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There are always moves available.  The question is if they are good moves or overpayments.  If you wanted him to outbid ottawa he could have got duchene in October.

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Given his track record, we should fear his making big moves, not demand he make them.

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11 hours ago, Commandant said:

There are always moves available.  The question is if they are good moves or overpayments.  If you wanted him to outbid ottawa he could have got duchene in October.

Or, maybe he could have just swallowed his swollen pride and let galchenyuk play centre.

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13 hours ago, Commandant said:

There are always moves available.  The question is if they are good moves or overpayments.  If you wanted him to outbid ottawa he could have got duchene in October.

First of all, hey everybody I’m a Duchene fan. Looks like he wasn’t so bad after all. 

 

1 hour ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Or, maybe he could have just swallowed his swollen pride and let galchenyuk play centre.

As much as I agree that Galchenyuk can be a center and should have been, I also think it’s sometimes an illusion that him actually having played there would  have made/make such a huge difference to everything. Just my two cents. 

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24 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

First of all, hey everybody I’m a Duchene fan. Looks like he wasn’t so bad after all. 

 

As much as I agree that Galchenyuk can be a center and should have been, I also think it’s sometimes an illusion that him actually having played there would  have made/make such a huge difference to everything. Just my two cents. 

 

Matt Duchene is not a bad player. He's pretty good. 

 

The trade to get him is TERRIBLE.

 

Ottawa Gets
Matt Duchene 39 points in 57 games since the trade.

Ottawa Gives up
Kyle Turris 34 points in 55 games since the trade. 
Shane Bowers (their 2017 first round pick)
Their 2018 first round pick (top 10 protected, can move to 2019)
Their third round pick in 2019
Andrew Hammond.


Basically, Turris and Duchene are about equal in productivity... and have been for several years as i said at the time of the trade. 

But they didn't just give Turris.... they gave Turris, plus the 2017 first rounder, plus a future first rounder, plus a future third... and dumped a goalie.

 

Thats a horrible trade by any measure. 

 

 

The Habs equivalent would be trading Max Pacioretty, plus Ryan Poehling, plus a first rounder, plus a third rounder, for Duchene.... anyone have any interest in making that deal?

 

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11 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

Matt Duchene is not a bad player. He's pretty good. 

 

The trade to get him is TERRIBLE.

 

Ottawa Gets
Matt Duchene 39 points in 57 games since the trade.

Ottawa Gives up
Kyle Turris 34 points in 55 games since the trade. 
Shane Bowers (their 2017 first round pick)
Their 2018 first round pick (top 10 protected, can move to 2019)
Their third round pick in 2019
Andrew Hammond.


Basically, Turris and Duchene are about equal in productivity... and have been for several years as i said at the time of the trade. 

But they didn't just give Turris.... they gave Turris, plus the 2017 first rounder, plus a future first rounder, plus a future third... and dumped a goalie.

 

Thats a horrible trade by any measure. 

 

 

The Habs equivalent would be trading Max Pacioretty, plus Ryan Poehling, plus a first rounder, plus a third rounder, for Duchene.... anyone have any interest in making that deal?

 

 

 

This is an example of why sometimes the best deals made are the ones that aren't. We can all complain about not acquiring a Center, but sometimes the ask is too much and it doesn't make sense. 

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37 minutes ago, Commandant said:

 

Matt Duchene is not a bad player. He's pretty good. 

 

The trade to get him is TERRIBLE.

 

Ottawa Gets
Matt Duchene 39 points in 57 games since the trade.

Ottawa Gives up
Kyle Turris 34 points in 55 games since the trade. 
Shane Bowers (their 2017 first round pick)
Their 2018 first round pick (top 10 protected, can move to 2019)
Their third round pick in 2019
Andrew Hammond.


Basically, Turris and Duchene are about equal in productivity... and have been for several years as i said at the time of the trade. 

But they didn't just give Turris.... they gave Turris, plus the 2017 first rounder, plus a future first rounder, plus a future third... and dumped a goalie.

 

Thats a horrible trade by any measure. 

 

 

The Habs equivalent would be trading Max Pacioretty, plus Ryan Poehling, plus a first rounder, plus a third rounder, for Duchene.... anyone have any interest in making that deal?

 

To be fair I wanted him (and was the only one) who wanted him before the year started last year. Once the year started, I wouldn’t have made the deal Ottawa made, that’s for sure. I also admit that at one point I proposed including Galchenyuk in a trade for him because I felt as though there were still issues surrounding his positioning in our lineup, whereas Duchene (may have been) a more clear cut center. At this point, I’m not sure I would have been overly thrilled with giving away Galchenyuk even though some issues actually still do come up regarding the center/wing debate and I also think Duchene would have done just fine.

 

In the end, I assume it may have been impossible to acquire him last off season because the price may have been even more steep than the Turris deal. I just think Duchene has done quite well this year all things considered, and there were even still people bashing him mid season this year.

 

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2 hours ago, illWill said:

This is an example of why sometimes the best deals made are the ones that aren't. We can all complain about not acquiring a Center, but sometimes the ask is too much and it doesn't make sense. 

 

Yeah sure, some teams make bad trades. Therefore we should fix nothing.

 

Marchesseault was left exposed in the expansion draft. Panthers gave him away for free. Probably could have got him and Smith for cheap. 

Schenn got a 1st and a cap dump.

Turris cost the Predators Kamenev/Girard/2nd.

 

But Peter Dorion targeted Duchene on the first day of his job and Sakic held onto Duchene until Dorion gave him a stupid amount to acquire him. So we should stop complaining about a need not being filled for six years.

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3 minutes ago, Machine of Loving Grace said:

 

Yeah sure, some teams make bad trades. Therefore we should fix nothing.

 

Marchesseault was left exposed in the expansion draft. Panthers gave him away for free. Probably could have got him and Smith for cheap. 

Schenn got a 1st and a cap dump.

Turris cost the Predators Kamenev/Girard/2nd.

 

But Peter Dorion targeted Duchene on the first day of his job and Sakic held onto Duchene until Dorion gave him a stupid amount to acquire him. So we should stop complaining about a need not being filled for six years.

 

Schenn and Marchessault are fair criticisms. 

 

Turris, I don't think the Sens would have dealt with Montreal on.

 

 

This topic was on moves Bergevin said he could have made to salvage things in October though, Schenn and Marchessault were long gone by October. 

I think October is referring to a Duchene deal (or some other deal that never came to fruition and we don't know about). 

 

Do you think we should have made a duchene deal?

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5 minutes ago, Commandant said:

Do you think we should have made a duchene deal?

 

Of course not. If you're trying to posit the idea that I want Bergevin to make stupid decisions just because it's a decision, that's not the point. He already makes stupid decisions, why would I want him to make more?

 

He said there were moves he could have made to make peace with the fans and media in October and the trade deadline. The team was pretty much dead at the deadline. What decision could he have made? Fans and media wanted him to sell/sell/sell not buy. There were multiple reports of players on the block being pulled back. Only Plekanec was moved. That tells me he could have made peace with the fans by trading Pacioretty/Byron/Shaw etc. but didn't because he didn't think it was the right move. And that he could have added players to help the team win in October but didn't. If his only option was Duchene, it's just another example of him being incompetent at his job. When you've had a need for six years and you either only temporarily fill it (T6RW) or you never really fill it because you hate the guy you drafted in 2012 (T6C), you don't get to cry about your lack of options.

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Nashville has acquired two legitimate top-6 C over the same span in which Bergevin has been moaning about it being "too tough" to get a top-6 C. :rolleyes: I love how he tries to present himself as the voice of sagacity versus us ignorant fans, when HE is entirely responsible for taking a very good team and turning it into a steaming pile of dogsh*t.

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14 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

Nashville has acquired two legitimate top-6 C over the same span in which Bergevin has been moaning about it being "too tough" to get a top-6 C. :rolleyes: I love how he tries to present himself as the voice of sagacity versus us ignorant fans, when HE is entirely responsible for taking a very good team and turning it into a steaming pile of dogsh*t.

 

Pretty much. He can't take back what he said in 2015:

 

Quote

“Do you want me to trade Carey Price? That’s what it costs to get a big centre.”

 

Quote

My reality, it might not be the same as the PlayStation that I play at night. I made a trade last night (on PlayStation), called the GM this morning and he hung up on me. So, to get that top centre, I’d love to get him, but I don’t see that happening. I think the last one was probably Joe Thornton.

 

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Would anyone here be happy if Bergevin traded Seth Jones for Ryan Johansen? Advantage Columbus by quite a bit in that deal player for player if you ask me. 

 

A GM can make a trade to fill a hole but will likely lose the deal. So pick your poison, either people will complain he doesn't make trades or will complain that he got ripped off. 

 

And just because players are traded doesn't mean that the Habs missed out on them

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43 minutes ago, illWill said:

Would anyone here be happy if Bergevin traded Seth Jones for Ryan Johansen? Advantage Columbus by quite a bit in that deal player for player if you ask me. 

 

A GM can make a trade to fill a hole but will likely lose the deal. So pick your poison, either people will complain he doesn't make trades or will complain that he got ripped off. 

 

And just because players are traded doesn't mean that the Habs missed out on them

 

Nashville's defence when they traded Jones: Josi, Weber, Eklholm, Ellis along with prospects Fabbro and Girard.

 

I'm okay getting the lesser player to fill a need if my depth looks like that.

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58 minutes ago, illWill said:

Would anyone here be happy if Bergevin traded Seth Jones for Ryan Johansen? Advantage Columbus by quite a bit in that deal player for player if you ask me. 

 

A GM can make a trade to fill a hole but will likely lose the deal. So pick your poison, either people will complain he doesn't make trades or will complain that he got ripped off. 

 

And just because players are traded doesn't mean that the Habs missed out on them

You complain about people complaining a lot... 

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17 hours ago, illWill said:

Would anyone here be happy if Bergevin traded Seth Jones for Ryan Johansen? Advantage Columbus by quite a bit in that deal player for player if you ask me. 

 

A GM can make a trade to fill a hole but will likely lose the deal. So pick your poison, either people will complain he doesn't make trades or will complain that he got ripped off. 

 

And just because players are traded doesn't mean that the Habs missed out on them

You mean, like Subban for Weber? :nuts:

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On Tuesday Mitch Melnick interviewed Bergevin on 690. He roasted him.

 

That interview was put up on the website, but is now gone. 

 

The producer of the show says he can't talk about it. 
 

 

Here is another copy of the interview someone has uploaded to soundcloud. 
 

 

What a clown show 

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Monday: This organization needs more transparency. 

 

Wednesday: Hey, radio affiliate wiht the contract to broadcast games, take down the interview where our GM looks bad. 

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The main answer I didn’t like was the Karl Alzner one. Comparing him to Chara from years past and then saying “maybe he (Alzner) was tired”. 

 

It’s a little too easy to always answer questions by saying fans and media just don’t know everything and it seemed like any opinion about Bergevin’s methods were always incorrect and had Bergevin always saying “no” to Melnyk’s opinion. 

 

The other stuff, like the attitude and character discussion is blown out of proportion in my opinion and even being lost somewhat in translation considering Bergevin is French. I don’t believe intangibles are the most important thing, but I certainly agree that some players like Drouin and Price often looked disinterested throughout the season. Some would say Pacioretty looked that way as well. It’s not the most outlandish thing to say that the attitude needs to change. 

 

The other side of the coin is that he keeps repeating that the team wasn’t ready from day 1 and were never in a position to compete for the playoffs. That’s where I believe he’s either completely blind or too manly (or not man enough) to admit that the team lacked enough skill to compete for a playoff spot. He instead says that we could have the best players in the world (which we did not) and it would not matter. 

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He should be removed immediately.

 

Sounds more like a politician than a hockey guy.

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If I hear attitude and character anymore, I'm going to lose my mind. You know what I'd like? Talent. Geez, who's left from the pre-Bergevin days? Gallagher, Patches, and Price...am I missing anyone? Good job gathering that attitude and character, Bergy. 

 

Here comes the annual offseason wash/rinse/repeat: What 3rd liner can he swap some picks, how many 6/7 dmen will he sign (can't have enough!) and what washed up player can he add for $1M? Sigh.

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Now after a lot of talk about it on twitter, the interview is back up, its like 1:30 something shorter though, I'm listening now to see if they cut something. 

Weird that it was down all morning. 

 

Weirder that Rod Francis was saying he couldn't talk about why. 

 

If it was some tech issue, why not just be like, oh... its a tech issue, it will be back soon?

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17 minutes ago, Commandant said:

Now after a lot of talk about it on twitter, the interview is back up, its like 1:30 something shorter though, I'm listening now to see if they cut something. 

Weird that it was down all morning. 

 

Weirder that Rod Francis was saying he couldn't talk about why. 

 

If it was some tech issue, why not just be like, oh... its a tech issue, it will be back soon?

 

And Mitch wasn't in today.

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17 minutes ago, Machine of Loving Grace said:

 

And Mitch wasn't in today.

My guess is the newly transparent habs brain trust threatened the station with going to a different provider and Mitch may be on thin ice for not sucking MB’s balls, instead of doing his job and asking MB some tough questions.

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