Do we really need our 2008 first pick ?

[BTH]

Gelinas would be an awesome deadline acquisition for us. Not only is he a hardworker but he turns it up in the playoffs and wants to come here (he said so in the offseason but Bob turned him down). He isn't worth a first though, maybe a 3rd.

[johnnyhasbeen]

Detroit seems to be doing a fine job of drafting with late picks.

They do great with 2nd and 3rd rounders. Now that has to have some element of luck?

Detroit also signs big time UFAs, they do what it takes to win. Now that we are a real team ( I do feel that after the NJ game ) it is time to win. This is Montreal so win means cup. To win the cup Gainey has to add a gun or 2 for a 2nd line. If he thinks there is a chance to make a serious run here he will pull the gun. He won't, however, sell the farm for one shot. That is what places him up there with the best. If it costs us Koivu, Ryder, our 1st rounder and a prospect that isn't what we consider untouchable for a Bona fide top big centre and a more consistant winger were at least one could easily be signed, I say he would do it. I figure we pick 24th at best and then again 37th at worst. Almost as good chance of picking up a "gee they all missed that one" player in either spot.

[Zowpeb]

Depending on the trade I'd deal the next 2 first round picks in a hearbeat...I'd even deal some of our NHL talent in a deal. Notably, Ryder or some of our depth d-men...but even guys like Smoke and Begin may have some value to other teams...

Preferably, and to save a pick, I'd rather try and off-load some of the mid-tier, and/or blocked, prospects the team has...guys like Locke, Halak(if not Huet), and even a guy who we drafted 1st in Fischer...but I don't think other NHL GM's are stupid enough to take our left-overs and consider equal value to a 1st rounder...even if it's a former 1st round pick of ours.

If you can get a top shelf guy who you will have locked up for the next 2 seasons, and fit them under the cap, then you have to make the move.

This team is loaded with very good, young, talented, depth. If you can acquire an 80+ point forward, off-load an underacheiving Ryder while only throwing in 1-2 1st round picks with an AHL/Junior/College prospect or two...then you almost have to do it.

This team is 1 good forward and 1 good d-man away from being among most people's lists for "contender" status. They can likely get away without the D help since they have solid goaltending depth and a solid top 4 d-men...though I'll admit I'm on the fence a little, I don't think this team needs a real scoring presence on D...but another solid skating shutdown type would do loads for my confidence in the team.

Edited January 29, 2008 by Zowpeb

[Neech]

If we finish way up there in the standings - a distinct possibility - then I wouldn't necessarily object, provided the move got us back a real threat (and preferably that C we've been craving) AND we have a realistic chance of signing him to a deal. However the idea makes me a bit nervous, because it just feels too soon to me to deviate from the build-from-within philosophy that has produced an unbelievably balanced attack, a really cohesive team of young guys all imprinted with the CH on their hearts, and tons of depth, all on an affordable budget. I'm quite happy to continue along the present track and watch this team keep getting better. I'd rather we spend a season or two as a bona-fide elite team, getting experience in the postseason and all that, before pulling the trigger on a big deal to win us a Cup. But I may just be cautious by nature

I agree. This is not the year to be dealing our top picks, especially with the deep draft coming up. We're doing well now, but honestly we're not a legit contender who thinks they are in the prime years for a Cup run. Maybe next year, more likely the year after. We should try to lock down our good young talent first. Just get to the playoffs for starters, see how we do there, evaluate where we might want to go in the offseason.

The Tanguay move seems like the most intriguing at this point, but there would probably be another team more willing to give up good players than us. They'd want significant return for him, and I'm not sure who I'd feel good about giving up.

I like Gainey's move of dealing away Rivet for Gorges and a 1st rounder, especially now that we're seeing some good play out of Josh. Ryder would probably not land us a 1st rounder, but maybe someone like Vancouver or Minnesota, or who knows, would want some PP offense for the playoffs.

[bluesgm]

why change the team???? IMHO we can go with this roster into the playoffs and perform well. We have shown we can score, we are fast and we have good chemistry going for us. I really beleive that the way the team has started to play as a unit is better than any upgrade we can receive at the trade deadline, expcept for maybe a character pl;ayer for the third line that we can trade Ryder and maybe a second rounder or third rounder for. Again I think this goes back to MTL fans being trade feinds.......feinding for trades like drug addicts feind fro their drugs. It would be stupid to trade our 2008-2009 1sts as they are supposed to be maybe better than the 2003 draft. Also a lot of experts have said we have the best chemistry as a team of any team in the NHL at the moment. We shouldnt mess with that.

oh...and Hossa is a slug in the playoffs...waste of time to pay out of our arses for him and have him struggle and then lose him....that would be a party wouldnt it!

IMHO these lines would look good in the playoffs:

Kovalev(his emergence is 10x better than any rental player)-Plekanec-Kostitsyn

Higins-Koivu-Kostitsyn

Lattendresse-Lapierre-Dandenault

Kostopolous-Smolinski-Begin

That is a solid offence that will bring lots of energy

on D:

Markov-Komisarek

Hamrlik-O'Byrne

Bouillon-Gorges

Huet

a) Halak(if Hamilton Makes the Playoffs)

b) Price(If Hamilton Misses playoffs) <------I cant see them letting him go home or sit around, if hes not playing in hamilton he will be backing up in MTL

[Neech]

We'll probably try to unload Ryder, maybe someone will be desperate and give up a 1st for him if we throw in a 3rd or 4th as well.

[JMMR]

We'll probably try to unload Ryder, maybe someone will be desperate and give up a 1st for him if we throw in a 3rd or 4th as well.

There will be desperate teams but will they learn from Nashville and Atlanta ?

[bluesgm]

We'll probably try to unload Ryder, maybe someone will be desperate and give up a 1st for him if we throw in a 3rd or 4th as well.

GM's know this is a deep draft...if yah think were getting a first for Ryder....you need to get to rehab, and fast!

[Neech]

GM's know this is a deep draft...if yah think were getting a first for Ryder....you need to get to rehab, and fast!

Yeah, I don't think we will, but in combo with another pick it could happen. More likely we'll get some prospect and/or a mid-level pick.

[Easy Ryder]

Yeah, I don't think we will, but in combo with another pick it could happen. More likely we'll get some prospect and/or a mid-level pick.

To have a first rounder for Ryder would need Ryder to go on rehab.

Too much at stake as we do not have a prospect centre first liner.

So for me never trade a first round pick for a rent player, i mean anyone in the list even

Hossa who is a major choker. He and is brother share the same blood.

The only prospects trade that i would accept would include Latendresse, Fisher, Maxwell, White and

Emelin-Perezhogin right.

[Habsfan]

if yah think were getting a first for Ryder....you need to get to rehab, and fast!

Do you guys think we could get a second round pick for Ryder?

At this point, I think i'd be willing to trade Ryder for a second round pick. Anything is better than nothing!

[bluesgm]

At this point, I think i'd be willing to trade Ryder for a second round pick. Anything is better than nothing!

I think we are most likely to get either a "project" prospect or an older third line checker for Ryder....look what we got for Ribeiro who was not struggling and tell me Ryder is worth more?? Sure 30 goals in

last two years

...its soooo funny how people over rate our struglling players...thinking we are going to get Richards in a trade involving Ryder. We have to hope we get something decent for Ryder....but I think we might just let him go to UFA...we have a decent top-6 without him

[ch_nl]

Basic no. 1: Do not trade a first round pick.

Basic no. 2: If violation to Basic no. 1 it better be a franchise player.

But I just took a look at The Fourth Periods list over available reantal players. First of all I don't think the Habs should trade Ryder. Yes he had a poor season thus far but I think it has to do with lack of chemistry. Remember how Higgins, Koivu and Ryder where the line that clicked? Now it's Plekanec and Kovalev that has something going on.

Trade may be the easy way but doesn't have to be the best.

Anyway, back to the list. Sundin won't play for the Habs and I don't think getting a sniper is the solution either. But a more physical forward.

Marleau and Jokinen should be on top if Gaineys list, and even Tanguay. But how about Fedorov? Recent rumour has him going to Ottawa for Joe Corvo. We have Smolinski with a no trade clause. In my book Fedorov would be an upgrade. A more versitaile player with great faceoff skills. Great +/- and could serve the third line. Smolinski is an Ohio native and maybe he could wave his clause to play near home?

[Neech]

I think we are most likely to get either a "project" prospect or an older third line checker for Ryder....look what we got for Ribeiro who was not struggling and tell me Ryder is worth more?? Sure 30 goals in ...its soooo funny how people over rate our struglling players...thinking we are going to get Richards in a trade involving Ryder. We have to hope we get something decent for Ryder....but I think we might just let him go to UFA...we have a decent top-6 without him

Yeah, it's probably just as likely that we'll let Ryder walk after the season, if he starts to play a bit better he could be more valuable for our playoff run than whatever slim pickings we might receive in a trade.

[Habsfan]

Sundin won't play for the Habs

I think we can pretty much all agree with that !

Marleau and Jokinen should be on top if Gaineys list, and even Tanguay.

Once again, I agree! However, I don'T think i'd be willing to give up too much to pick up these players. Sure, we would all be willing to give up Ryder, Halak, Locke, Ferland, Dandenault, Danis, Archer, Grabovski, Milroy, J.P Côté, and i'd even be willing to part with Chipchura or Carle. But let's be honest here. These guys are a dime a dozen in the NHL, no GM will give up a good NHL player for these guys. SO to think that we could trade for Jolkinen or Marleau...is a bit unrealistic.

I doubt Bob will get a chance to make any deals come Feb. 26th!?!?!

But how about Fedorov? Recent rumour has him going to Ottawa for Joe Corvo. We have Smolinski with a no trade clause. In my book Fedorov would be an upgrade. A more versitaile player with great faceoff skills. Great +/- and could serve the third line. Smolinski is an Ohio native and maybe he could wave his clause to play near home?

Meh! I'm not sure that would be a good trade? True Fedorov has more talent then Smokes, but he's 38 years old. Smokes is 35. Fedorov is in the last year of his contract. He was making 6 million$ per year. Do you think he'd be willing to take a HUGE paycut? Like all the way down to 2 million$ for one season? I certainly don't think so!

[Dalhabs]

Keep the picks. Id rather not trade away future keyplayers for a slight (at best) improvement of our current team.

[bluesgm]

i WOULD not trade our first this year for:

Jokinen

Tanguay

Hossa

Sundin

All these guys are good players but none of them are Franchise. Jokinen and Tanguay are young and dynamic but they are not franchise players. Hossa is good in the reg. season but I wouldnt want him in the PO, he was front and centre of the Snes F-ups. Sundin "was" a franchise centre but he isnt anymore...too old

I dont even think I would disrupt the obvious chemistry our team has at the moment for many players in the NHL if I know Gainey like I think I know him it would take a special guy for him to move anyone this year. Except for Ryder, who is obviously struggling, but still we would get such a shitty return for him that i might be worth it to "hope" that he breaks out and reverts to his old self in the playoffs.

[ch_nl]

Sundin is a franshise player.

The Maple Leafs wouldn't be anything at all without him.

And about Smolinski over Fedorov. As I see it Chipchura can do the job that Smolinski does right now in about a year. I think I have read that Fedorov would love to end his career in Montreal and I do believe he could take a paycut. (He's not offensive threat he once was when playing with Larionov and Kozlov. But he's still solid in the defensive zone and Montreal have interesting scoring in the youth department)

Im trying to find a trade partner among the 25 on the list that makes sense for both clubs as I don't see how Gainey could obtain Jokinen, Marleau or Tanguay.

[smon]

Fedorov is feasible, depends on if the Blue Jackets fall out of the playoff race though. If they do, I'm sure he'd be attractive to many contending teams because of his expiring contract and track record.

[ch_nl]

If there's any truth in the rumour having him for Joe Corvo then why wouldn't Smolinski fit?

I guess our Blue Jackets expert could answer this?

[Neech]

If there's any truth in the rumour having him for Joe Corvo then why wouldn't Smolinski fit?

I guess our Blue Jackets expert could answer this?

Why would a non-playoff team want an old mediocre player? They look for picks, prospects or good young roster players in exchange for rentals.

[smon]

If there's any truth in the rumour having him for Joe Corvo then why wouldn't Smolinski fit?

I guess our Blue Jackets expert could answer this?

I'm no expert on the Blue Jackets, but there are several things that are obviously wrong

For starters, Smolinski's contract is expiring at the end of this season and his talent level is nowhere near Fedorov's - why wouldn't they just keep Fedorov for the remainder of his deal till the end of the year then?

Next, Corvo is actually a useful offensive blueliner who is not in his late 30's.

And, the Blue Jackets are all of 1 point out of the playoffs right now, so chances are they keep Fedorov.

Edited January 31, 2008 by smon

[bluesgm]

Sundin is a franshise player.

The Maple Leafs wouldn't be anything at all without him.

TOOO OLD! past his prime!!!!!! has about 2 years of decent play in him, nothing special!

I wouldnt trade your left nut for him!

[Habsfan]

TOOO OLD! past his prime!!!!!! has about 2 years of decent play in him, nothing special!

I wouldnt trade your left nut for him!

I agree that Sundin is gettin up there (in terms of Age) but look at him this year. HE is a real Monster. AS much as we are all happy with Kovalev this year, Sundin has 10 points more than Kovy. THe Guy is a work horse. I'd love to have this guy on our team, but I'm not willing to pay much for him, as he'll be a UFA in July, and he will most definitely go back to Toronto.

[SAKS-AVENUE]

I agree that Sundin is gettin up there (in terms of Age) but look at him this year. HE is a real Monster. AS much as we are all happy with Kovalev this year, Sundin has 10 points more than Kovy. THe Guy is a work horse. I'd love to have this guy on our team, but I'm not willing to pay much for him, as he'll be a UFA in July, and he will most definitely go back to Toronto.

I hate these goofy loop holes in the NEW Nhl. If I was a GM this is what I would do. Time three or four big contracts with your top players so that they all become UFA's at the end of a certain year. In those contract talks a new "5 year deal would be negotiated and agreed upon before the trading deadline of that year. A part of the agreement would state the player must honor signing back with the team during the summer, most likely a handshake.

How does everyone win?

Let's say Saks, Kovalev, and Markov's contracts end in the same year and have agreed to come back in the summer. We trade Markov to Atlanta for Hossa, Kovalev to Calgary for Tanguay and Saku to San Jose for Marleau. Season ends all players resign and we now have all 6 players to go and win the cup ourselves without losing anybody.

I know it's a little more complicated with the salary cap and players being tempted with crazy money as UFA'S, but in certain circumstances where players are extremely loyal like Saks and Markov this could be pulled of for the name of family. In this case . The HABS.

Saks loves Montreal. Markov could have tested free agency and sign with OV in Washington but he did not. Kovalev loves Montreal and might do it if he knew the big plan. The one thing to consider is how to keep all of this bullet proof, Hush-Hush, and under the salary cap.