Leaderboard

1) He's not being outshined by Ryan Ellis and Roman Josi. Don't be that guy who is only looking at goals and assists, and not looking at the job that Subban did against Toews line in the first round, and against Tarasenko's line in the second round. There is a reason that Subban/Ekholm is playing the minutes against the other team's number 1 line so far in these playoffs. 2) The point is about the room though. Subban isn't causing problems in the Nashville room. Removing "Weber's leadership" isn't causing the Nashville team to do worse. Surely if Weber's leadership mattered as much as we've been told it does, Nashville wouldn't be having its most successful playoff run ever the first year he was gone. Meanwhile in montreal the GM is calling the team "fragile". The fact is that the "leadership" aspect was harped on ad nauseum by the proponents of the trade. This isn't a knock on Weber. This is a knock on tired cliches and media narratives that things like "leadership" and "character" matter more than skill. Its just not true. Unfortunately our GM seems to be buying that narrative, not just in this move, but in many others. 3) Price didn't have a great season? Second in the NHL in 5v5 save percentage. Third in the NHL in overall Save Percentage. Nominated for the Vezina, .933 save percentage in the playoffs. Not a great season? Our expectations might be run amok here.

Hab "fans" down-voting positive posts like

It's strange that the Italians and Germans got lit up like that against a powerhouse Russian team

Since this thread title is discussing whether sweeping changes need to me made, I have wondered that since there are not very many French speaking coaches for us to chose from, compared to English speaking, I have to ask why there has not been a major emphasis on making sure that we develop coaches from within. For example, I wonder if Sylvain Lefebvre was considered for even a moment, or was he ever even in the conversation, to replace MT. Somehow I think not. But shouldn't that be an obvious for our AHL head coach? I would think that the three main aspects or priorities of that coaches job description should be: 1. Install and teach a system to the players that the parent club is using so that younger players will learn how to play and be prepared when they are called up. 2. Have the best possible French speaking coach in place in our AHL team so just as the players are being prepared, the coach [coaches] are being prepared and trained to be able to coach the parent club. 3. Win. Develop a winning attitude, game plan and build the team to win in all position. Shouldn't that be an obvious priority for us since: 1. We must have a French speaking coach. 2. Our team is from Quebec where there are more French speaking coaches in waiting than anywhere in the world. Why can't/shouldn't we have a great young up and coming French coach in the AHL? Seems pretty obvious to me. Instead.........

200% This off-season is his last stand for me. Unfortunately. Im not sure winning will ever be a priority, because no matter what, people will go. Keep in mind Geoff Molson is a business man. His family has sold watered down poison for profit for generations.

The Habs were missing a game breaker aside from Radulov (who wanted to be a Hab before Weber came in, and turned down a two year deal with other teams to come here for one year. But nah let's credit Shea. He's the only reason we had Quebec loving Radulov!) against New York but nah the series would have been the same. It's like 2014-15 didn't exist to some people. With Subban and a healthy Price Montreal won 50 games and went to the second round. We needed more scoring support. Bergevin went lazy and cheap and got Fleischmann and Semin. Price went down and Montreal went from the hottest team in the league to the bottom of the barrel. We were still near the top of the standings in late December when Bergevin traded for Scrivens instead of a real starter like Reimer. Subban was a near point per game player in 2016 before his injury. Then he gets blamed for the season? 2016-17 meant we scored five more goals than 14-15 and allowed 11 more goals. Habs out in the first round. In other words, similar season result with less playoff results. Do I blame Weber? Not one bit. He did his job. All you can ask for him to do. I blame the guy who hasn't added a top six centre in five years. I blame the guy who has gone into every season having to fill a hole in the top six RW. I blame the guy who allowed the left defence to become Markov and a bunch of plugs. I blame the guy who watched two coaches mess with the third overall pick instead of letting him play a full season at centre. I blame the guy who traded Subban. I blame the guy who inherited Carey Price in his prime and instead of building the team with firewagon offence because we all knew Carey would stop the puck, he focused all of his attention on the defence and bottom six. I blame Bergevin and everyone he brought in. I defended him for years. I bought the lies. Not cheering this team until he's fired.

No kidding. Lately I've been upvoting posts not because I think they should be in the positive but because they damn sure don't deserve to be negative.

I didn't see anything about last year anywhere in this thread. My statement was in response to the post above about how he got 4 points against Italy and 2 against Germany.

The big question here is : What about Draisaitl's leadership ? Anyone took a peek at his warmup habits ?

Julien, Burns, and Therrien all coached AHL teams for Montreal before going to the big leagues. Oh and Cunnyworth but nevermind him. There's a lot of guys out there but they are not getting any NHL head coach experience and after Carbonneau and Cunnyworth the team has been reluctant to go with someone lacking experience at an NHL level. Even though coaches win in their first and second years quite a lot (at least in Pittsburgh). AHL Head Coaches that are French Canadian: Sylvain Lefebvre, Pascal Vincent, Benoit Groulx, Eric Veilleux (everyone except Lefebvre had won a Ron Lapointe trophy for QMJHL coach of the year in the past) NHL Assistant Coaches that are French Canadian: Terry Murray, Dan Lambert, Martin Gelinas, Jacques Cloutier, Kevin Dineen, Mike Kelly, Clement Jodoin, JJ Daigneault, Dan Lacroix, Marc Crawford (speaks French), Andre Tourigny, Ian Laperriere (I'm going by an outdated list) So right there is like 16 guys, probably more, who are French Canadian or speak French. Dineen has been shooting for an NHL head coaching gig, but there's a lot of others there who could be AHL coaches for Montreal. The fact that teams like Ottawa and Tampa seem to be getting a lot of really good potential guys that Montreal are skipping on because they stick to Lefebvre is pretty pathetic.

same.

If you'd rather talk about history that's up to you. I mean, we can make some threads dedicated to the past, I just don't see how the past should creep up into every discussion on this board about the 2017 and future Montreal Canadiens. I don't think I need to respond to this comment other than saying it's plain to see how bad you make yourself look Nashville has a great team and it'd be good to see them win. The fans there are passionate, especially in a non-traditional market. But yes, it would be a nightmare around here

Better hope Nashville doesn't win a cup before we do or look out lol

My bad I misread it.

I also read that Timmins was furious when that deal was made. I hated the deal just from the standpoint of having to give up anything to take on an "untradable" contract.

Making fun of Webers leadership and calling him washed up, also the whole good ol boy shtick is getting tiring. Why is it a bad thing to be a stand up Canadian boy. Lol?

"If Subban was still on the Habs they would still be in the playoffs. If Weber was still on the Predators they would be out of the playoffs." - Irrational Hab fan logic

Yep I remember. I get people want to jump on the I told you so bandwagon but IMO Weber was our best player in the playoffs so I'm fine with him. I honestly don't understand the random shitting on him though.

Straight out of his mouth. Radulov said Weber played a big part in him going to Montreal.

Well on that basis I guess MB will offer sheet Matt Stajen instead!

I think he was targeting a #1 pick and given our window and our needs, I would have forsaken the pick and gone after a top centre and a young dman + a pick from the 2018. I think Edmonton would have been more willing to move draisaitl If they also didn't have to include a top 3 pick. In any event, there is no way Subban should have been traded for someone that didn't have more upside. You don't trade someone entering their prime, for someone that is going into decline. Chelios should have taught this franchise that much.

Regarding the two previous posts, by Commandant and Machine: HEAR HEAR.

Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Also looking at the header of this forum I don't see the faces of the 2017 Montreal Canadiens.

Just because not everyone wants Bergevin's head on a platter does not mean that we think the team or management team is perfect and it certainly does not mean that we are happy with over 20 years without a Cup

Didn't you know the kool-aid drinkers only want to discuss the successful history, not the last 22 years of mainly hell - which they seem to be good with!

Didn't make an offer.

He's a C, is he? I like the way you're thinking...raiding the KHL to plug roster holes could buy the team 3-4 years which they can use to rebuild the farm system. But don't worry, signing him will probably be too 'tough'

Interesting. The team we laughed at for so many years hired as their president.....a former hockey player, Brendan Shanahan. And look at the results they've been having as a result of the management team he has put together. Could we be that flawed? That's kind of a scary scenario.

People are making fun of the idea that leadership matters. This media narrative that you can't win with a guy who likes to have fun in warm-ups like PK, and that he's disruptive to chemistry, so he needed to be traded for character. its not making fun of weber. Its showing how silly Bergevin looks for putting such an emphasis on character over and above skill. Character over skill is what got us three trade deadline forwards who scored 2 points in 50 games as Habs. Character over skill is why we traded Subban in his prime for a guy four years older. Character over skill is why our second most talented forward started the playoffs on the fourth line. Character over skill is why we didn't even bid on a talented centre from Russia who became a UFA. Character over skill is why we draft Mike McCarron in the first round.

Here is the main point. Surrounding the trade and the narrative of "Character" The narrative was that PK was divisive in the locker room and the team could never win with such a divisive personality. The narrative was also that Shea Weber was a great leader, and that he would help lead a team that had issues in its locker room. Well one team is winning and is in the conference final. PK isn't disturbing the Nashville lockerroom. Meanwhile Bergevin called this team "fragile" when the season ended, in his press conference. What this tells us is one of the following 1) leadership and locker room harmony aren't nearly as important to winning as we have been lead to believe. 2) Winning actually leads to locker room harmony and losing leads to schisms and finger pointing.... basically we have been wrong about what was the cause and effect all this time. 3) The narratives around PK being such a poor member of the locker room, and Shea being a supreme leader were exagerrated. Personally I think its a combination of the three. but mostly 1 and 2.

I've looked into it in the past - it's not an option.