The Best Habs Free Agent Signing

[BCHabnut]

Coughpaciorettycough

Lol. Oh ya. Stuck in the past

[DON]

Don gets mad at players who don't Rispek Da Sysdum

"Used" to get mad at, now I don't give em much thought till Cammy get praised by someone here and is just kinda like like nails on a chalkboard.

Not a big deal and I do know 90% of Habs fans think a lot of him and he does average 29g/82gms, so he can score goals.

[Machine of Loving Grace]

Cammalleri is like that scene in Moneyball where he has to constantly repeat that the players get on base. Cammy scores goals. Doesn't matter how you feel about his play without the puck. Dude scores goals. Period.

[Commandant]

I think we should dig up the Cammalleri traded thread.

Lets remember the deal... the Habs gave up Cammalleri, Kari Ramo and a 7th for Rene Bourque, Patrick Holland and a 2nd.

I remember hating the deal.

I also remember some liked it.

I think in hindsight, its pretty clear that it was a TERRIBLE trade for the Habs.

I wonder if the people who liked it are the same ones defending the Subban trade today.

[dlbalr]

I think Roman Hamrlik should be in the discussion here. He gave the Habs four solid (and underrated seasons), playing pretty much #2 minutes the entire time while replacing Sheldon Souray. He averaged nearly 30 points per season (the Habs made the postseason each year), blocked an absolute ton of shots (731 in 312 games), and provided a lot of stability on the back end. He was never flashy but he was a key, core player in his tenure with Montreal.

[DON]

I think we should dig up the Cammalleri traded thread.

Lets remember the deal... the Habs gave up Cammalleri, Kari Ramo and a 7th for Rene Bourque, Patrick Holland and a 2nd.

I remember hating the deal.

I also remember some liked it.

I think in hindsight, its pretty clear that it was a TERRIBLE trade for the Habs.

I wonder if the people who liked it are the same ones defending the Subban trade today.

Umm, I may be all alone on that one, but I will never forget after the intermission and Squid wasn't on the bench, that was a good evening indeed (in hindsight, did I like the way it was done, not at all, was bush-league)

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

I think Roman Hamrlik should be in the discussion here. He gave the Habs four solid (and underrated seasons), playing pretty much #2 minutes the entire time while replacing Sheldon Souray. He averaged nearly 30 points per season (the Habs made the postseason each year), blocked an absolute ton of shots (731 in 312 games), and provided a lot of stability on the back end. He was never flashy but he was a key, core player in his tenure with Montreal.

Good call. The Hammer was under-rated and a real glue guy for that back end over much of the life of the contract.

[dlbalr]

Umm, I may be all alone on that one, but I will never forget after the intermission and Squid wasn't on the bench, that was a good evening indeed (in hindsight, did I like the way it was done, not at all, was bush-league)

It was certainly bush league but boy was that an interesting couple of hours. I was on 3 Stars duty that game and I spent more time looking for any info on the trade than I did actually writing the article. (I did get the 3 Stars online although hardly anyone read it as the trade came out shortly thereafter.) Evidently many others were looking for info well as that 'Most Online' number you see in the site stats at the bottom of the main forum page came from that night (though I imagine some of that number consisted of some bots as well).

[Commandant]

Hamrlik was debated.

Shawn told me his top 3 were Cammalleri, Hamrlik, Gionta in that order.

Umm, I may be all alone on that one, but I will never forget after the intermission and Squid wasn't on the bench, that was a good evening indeed (in hindsight, did I like the way it was done, not at all, was bush-league)

I think most if not all of us agreed it was a bushleague way to make a trade.

I think the issue is if people thought it was a good return or not... and in hindsight, we got hosed.

[Lovett's Magnatones]

I think Roman Hamrlik should be in the discussion here. He gave the Habs four solid (and underrated seasons), playing pretty much #2 minutes the entire time while replacing Sheldon Souray. He averaged nearly 30 points per season (the Habs made the postseason each year), blocked an absolute ton of shots (731 in 312 games), and provided a lot of stability on the back end. He was never flashy but he was a key, core player in his tenure with Montreal.

He was a major hole when Markov got injured at the start of 2010-2011. Back when my Bruins friends used to give me a bunch of crap about Markov playing again. "Dude. He's not coming back."

[dlbalr]

He was a major hole when Markov got injured at the start of 2010-2011. Back when my Bruins friends used to give me a bunch of crap about Markov playing again. "Dude. He's not coming back."

How much of him being a hole was relative to the fact he was playing heavy minutes at the age of 36 (as he was in '10-'11?) They had Gill, Gorges, and Subban as the other top four defencemen that year when Markov was out. That's a tough spot to thrive in.

[DON]

Hamrlik was debated.

Shawn told me his top 3 were Cammalleri, Hamrlik, Gionta in that order.

I think most if not all of us agreed it was a bushleague way to make a trade.

I think the issue is if people thought it was a good return or not... and in hindsight, we got hosed.

Yes agree that Bourque flopped, Holland busted and basically got Fucale or de la Rose left from the deal I think.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

If memory serves, I didn't mind Bourque as a return at the time - based mostly on his stats and profile as a big, dirty SOB - but denied the need to trade Cammalleri in the first place. Cammy had led a player rebellion against The Count. The Goat fired The Count. OK. But to then ship out a star player who had led the rebellion just seemed like confusion to me. Either you accommodate the rebellion and fire the coach, or you accommodate the coach and trade away the key figures in the player rebellion. To sabotage both coach and rebel just spoke to incoherent, reactive, petulant management. That was the moment when I concluded Gauthier had lost the plot, never mind the whole way the trade was handled, which was a disgrace.

Anyway, I was totally wrong to put any hope in Bourque as adequate value for Cammy - as Habs29 quite correctly insisted at the time. Sadly, Habs29's grouchy responses to management decisions have all too often proved to be the right response over the years.

My history, by contrast, is one of tending to align with management on these things, inclining toward an optimistic interpretation of what the team is doing. It takes an egregious exercise in massive and self-evident, franchise-damaging stupidity - like the Subban trade - to override this basic impulse.

[Lovett's Magnatones]

How much of him being a hole was relative to the fact he was playing heavy minutes at the age of 36 (as he was in '10-'11?) They had Gill, Gorges, and Subban as the other top four defencemen that year when Markov was out. That's a tough spot to thrive in.

Wrong year...I meant 2011-2012 when Markov got hurt and Hamrlik signed elsewhere.

[DON]

as Habs29 quite correctly insisted at the time. Sadly, Habs29's grouchy responses to management decisions have all too often proved to be the right response over the years.

Even a broken clock is correct twice a day.

[xXx..CK..xXx]

I think we should dig up the Cammalleri traded thread.

Lets remember the deal... the Habs gave up Cammalleri, Kari Ramo and a 7th for Rene Bourque, Patrick Holland and a 2nd.

I remember hating the deal.

I also remember some liked it.

I think in hindsight, its pretty clear that it was a TERRIBLE trade for the Habs.

I wonder if the people who liked it are the same ones defending the Subban trade today.

Personally, I hated the Cammalleri trade and did not see the return as enough. He led the playoffs in scoring for crying out loud. How can you have a more important player than that?

I disliked the Subban trade when I heard about it but think there are some positives that come from the move as well.

I didn't see any positives out of the Cammalleri trade and think that trade was clearly much worse of a return. The numbers did show some promise for Bourque but I just wasn't feeling it... At all.

Weber is older but it can't be argued that he's been and hopefully still is an elite player. Bourque's not comparable and in my opinion, at the time, Cammalleri was one of the most valuable players in the league. I know, some might argue Subban is as well.

For the record, I thought of Subban in the same way that people who hate the trade think of him now, when he was a junior and when we drafted him. As a matter of fact, I'm sure like others, I was surprised he made it to the 2nd round. He was literally my favorite player not in the NHL after I saw the WJC. I still think he's quite good obviously but I don't agree that he's the best. What I can agree with is that he still has the potential and time to grow into being the best. At the time, I felt like there was no better player in the league (playoffs) who would perform better in the playoffs than Cammy. He was ridiculously clutch.

I guess I can admit that I do have more faith in Bergevin than Gauthier because I do try to look at things from all perspectives in a fair manner and at the time I thought the attitude reasoning for shipping out Cammy was pretty much stupid. While I take the Subban comments with a true grain of salt, I do see him as having more of a domineering personality that can really have an effect on others, either positive or negative.

Who knows? Maybe he's a narcissist who has us all fooled! That was a joke, but my humor is often based with the 1% chance that there's some truth to it ?

[xXx..CK..xXx]

After reviewing a bit of the Cammalleri thread, I think it's possible that people were a little more patient with that trade because it included more pieces than just a straight up Cammalleri for Bourque. Holland was a little bit of a wildcard.

It's very odd for me because I'm trying to be open minded about this and people seem to have been much more upset about this trade than the Cammy one. Perhaps it was the other pieces, perhaps it's contracts as well but I just think that we at least got a serviceable return in the Subban trade whereas we traded Michael Cammalleri for (to quote someone) Rene 'friggin' Bourque.

I guess subtracting Subban is fairly substantial but the team is still going to be fighting next year. The Cammy trade was like rebuilding a new team all over again because he was THE guy in the playoffs. Price wasn't there yet.

[DON]

After reviewing a bit of the Cammalleri thread, I think it's possible that people were a little more patient with that trade because it included more pieces than just a straight up Cammalleri for Bourque. Holland was a little bit of a wildcard.

It's very odd for me because I'm trying to be open minded about this and people seem to have been much more upset about this trade than the Cammy one. Perhaps it was the other pieces, perhaps it's contracts as well but I just think that we at least got a serviceable return in the Subban trade whereas we traded Michael Cammalleri for (to quote someone) Rene 'friggin' Bourque.

I guess subtracting Subban is fairly substantial but the team is still going to be fighting next year. The Cammy trade was like rebuilding a new team all over again because he was THE guy in the playoffs. Price wasn't there yet.

Cept when faced Flyers in Semi-Finals.

Also, do still have Fucale from the trade.

[hab29RETIRED]

Even a broken clock is correct twice a day.

Whereas a DON is always wrong.

[hab29RETIRED]

Cept when faced Flyers in Semi-Finals.

Also, do still have Fucale from the trade.

When exactly did play well against the Flyers??? Even Halak looked done. The one guy in that series who at least TRIED hard for us, just got traded.

[DON]

When exactly did play well against the Flyers??? Even Halak looked done. The one guy in that series who at least TRIED hard for us, just got traded.

Didn't say anything about any other player and was strictly responding to Squid as "the man" comment, but if you want to go off on some other tangent, fly at er.

[hab29RETIRED]

You commented about his lack of production against the flyers. My point is that no one on our team did squat, so it's hardly fair to single out Cammy. Hell, we could have still used him th past couple of years.

Didn't say anything about any other player and was strictly responding to Squid as "the man" comment, but if you want to go off on some other tangent, fly at er.

[Commandant]

It should be noted that with 10 points in 7 games against the Bruins in 2011.... Cammalleri was once again the NHL's leading playoff scorer at the end of the round the Habs were eliminated.

[Lovett's Magnatones]

The Cammalleri trade was a loser. I can see DON's perspective because I remember how much he personally disliked him (like me with Diaz) but there was no upside to that deal then or now.

[xXx..CK..xXx]

Cept when faced Flyers in Semi-Finals.

Also, do still have Fucale from the trade.

Yeah, I think the timing was just right when it came to his playoff success with us and our system favored his style. I possibly overrated him to an extent but to get Rene Bourque as a return when Cammalleri was developing a reputation as a playoff monster was ridiculous in my opinion. Was Calgary even a playoff team? Why target them? That trade was a doozy and I wasn't a fan but he was not doing as great in the regular season and I guess that should count for something.

I also think it's important to randomly note that it's difficult to compare trades under different regimes. We're the Habs forever but different management will have a different mindset. It's the same for the team Canada debate. Saying that past GMs have left key players off the team, doesn't have much to do with the now. For instance, was it the same people who chose Draper over Crosby and Weber over Subban? I could look it up but I'm really asking. I believe Hitchcock has been around awhile but the point remains. If it's different management, then it's tough to compare why they've done what.