I hope Bob Gainey is working to sign Huet

[brobin]

Who said Ward was a great goalie? I said he outplayed Huet in their one matchup, I said that he has accomplished more and I said it is ridiculous to write off a 24 year old goalie

because if you looked at Roy's 2nd and 3rd year he was not that great and Brodeur missed the playoffs in his 3rd year with the same team that won the Cup the year before.

Anybody who had written those 2 off like you are with Ward would look like bloody fools.

I don't care about Save percentages etc. Two things turned the tide in that series. The Koivu eye injury and Ward replacing Gerber.

How can anybody possibly have an intelligent discussion when you essentially take Wards resume, rip it up and say it means nothing?

No matter what you say, he has achieved more at 23 years old than Huet has at 33.

Those are the comparables, and they don't favour Huet. Simple as that.

As far as Huet, I agree that he resembles Moog and Hackett more than the elite of this league. He is good, but not great.

Thanks for that thoughtful analysis based on one data point. Let's ignore all the other data points.

I sure am glad you are not Gainey, since he has the ability to look past "glory stats" and find under rated winners, like Huet.

I don't care what Ward did over 16 games, his stats tell me he is not likely to do it again. Huet may never do it, but I doubt it will be because of him.

[Wamsley01]

Thanks for that thoughtful analysis based on one data point. Let's ignore all the other data points.

I sure am glad you are not Gainey, since he has the ability to look past "glory stats" and find under rated winners, like Huet.

I don't care what Ward did over 16 games, his stats tell me he is not likely to do it again. Huet may never do it, but I doubt it will be because of him.

What are you talking about? I love how Stanley Cups and MVPs are meaningless when they do not support one's argument.

But Save Percentage is the only thing that matters right?

Huet is such an underated winner that he has made the playoffs once in 5 years. Out of 151 NHL decisions he has won 71 times.

Impressive. Huet is such a winner that he has won less than half of his decisions. Wow, how do they establish winners in your universe?

I must be crazy to think that a Cup and Smythe trophy could trump a Roger Crozier award.

I must be crazy to think that a 23 year olds stats will never get better. A 23 year old will never be better?

I wonder how much Huet has improved since he played for Lugano in the Swiss League? I am sure if you saw him then

you would have established his future in the NHL.

What data point does your tireless research show that Huet is a great goalie? It sure as hell is not wins and losses.

It sure as hell is not playoff victories, it sure as hell is not his shootout record. So what is it then? ahhh Save Percentage

If so I guess Manny Fernandez is great because he has a great career save percentage, Manny Legace, great.

Chris Mason, great. Gerber, great. Dubielewicz, great, Tim Thomas, great, Cechmanek, once again great.

You have been defending Huet on this board for months, you have spent countless hours creating arguments to show how good he is yet you dismiss

Ward's future in 2 sentences? A 23 year old kid who lead his junior team to the Finals two times, a 23 year old who has already reached the pinnacle

of success at the NHL level with a Cup and a Conn Smythe. Yeah, that doesn't sound like a winner to me, just a guy with a bunch of glory stats.

But you have assessed that a 23 year old cannot get any better than he is right now. Why is that? Let me guess Save Percentage?

Patrick Roy's save percentage during his first 3 seasons in the league. .875, .891 and .900. But during the 86 playoff run his .923 SV%

did not match his regular season statistics. So I have to assume you would have deduced that he was a fluke right. Just a 16 game fluke.

He actually never matched that playoff percentage during the regular season and finished his career with a .904 Save Percentage.

I am impressed that 20 years ago you would have dismissed arguably the greatest goalie of all-time as a player who crafted his career

on glory stats.

Amazing, how when you want something to be true that you will dismiss whatever you need to to justify your opinion.

Edited February 7, 2008 by Wamsley01

[OneSharpMarble]

Thanks for that thoughtful analysis based on one data point. Let's ignore all the other data points.

I sure am glad you are not Gainey, since he has the ability to look past "glory stats" and find under rated winners, like Huet.

I don't care what Ward did over 16 games, his stats tell me he is not likely to do it again. Huet may never do it, but I doubt it will be because of him.

Cmon sure you don't want Theodore back?

He won a Vezzziinnnnnaaaaa

[Ecurb]

Wow, I didn't realize that Huet or Koivu could invoke such passionate

feelings for or against.

I felt we should try to re-sign Huet to a 3 year deal. We should front

load it and pay something like 5M the first year, 4M the second and

2M the third. In that way when Price became a RFA, Huet would be on

the last year of his contract and could be moved easily if he were putting

up similiar numbers. I felt this way not because I don't think Price can

become a legit #1 as soon as next year. Its just considering his makeup

and the pressure of the media I wanted him brought along slowly.

But, after reading all the arguments, I'm not so sure we wouldn't be better

off going with Halak and Price. Halak will be a RFA after this season and I

fear a team in Russia will make him an offer that he would take rather

spending another year in Hamilton.

Gainey's got some tough choices to make, he needs to either re-sign Huet

at a reasonable rate for 3 years or less and trade Halak. Or, let Huet go

at the end of the season and let Price and Halak fight it out . Considering

what we'd we get for Halak, I'm now leaning towards keeping him and

letting Huet go. We have 2 fine goalie prospects, why not keep both?

[Wamsley01]

Cmon sure you don't want Theodore back?

He won a Vezzziinnnnnaaaaa

A response that I would expect from you. Taking things out of context to get under people's skin while bringing nothing of substance to the argument.

Well done, you have lived up to your reputation.

[OneSharpMarble]

A response that I would expect from you. Taking things out of context to get under people's skin while bringing nothing of substance to the argument.

Well done, you have lived up to your reputation.

You take everything I say so personally, you'd swear Theodore was your personal rogaine dealer or something....

What do you think? Next year he gets league minimum? Or does he get AHL league minimum?

[Habsfan]

What do you think? Next year he gets league minimum? Or does he get AHL league minimum?

Are you talking about hteodore? Cause if you are, the guy has somewhat turned his career around.

he's having a decent year in Colorado. 14 wins(in 28 Games started) a G.A.A. of 2.45 and a save % of .908

Not bad. If I were Colorado, I'd be looking to offer hiim a 2 year 7 million$ contract.

[OneSharpMarble]

Are you talking about hteodore? Cause if you are, the guy has somewhat turned his career around.

he's having a decent year in Colorado. 14 wins(in 28 Games started) a G.A.A. of 2.45 and a save % of .908

Not bad. If I were Colorado, I'd be looking to offer hiim a 2 year 7 million$ contract.

Yeah I am sure thats what they will offer him

[Habsfan]

Yeah I am sure thats what they will offer him

Are you laughing at me or at the offer?

[Wamsley01]

Are you laughing at me or at the offer?

I think both

[OneSharpMarble]

Are you laughing at me or at the offer?

It was the offer, I don't see anyone giving a backup 3.5 million per year.

[lazy26]

It was the offer, I don't see anyone giving a backup 3.5 million per year.

Not to defend Theo.. but he's definitely outplayed Budaj this year. I could see the Avs dipping in the FA pool, but there won't be many goalies. Is there a prospect that I'm unaware of?

[OneSharpMarble]

Not to defend Theo.. but he's definitely outplayed Budaj this year. I could see the Avs dipping in the FA pool, but there won't be many goalies. Is there a prospect that I'm unaware of?

It took Theo a whopping 3 or 4 weeks to go from star to absolute disaster. They were stuck with him and his monstrous contract for the past 3 years, I am pretty sure they wont be itching to get into any contract with him again.

His stats don't indicate he has vastly outplayed Budaj, they are very similar except Budaj has 6 more wins than loses and Theo is about 2 games over .500.

I could see Budaj getting the starter position and Theo backup salary for a few years. He should be grateful they didn't waive him.

Theo 28 1,616 14 12 - 2 66 718 1 2.45 .908

Budaj 30 1,683 15 9 - 3 76 762 0 2.71 .900

Edited February 7, 2008 by OneSharpMarble

[lazy26]

It took Theo a whopping 3 or 4 weeks to go from star to absolute disaster. They were stuck with him and his monstrous contract for the past 3 years, I am pretty sure they wont be itching to get into any contract with him again.

His stats don't indicate he has vastly outplayed Budaj, they are very similar except Budaj has 6 more wins than loses and Theo is about 2 games over .500.

I could see Budaj getting the starter position and Theo backup salary for a few years. He should be grateful they didn't waive him.

Theo 28 1,616 14 12 - 2 66 718 1 2.45 .908

Budaj 30 1,683 15 9 - 3 76 762 0 2.71 .900

Their stats are similar, but Theo seems to have been handed the reins since Jan, and he has done well in stabilizing a club that is missing it's best players. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want to sign him as a starter, but IMO, he's a better option than Budaj.

[Wamsley01]

Their stats are similar, but Theo seems to have been handed the reins since Jan, and he has done well in stabilizing a club that is missing it's best players. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want to sign him as a starter, but IMO, he's a better option than Budaj.

Theodore - last 12 starts 1.83 gaa and .933 sv% with 7 wins

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/players/1420/g...8kyVtR0ltFivLYF

He is playing better, but I wouldn't touch him after the last 3 years.

[lazy26]

Theodore - last 12 starts 1.83 gaa and .933 sv% with 7 wins

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/players/1420/g...8kyVtR0ltFivLYF

He is playing better, but I wouldn't touch him after the last 3 years.

That was my point, and I concur.

[Fat Tony]

It was the offer, I don't see anyone giving a backup 3.5 million per year.

How do you figure a guy who started 10 games in a row while a healthy Budaj sat on the bench is a backup? Theo has played very well after his slow start due to injury. Budaj has been very average the last couple of months, and was awful in 2 of his 3 starts while Theo was out (Theo was back with a 3-1 win and first star on Wednesday) . Barring a big trade or the emergence of one of their minor league goalie, the Avs would be very wise to pitch an offer to Theo. And no, he may never see 6 mil a year again, but with his stats this year it's equally unlikely he'll be at the league minimum. I loved him as a Habs, felt for him when he fell apart, and am glad he's pulled it together...but he'll NEVER be a Canadien again...even if the team considered it (not a chance), if you were him would you want back?

[OneSharpMarble]

How do you figure a guy who started 10 games in a row while a healthy Budaj sat on the bench is a backup? Theo has played very well after his slow start due to injury. Budaj has been very average the last couple of months, and was awful in 2 of his 3 starts while Theo was out (Theo was back with a 3-1 win and first star on Wednesday) . Barring a big trade or the emergence of one of their minor league goalie, the Avs would be very wise to pitch an offer to Theo. And no, he may never see 6 mil a year again, but with his stats this year it's equally unlikely he'll be at the league minimum. I loved him as a Habs, felt for him when he fell apart, and am glad he's pulled it together...but he'll NEVER be a Canadien again...even if the team considered it (not a chance), if you were him would you want back?

He is a starter in name and pay only, Budaj is not yet experienced enough to be the starter. You can't bench a player you pay 6 million a year for and not expect some heavy backlash you must find a way to turn his game around while he is on your team. Once that big contract is up then you will see who the team really has faith in. His last few games aren't proof he is going to be a stable goalie in the future in alot of his games he has been blown out by 4 or 5 goals.

Thats nice to hear he'll never be a Canadien again all that drama and nonsense around him almost ruined that entire season for the habs. Just think if Gainey had not been able to move him how that would have really sunk this team hard the last couple years. We would have had to completely rely on one of our backups for 60+ games a season.

[Neech]

I've gotten over rooting against Theo, now I wish him success and hope he can get the Avs somewhere in the playoffs if they make it.

[Fat Tony]

He is a starter in name and pay only, Budaj is not yet experienced enough to be the starter. You can't bench a player you pay 6 million a year for and not expect some heavy backlash you must find a way to turn his game around while he is on your team. Once that big contract is up then you will see who the team really has faith in. His last few games aren't proof he is going to be a stable goalie in the future in alot of his games he has been blown out by 4 or 5 goals.

Thats nice to hear he'll never be a Canadien again all that drama and nonsense around him almost ruined that entire season for the habs. Just think if Gainey had not been able to move him how that would have really sunk this team hard the last couple years. We would have had to completely rely on one of our backups for 60+ games a season.

Of course you can bench a 6 million dollar player, in fact Theo rode the pines early this year and for long stretches last year. This is a discussion going nowhere, many Habs fans hate Theo for "letting us down" and will never get over it. I kind of chuckle at that line of thought, the guy intentionally melted down his career for 2 years just to show us fans who's boss.

[OneSharpMarble]

Of course you can bench a 6 million dollar player, in fact Theo rode the pines early this year and for long stretches last year. This is a discussion going nowhere, many Habs fans hate Theo for "letting us down" and will never get over it. I kind of chuckle at that line of thought, the guy intentionally melted down his career for 2 years just to show us fans who's boss.

Long stretches doesn't equal whole seasons. Who said he intentionally melted down? Maybe some reading comprehension or maybe a stronger prescription for your glasses is required?

Edited February 9, 2008 by OneSharpMarble

[Fat Tony]

Long stretches doesn't equal whole seasons. Who said he intentionally melted down? Maybe some reading comprehension or maybe a stronger prescription for your glasses is required?

A lot of fans blame Theodore and hold him responsible. I just find that irrational, I'm sure the person on the planet least thrilled with his meltdown is him, this is all I'm saying. The intentional reference was sarcastic...too subtle for you?

Edited February 9, 2008 by Fat Tony

[Dirty Harry]

A lot of fans blame Theodore and hold him responsible. I just find that irrational, I'm sure the person on the planet least thrilled with his meltdown is him, this is all I'm saying. The intentional reference was sarcastic...too subtle for you?

His hard partying was WELL documented, and that was his choice.

A NHL goalie's skills need to stay razor sharp, drinking heavily, doing coke, constant female distractions, not enough sleep or practice will dull that edge easily and that's clearly what happened.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

I liked Theodore - he had that cocky swagger, that lightning-quick lateral movement, and eventually an MVP - and I found his meltdown sudden, painful and shocking. From a Habs' fan standpoint, I was relieved Bob was able to move him; from a human standpoint, I was relieved that he was able to go somewhere where he'd be less relentlessly visible. If he recovers his form, it'll be a nice story all around. He was a good-to-great goalie for us and deserves our affection for carrying the team on his back during some of the darkest moments in its entire history. Anyone who hates the guy is playing a minor variation on the theme of resenting Patrick Roy for that one game against Detroit, forgetting the Cups and great years before that.

Now then. Did anybody note Fisher's story in Friday's Gazette? Basically, a ringing endorsement of Huet as the only guy who can offer the Habs 'playoff quality' goaltending. Note the implied critique of Price.

http://www.canada.com/topics/sports/hockey...a01&k=73754

Not that Red knows it all, but he's a voice to be listened to.

[Dirty Harry]

I don't think Price has earned criticism, but he is a rookie and there's always risks asking a rookie to carry the load for the team (See Raycroft, Carey, Ward, Fleury). Maybe him and Halak together could, but it's a lot riskier than Huet who is a veteren skilled goalie amongst the top 10 in the league. That's a tough choice for Gainey to run with the rookies who obviously have skills and potential to do the job, but maybe aren't quite up to it yet. Or give another contract to Huet and let him carry the load for a few more years. Both choices are ok, and have their pros and cons (salary saved vs consistency questions). We wouldn't be able to say which would be right except in hindsight. Either way, in Bob I Trust.