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Is it time to split up Subban and Markov?


Psycing
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I agree, but this is an age-old debate: if your team is struggling to score, are you better off spreading around your scoring, or loading up on a single line/pairing? There's no automatic answer. PK-Markov worked for a while, and I won't be surprised if sooner or later we see it again. It's all about adjustements.

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I can't seem to quote anyone, but really, PK avoiding hits because of Markov's influence???!!! PK is hitting less because a. he is a smart player and realizes that occasionally the big hit takes him out of position. It's called gaining experience; b. the coaches are coaching him to play the defensively safe game noted in point a; and c. he is under tremendous scrutiny re: team Canada and clearly knows that the "flashy" way he plays/played will not get him on the team.

I am not saying that these a, b,c 's are the way things SHOULD be-- ie., don't shoot the messenger; but rather the way it is. Unlike Cucumber I still think PK will be an outstanding talent in the league. It is my fear that it might be with another team. Our team has a terrible tradition of trading talent that doesn't always conform.

In short, to blame Markov for any perceived drop in PK's game--which I don't see in any case-- is ridiculous

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Simply put, both Markov and Subban are capable of making their defense partners better. Together, that collective influence has done wonders. However, for the "greater good" it makes sense to split them and improve the top 4 as a whole. Gorges and Emelin will benefit greatly from having Subban and Markov with them, respectively, while Subban and Markov should maintain their outstanding performances. It's win-win.

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At even strength, yes.... we need more puck movement on the second pair. A pair of Gorges and Emelin is getting hemmed in their own end too often.

I still think, shake up PP units an use 79-61 combo.

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PKs play dropped off after Yzerman visited and told him he was concerned with his defense and making hits on the big ice, getting himself out of position.

Since then, PKs offense has dried up and he isn't making any big hits, taking a physical element out of his game. He appears to be over thinking his game and worried about making a mistake.

While PK should be in the Olympics without question, I wish he was either out or in at this point. Changing his game to meet the needs of a skeptical team Canada GM who wants him as a third pairing guy at best is killing PKs game and hurting this team. PK can't "go for it" anymore as any mistake will be running on TSN with "Olympic issue" commentary, hurting his team Canada chances.

Lets assume PK makes the team. He might barely see any ice time, if he gets used at all. He certainly won't be given many chances to be the difference maker unless there is a major injury to someone else. Sadly, I see little upside for PK at this point.

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Guest Stogey24

To be honest, I don't want Subban or anyone on Montreal making Olympic teams. It's inevitable due to their talent but it matters none how they perform on international ice.

It doesn't matter to you. Being part of a gold medal team is a huge accomplishment.
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It's not the size of the ice that's important, it's extremely important for our guys getting a chance to prove themselves in pressure filled games in the big stage.

There is nothing bigger than the Olympics and it is good for the habs to have young guys like Subban, Price, Maxpac and Galchenyuk go through that experience. Sone if them have been to the WJC's but that isn't the same stage.

I think it helped Pleks playing with a world class player like Jagr. It should also be a great show case opportunity for someone like Duaz.

To be honest, I don't want Subban or anyone on Montreal making Olympic teams. It's inevitable due to their talent but it matters none how they perform on international ice.

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If he's in the team he MAY get a shot. If he's not' he'll be on a beach. I'd rather have him in the team with a shot of getting experience and playing with the beat players in the world.

I am not convinced Subban will get ice time at the Olympics to gain anything like confidence under pressure.

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I can't seem to quote anyone, but really, PK avoiding hits because of Markov's influence???!!! PK is hitting less because a. he is a smart player and realizes that occasionally the big hit takes him out of position. It's called gaining experience; b. the coaches are coaching him to play the defensively safe game noted in point a; and c. he is under tremendous scrutiny re: team Canada and clearly knows that the "flashy" way he plays/played will not get him on the team.

I am not saying that these a, b,c 's are the way things SHOULD be-- ie., don't shoot the messenger; but rather the way it is. Unlike Cucumber I still think PK will be an outstanding talent in the league. It is my fear that it might be with another team. Our team has a terrible tradition of trading talent that doesn't always conform.

In short, to blame Markov for any perceived drop in PK's game--which I don't see in any case-- is ridiculous

I don't know who's the blame, but this team must have hired Floyd Mayweather junior to learn how avoid all of these hits. They were very intimidated on the puck by STL last night. Whatever happened to taking a hit to make a play? The team is losing out with a less physical/agitating Subban. Pre-Olympic hype Subban used to draw frustration penalties, he needs to be a flashy agitator to achieve his full output. As far as the coaching staff goes, if they're worried about the play of a Norris trophy winner, they're overthinking things.
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I don't know who's the blame, but this team must have hired Floyd Mayweather junior to learn how avoid all of these hits. They were very intimidated on the puck by STL last night. Whatever happened to taking a hit to make a play? The team is losing out with a less physical/agitating Subban. Pre-Olympic hype Subban used to draw frustration penalties, he needs to be a flashy agitator to achieve his full output. As far as the coaching staff goes, if they're worried about the play of a Norris trophy winner, they're overthinking things.

This team has, for years, been the type of team that CAN compete against big, strong clubs when it has the will to do so, but tends to look really bad against them when it doesn't. (Frankly, I think having Parros around helped to instil some intestinal fortitude). There will be no solution to this problem until we add more size in the top 9.

I am inclined to blame to coaches re: PK, because they clearly subscribe to the conventional wisdom that he needs to stop being PK Subban, i.e., a Norris Trophy winner. Don't carry the puck out of the zone with one hand on your stick and the other fending off a forechecker; that's too "high risk" even though you do it successfully 99.9% of the time. Because most players can't do it, you shouldn't do it either. Don't pinch on offence; that's too "high risk" even though your incredible skating means you can get back safely 99% of the time. Because most players can't do that, you shoudn't do it either. Don't go for the big hit; that's too "high risk" even though it inspires your team and creates fear in the opposition and only occasionally leads to danger in your own end. Because most players can't do it, you shouldn't either.

The conventional wisdom of today's coaches and "experts" is predicated on denying the extraordinariness of any individual talent. PK is a victim of cookie-cutter coaching formulae IMHO.

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