Whatever happens, this has been really fun!

[dlbalr]

What things were said?

Wasn't publicized (I'm sure to avoid controversy), I heard this from a contact of mine. I should emphasize, this is off the record stuff so I can't 100% guarantee its validity - it makes sense though which is why I mention it. As to what was said, I'm pretty sure we can figure it out (player whines, coach benches, player comes back, coach gives instructions, player ignores, player gets benched again) - insert standard script here.

[Wamsley01]

Let's not forget the "incident" when he'd just finished junior (in 2007). The Habs signed him to an ATO so he could skate with the Bulldogs. When he quickly learned he wouldn't be playing, he whined until they let him go. Anyone remember what happened back in 2007?

As for now, I mentioned this the other day: some things were said after Game 5 of the Washington series; unless there are multiple injuries (or the Habs become flat out desperate), he ain't playing.

He has generally been a pain in the ass and he just doesn't possess the talent level to get away with it.

[saskhab]

Wasn't publicized (I'm sure to avoid controversy), I heard this from a contact of mine. I should emphasize, this is off the record stuff so I can't 100% guarantee its validity - it makes sense though which is why I mention it. As to what was said, I'm pretty sure we can figure it out (player whines, coach benches, player comes back, coach gives instructions, player ignores, player gets benched again) - insert standard script here.

Game 5 is about when Andrei became completely useless, too.

It sucks because, well, Sergei has been a good player at times. Definitely not consistent, but when his brother was out with injury, he was very good.

[bar]

Why is SK getting the short end of the stick? He has been a problem for 2 years. Pyatt, Subban both rookies do exactly what JM wants them to do and they are rewarded by being on the big club and earning minutes every night. So i don't see a JM problem with with rookies.

I am not even a big JM fan but his teams do work hard. He asks his players to follow the system or else, if players can't figure that out it's on them.

What has SK done to earn ice time?

Subban hasn't made a mistake yet, just wait for it. SK has played well, how can he score these tons of goals, getting peanuts for time? I remember SK getting PK time, and looking pretty good. I'd rather SK out there than Maxwell or Metro..especially since he's a good skater. I must be blind, I don't see the lack of effort on his part. I'd rather a 3rd line of Moore/Laps/Skost, than Moore/Laps/Metro.

Edited May 4, 2010 by bar

[BCHabnut]

Subban hasn't made a mistake yet, just wait for it. SK has played well, how can he score these tons of goals, getting peanuts for time? I remember SK getting PK time, and looking pretty good. I'd rather SK out there than Maxwell or Metro..especially since he's a good skater. I must be blind, I don't see the lack of effort on his part. I'd rather a 3rd line of Moore/Laps/Skost, than Moore/Laps/Metro.

SK is a very good penalty killer. But if there is a problem, there is a problem. I would be willing to bet money that it is that he likes to dangle at the opposition blueline when he doesn't have support. I have seen him get stripped of the puck so many times doing that. If the coach wants puck support, no stretch pass, back coverage and north south, that's what you give him. If AK and SK are spoiled brats, then buh bye! The only thing that concerns me about the whole thing is that Latendresse was the opposite of a bawl baby. He took his lumps and seemed to have a good atitude. Insert JM, bye bye Gui.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

My impression with SK is less that he doesn't hustle out there on the ice, than that he doesn't listen to/respect coaches and is perpetually whining. On the ice, he plays with some moxy a reasonable per centage of the time. That doesn't mean he's coachable or isn't poison in the room.

With AK, it seems to be more a general cluelessness and on-ice laziness (or else, lack of confidence). He is, to a striking degree, a carbon copy of Kovalev in terms of on-ice approach, just not talented enough to get away with it.

I'm with everyone else - both bros. will be out of here by next training camp. This will create problems, though, because we'll need comparably cheap talent to fill those roster spots. Nonetheless, one thing is overwhelmingly clear. The Jacques Martin era is a return to the traditional Habs' philosophy that values hard work, team play and commitment above all else. We're seeing in these playoffs exactly what that philosophy can accomplish. As an organizational philosophy, it does mean sometimes letting go of talented players; the trade-off is that you can often achieve a whole that surpasses the sum of its parts.

Latendresse is a hard case. He said himself that he 'knew' his time here was done when he wasn't offered a longer-term contract. I think he went into this particular season with a bad attitude, perhaps alienated by the Big Purge as well as his disappointment that the team didn't commit to him; and therefore he was demoralized and unwilling to buy into what JM was selling. This is too bad, because while his talent was always open to question, until this season he did seem to be a committed player who could have fit into the team-first philosophy described above. It seems that the Lats/Habs relationship is a casualty of timing more than anything else.

Edited May 4, 2010 by The Chicoutimi Cucumber

[bar]

After the recent incident...I rescind my earlier defense

Where's the crow I gotta eat.

[Doktor Kosmos]

Regardless of how it ends (I think the Pens will win the series and I consider every Habs win a success in itself), although I'm sure everyone who's not a Habs fan (and even a bunch of us) agree that while it isn't pretty, they've won a number of games against (supposedly) better opposition teams in these playpoffs. They've outdone themselves, which is not something you can say for either the Pens or the Caps IMHO. So how can I not be thrilled with this season? Except for when my brother and I were in Montreal to see three games, I haven't had this much fun as Habs fan since 1993. So even if they lose this series, I am geniunly proud to be a Canadiens fan.

Gionta, Cammalleri, Gomez, Gill, Moen and Moore have been real nice additions. Subban has stepped in and done a real good job replacing arguably the best player on the team; Andrei Markov. Halak, while maybe not on the same level as Brodeur or Roy and the like, what's impressed me the most about him is his way of finding a way to see the puck when the shot comes (which is key to making the saves of course) and how calm he is. I think in Game 1 of this series both he and the rest of the team were simply mentally and physically drained after the 7-game series against Washington. They just had too little time to muster the needed strenght to make it into a tought game for the Pens - and even then they only lost by a margin of two goals (not counting the empty netter). And they'de done a good job at keeping world-class offensive players off the scoresheet on regular basis.

In other words: <3

[Prime Minister Koivu]

Subban hasn't made a mistake yet, just wait for it. SK has played well, how can he score these tons of goals, getting peanuts for time? I remember SK getting PK time, and looking pretty good. I'd rather SK out there than Maxwell or Metro..especially since he's a good skater. I must be blind, I don't see the lack of effort on his part. I'd rather a 3rd line of Moore/Laps/Skost, than Moore/Laps/Metro.

If we let players get away with not listening to the coach then we create the same old atmosphere that Bob purged last summer. Listen to the coach, work hard and you will play. Be an ass and you will not play regardless of talent.

I like this aspect of JM.

[saskhab]

It's hard to stand up for SK74. That London Knights team has produced a lot of talented, high on themselves drama queens. Rob Schremp comes to mind. Patrick Kane isn't exactly a model citizen.

We should be a better player with Sergei. We aren't. That's a problem right there.

[Wamsley01]

It's hard to stand up for SK74. That London Knights team has produced a lot of talented, high on themselves drama queens. Rob Schremp comes to mind. Patrick Kane isn't exactly a model citizen.

We should be a better player with Sergei. We aren't. That's a problem right there.

When your teammate asks you why you aren't practicing and follows it up with "too good?"

it says a hell of a lot about the situation.

[alexstream]

...BTH has said something similar. Other fans (younger?) seem to take the view that beating Washington,...

hmm, you can't really be younger than BTH.

[alexstream]

the thread is tl, therefore, I dr

for my part

ranking (recent) :

2002 (we won vs #1 boons, koivu back from cancer, audette back from "hand-cutting" injury, emotions emotions emotions, Theo won the Hart, made diving saves and saves with one hand in his back, etc.)

2004 (we came back from a 3-1 lead to win vs #1 boons. crapping our pants vs Carolina is the reason why it's not #1)

2010 (we bored the Caps to death, so they comitted suicide, we're trying to do the same with the Pens)

2008 (we finished 1st and only barely made it to 2nd round to get crushed in the 2nd round...)

Overall

I can only remember 1993 for the habs, but I don't remember the games so well, I just remember the excitement, the newspaper collection (I still have a bunch of frontpages of lapresse)

I remember enjoying Bure's run for the cup while with Vancouver in 199(5?)

after 1995, my interest tanked until 2001-2002.

Don't mistake me, this is the best habs team since 1998 (Damphousse and Recchi left). This is the most exciting, the team most filled with leaders, etc.

But those games in these playoffs are not bringing tears to my eyes.

I know that if the Pens score more than 3 goals, we're most likely cooked. While in 2002, I really was under the impression that that team could do ANYTHING. right now, I don't have that feeling. If camm doesn't score or Halak doesn't save, we're cooked. Matt Cooked.

[Wamsley01]

the thread is tl, therefore, I dr

for my part

ranking (recent) :

2002 (we won vs #1 boons, koivu back from cancer, audette back from "hand-cutting" injury, emotions emotions emotions, Theo won the Hart, made diving saves and saves with one hand in his back, etc.)

2004 (we came back from a 3-1 lead to win vs #1 boons. crapping our pants vs Carolina is the reason why it's not #1)

2010 (we bored the Caps to death, so they comitted suicide, we're trying to do the same with the Pens)

2008 (we finished 1st and only barely made it to 2nd round to get crushed in the 2nd round...)

Overall

I can only remember 1993 for the habs, but I don't remember the games so well, I just remember the excitement, the newspaper collection (I still have a bunch of frontpages of lapresse)

I remember enjoying Bure's run for the cup while with Vancouver in 199(5?)

after 1995, my interest tanked until 2001-2002.

Don't mistake me, this is the best habs team since 1998 (Damphousse and Recchi left). This is the most exciting, the team most filled with leaders, etc.

But those games in these playoffs are not bringing tears to my eyes.

I know that if the Pens score more than 3 goals, we're most likely cooked. While in 2002, I really was under the impression that that team could do ANYTHING. right now, I don't have that feeling. If camm doesn't score or Halak doesn't save, we're cooked. Matt Cooked.

I bought in to 2002 whole heartedly too. Most people forget yesterday by 11pm yesterday.

THere has been NOTHING in these playoffs that matched Game 3 against the Bruins when they trailed 3-1

in the second period and the Canadiens scored 2 goals in less than a minute to tie it. If that wasn't enough,

Markov fed Audette who fed Saku coming across the net as he went by Dafoe and slid it in the empty net.

The Bell Center erupted louder than I can remember as it was all a buildup from Koivu's cancer treatment.

It was the first goal he scored after his 10 minute ovation at the Bell for his return. The fact that it put the

Habs in the lead created bedlam.

Add in Theo's magic season and heroics and I really believed that they were going on a historic run.

Halak's great Game 6 pales in comparison to that moment. Still gives me chills when I see that highlight.

[BCHabnut]

Ya 2002 is deinitely the most fun I've had since 93, Habs wise. But you have to admit that this is fun. Anyone that watched the Habs in the 80's, this is a lot of what you got. Steady dose of defense.

[Wamsley01]

Ya 2002 is deinitely the most fun I've had since 93, Habs wise. But you have to admit that this is fun. Anyone that watched the Habs in the 80's, this is a lot of what you got. Steady dose of defense.

The 80s was dominant stifling defense though. In the 80s there would be games where the

opposition got 6-7 scoring chances in 60 minutes. New Jersey Devils style "you aren't getting a lick" defense.

The Caps were getting 25-30 scoring chances per game.

This is passive and dangerous.

[BCHabnut]

The 80s was dominant stifling defense though. In the 80s there would be games where the

opposition got 6-7 scoring chances in 60 minutes. New Jersey Devils style "you aren't getting a lick" defense.

The Caps were getting 25-30 scoring chances per game.

This is passive and dangerous.

No, you are right. The style was like the third period yesterday. 7 shots for, and 3 against. LOL Carried over 3 periods. I was more pointing out the boring part, or lack of firewagon style. The shots against are silly and dangerous. Way too passive in keeping the shots to the outside.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

The Montreal Canadiens INVENTED New Jersey Devil style hockey. We had it practically patented over the 1980s and until Pat Burns's departure. Even the 1970s team had an overarching commitment to team D. It's been aggravating to me to watch Jersey basically steal that model and win with it, while we floundered around pathetically. There's a reason Lou Ciagrillo tends to hire ex-habs to run his operation.

A further note. All you young fans watching this playoff: the kind of work ethic, leadership, discipline and team commitment that you're seeing from this group? It used to be something the Habs put out EVERY YEAR. Year in and year out. What's blowing you away right now is something that old coots like me used to take for granted from the Montreal Canadiens. Think about that and you start to undertand the real meaning of the :hlogo:

[BCHabnut]

What sucks about this whole run is that as Kozes said, now JM has a little more credibility and Boucher is on the block for a NHL job. Sigh. I really want to see Boucher coach the Habs in the next few years.

[dlbalr]

What sucks about this whole run is that as Kozes said, now JM has a little more credibility and Boucher is on the block for a NHL job. Sigh. I really want to see Boucher coach the Habs in the next few years.

What you say is easily doable though. The average shelf life for a coach is what, 2-3 years? If someone wants to bring Boucher up now, let them - he'll be fired at or around the same time Martin's deal expires anyways. Best of both worlds, let Boucher go through the growing pains elsewhere.

[Wamsley01]

What sucks about this whole run is that as Kozes said, now JM has a little more credibility and Boucher is on the block for a NHL job. Sigh. I really want to see Boucher coach the Habs in the next few years.

I think that they have a plan with Boucher. I think fans tend to get driven by fear, I do it all the time with Price.

I probably worry more about the possibility of them dealing Price in one day then Gauthier/Gainey have even thought about

it this season. Same thing with Boucher, none of us wants him to go anywhere, so we fear that he will.

I never worried about things like this through the 1980s, it is essentially the pain and fall out from Houle trading Patrick Roy.

A move so earth shattering for the fanbase that we still haven't recovered from it. We all know that at any point that any

player is vulnerable. Gainey cutting Koivu and Kovalev loose this summer hasn't helped, even though it was the right move.

Fans born pre 1975 have a different understanding of what constitutes the CH. It's just the way it is. I didn't celebrate first round

victories, the concept was and is still absurd to ME. I understand why the fanbase does it, I just think it is silly to celebrate a job

that is 25% done. It is like acting like you won the Superbowl because you lead after the first quarter.

Edited May 6, 2010 by Wamsley01

[BCHabnut]

I was pretty much furious if they didn't make the whales conference final. They always won the Norris division playoff, but when they moved to the Adams, I was still mad if they didn't make the conference final.

[Wamsley01]

I was pretty much furious if they didn't make the whales conference final. They always won the Norris division playoff, but when they moved to the Adams, I was still mad if they didn't make the conference final.

Yep. From 88-94 it was pretty frustrating. They only beat the Bruins once.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Yep. From 88-94 it was pretty frustrating. They only beat the Bruins once.

Damn that Andy Moog!!

[Prime Minister Koivu]

Damn that Andy Moog!!

Réjean Lemelin!

I hated that guy too!