IN THE HEARTS OF MEN Posted August 10, 2016 Share Posted August 10, 2016 I am saying that unless MT and coaching staff change their strategy in the transition game and how quickly to move out of their own end, this team won't make the playoffs. They relied soo heavily on the 25 minutes PK gave them..Sure he would make mistakes..but given the frequency of times he moved the puck and transitioned from D to FWD..this helped greatly in their possession game. something WEBER seriously lacks..and he was left severely exposed during the serisomething WEBER seriously lacks..and he was left severely exposed during thees.. And perhaps is the early signs of things to come as the game is changing and as it bares the results with Penguins winning the Cup. Well lets see how he does during WC with an all star cast surrounding him. Last 3 years Habs assist Leaders I believe ( I haven't totalled the numbers..but I am sure: Subban has been number 1 Markov 2 Plekanec 3 The whole premise has been the quick transition and counter and neutral zone play that MT utilizes. Now his most valuable peace of the puzzle will be missing That's 25 to 27 minutes a game that Weber slides into..where this is not his asset and skillset. Weber is a shut down.front of net clearance guy.. Now the team has to rely on Beaulieu and Barberio..? Unproven and inconsistent I am not confident that MT can change his strategy.. If he indeed has one With PK and additions of Radulov ..this team I would be more confident in.. But I can't see it with the loss of PK and much lesser extent of ELLER..which in my opinion was underrated and taken for granted.. And excellent 3rd line C ..who did well in transition and neutral zone play.. Shaw got overpaid and team paid too much in giving up 2 2nd picks. For a contender he may be the missing piece to..but not on this team.. Petry healthy helps a little But overall still think this team regressed. I SURE HOPE I AM WRONG! Perhaps MT will surprise us with a whole new approach based on his new additions but I am not holding my breath.. Losing 25 minutes of a higher paced D for a slower plundering D..with a boom of a shot.. On THIS TEAM .imho..doesnt work with this coaching staff that has a hard time adjusting their game plan.. Maybe Muller will surprise us..I hope so..normally I am very optimistic.. But so far not in this situation. Too bad MB didn't realize..the " Best trades are does you DONT MAKE" Best..here is hoping this team surprises us all! -the habs are instant contenders for the eastern conference with price alone back and healthy!! the addition of arguably one of the top 5 best russian forwards on the planet in Radulov . Plus shaw brings even more energy and sand paper to our 3rd line. the emergence of galchenyuk to star status and weber playing a role in elevating nate to the top pair and markov to the 2nd pair (what we've all been asking for) can only do us good. - A BETTER POWER PLAY?? like how could it be worst! -weber will fill those heavy minutes of PK easily. Also note that weber forces teams to dump the puck in and chase it rather then skate it in. this also plays to our strengths as price is world class at handling dump ins and helping move it quickly and effieciently. -weber will assist in the staled progression of beaulieu* as a puck moving top pair defensemen and i believe he will thrive in a role next to weber. it will also facilitate markov to a diminished 2nd pair role with another greta skater in petry!!!! the habs better be ready to open up their wallets for beaulieau the year after next could you imagine though beaulieu* weber markov subban emelin petry wow!! lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted August 10, 2016 Share Posted August 10, 2016 So yesterday at the golf tournament, MT said that Bergevin did consult with him prior to the trade. Earlier MB said he consulted with his hockey people but not the coach. Which one is it? Someone is lying (i suspect Bergevin, cause really if he's consulting with the hockey people, why not the coach)... and why are they lying? Dumb and ing Dumber. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted August 10, 2016 Author Share Posted August 10, 2016 So yesterday at the golf tournament, MT said that Bergevin did consult with him prior to the trade. Earlier MB said he consulted with his hockey people but not the coach. Which one is it? Someone is lying (i suspect Bergevin, cause really if he's consulting with the hockey people, why not the coach)... and why are they lying? There's a scenario where both could actually be true - Did Bergevin talk with Therrien in the days leading up to the trade (such as when Poile approached Bergevin on draft night)? Yes. Did he talk to him immediately prior to making the trade? No. I think that would cover both sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IN THE HEARTS OF MEN Posted August 10, 2016 Share Posted August 10, 2016 So yesterday at the golf tournament, MT said that Bergevin did consult with him prior to the trade. Earlier MB said he consulted with his hockey people but not the coach. Which one is it? Someone is lying (i suspect Bergevin, cause really if he's consulting with the hockey people, why not the coach)... and why are they lying? Dumb and ######ing Dumber. There is no way a trade of this magnitude wasn't run by the Executive* management team. Think about it in any work eniviroment and I'm sure who ever wasn't included would be pissed. Molson, MB, Dudley, MT, TT, maybe even Muller and Waite all were probably involved in some way or another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted August 10, 2016 Share Posted August 10, 2016 But that rational argument dosent jive with the whole Dumb, Dumber and Dumbass owner thing many are trying so f'in hard to sell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted August 10, 2016 Share Posted August 10, 2016 There's a scenario where both could actually be true - Did Bergevin talk with Therrien in the days leading up to the trade (such as when Poile approached Bergevin on draft night)? Yes. Did he talk to him immediately prior to making the trade? No. I think that would cover both sides. Talk about trying to wiggle around the question. Nobody is asking the exact time they spoke, just that they did. Bergevin said no, Therrien said yes. I got a bit more respect for how Therrien has handled the trade than Bergevin. Therrien didn't take any mysterious shots at Subban at all. Complimented how hard he worked and what a great player he was for the team. Didn't allude to stuff we didn't know. Just said he was a great player and did everything he was asked, including show up to practice (which is now a weird rumour floating around that Subban was late for 14 practices in his Habs career), but they feel Weber brings more. That's a perfectly acceptable opinion (just one I don't agree with whatsoever). Bergevin couldn't do that, which is why the trade looks like nothing but politics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted August 10, 2016 Author Share Posted August 10, 2016 Talk about trying to wiggle around the question. Nobody is asking the exact time they spoke, just that they did. Bergevin said no, Therrien said yes. I got a bit more respect for how Therrien has handled the trade than Bergevin. Therrien didn't take any mysterious shots at Subban at all. Complimented how hard he worked and what a great player he was for the team. Didn't allude to stuff we didn't know. Just said he was a great player and did everything he was asked, including show up to practice (which is now a weird rumour floating around that Subban was late for 14 practices in his Habs career), but they feel Weber brings more. That's a perfectly acceptable opinion (just one I don't agree with whatsoever). Bergevin couldn't do that, which is why the trade looks like nothing but politics. I wasn't trying to wiggle around the question. Believe me, I too found it interesting that one said one thing and the other the opposite. So which one was lying? Perhaps neither were, my little hypothetical isn't that crazy to believe. So I dug up the old Bergevin quote which actually goes against my hypothetical - clearly I didn't quite remember what he said in the first place: Bergevin: I always say, "You don't want 23 robots." I have no issues with personality. Everybody's different, everybody brings different things to the table. But at some point I had to make a hard decision where I thought I could make the team better. That's when we pulled the trigger. And those who insist the trade was made to please [coach] Michel Therrien? That's [nonsense]. Mike didn't know anything -- anything -- about the trade until after it was made. So based on that, I'd say Bergevin was probably the one who misled here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted August 10, 2016 Share Posted August 10, 2016 I wasn't trying to wiggle around the question. I wasn't referring to you but to Bergevin. But yeah, now it's right out that Therrien knew. Bergevin has lied, tried to spread rumours, and tried to make excuses for why he made the move. Therrien just said hey, Subban was great, Weber will be better. Far more respect for Therrien about this than Marc. If that's all Marc did I'd question the validity (as I question Therrien's) but it's still the high road and what I'd want to hear from my GM. Not ways to try to make it look like Montreal traded a "problem" away. Sell it as an upgrade, not as a solution. At least then it feels like a question of what you prefer for your hockey club, and not something completely motivated by what doesn't happen on the ice. And I do believe Therrien when he thinks Weber will be better. Weber plays the way Therrien prefers the Habs to play. Short passes, dump and chase, big shot from the blueline. He fits Therrien like a glove. That's not to say that is a good thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 So yesterday at the golf tournament, MT said that Bergevin did consult with him prior to the trade. Earlier MB said he consulted with his hockey people but not the coach. Which one is it? Someone is lying (i suspect Bergevin, cause really if he's consulting with the hockey people, why not the coach)... and why are they lying? Dumb and ######ing Dumber. MB is protecting his foxhole buddy. Le Genius is just too stupid to figure that out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 I wasn't referring to you but to Bergevin. But yeah, now it's right out that Therrien knew. Bergevin has lied, tried to spread rumours, and tried to make excuses for why he made the move. Therrien just said hey, Subban was great, Weber will be better. Far more respect for Therrien about this than Marc. If that's all Marc did I'd question the validity (as I question Therrien's) but it's still the high road and what I'd want to hear from my GM. Not ways to try to make it look like Montreal traded a "problem" away. Sell it as an upgrade, not as a solution. At least then it feels like a question of what you prefer for your hockey club, and not something completely motivated by what doesn't happen on the ice. And I do believe Therrien when he thinks Weber will be better. Weber plays the way Therrien prefers the Habs to play. Short passes, dump and chase, big shot from the blueline. He fits Therrien like a glove. That's not to say that is a good thing. You seem to think Le Genius has a plan, other than "hey Carey you good to go?" I don't think so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 You seem to think Le Genius has a plan, other than "hey Carey you good to go?" I don't think so. Geez, another original post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 Geez, another original post. What do you want? Pot stirrer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 Maybe just give a bit more thought and effort and find some new material when posting an insult for Dumb or Dumber. Not that I don't beat dead horse often, so bit hypocritical I know but that is what I was getting at. That's all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toronthab Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 -the habs are instant contenders for the eastern conference with price alone back and healthy!! the addition of arguably one of the top 5 best russian forwards on the planet in Radulov . Plus shaw brings even more energy and sand paper to our 3rd line. the emergence of galchenyuk to star status and weber playing a role in elevating nate to the top pair and markov to the 2nd pair (what we've all been asking for) can only do us good. - A BETTER POWER PLAY?? like how could it be worst! -weber will fill those heavy minutes of PK easily. Also note that weber forces teams to dump the puck in and chase it rather then skate it in. this also plays to our strengths as price is world class at handling dump ins and helping move it quickly and effieciently. -weber will assist in the staled progression of beaulieu* as a puck moving top pair defensemen and i believe he will thrive in a role next to weber. it will also facilitate markov to a diminished 2nd pair role with another greta skater in petry!!!! the habs better be ready to open up their wallets for beaulieau the year after next could you imagine though beaulieu* weber markov subban emelin petry wow!! lol OK..you're cheering me up a little. Who knows... maybe in a month or two I'll stop crying. Maybe. .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Ethan Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 Nate Beaulieau not big on analytics or the Subban whiners I see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meller93 Posted August 11, 2016 Share Posted August 11, 2016 Nate Beaulieau not big on analytics or the Subban whiners I see. And? It seems huge numbers of NHLers don't, even when they post excellent possession numbers themselves (see Drew Doughy). And they don't have to, they're paid to played not make the decisions. Why on earth would you not use statistics as the resource that they are? I'm not saying they're the be all end all, but why throw away one of the best indicators you have to work with? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 And? It seems huge numbers of NHLers don't, even when they post excellent possession numbers themselves (see Drew Doughy). And they don't have to, they're paid to played not make the decisions. Why on earth would you not use statistics as the resource that they are? I'm not saying they're the be all end all, but why throw away one of the best indicators you have to work with? Stop being a sheep.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meller93 Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 Stop being a sheep.... Uh oh, are you in league with Mr. Raphael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 Ummm, mutton stew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meller93 Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 Ummm, mutton stew. Sorry Don I was borrowing the ladle! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 Maybe just give a bit more thought and effort and find some new material when posting an insult for Dumb or Dumber. Not that I don't beat dead horse often, so bit hypocritical I know but that is what I was getting at. That's all. Hey we get along. It's all good with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IN THE HEARTS OF MEN Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 OK..you're cheering me up a little. Who knows... maybe in a month or two I'll stop crying. Maybe. .. Don't get me wrong...I'm a fan of PK... But whats done is done... We need to move on now cause "dang it" Subban has! I think we've all said our piece and now its time to give this retooled group a chance. It can't be worse then what we we saw last season... Maybe Weber is exactly the player price and this team needs to get over that ECF hump and back to the biggest stage... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 Maybe Weber is exactly the player price and this team needs to get over that ECF hump and back to the biggest stage... At best it'll do nothing to change the team. Radulov will have a greater potential effect in changing the team. Same to Shaw if he comes half as advertised. Removing Eller the Anchor will help too. If the youngsters can grow they will improve the team. It was fixing a problem that never existed. Signing Radulov fixed a problem that did exist... at least for one season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IN THE HEARTS OF MEN Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 Interesting how Friedman said that he spoke to a habs player late last season after a game and the player said the GM and coach thought the team was soft both mentally and physically... Said team knew change was coming.... If you play sports it's amazing how one attitude one character can change the attitude of a whole team. I'm talking about how the presence of say Weber can make a whole line or at least beaulueu feel 3 inches taller for example Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stogey24 Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 This trade may be beneficial to Radulov. The spot light is completely on Weber. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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