Habs reportedly give Timmins an extension

[Lovett's Magnatones]

No, you are confused about my post, which observed the "dissonance between his apparent excellence and the on-ice results." I also said that I wasn't blaming Timmins. So, yes, I was trying to underscore the oddity of a situation where the Habs apparently have an excellent grasp of drafting, and yet have done nothing but fail since Timmins came aboard (and, obviously, before that). It points, presumably, to bad management. Habs GMs are like Donald Trump, who supposedly would be wealthier today if he had done NOTHING with his inheritance rather than actually try to invest with it; i.e., Habs GMs may well have been better off eschewing trades altogether. Between McDonagh and Subban, they've dealt away what would have been quite possibly the best duo in all of hockey, for instance. Just as you'd expect of the Toronto Maple Leafs, which is what the Habs have basically become.

DJT gets a bad rap. He's a goon that's made some dumb comments, but he isn't the subject of four (!) federal investigations with more this week showing that he's corrupted two major news networks and rigged a primary election.

[Commandant]

Keeping Sylvain Lefebvre in St. John's is really a huge red flag that this team doesn't know what its doing development wise.

[Machine of Loving Grace]

Keeping Sylvain Lefebvre in St. John's is really a huge red flag that this team doesn't know what its doing development wise.

He wasn't just kept. He was given the seal of approval that his losing seasons are AOK because Therrien likes the development of players after they've been in the AHL.

[hab29RETIRED]

What can you say, MB likes to go in the foxhole with his buddies.

I've heard of rats not wanting to sink with the ship, this is the first time I've seen a captain hell bent on sinking the ship!

Keeping Sylvain Lefebvre in St. John's is really a huge red flag that this team doesn't know what its doing development wise.

[Meller93]

Geez, he did draft Subban in the second round. That's the equivalent of scoring a #1 overall pick. Oh wait, I forgot, Subban is a high-risk airhead with lots of holes in his game and a terrible teammate. Bad pick. Thank God we managed to spin that dross into gold of a declining behemoth with worse stats on a bloated 10-year contract

He also scored Gallagher in round 5, that's not too shabby either. I don't think he's the problem. Hell, if Gainey had not traded McDonagh the team might have already made the finals.

Subban, Price, Pacioretty, McDonough, Galchenyuk, Gallagher are a decent crew. Scherbak Mccarron, Julssen could all be quite good yet. And by all accounts Sergachev projects as a top pairing defenseman. Hell, mark striet was snatched up in 2004. This done with a grand total of 3 top 10 picks I believe? We average pick 16.4 since 2003.

This may not be completely relevant but

Steve Bernier, Nokelainen, Alex Bourret, Ty Wishart, Colton Gillies, Joe Coulbourne, Nick Leddy, Tarafreakinsenko, Joel Armia, Tom Wilson, Nikita Zadorov, Sonny Milano, Matthew Barzal, and Jacob Chychrun were all 16th overall picks since 2003.

Point is not exactly all gold even in the first round with an average of 16th.

[dlbalr]

This isn't Timmins-specific but this scouting news isn't thread worthy. Frank Jay, one of Montreal's well known amateur scouts (based in the OHL), has left the organization and was officially hired by the Oilers today.

[Commandant]

Maybe that frees up a spot for Scott Luce (one can hope).

[dlbalr]

Another non-Timmins scouting tidbit that isn't thread worthy: Montreal's pro scouting director Vaughn Karpan has resigned and has been hired by the Las Vegas franchise as their Director of Player Personnel. Karpan had been with the Habs since 2005 and had been promoted to pro scouting director in May of 2015.

[dlbalr]

Another non-Timmins scouting tidbit that isn't thread worthy: Montreal's pro scouting director Vaughn Karpan has resigned and has been hired by the Las Vegas franchise as their Director of Player Personnel. Karpan had been with the Habs since 2005 and had been promoted to pro scouting director in May of 2015.

It didn't take long for his replacement to be named as Eric Crawford (who the Habs hired last year after Vancouver let him go) is now the new pro scouting director.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

It didn't take long for his replacement to be named as Eric Crawford (who the Habs hired last year after Vancouver let him go) is now the new pro scouting director.

The Habs are using a pro scouting guy from Vancouver? Oy.

[dlbalr]

The Habs are using a pro scouting guy from Vancouver? Oy.

Crawford was among the long-time front office people Benning got rid of last year when they decided to get rid of anyone with any ties to previous regimes (he was let go at the same time as Lawrence Gilman/Lorne Henning). He actually spent 16 years there so he had a hand in scouting back when the Canucks were actually competitive.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Crawford was among the long-time front office people Benning got rid of last year when they decided to get rid of anyone with any ties to previous regimes (he was let go at the same time as Lawrence Gilman/Lorne Henning). He actually spent 16 years there so he had a hand in scouting back when the Canucks were actually competitive.

I don't have the energy to sift through the record, but as I recall Mike Gillis's trading record was not terribly good. This isn't proof that his pro scouts didn't know their business, but it's at least suggestive of mediocrity. So this looks like a dodgy move to me, but it's hard to say for sure.

[BlueKross]

Another non-Timmins scouting tidbit that isn't thread worthy: Montreal's pro scouting director Vaughn Karpan has resigned and has been hired by the Las Vegas franchise as their Director of Player Personnel. Karpan had been with the Habs since 2005 and had been promoted to pro scouting director in May of 2015.

No chance of advancement with Timmins firmly in place?

[Commandant]

No chance of advancement with Timmins firmly in place?

Different positions... pro scout vs amateur scout.

[DON]

I don't have the energy to sift through the record, but as I recall Mike Gillis's trading record was not terribly good. This isn't proof that his pro scouts didn't know their business, but it's at least suggestive of mediocrity. So this looks like a dodgy move to me, but it's hard to say for sure.

Of course it does, Dumber made the move so this goes without saying (or is he Dumb? I could never figure out which is which).

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Of course it does, Dumber made the move so this goes without saying (or is he Dumb? I could never figure out which is which).

MT is Dumb. MB is Dumber, because he's the one kneecapping the future in return for a downgrade in the present. But I stopped using these labels after a poster (sorry, I've forgotten who) complained about the whole approach of using denigrating nicknames.

Anyone bothering to read my posts will know that - unlike you, for whom everything management does is always awesome - I don't subscribe to axiomatic reasoning. I'll assess each move on what I perceive to be its own merits. And what I'm saying in this instance is that Vancouver's track record with pro scouting (all scouting, really) seems pretty poor. (Just look at Gillis's deadline deals - oy vey). This doesn't mean Crawford is himself mediocre at his job, but it's suggestive that he is.

[DON]

OK, thanks for clarification. Stop using big words I got to look up to figure out what you are referring to.

Never said all was awesome (may seem like that I agree) and numerous moves or signings haven't panned out. But, same can be said for 29 other teams and Mgmt groups, they all have their 'hiccups'.

I simply don't take this stuff too serious and get too upset with moves/signings going sideways and tend to look at brighter side or 1/2 full option.

[JoeLassister]

http://plus.lapresse.ca/screens/f4cc1e1d-67e9-409f-b546-e5f7d6adead3|_0.html?utm_medium=Twitter&utm_campaign=Internal+Share&utm_content=Screen

 

Nice in depth interview from Mathias Brunet.  He asks a lot of good questions to Timmins about past drafts.

 

Quick translation of some information in there (link is in French) :

 

1- Chris Kreider was Timmins' pick.  He says that the organization didn't force him to pick Louis Leblanc, but they told him to stay away from Americans prospects who grew up in the High School system.

2-  Funny bit when Mathias asks him what he'd think about his own defense squad that would include  : McDonagh, Subban, Sergachev and Mete.   Timmins answered :  "You need to add one more".  

 

Then Brunet goes :  Beaulieu ?

Timmins :  Yes, but another one.

Brunet :  Emelin ?

Timmins :  Yes, but another one.

 

If the Habs wouldn't have traded their 1st rounder for Alex Tanguay,  John Carlson would have been a Habs !!!!   Timmins says that he was  7th on his list and still available at 25th.

 

 

3-  Timmins says that Victor Mete is the pick that made him the most proud in the last 9 years. 

4-  Says Joni Ikonen is the next  Artturi Lehkonen, most underrated prospect, potential hidden gem.

[hab29RETIRED]

3 minutes ago, JoeLassister said:

http://plus.lapresse.ca/screens/f4cc1e1d-67e9-409f-b546-e5f7d6adead3|_0.html?utm_medium=Twitter&utm_campaign=Internal+Share&utm_content=Screen

 

Nice in depth interview from Mathias Brunet.  He asks a lot of good questions to Timmins about past drafts.

 

Quick translation of some information in there (link is in French) :

 

1- Chris Kreider was Timmins' pick.  He says that the organization didn't force him to pick Louis Leblanc, but they told him to stay away from Americans prospects who grew up in the High School system.

2-  Funny bit when Mathias asks him what he'd think about his own defense squad that would include  : McDonagh, Subban, Sergachev and Mete.   Timmins answered :  "You need to add one more".  

 

Then Brunet goes :  Beaulieu ?

Timmins :  Yes, but another one.

Brunet :  Emelin ?

Timmins :  Yes, but another one.

 

If the Habs wouldn't have traded their 1st rounder for Alex Tanguay,  John Carlson would have been a Habs !!!!   Timmins says that he was  7th on his list and still available at 25th.

 

 

3-  Timmins says that Victor Mete is the pick that made him the most proud in the last 9 years. 

4-  Says Joni Ikonen is the next  Artturi Lehkonen, most underrated prospect, potential hidden gem.

There were at least 3 analysts that had the habs picking Kreider and filling a long needed power forward hole.

[Guest Stogey24]

55 minutes ago, JoeLassister said:

http://plus.lapresse.ca/screens/f4cc1e1d-67e9-409f-b546-e5f7d6adead3|_0.html?utm_medium=Twitter&utm_campaign=Internal+Share&utm_content=Screen

 

Nice in depth interview from Mathias Brunet.  He asks a lot of good questions to Timmins about past drafts.

 

Quick translation of some information in there (link is in French) :

 

1- Chris Kreider was Timmins' pick.  He says that the organization didn't force him to pick Louis Leblanc, but they told him to stay away from Americans prospects who grew up in the High School system.

2-  Funny bit when Mathias asks him what he'd think about his own defense squad that would include  : McDonagh, Subban, Sergachev and Mete.   Timmins answered :  "You need to add one more".  

 

Then Brunet goes :  Beaulieu ?

Timmins :  Yes, but another one.

Brunet :  Emelin ?

Timmins :  Yes, but another one.

 

If the Habs wouldn't have traded their 1st rounder for Alex Tanguay,  John Carlson would have been a Habs !!!!   Timmins says that he was  7th on his list and still available at 25th.

 

 

3-  Timmins says that Victor Mete is the pick that made him the most proud in the last 9 years. 

4-  Says Joni Ikonen is the next  Artturi Lehkonen, most underrated prospect, potential hidden gem.

Great post. Nice to read stuff like that 

[DON]

Ikonen has 0g 2a in 20gms in Finn league and I think he has played his way into being a healthy scratch. Not even looking like a good 2nd round pick at the moment, let alone a hidden gem.

[Commandant]

 

18 minutes ago, DON said:

Ikonen has 0g 2a in 20gms in Finn league and I think he has played his way into being a healthy scratch. Not even looking like a good 2nd round pick at the moment, let alone a hidden gem.

 

 

As an 18 year old playing in a Men's League. 

He's not ready to face men.  That doesn't mean he doesn't have talent. 

[alfredoh2009]

That article aligns well with this analysis https://recrutes.ca/trevor-timmins-drafting-record-top-class/

 

I think TT has done well given the context he has been working in.

[DON]

2 hours ago, Commandant said:

 

 

As an 18 year old playing in a Men's League. 

He's not ready to face men.  That doesn't mean he doesn't have talent. 

No, but he is struggling big time for sure and comparing him to a fellow who didn't, is a stretch. Will be a 'fairer' playing field at world juniors, for sure.

[Trizzak]

44 minutes ago, DON said:

No, but he is struggling big time for sure and comparing him to a fellow who didn't, is a stretch. Will be a 'fairer' playing field at world juniors, for sure.

 

I know my record on recollection has been spotty, but I am almost positive that Lehkonen also went through a stretch of poor stats while playing against men as a teen.