chemistry. They played a REALLY good game yesterday and hit a hot goalie. Smoke with Plex and Kovy was a good second line. Kosty with Grabs and Kostopoulous was actually a good third line. If you really want to, put lats back in their without changing the ENTIRE thing. He could have played on the 4th in place of Murray...

Give them a chance to try the same lineup again, please.....

*slaps forehead!*

I don't get it. Atleast put Kostopoulos on the 4th and try ANY of the four guys you listed on the bottom line in his place. I wuoldn't mind having Dandenault as 3rd line RW - that would atleast make Gui's lack of footspeed the exception instead of the rule.

[OneSharpMarble]

*slaps forehead!*

I don't get it. Atleast put Kostopoulos on the 4th and try ANY of the four guys you listed on the bottom line in his place. I wuoldn't mind having Dandenault as 3rd line RW - that would atleast make Gui's lack of footspeed the exception instead of the rule.

I for one am glad to see pleks back with the two slowest players out there.

[sbhatt]

I'm glad someone on the team isn't afraid to call Carbo out when he screws up. If a coach can call out his players, why shouldn't players be allowed to call out their coach. Two way street.

[Punkned]

Face it he messed up Perezhogin

So true

At least he seems to have fun in russia; 5G 5A in 10 games...

I hope it'll be different for AK46. Why the hell does that guy plays only 11 minutes per game?! He has 13 shots in 5 games while being next to last in ice time (only lats got less icetime). Would giving him 4-5 mores minutes help remedy our scoring problems?

[OneSharpMarble]

So true

At least he seems to have fun in russia; 5G 5A in 10 games...

I hope it'll be different for AK46. Why the hell does that guy plays only 11 minutes per game?! He has 13 shots in 5 games while being next to last in ice time (only lats got less icetime). Would giving him 4-5 mores minutes help remedy our scoring problems?

In the shootout the other night the announcer said Kosty has been amazing in practice yet he doesnt get chosen, absolutly ridiculous.

[JMMR]

I'm glad someone on the team isn't afraid to call Carbo out when he screws up. If a coach can call out his players, why shouldn't players be allowed to call out their coach. Two way street.

Very true, but maybe he should have done it behind closed doorsm but maybe so should Carbonneau.

Anywyas I'm sure as an alternate captain he said something to Guys face as well.

Edited October 17, 2007 by JMMR

[thib46]

I'm glad someone on the team isn't afraid to call Carbo out when he screws up. If a coach can call out his players, why shouldn't players be allowed to call out their coach. Two way street.

It is not the place of any player to call out the coach or other players in the media. It is not the place of the coach to call out players in the media. Those issues are to be taken care of the in the locker room. Komissarek has it right, the coach is the coach his decisions are his decisions to make. If he screws up (my words here) but Komissarek said something to that effect, it his issue, the players play and if they have issue to speak to the coach in the office not to the media. I like this kid!!

[B-7]

It is not the place of any player to call out the coach or other players in the media. It is not the place of the coach to call out players in the media. Those issues are to be taken care of the in the locker room. Komissarek has it right, the coach is the coach his decisions are his decisions to make. If he screws up (my words here) but Komissarek said something to that effect, it his issue, the players play and if they have issue to speak to the coach in the office not to the media. I like this kid!!

Anyway, as for the time-out, Carbo didn't make a mistake. As reported today, he said that he was waiting for a whistle in order to rest his players he wanted there but the whistle never came. 20/20 insight is a good thing. But at least, it let some fans vent their anger on him instead of the bonehead play by Komisarek who has been prone to many mistakes in the last 2 loss by the Habs.

[Cataclaw]

Yes. But Carbo is now being tested again. Hickey (who I never liked) wrote in today's Gazette that he's alienating Begin through poor communication. Now the whole Kovalev genie is out of the bottle once more.

If I were Carbonneau, I'd head this off at the pass: call a team meeting, emphasize that what Kovy said is no big deal - maybe even invite a bit of discussion over the overall coaching strategy, whether the players are comfortable with it (that's how I tend to run my operations and it works fine, you know); and generally clear the air by explaining (as Carbo said on RDS before last night's game) that sitting out is not always a criticism, but rather an attempt to give everyone a chance to contribute.

If Carbo really does NOT have a problem communicating, now might be a good time to show it.

Well put, CC.

I agree. I also don't have a problem with the way Kovalev expressed himself and it was an acceptable comment, he didn't directly accuse Carbo of anything.

[habs rule]

Not since he got hired, since he started being a "my way or the highway" coach. Face it he messed up Perezhogin, almost ruined kostitsyn, breaks up good lines, alienates non french players, plays favorites, doesnt learn from mistakes, never admits his own faults, scapegoats players and forces gifted players into roles they arent suited for.

Doesnt sound like sound coaching to me, if he doesnt change then yes he deserves to be fired.

and I am pretty sure he was on the grassy knoll. He's the guy who threw the hockey stick at Kennedy. An objective person would be able to see the good and the bad.

[Prime Minister Koivu]

Not since he got hired, since he started being a "my way or the highway" coach. Face it he messed up Perezhogin, almost ruined kostitsyn, breaks up good lines, alienates non french players, plays favorites, doesnt learn from mistakes, never admits his own faults, scapegoats players and forces gifted players into roles they arent suited for.

Doesnt sound like sound coaching to me, if he doesnt change then yes he deserves to be fired.

That is exactly how I see Carbo as well.

[habs rule]

That is exactly how I see Carbo as well.

well I for one would like to know where all this info regarding him destroying players, creating rifts etc comes from cause I ain't seen no evidence of it. Yes he has made it plain that if you want to play for the habs you will work hard and be strong defensively. You guys should remember that before he came the inmates were running the asylum. He is the coach he gets to make the rules, call it what you will but he has a way that he wants his players to play and either they do it or he will find someone else who will. Ya know that reminds me of a couple of coaches for the habs, they weren't very good but neither scotty bowman nor toe blake were loved by the MEN they coached. They were definitely my way or the highway type coaches. They were also my type of coach and they won a lot of cups. We will have the cup again and carbo will be the coach.

[OneSharpMarble]

well I for one would like to know where all this info regarding him destroying players, creating rifts etc comes from cause I ain't seen no evidence of it. Yes he has made it plain that if you want to play for the habs you will work hard and be strong defensively. You guys should remember that before he came the inmates were running the asylum. He is the coach he gets to make the rules, call it what you will but he has a way that he wants his players to play and either they do it or he will find someone else who will. Ya know that reminds me of a couple of coaches for the habs, they weren't very good but neither scotty bowman nor toe blake were loved by the MEN they coached. They were definitely my way or the highway type coaches. They were also my type of coach and they won a lot of cups. We will have the cup again and carbo will be the coach.

Wow Carbo must serve really good koolaid at his place.

[habs rule]

Wow Carbo must serve really good koolaid at his place.

that's a good answer to different question. No facts to back up your Statements?

[Prime Minister Koivu]

well I for one would like to know where all this info regarding him destroying players, creating rifts etc comes from cause I ain't seen no evidence of it. Yes he has made it plain that if you want to play for the habs you will work hard and be strong defensively. You guys should remember that before he came the inmates were running the asylum. He is the coach he gets to make the rules, call it what you will but he has a way that he wants his players to play and either they do it or he will find someone else who will. Ya know that reminds me of a couple of coaches for the habs, they weren't very good but neither scotty bowman nor toe blake were loved by the MEN they coached. They were definitely my way or the highway type coaches. They were also my type of coach and they won a lot of cups. We will have the cup again and carbo will be the coach.

My statement wasn't factual based it was my feeling. My feeling comes from:

I look at the comments by Kovalev both this time and last year's.

I look at the comments by the players that there wasn't enough communication by Carbo last year (admitted by Carbo himself).

I look at the comments by Begin yesterday finding out that he was scratched by the media instead of Carbo.

I look at the mess that was Perezhogin.

I look at the constant line juggling with bizarre combinations.

I look at the players on the ice during the final crucial minutes against both Toronto and Florida.

I look at the defensive system and I question if it fits the assets we have.

I look at the press conferences with Carbo and he sounds like an asshole.

I look at Carbo's comments about the Florida game, "I asked the team to play 60 minutes every game for a week and they only played 58". Bullshit comment.

My perception of Carbo is that he played a certain style and he believes it is the only style a team can play to win. My way or the highway attitude only works if that way is the right way. If there are members of the team that strongly believe that his way is wrong then it will never work.

The best thing that could happen to this team is if Gainey fires Carbo and takes over. Gainey is a better coach than GM.

[blicemj]

i am quite angry with TSN for making this an issue for their little panel, consisting mostly of wannabes and has-beens. It was such a meaningless comment and should have never got the attention it did, but I have a gut feeling they will do whatever they can to throw off the star players of their rival.

btw, we got stoned by a hot goalie,

/discussion.

Edited October 18, 2007 by blicemj

[OneSharpMarble]

that's a good answer to different question. No facts to back up your Statements?

Oh you were being serious? I thought you were playing around since you had no facts and had that grassy knoll comment. Then you compared him to Scotty Bowman which almost made me fall out of my chair.

Alright...

Face it he messed up Perezhogin = Cmon do I need to explain this one? Put on the friggin checking line and then punished when he takes a hooking penalty.

Almost ruined Kostitsyn = If it wasn't for last years flu he wouldnt have been called up for that last quarter, he got sent down for no reason. Now he is still being improperly used with tiny amounts of ice time and no shots in the shootout.

Breaks up good lines = I still havn't seen the Higgins/Plekanec/Kosty line since last year when it was lethal and single handedly almost got us into the playoffs. And why the hell isn't Koivu playing with Kovalev?

Alienates non french players = From Kovalev to Perezhogin to Samsonov to Kosty he really seems to dislike them.

Plays favorites = Latendresse on the 1st line, no more is needed to be said.

Doesnt learn from mistakes = Stop with this defensive shit gameplay! Seriously it's getting old.

Never admits his own faults = Last night was not the first time he's tossed a player in front a bus before he got a little mud on his pant leg. Samsonov was one player last year, Perezhogin another.

Scapegoats players = Already explained.

Forces gifted players into roles they arent suited for = Perezhogin on checking line, Dandenault playing forward when we have players like Chipchura and Lapierre deserving ice time.

Edited October 18, 2007 by OneSharpMarble

[habs rule]

My statement wasn't factual based it was my feeling. My feeling comes from:

I look at the comments by Kovalev both this time and last year's.

I look at the comments by the players that there wasn't enough communication by Carbo last year (admitted by Carbo himself).

I look at the comments by Begin yesterday finding out that he was scratched by the media instead of Carbo.

I look at the mess that was Perezhogin.

I look at the constant line juggling with bizarre combinations.

I look at the players on the ice during the final crucial minutes against both Toronto and Florida.

I look at the defensive system and I question if it fits the assets we have.

I look at the press conferences with Carbo and he sounds like an asshole.

I look at Carbo's comments about the Florida game, "I asked the team to play 60 minutes every game for a week and they only played 58". Bullshit comment.

My perception of Carbo is that he played a certain style and he believes it is the only style a team can play to win. My way or the highway attitude only works if that way is the right way. If there are members of the team that strongly believe that his way is wrong then it will never work.

The best thing that could happen to this team is if Gainey fires Carbo and takes over. Gainey is a better coach than GM.

you can disagree with his style of coaching but to make statements that he screwed up perez etc is nonsense you have no idea what went on. as to kovalev he has been saying things like this for years. as i said he was frustrated. I obviously watched a different game than you because that team I watched last night was well coached and played their hearts out ,must be for coach they don't respect huh? Komi admits it was a stupid penalty. He knows that without that penalty there is no tie game no overtime no shoot out. I guess we will agree to disagree but when all you have is your "feeling" which is that of a non pro coach and I assume you are not a pro nhl coach or gm I'll stick with Bob and Guy. They have been success full before and will be again. Go back and watch tremblay houle julien and all the rest of the loser coaches and tell me you wouldn't rather have guy and bob. Be carefull what you ask for you might get it. This team needs a strong coach and they got one. 2 years ago this was a sad sack bunch of losers. After last night we have a very good team in my opinion. :ghg: :ghg: :ghg: :hlogo:

[OneSharpMarble]

I wouldn't be suprised at all to hear that Emelin didn't want to come here because of Carbo, wouldn't shock me at all.

[Peter Puck]

I think Kovalev just proved that he doesn't really understand the game.

There is no point in calling a timeout before the penalty kill starts.

Carbonneau said he was waiting for a stopage about half way into the

penalty kill. This is the right thing to do. Unfortunately there was no whistle.

In reality, this game was lost not by the defensive play but by the offence.

Given the terratorial domination we had we needed to score more than one

goal. This is about our forwards' (and defencmen's) inability to finish and

has basically nothing to do with the way Carbo coaches.

[habs rule]

I think Kovalev just proved that he doesn't really understand the game.

There is no point in calling a timeout before the penalty kill starts.

Carbonneau said he was waiting for a stopage about half way into the

penalty kill. This is the right thing to do. Unfortunately there was no whistle.

In reality, this game was lost not by the defensive play but by the offence.

Given the terratorial domination we had we needed to score more than one

goal. This is about our forwards' (and defencmen's) inability to finish and

has basically nothing to do with the way Carbo coaches.

thank you I tried to make that point earlier.

[Peter Puck]

whoops- double post

Edited October 18, 2007 by Peter Puck

[blicemj]

"In the last two minutes, we knew they were going to put a lot of pressure on us," Kovalev told the TEAM 990 in Montreal. "It was just my idea that we could have taken a timeout, get organized and get the right people on the ice. Maybe it could have been better. That's what I saw from the bench."

All I'm saying, is why did the media choose to spin this into something it never was?

He said maybe it could have been better, not "I hate the way Carbo coaches." It was harmless. TSN can seriously stick it, if their great panelists can do nothing but stir up crap. Kovalev is a leader on this team and has a right to speak his mind.

They need to stop jumping on every little thing he says as a negative. Truthfully, I hope he stops talking to the media after this, or save making even the simplest criticisms. He's just frustrated, Carbo has been changing his linemates so much, maybe that is why.