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Who will Gauthier target next?


jmaac1

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With Markov, Gill, Spacek and even include Gorges, how many more proven d-men do you need??

I would maybe suggest Mara on 2 way contract (or the like), but with a bunch like Weber/Nash/Carle/St Denis/other swiss guy and russian i aint too worried bout depth, even though you can never have too many d-men i know. I wouldnt mind seeing the group get younger and quicker.

But I am glad Hamrlik signed with another team, too bad Spacek couldnt have gone away as well (but is OK 6th 7th d-man i guess).

Two no-brainers: beefiness and faceoff prowess in the bottom-6; and proven NHL depth on the blueline. These may seem like minor matters, but both are indispensable if we are to have a pretense of being contenders - just the sort of small but important decisions that a good GM won't flub.

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It's the fact that 2 of those D you mentioned are coming off knee surgeries. Gill and Spacek were injured as well last year. When healthy they are fine.

Grier would be another good pick up as someone else mentioned.

JM does know Bernier whether that's good or bad i don't know.

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If use Palushaj and Engqvist instead of Pouliot and Halpern, how do you figure less talented? Palushaj looked fine in the 1 game he was called up for didnt he? At least he seemed to take the puck to the net, which Pouliot seemed averse to.

Engqvist is depth player?? he has only played 1 year in AHL, a bit quick to pigeonhole him aint it? He has size, is good on the PK, faceoffs and is young, so why cant he replace Halpern, who played very few minutes anyways.

You could be correct ; but i am a fan of developing what you got in your own system.

But sounds like Gauthier is searching for 1 more big forward and most likeley a d-man as well and has another couple months to look.

I don't know about you but I feel that montreal's bottom 6 got less talented with the losses of pouliot and halpern. And Engquist taking eller's spot till he gets back? I don't know about that, he is at best a depth forward and I seriously think that there are much better alternatives in free agency than him. No disrespect to him but I just can't see him replace the offensive production that was lost with benny and halpern. And with montreal having around 2.5 to 3 million to spend on a free agent (note that rest of the space is for gorges and white) why not go out there and pick up a proven veterans like a langenbrunner or a grier, or even bernier for that matter who is still young and has shown that he can put the puck in the net. Could you imagine our third line of AK(who can easily score 20 a year, Eller (who's just gonna get better and better), and Lagenbrunner (who gives you 45 to 50 points a year) it just plain scary for a third line and its even nerve wrecking considering that montreal can make it happen.

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If use Palushaj and Engqvist instead of Pouliot and Halpern, how do you figure less talented? Palushaj looked fine in the 1 game he was called up for didnt he? At least he seemed to take the puck to the net, which Pouliot seemed averse to.

Engqvist is depth player?? he has only played 1 year in AHL, a bit quick to pigeonhole him aint it? He has size, is good on the PK, faceoffs and is young, so why cant he replace Halpern, who played very few minutes anyways.

You could be correct ; but i am a fan of developing what you got in your own system.

But sounds like Gauthier is searching for 1 more big forward and most likeley a d-man as well and has another couple months to look.

Look you prove a couple of valid points about these kids just getting their feet wet and the habs continuing to build from within, I agree with you that engvist can turn out to be a solid player in the nhl one day, but I don't see him as the replacement for halpern for "next year". considering their are better options out there in free agency I would play it safe and sign a veteran, and then give engvist his chance after another year in the Ahl. As for palushaj in my opinion he is a bust considering I expected him to make the club last year, and yes he did show some glimpses of speed and going to the net in his 3 game call up with montreal but i find it quite a stretch to compare him to pouliot who we all know is probably the most frustratingly incosistent player in the league, but who was a double digit scorer with montreal, and considering palushaj has yet to record a point in the NHL there is no argument here. And I would bet you that Avtsin has more of a chance to crack the lineup than he does.

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People are always too optimistic about what rookies can bring. Look at Eller: considered an absolute blue-chip prospect, he was still on a steep learning curve and had little impact until the playoffs. Yes, there are exceptions - Ryder came in and made an impact immediately, for instance. But in general you cannot pencil in rookies for too many roster spots and expect to have success.

If we rely on rookies in our bottom-6, we may be able to muddle along until around December when the intensity picks up. But sooner or later we will have to go out and get guys who know what they're doing. The bottom 6 is NOT a luxury item in today's NHL, and this is especially true down the stretch and into the playoffs. You have to have guys who can go out there and give you reliable minutes, fulfilling certain roles - e.g., physical robustness, energy, faceoffs - with consistent effectiveness.

On D, we have four proven guys, two of whom are coming off serious injuries and one of whom is widely viewed as washed up (Spacek); along with a very impressive sophomore (Subban). We are, therefore, depending on the totally unproven Emelin and Weber not to struggle. Weber has at least been halfway around the block, but when you consider that even the mighty Subban struggled in the first half of last season, we should expect Emelin to struggle or at best blow hot and cold. Are you comfortable with, for instance, this alignment:

Markov-Gorges

Subban-Gill

Spacek-Weber?

If not, then you go out and get an experienced defenceman.

Then there's the likelihood of injuries. Are you comfortable, then, with something like

Subban-Gill

Weber-Gorges

Emelin-Spacek?

If not, then you go out and get an experienced defencemen.

Just my two cents. I have seen this movie of Rookie Disappointment over and over. Don't bank on perfect health, and don't bank on rookies playing great. Indeed, if Subban weren't so incredibly PK Subban, I'd also warn against the infamous sophomore-defenceman jinx. (Remember what happened to Phaneuf!)

So I stand by my earlier post. Experienced D, experienced bottom-6er(s). We need 'em.

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Look you prove a couple of valid points about these kids just getting their feet wet and the habs continuing to build from within, I agree with you that engvist can turn out to be a solid player in the nhl one day, but I don't see him as the replacement for halpern for "next year". considering their are better options out there in free agency I would play it safe and sign a veteran, and then give engvist his chance after another year in the Ahl. As for palushaj in my opinion he is a bust considering I expected him to make the club last year, and yes he did show some glimpses of speed and going to the net in his 3 game call up with montreal but i find it quite a stretch to compare him to pouliot who we all know is probably the most frustratingly incosistent player in the league, but who was a double digit scorer with montreal, and considering palushaj has yet to record a point in the NHL there is no argument here. And I would bet you that Avtsin has more of a chance to crack the lineup than he does.

Palushaj made progress last year and Avtsin drowned. Avtsin could make the team in the future, but NO WAY will he play in the NHL this season. Palushaj is going to be the go too guy for offense in Hamilton and I think he is most likely to see a call up.

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I agree and i am one of those people who is always optomistic and favour playing say a Ryan White at least 12 minutes a game and cutting back on Gomez , who month after month got prime minutes even though he did dick-all and make him earn it, White threw more hits in his couple minutes/game than almost the whole team.

Also i would of had Desharnais and Eller on the PP.

I would of played Weber a lot more and not signed both Mara and Sopel (1 of them but not both); but i would of also traded the Wiz at the deadline when the Habs could of really got some good returns.

So i agree, my lineups are probably a bit unrealistic and your strategy is smarter and safer, but i would be more pleased to see a Palusha or Nash succeeding/improving over the year, than a Konopka or Hannan come in on a 1 year deal.

People are always too optimistic about what rookies can bring. Look at Eller: considered an absolute blue-chip prospect, he was still on a steep learning curve and had little impact until the playoffs. Yes, there are exceptions - Ryder came in and made an impact immediately, for instance. But in general you cannot pencil in rookies for too many roster spots and expect to have success.

If we rely on rookies in our bottom-6, we may be able to muddle along until around December when the intensity picks up. But sooner or later we will have to go out and get guys who know what they're doing. The bottom 6 is NOT a luxury item in today's NHL, and this is especially true down the stretch and into the playoffs. You have to have guys who can go out there and give you reliable minutes, fulfilling certain roles - e.g., physical robustness, energy, faceoffs - with consistent effectiveness.

On D, we have four proven guys, two of whom are coming off serious injuries and one of whom is widely viewed as washed up (Spacek); along with a very impressive sophomore (Subban). We are, therefore, depending on the totally unproven Emelin and Weber not to struggle. Weber has at least been halfway around the block, but when you consider that even the mighty Subban struggled in the first half of last season, we should expect Emelin to struggle or at best blow hot and cold. Are you comfortable with, for instance, this alignment:

Markov-Gorges

Subban-Gill

Spacek-Weber?

If not, then you go out and get an experienced defenceman.

Then there's the likelihood of injuries. Are you comfortable, then, with something like

Subban-Gill

Weber-Gorges

Emelin-Spacek?

If not, then you go out and get an experienced defencemen.

Just my two cents. I have seen this movie of Rookie Disappointment over and over. Don't bank on perfect health, and don't bank on rookies playing great. Indeed, if Subban weren't so incredibly PK Subban, I'd also warn against the infamous sophomore-defenceman jinx. (Remember what happened to Phaneuf!)

So I stand by my earlier post. Experienced D, experienced bottom-6er(s). We need 'em.

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I would of played Weber a lot more and not signed both Mara and Sopel (1 of them but not both); but i would of also traded the Wiz at the deadline when the Habs could of really got some good returns.

So i agree, my lineups are probably a bit unrealistic and your strategy is smarter and safer, but i would be more pleased to see a Palusha or Nash succeeding/improving over the year, than a Konopka or Hannan come in on a 1 year deal.

The Habs helped to establish the market rate for an offensive type defenceman, the Habs could've maybe got a 2nd round pick for him at the deadline with some sort of low level prospect. Considering they were 3 points out of 5th at the deadline, that wouldn't have gone over too well. I understand the reasoning behind your idea (though Nash was a rookie pro last year, he clearly still needs AHL seasoning) but in a playoff race, that would have set the Habs back for sure, especially with the injuries to Markov and Gorges.

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So I'm hearing there's smoke behind a possible trade with Chicago or LA. Can't imagine who Gauthier's targeting on either team? Up for grabs IMO would be Kostitsyn, Moen, Weber and of course Gomez. I wonder...

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There seem to be a lot of rumours lately. Could it be that Gauthier has a big move up his sleeve? Surely that would fly in the face of his repeated mantra that he wants stability on the roster?

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There seem to be a lot of rumours lately. Could it be that Gauthier has a big move up his sleeve? Surely that would fly in the face of his repeated mantra that he wants stability on the roster?

Well, it is the season for rumours after all. I wouldn't be surprised if PG made a significant move to improve the roster, but I think he will hold true to his stability ideal and only move player for player, etc... I don't think we'll see a roster overhaul any time soon.

So I'm hearing there's smoke behind a possible trade with Chicago or LA. Can't imagine who Gauthier's targeting on either team? Up for grabs IMO would be Kostitsyn, Moen, Weber and of course Gomez. I wonder...

I wouldn't be surprised if LA was taking calls for Penner. There have been rumblings that Chicago is shopping its RFAs around.

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There seem to be a lot of rumours lately. Could it be that Gauthier has a big move up his sleeve? Surely that would fly in the face of his repeated mantra that he wants stability on the roster?

I think with more self appointed insiders, there are indeed more unfounded rumors bouncing around. Still, it's all entertainment.

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yes Nash looked out of step in his first stint, but any player does in jumping up. But just my opinion that he would adjust quick enough as he is good sized, OK on the PP and quick enough, but i would of had Weber eat up Wiz's minutes and if a 2nd was all you think they would of got at deadline, then would not of traded, but i knew he would demand $5/year with his offensive numbers and unlike a Souray or Strait, it would be nice to think long term and trade when value is highest, instead of letting walk for nothing.

I really doubt would of noticed a difference with Weber in Wiz's spot for the last 20 games and 1st round, other than Weber would be more advanced and ready to be a 3rd weapon on the PP point for this coming season .

I really like how Gauthier is very conservative at trade deadline in acquisitions, but Habs seem to be very unwilling to risk biting the bullet and parting with players coming up on free agency as well, if there is any chance that may hurt short term goal of squeeking in to playoffs, i am not for any "tanking" at all, but taking a risk on using younger players, for sure.

If Gauthier is going to sign another d-man, i would of just resigned Picard, he is no worse defensively than Spacek and cheap.

The Habs helped to establish the market rate for an offensive type defenceman, the Habs could've maybe got a 2nd round pick for him at the deadline with some sort of low level prospect. Considering they were 3 points out of 5th at the deadline, that wouldn't have gone over too well. I understand the reasoning behind your idea (though Nash was a rookie pro last year, he clearly still needs AHL seasoning) but in a playoff race, that would have set the Habs back for sure, especially with the injuries to Markov and Gorges.

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Palushaj made progress last year and Avtsin drowned. Avtsin could make the team in the future, but NO WAY will he play in the NHL this season. Palushaj is going to be the go too guy for offense in Hamilton and I think he is most likely to see a call up.

First of all we all expected that Avtsin was going to have to go through a learning curve considering its his first year playing in north america, second of all he just turned 20, so he's still very young and raw. But there is no doubt that this guy can become a force to be reckoned with, considering the fact that when he played in russia's league 1 junior divison he had 56 goals and 54 assists in 76GP, (yes he didn't really play against tough competition but those are really impressive numbers), and also to add that he was picked up by dynamo moscow the KHL's top team as a 19 year old who although didn't really produce (3 goals 6 assists for 9 points) he didn't play much either (30GP averaged 11.5 minutes a game) but he did manage to boast an impressive +6 on the team. So when you say he drowned last year it was "expected" and also to note that many experts projected this kid as a diamond in the rough kind of prospect with second or first line material so it says a lot. Now after a year of him getting his feet wet in Hamilton and also to (note played in only 58 games this year), I expect him to score at least 25 to 30 this year, and exploding on the scene. Also to point out palushaj is 5'11 -178 pounds, compared to avtsin who is 6'2 - 200 pounds so do we really need another small forward on the habs?

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I don't see why everything thinks we need more players like Langenbrunner and especially Zherdev (who I wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole anyways). We need defensive depth and bottom 6 grinders, if we need anything at all.

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People are always too optimistic about what rookies can bring. Look at Eller: considered an absolute blue-chip prospect, he was still on a steep learning curve and had little impact until the playoffs. Yes, there are exceptions - Ryder came in and made an impact immediately, for instance. But in general you cannot pencil in rookies for too many roster spots and expect to have success.

If we rely on rookies in our bottom-6, we may be able to muddle along until around December when the intensity picks up. But sooner or later we will have to go out and get guys who know what they're doing. The bottom 6 is NOT a luxury item in today's NHL, and this is especially true down the stretch and into the playoffs. You have to have guys who can go out there and give you reliable minutes, fulfilling certain roles - e.g., physical robustness, energy, faceoffs - with consistent effectiveness.

On D, we have four proven guys, two of whom are coming off serious injuries and one of whom is widely viewed as washed up (Spacek); along with a very impressive sophomore (Subban). We are, therefore, depending on the totally unproven Emelin and Weber not to struggle. Weber has at least been halfway around the block, but when you consider that even the mighty Subban struggled in the first half of last season, we should expect Emelin to struggle or at best blow hot and cold. Are you comfortable with, for instance, this alignment:

Markov-Gorges

Subban-Gill

Spacek-Weber?

If not, then you go out and get an experienced defenceman.

Then there's the likelihood of injuries. Are you comfortable, then, with something like

Subban-Gill

Weber-Gorges

Emelin-Spacek?

If not, then you go out and get an experienced defencemen.

Just my two cents. I have seen this movie of Rookie Disappointment over and over. Don't bank on perfect health, and don't bank on rookies playing great. Indeed, if Subban weren't so incredibly PK Subban, I'd also warn against the infamous sophomore-defenceman jinx. (Remember what happened to Phaneuf!)

So I stand by my earlier post. Experienced D, experienced bottom-6er(s). We need 'em.

What movie of "rookie disappointment" are you referring too? I have seen quite the opposite.

It is about expectation level and perspective. What is a 4th liners expectation level to you?

You use Eller as an example, but can we say Eller was a terrible 3rd or 4th liner in 2011?

Can we say that Desharnais was a poor 3rd or 4th line performer? How much of this viewpoint is skewed by a terrible decade in which we put our hopes on prospects who were A. not elite or B. put in positions where they could not succeed.

Was Plekanec a disappointment in 2006? Was Higgins poor before he was placed on the 1st line that season? What about Kostitsyn in 2008?

Players like Subban are the exception. They generally come up and are handed offensive zone starts, easy competition and eased into the NHL. Exactly what we are looking for this season from a player like Emelin. We are likely going to see the season start with him getting 14 minutes a game and eased in. I don't understand what you think are reliable minutes?

Last season had the Habs using all types of players to plug holes. Subban had to replace Markov. Eller was moved up and down the lineup. Desharnais played every possible line combo you can imagine. Pacioretty was carrying the Habs for a while. White came up and was solid in the second half of the season. Yet there these players were, playing great hockey down the stretch and into the playoffs, to the point where we were concerned what the Habs would do without DD, Pacioretty and Eller. All of these players were rookies.

I understand your argument if you are talking about leaning on rookies to carry the load , but you have to apprentice rookies in the NHL, especially in a cap age when they make 800k per season. This team has been riddled with these guys since 2008 who have stepped up and delivered. Lapierre and S. Kostitsyn in 2008 were very helpful in the Eastern title run. They are unpredictable, but that is why you don't rely on them to carry offense on the lower lines. You simplify their game and look at their offense as a bonus, just like you would with a Halpern, Metropolit or Moore.

You did this whole "injury scarefest" ALL SEASON last year. Every time you predicted doom somebody stepped in and filled the production. The fanbase did it all the way to the wee minutes of Game 7 before Subban tied it. The Habs never quit and their system allowed players to step in and fill gaps. The season hasn't even started and you are putting up "what happens if our defense looks like this without Markov?" "Are we comfortable with Emelin playing more minutes?"

If any players are going to falter, it is going to be the sophomores who you have placed an increased expectation upon. Those are the seasons in which Lapierre, Higgins, both Kostitsyn's, Price, D'Agostini, Pouliot etc, disappointed. Hence it comes down to expectation again. You expect nothing from Emelin, so average play will make your glass half empty feel half full. You expect nothing out of Weber, same thing.

Next season comes along and you are looking for not only average, but progression. If they are average/below average, they become a disappointment. What were your expectations of DD, Pacioretty, Subban and Eller last season and which of them failed to surpass those expectations? Now what are your expectations for those same 4?

I think you are looking for negatives already.

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I want to know if the young players can play, my friend was bemoaning the loss of potential signings of Arnott and Lagenbrunner, but I am happy. I see a lot of people point at teams like Philly, and Boston, who have these young players step up and say "why can't the habs?", the reason as I think Wammy very well put was, we lack faith in them and go get these vets. I seem to be pulling a lot of stuff from Wammys post, but this is the cap age, I'd rather a player like Enqvuist making a mistake and gaining experience at 800k, than a vet making a mistake and getting paid 1.6m, only to see him leave at years end ala Halpern, Lang, etc.

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JF Jacques signs with the Ducks on a two-way deal. So that weird fetish some fans have for a useless player who was cut loose by the worst team of each of the past two years is out the window.

Also, Pyatt is poached by Boucher and the Bolts! Again!

The Habs have 40 players signed to contracts and have 5 RFA's. Max you can sign is 50. Habs usually have about 47. Barring trades, only one or two additions are likely.

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Good to hear Pyatt got signed and hope he does well. Boucher also signed Wyman from bulldogs.

Pyatt certainly, for some reason, helped the Habs when he was in the lineup and always seemed to work hard every game, but just cant seem to score one lick.

JF Jacques signs with the Ducks on a two-way deal. So that weird fetish some fans have for a useless player who was cut loose by the worst team of each of the past two years is out the window.

Also, Pyatt is poached by Boucher and the Bolts! Again!

The Habs have 40 players signed to contracts and have 5 RFA's. Max you can sign is 50. Habs usually have about 47. Barring trades, only one or two additions are likely.

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