Commandant Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 I love how guys who are 5'11 are smaller players, but 6'0 is adequate size. Yakupov is closer is height to EriK Cole than he is to DD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blonde Demon Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Did you not read my last post? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HabsTrick450 Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 lol, yes, he is, but Parise has proven he can play the NHL game..Yakupov, as good as he is, is just a prospect..Do you want to take a risk on a smaller player in the lottery position? Nail hasn't proven that he can play in the bigs, just yet.. I never said the kid doesn't have the talent, just mean I wouldn't pick him 1st overall.. Crosby is 5'11'', he had not proven that he could play in the NHL and Pittsburgh picked him 1st OA. Now I know Sid is a much more talented player than Yakupov, but still, if someone is being touted as one of the best prospects in years and that he is available to pick at 1st OA, why wouldn't someone pick him? As for the Habs, Yakupov would be awesome but will probably be picked by Columbus so either Forsberg or Grigorenko will do. If the Habs decide to grab a d-man, which is highly unlikely given the number of D's with the team and Beaulieu, Tinordi as top prospects coming, Murray would be a decent choice. In the off-season, I would fire Gauthier and find a suitable replacement. Cunneyworth I would consider keeping,as he's not that bad, but the language barrier will probably force the Habs to fire him. Patrick Roy is my top candidate to replace him, but if not then perhaps Clément Jodoin the Bulldogs coach? or maybe give Pascal Vincent a chance, even if he is inexperienced as a head coach. At the very least, bring him to Montreal and leave Cunneyworth behind the bench and if he doesn't perform, put Vincent behind the bench.I also feel like, for some reason, Patrice Brisebois would be a good coach in the future, so why not make him an assistant and see where it goes. Signing Shane Doan wouldn't be a bad idea, if the price is right. At his age, he could really help youngsters with his leadership and experience, and he has the size that we need, kind of like Cole. He is consistent and puts up decent numbers every year, although he has definitely slowed down this year. The top free-agents I would target would be Parise and Suter. Parise is very unlikely but Suter could be reachable, as it is highly unlikely the Predators will be able to afford both Weber and him. If Suter fails, Barret Jackman would be a good option, assuming he doesn't re-sign with the Blues. Alexander Semin, if he doesn't re-sign with the Caps, would be a force on this team, no question, so maybe try and get him. If not, we could always re-sign Andrei Kostitsyn if the Predators don't, but that's not happening. I see our lineup as something like this: Buyout Gomez Send Kaberle to minors/trade him/ buy him out Trade rights to Nokelainen, Blunden, Palushaj or sign them to 2 way contracts, send em to AHL and call em up when there is an injury Don't re-sign Matthieu Darche Re-sign Moen, Price, Subban, Emelin, Diaz, White, Geoffrion, Staubitz (insert him in games when we need a tough guy), Doan/Parise/Semin (only get one of those guys)-Plekanec-Gionta Pacioretty-Desharnais-Cole Bourque-Eller-Moen Leblanc-White-Geoffrion Markox-Suter/Jackman/Beauchemin Subban-Gorges Emelin-Diaz Weber (trade him or keep him as 7th D) Price Budaj This is a pretty decent lineup IMO. 3 legit scoring lines, a good shutdown line and balanced D pairings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCHabnut Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Don't want Semin, Parise is the big fish this summer, and we never go after the big fish, Doan loves Phoenix. His ranch is huge. Plus Doan is not really a 1st liner. I like him though. He may come play with cousin Carey if Phoenix looks like they are on the move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 IMO, Suter is less likely than Parise. I really think Suter to Detroit is a done deal with the Rafalski money from last year and the possible retirement of Lidstrom this year. Why wouldn't he want to go to Detroit, if they make a lucrative offer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 lol, yes, he is, but Parise has proven he can play the NHL game..Yakupov, as good as he is, is just a prospect..Do you want to take a risk on a smaller player in the lottery position? Nail hasn't proven that he can play in the bigs, just yet.. I never said the kid doesn't have the talent, just mean I wouldn't pick him 1st overall.. He's the most talented player available in the draft. Like I said, 1 inch taller. If he was 6'0 instead of 5'11 no one would even consider his size as a detriment. Does this one inch really make a difference? I say it doesn't. Basically being 5'11 instead of 6'0 is the equivalent of a store pricing things at $4.99 instead of $5.00. It really doesn't effect things much other than the psychological effect of the 4.99 seeming to be so much cheaper. We're not talking about David Desharnais or even Mike Cammalleri height here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 For those happy with PG's moves when looked at in "isoloation", note that AK46 in less then two weeks (and in a 1/5th of the games), has about the same numbers and has much more of a positive impact then Bourque has in his 2 or 3 months with Montreal. Not only is Bourque a lousy replacement for Cammy, he is a horrible replacement for AK46. It makes a big difference playing for a coach who knows how to get the most out of his players and his good with young players. For those that are were arguing about the cap savings of Bourque over Cammy, I'd rather have Cammy's $6M hit for two years (would have been easily moved at the deadline or the summer anyways), rather then a bum like Bourque for another 4 years at $3.5M, or how much ever the brain dead, lazy ass bum is getting paid. Geofferion looks to me like a 4th liner. Holland is a putting up good numbers in the WHL but is an over age player, playing with good players, so who knows if that means he has the potential to be a 2nd/3rd liner, or will be under a long line of 3rd/4th liners that montreal is good at drafting and trading for. Campoli looks worse each game. When I brought up his big giveaway with the hawks at the start of the year, I was rebuked that that was a single play. Well, I've seen around 60 or 70 of those "single plays" from him this year. The guy is about as plays a dogshit game and is so soft, that he would probably get knocked off the puck and would be a pylon in a ten year-old girls' league. I don't care if Kaberle scores 70 points with us, because, the pylon would still be a minus player. The guy is a softer then a marshmellow. There is a reason Rutherford said "I should have known better" and why no other team wanted anything to do with Kaberle and his stupid contract. Funny how unlike people on this site, no other GM thought that a 45-50 point Dman was worth $4.3M, even if it meant giving up nothing more then a 7th dman like Spacek to get him. He has made exactly one good move as a GM - signing Cole. I still think the Halak trade was idiotic. When the deal was made, I said that it didn't matter if Eller scored 40 goals, in his first year, bottom line is, PG should have been able to get more for the biggest hero of the 2010 playoffs. Bottom line, is from the deals that PG has made, he seems to move guys to out of conference teams where he won't be embarrsed when a deal blows up in his face. so just to be clear it doesn't matter what PG does if you don't like it he should be fired. In spite of he results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 What are his results - missing the playoffs. Damn right he should be fired!! so just to be clear it doesn't matter what PG does if you don't like it he should be fired. In spite of he results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 I think the overall point is that we don't need to demonize every single decision made over the past three years in order to make the case that PG should go. We're not dealing with Reggie Houle here; some of PG's moves have been reasonable and there's no need to pretend otherwise. For instance, saying that Kaberle is a waste of money even if he gets 70 points is just irrational - anybody in their right minds would trade off defensive lapses for 70 points from the back end. The case for firing PG makes itself without having to overreach like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 If Kaberle gets 70 points, but js still a minus player and gives up two scoring chances for every scoring chance he creates, it's irrational to say he is useless??? PG has only made one good move - signing Cole. I think the overall point is that we don't need to demonize every single decision made over the past three years in order to make the case that PG should go. We're not dealing with Reggie Houle here; some of PG's moves have been reasonable and there's no need to pretend otherwise. For instance, saying that Kaberle is a waste of money even if he gets 70 points is just irrational - anybody in their right minds would trade off defensive lapses for 70 points from the back end. The case for firing PG makes itself without having to overreach like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 You realize +- excludes pp goals right? If he puts up 70 pts its likely he did a lot on the PP and our PP is absolutely dominant. But besides all that a lot of kaberle's defensive issue is his partner. Give him a steady partner and you can make a good pairing with his puck moving and a tough defensive D beside him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habsy Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Does anybody actually watch Kaberle play? For **** sakes, get over his 40 points per season. With a salary cap, given what he's paid, he should play top minutes, in all aspects of the game. You're not supposed to shelter his minutes, and work at selecting a viable partner to help overcome his horrendous defensive play. The trade was laughed at, and he is un tradable. I haven't seen a single argument to refute those claims. When this season ends, and a review is done. The Kaberle trade goes into the fire PG's ass column. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 The cap hit is such a bs excuse. Yes Kaberle needs help in his own end. However what do UFA D who score 45+ pts and play top minutes get paid? A heck of a lot more than Kaberle As for being untradeable, I dont buy it just look at Marek Zidlicky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Does anybody actually watch Kaberle play? For **** sakes, get over his 40 points per season. With a salary cap, given what he's paid, he should play top minutes, in all aspects of the game. You're not supposed to shelter his minutes, and work at selecting a viable partner to help overcome his horrendous defensive play. The trade was laughed at, and he is un tradable. I haven't seen a single argument to refute those claims. When this season ends, and a review is done. The Kaberle trade goes into the fire PG's ass column. I'm not saying Kaberle is superman. A $4.2 million d-man should 'play top minutes in all aspects of the game.' Hmmm. I agree that that'd be nice. But there are plenty of $4-million-plus defenceman who do not play top minutes in all aspects of the game. The list from 2010-11 included Souray, Jovanoski, McCabe, Hainsey, Hannan, Komisarek, Liles and Ballard. It's not that I disagree with criticisms of Kaberle. They just seem heavily overstated to me, as though this is some sort of crippling catastrophe instead of something easily managed on a good team. I also don't quite grasp why one-dimensional offensive players are heatedly condemned as though their contributions don't count, while one-dimensional defensive players never are. A wider point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habsy Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 The cap hit is such a bs excuse. Yes Kaberle needs help in his own end. However what do UFA D who score 45+ pts and play top minutes get paid? A heck of a lot more than Kaberle As for being untradeable, I dont buy it just look at Marek Zidlicky That's your opinion, and you're entitled to it. His cap hit is the problem. It's why nobody wants him. That's why PG was laughed at. In the end though, we're stuck with him. As a result, have to work at finding him a partner. As usual, nobody seems to be watching his play. It's not always about stats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Even if he was "untradeable" which I believe no player ever is, his buyout is a mere $1.5M for four seasons. If Montreal held it off to 2013 we'd be looking at just seasons of $1.25 and $1.5M. Anyway, I wonder if the people who complain about Montreal having Kaberle on the books are the same people who complained about the Habs losing Mark Streit... who is pretty much exactly like Kaberle statistically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Marek Zidlicky is an older player, with the same defensive problems, with less offense, signed for next year, and making 250K less and look at what was just traded for him. Here are kaberle's top 20 contract comparables http://capgeek.com/c....php?player=182 Liles, Hainsey, Jovo, Ballard, Zidlicky, Komisarek, Gilbert all are easily as bad or worse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbp Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Commandant is making good points here.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habsfan Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Throughout the season I had a hard time accepting that we wouldn't make the playoffs. Now that I've accepted the fact that we won't play after April 7th, I want our boys to finish last in the east. I mean, if you're not gonna make the playoffs, might as well try to get the highest pick possible!! In any case, I am very optimistic for next season. Just with what I saw from Markov last night, and what we've seen from Subban and Paccioretty over the past couple of months, I really think we can turn this thing around pretty fast. I don't think Markov will ever be back to 100% of what he used to be, but even at 85%, Markov is better than the vast majority of D-men in the league. His importance to this team is HUGE! Let's not forget that this has been a tough season for Price, and even then, he's held us in games more often than we deserved to be there. Carey will only improve over the next few years. Add in some solid young players like Desharnais, Emelin, Diax and a few wily veterans like Cole and Gionta, and I definitely believe we'll back in the playoff hunt next year! So lets finish low this year, and get the highest pick possible, to make the turn-around even quicker! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Sorry, Streit could actually play defense. , We misused him in montreal as a pp specialist, with the NYI, he was actually a very solid dependable dman on a very bad team . Stereo is not the giveaway machine thae Kaberle and Campoli are. People need to look past the stats and look at what these guys actually do on the ice. Even if he was "untradeable" which I believe no player ever is, his buyout is a mere $1.5M for four seasons. If Montreal held it off to 2013 we'd be looking at just seasons of $1.25 and $1.5M. Anyway, I wonder if the people who complain about Montreal having Kaberle on the books are the same people who complained about the Habs losing Mark Streit... who is pretty much exactly like Kaberle statistically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 If Kaberle gets 70 points, but js still a minus player and gives up two scoring chances for every scoring chance he creates, it's irrational to say he is useless??? PG has only made one good move - signing Cole. What are his results - missing the playoffs. Damn right he should be fired!! so for a guy who's only move was signing cole then i guess picking up wiz was a mistake? picking up moore was a mistake? bringing emelin over? resigning gorges? The gill trade? the ak47 trade? Ya know that your ideas ( and some of them are good and I agree with some of them) weren't so over the top you would come across a lot better. I don't think PG is to blame for the injuries or for the fact that the powerplay crapped out and those are the 2 biggest factors as to what happened to his team this year. I think he hs done a pretty good job considering all the problems this team has endured this year. I will be proven right nex year when we are fight for first and not last. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Sorry, Streit could actually play defense. , We misused him in montreal as a pp specialist, with the NYI, he was actually a very solid dependable dman on a very bad team . Stereo is not the giveaway machine thae Kaberle and Campoli are. People need to look past the stats and look at what these guys actually do on the ice. He could before, he can't now. Islander fans have been complaining about him all year; his -23 rating is 3rd worst in the league (and from a non-analytical perspective, he has been undressed in quite a few highlights I've seen this year). He's only a few points ahead of Kaberle too. There seems to be a time where the high end offensive blueliner that can still log a regular shift starts to tail off. We've seen Kaberle is at that spot, it appears Streit is there this year as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HabsFanOhio Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 I keep reading that Kaberle's conditioning is poor. How does anyone know that or how can it be validated? I will say that he doesn't look especially fit or strong. I wonder how much better he could be if he was bulked up a bit? What kind of leverage does a team have in getting a player into better shape? Which brings to mind a broader point. I often wonder about how much work goes into helping players improve weak parts of their game, even if they are veterans? Sometimes they are small things that would make a big difference. Examples would be Hal Gill's inability to keep the puck in at the point. Or Josh Gorges' truly mundane and unimaginative play in the offensive zone ( if you're gonna give him all that ice time, why resign yourselves to poor offensive play?)....there are many other examples...faceoffs, clearing the zone, etc....but I digress. Kaberle of course would play much better with a solid partner. I watched him for years with the Leafs when I played in Toronto. He was never especially physical but he was decent defensively by using his skating ability and by making quick, crafty decisions. We need two new D...one should be a Craig Ludwig type player who would be a natural partner for Kaberle. The other should be a top 4 with a bomb from the point. Our D for next year worries me more than our forwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trizzak Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 I keep reading that Kaberle's conditioning is poor. How does anyone know that or how can it be validated? I will say that he doesn't look especially fit or strong. I wonder how much better he could be if he was bulked up a bit? What kind of leverage does a team have in getting a player into better shape? Well for one thing, look at him. He's not reaching Spacek-like chins status yet, but he clearly enjoyed many a celebratory libation, "Have one on me ol' chap", for winning the Stanley Cup. He's always going to be a weak-in-his-own-end defenseman, but he could at least strive to be a LEAN weak-in-his-own-end defenseman. You might as well look good when you look bad! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 I keep reading that Kaberle's conditioning is poor. How does anyone know that or how can it be validated? I will say that he doesn't look especially fit or strong. I wonder how much better he could be if he was bulked up a bit? What kind of leverage does a team have in getting a player into better shape? Welcome to the board first of all. A lot of the complaints about his conditioning stem from the beginning of the season where he was called out in Carolina for not being in good shape coming into camp. Personally I'm hoping that he learns from this and comes to camp more ready to go from the get go next season which could hopefully help his play in his own end (a little stronger, a little quicker to react, I'm sure it would help from time to time). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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