TheAussiePosse Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Higgins, while playing on Koivu's line, is not a 1st line forward, and was originally a C. Ribeiro, playing as 2nd line C, has been average at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycing Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 As much as I'd rather have Higgins on the wing, I'd still pick him over Ribs on the 2nd line... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koivu-11 Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 One thing we can look forward to is the non-resigning of ribiero. lol cammon bob bring in TEMMU SELANNE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The-Habby2919 Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 One thing we can look forward to is the non-resigning of ribiero. lol cammon bob bring in TEMMU SELANNE Pardon my language but, ABSOLF%$KINLUTELY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Arnott and Bell and a D upgrade somewhere would be nice too. :hlogo: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 One thing we can look forward to is the non-resigning of ribiero. lol cammon bob bring in TEMMU SELANNE The Habs have plenty of wingers already, especially with Kostitsyn and Latendresse waiting for their big chance. What this team needs is a true #2 center and a defenceman to replace Souray. Souray was a HUGE disappointment this series. Sure, he scored some goals, but his defence was attrocious. IDEA: Spend all offseason working with Souray learning how to play forward. He could be a great power-forward with his size and shot. He simply isn't a defenceman I am comfortable with on my blueline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 I can't wait to read that Bob won't sign Ribs, his ass is gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch_Habs_Fan Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 As much as I'd rather have Higgins on the wing, I'd still pick him over Ribs on the 2nd line... Thats for sure!! But i hope we get a better C next season and have Higgins on the wings again!! Go Ribs Go (away) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierre the Great Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Montreal needs a Barrett Jackman type D-man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoZed Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 (edited) Ideally, Koivu should be our #2 C, so we could have a real #1 C. That takes care of this Ribs/Higgins dilemma. And dont give me crap about Koivu "being able to be a #1 C", that time is gone. By today's League standards Koivu's far behind the Staal, Crosby, Richards, Datsyuk and Co. We've got to higher expectations for our team and its starts with being realistic and finding a C that can match Kovalev's skills, a C that can score as well as make plays, which Koivu can't do. We need to have that 1-2 punch up there on the #1 line. Plekanec is already a very good 3rd line C, and eventually he'll be able to replace Saku in a more offensive role. 4th line C can go to Begin. Higgins stays on the wing, he's more useful there than at C. Edited May 3, 2006 by KoZed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CerebusClone Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Ideally, Koivu should be our #2 C, so we could have a real #1 C. That takes care of this Ribs/Higgins dilemma. And dont give me crap about Koivu "being able to be a #1 C", that time is gone. By today's League standards Koivu's far behind the Staal, Crosby, Richards, Datsyuk and Co. We've got to higher expectations for our team and its starts with being realistic and finding a C that can match Kovalev's skills, a C that can score as well as make plays, which Koivu can't do. We need to have that 1-2 punch up there on the #1 line. Almost all players in the league are behind Staal, Crosby, Thornton, Forsberg, and a few more. Those aren't first line centers, they are franchise players. Most teams don't have one, and Koivu ins't one. However, I'm sorry but if I have to pick between Koivu and Datsyuk, I pick Saku Koivu anytime. Datsyuk is flashy, sure, but overall Koivu is a superior player. Also, Koivu doesn't have the likes of Shanhan and Zetterberg to finish his plays. I would even go as far as saying that he's on par with Brad Richards (although if I have to choose, I would take the younger and healthier Richards), but again, Koivu didn't have St-Louis and Lecavalier with him on powerplays to boost his statistics.. he had Higgins and Ryder. Also, Kovalev is all skills, but he never had a great season outside Pittsburg. Maybe the problem is Kovalev; maybe he doesn't have the hockey sense to be the premier player he should have been. Sure, he makes some crazy moves every once in a while, but more often than not, his plays become turnovers because he's too selfish to make an easy play, and simply pass the puck to the open guy. When you're cornered by 2-3 opposing players, it's usually because you waited too long to pass the puck. Koivu is a good number 1 center. Is he the best number 1 center in the league? No. Would we improve the team by getting a better center (ex. Thornton) and moving Koivu to the 2nd line? Of course. But we would also improve by getting a great number 2 like Arnott to support him. At least, we can all agree that by replacing Ribeiro by a real top 2 center is the way to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mont Royale Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Koivu is a good number 1 center. Is he the best number 1 center in the league? No. Would we improve the team by getting a better center (ex. Thornton) and moving Koivu to the 2nd line? Of course. But we would also improve by getting a great number 2 like Arnott to support him. At least, we can all agree that by replacing Ribeiro by a real top 2 center is the way to go. Definitely agree (did I just say that to a CerebusClone post??). Our attack needs more balance and firepower. While your criticisms of Kovalev are just, I think he would respond well to a centre who makes some room for him, which an Arnott would do. Kovalev has had Ribeiro and Bulis lately - ugh! After a couple decent games, Ribeiro was useless. Bulis' performance was terrible, too. Perhaps he knew he was leaving and so didn't give his all... but whatever, he made his departure definite, playing like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaos Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Higgins probably makes a better 1st or 2nd line left winger than a center. Ribeiro should be sent on his way. I believe he's a RFA? Trade him for whatever you can get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diebels Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Ribeiro has big plans for the future http://www.canada.com/topics/sports/hockey...d4-457dc2244e18 I hope the media wins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoZed Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Sorry, but Koivu looked almost nothing like a true #1 center this season, except at the Olympics. I hope I'm not the only one that noticed how Koivu lost that split-second that was allowing him to dangle and create things out of nothing before. Without that, Koivu becomes your run-of-the-mill small passing center. Someone mentionned Koivu not having a Shanny or Zetterberg to play with... That is a self-defeating arguement. True #1 C's will produce regardless of who they're playing with, so if Koivu has to depend on his wingers, maybe that's because he's not that good anymore. Beside, Koivu played with Kovalev for most of the season. Not too bad a winger. You think Bergeron in Boston had more support than Koivu? The funny thing is, Higgins and Ryder both looked as good if not better than Koivu when they were playing together. They still looked OK without him, but probably didnt benefited from having 3 new centers rotating between them either. Koivu's a small and fragile aging center who's numerous injuries have chipped away most of his edge. There's still very good hockey left in him, but not enough to be #1 C level. Not anymore. His PPG average this season was in the same vicinity as other C's like Brad Boyes, Yannick Perreault, Craig Conroy, Joe Nieuwendyk, Robert Lang, Tim Connolly, etc. None of them are really a #1 C, are they? I like Koivu, so its tough having to bring up his negatives, but you have to face the cold hard truth someday. At this point, I think the Habs dont have a #1 C at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 I've been saying this for years, though I think a team can be successful with Koivu as the #1 center. True #1 centers make the players around him better. Koivu has great leadership and makes his team better, but not the players around him. If he did, Ryder would have had 40 goals and Higgins never would have made it to the first line, since Zednik or whoever was there before would have been putting up better numbers. Look at Joe Thornton, he makes the guys around him better. Cheechoo is a good player, but without Joe, there is no way he leads the league in goals. Cheechoo's season was a direct result of Joe being a true #1 center. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gohabsgo252006 Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Ribeiro has big plans for the future http://www.canada.com/topics/sports/hockey...d4-457dc2244e18 I hope the media wins According to our official poll, it seems it's not just the media that wants to see him go. Either he's ignorant or creating an excuse when he really isn't back (blame the media) but if I was him I'd start packing my belongings and loadign the truck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CerebusClone Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 I've been saying this for years, though I think a team can be successful with Koivu as the #1 center. True #1 centers make the players around him better. Koivu has great leadership and makes his team better, but not the players around him. If he did, Ryder would have had 40 goals and Higgins never would have made it to the first line, since Zednik or whoever was there before would have been putting up better numbers. Look at Joe Thornton, he makes the guys around him better. Cheechoo is a good player, but without Joe, there is no way he leads the league in goals. Cheechoo's season was a direct result of Joe being a true #1 center. Come on. If you're going to base yourself on Joe Thornton as to what constitutes a number 1 center, then pretty much nobody else in the league is one However, I agree that even though his numbers were actually superior to previous seasons, Koivu dind't have his best year; actually, I would even say he just had his worst season ever. He didn't control the play like he used to, or like he did in Turino. Yet, until he had a big slump (not talking about his goal slump) somewhere after the mid-season, he was actually ahead of Richards, Sakic, Lecavalier, Modano, Sundin, and a few other star centers in terms of point-per-game production (he missed, once again, about 10 games due to an injury). Next season, Koivu must step up in a big way, and prove that this was an off season. If he doesn't, then I'll agree that he's over as a number 1 center. KoZed, you mentionned Kovalev as a great winger (although I have to disagree on that - he's got the skills, but he does more dangling than scoring), Kovalev was actually having his best season alongside Koivu since he played a lot with Lemieux and Jagr on on the powerful Penguins powerplay - Koivu is good, but these guys are much better. And I don't get how people can still say that Koivu doesn't make people around him better. What about Brian Savage? What about Richard Zednik during his first 3 season with Montreal? What about Chris Higgins this year? What about Ryder, who saved his season by playing with Koivu near the end? What about their complete lack of production once Koivu got Williams' stick in the eye. The one thing I can agree with is that Koivu won't put up monster numbers by himself because he's a playmaker, and doesn't shoot nearly enough. But do you guys really believe that Marc Savard (what was he doing before being traded to Atlanta?) and Pavel Datsyuk would have had great numbers in Montreal this season, not playing on powerplays with the likes of Kovalchuk, Hossa, Lidstrom, Schneider, Shanahan, and Zetterberg? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 I guess my main point is that everyone always says that Koivu would be great with elite talent around him. My argument has always been that if he is truly an elite player himself, he would make the players around him elite.\ With that said, this team needs scoring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CerebusClone Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 I guess my main point is that everyone always says that Koivu would be great with elite talent around him. My argument has always been that if he is truly an elite player himself, he would make the players around him elite.\ With that said, this team needs scoring. Well, I don't think Koivu is an elite player. A star player, sure, but not elite. As for the players around him, I think he just needs players that can complete him well; Higgins seems to, and he's far from elite status. I think Koivu would do very well next season with Higgins and either Perezhogin (who by the way has about a point-per-game this season playing on the Koivu line) or Kostsitsyn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brboo Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 I've been saying this for years, though I think a team can be successful with Koivu as the #1 center. True #1 centers make the players around him better. Koivu has great leadership and makes his team better, but not the players around him. If he did, Ryder would have had 40 goals and Higgins never would have made it to the first line, since Zednik or whoever was there before would have been putting up better numbers. Look at Joe Thornton, he makes the guys around him better. Cheechoo is a good player, but without Joe, there is no way he leads the league in goals. Cheechoo's season was a direct result of Joe being a true #1 center. You know what there arent 30 joe thorntons or peter forsbergs or any other of the truly elite 5-6 players in the world. Every team cant have a mega superstar center. The team who owns them im sure just arent going to give them away. And finishing in the middle of the pack every year doesnt get us great draft positions. So the only way to get one is by either signing a FA, which would mean we would have to outbid all of the other big market teams. Trade away alot of our young talented players. Cause no body is giving us a number one center for Ribs and Bulis or zednik or any of our other underacheivers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaos Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 You know what there arent 30 joe thorntons or peter forsbergs or any other of the truly elite 5-6 players in the world. Every team cant have a mega superstar center. The team who owns them im sure just arent going to give them away. And finishing in the middle of the pack every year doesnt get us great draft positions. So the only way to get one is by either signing a FA, which would mean we would have to outbid all of the other big market teams. Trade away alot of our young talented players. Cause no body is giving us a number one center for Ribs and Bulis or zednik or any of our other underacheivers. Exactly, which is why I believe we won't be getting any top flight talent anytime soon. Having said that, you are wrong on point. Boston did give away Joe Thornton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoZed Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Sure, you dont need a Thornton to win the Stanley Cup... although I think the only team who won the Cup without a full-fledge #1 C was, uh... NJ? You do need elite players, however, and very good centers throughout the lineup. And if you dont have elite players up front on your #1 line, you must have them between the pipes or at the blueline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortcat1 Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Knowing the reactions of most habsworld members on this one, this was an easy poll result to predict. :king: :hlogo: :king: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Iron Lung Posted May 4, 2006 Share Posted May 4, 2006 Higgins all the way. I've never seen a player miss opportunities like Ribeiro... he should have had 5 goals in the series. He's becoming Brisebois... the centre of mistakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaos Posted May 4, 2006 Share Posted May 4, 2006 (edited) Its too bad his value has dropped so much. Gainey should be able to move him (RFA) but whether he can get more than a mid level draft pick for him (4th, 5th rounder) remains to be seen. I suspect as much as he's disliked Gainey will bring him back. Edited May 4, 2006 by kaos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.