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What to do with Plekanec and Halak

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Trading Plekanec is a bad idea... but we do need to trade a goalie

Everyone who wants to trade Plekanec and/or Halak for Carter or just wants to trade these players for assets is forgetting a crucial detail - THE SALARY CAP!!!

If we get Carter, he only has one year left at $5M. If Carter performs like he did last year, he'll be due for a big raise. Even if he continues at this current year's pace, he'll still likely get at least $5M a year. Assuming Carter would even want to play in Montreal, we'll have the same problem next year as we do now - the Habs can't afford to add another big contract.

In fact, we can only trade these players for similar salaries. In other words, the Habs would likely only receive prospects and picks by trading Plekanec and Halak.

In my opinion, the best strategy is for BG and Company to decide which goalie to keep and trade the other goalie for picks and/or prospects. After that, wait until the offseason (before July 1) and clear cap space (Mara, Laraque, Laps, etc or maybe even Hamrlik) and sign Plekanec.

Trading Plekanec for picks and/or prospects is a huge risk. The odds of having a prospect or pick turn into a 0.75-1 point per game player (plus one of the best defensive centres in the league) is very slim (i.e., see the Habs’ past 15 year draft history).

If I were BG, I would try to sign Plekanec to a Marc Savard type of contract as soon as the Habs’ season is over. Savard got $28.5M over 7 years and it was heavily front loaded. Given Plekanec's age, I’m thinking a heavily front loaded $35M over 9 years ($3.89M per year). This would be a fantastic contract for both sides.

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work overtime to sign Pleky before the deadline. Keep halak, and sign him to a moderate RFA contract and if you can rely on Price trade halak at the draft for a move up in the first round. if price is still inconsistent, use the savings on price's low contract to role two goalies. buy out bgl, let mara walk. call up one maybe two defense from minors.

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We'll do what we do best since we traded Roy and Keane for nothing

Let's trade Halak and Plekanec for Mr Peanut and a couple of illegal sticks

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We'll do what we do best since we traded Roy and Keane for nothing

Let's trade Halak and Plekanec for Mr Peanut and a couple of illegal sticks

You really made an intelligent post, waste of ink.

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work overtime to sign Pleky before the deadline. Keep halak, and sign him to a moderate RFA contract and if you can rely on Price trade halak at the draft for a move up in the first round. if price is still inconsistent, use the savings on price's low contract to role two goalies. buy out bgl, let mara walk. call up one maybe two defense from minors.

i like the idea of working OT to sign Plecks.

on the other hand why not just loose Halak to another team that signs him for mo money ?

we will get a tone of picks and maybe just maybe they will pan into great player(s) :)

Halak is an RFA other then to move him in order to grant his wish to be moved, I have no probs on just sitting on his value.

Sorry Halak if you are reading this but the team before you bud.

GO! :hlogo: GO!

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You really made an intelligent post, waste of ink.

Damn you're uptight

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Seems every other thread talks about these two....(and until their traded or signed we've basically discussed it all) and no ink was wasted in the replies.

And they were short and to the point

Edited by kenadian

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In my mind, a waste of ink is when someone comments on another's post without adding any useful hockey ideas. The person whose post was criticized was making a hockey point: (whether you agree or not) that Gainey was not making good trades and would probably screw this one too. The person who criticized this post said nothing.

Not being particularly enamored with Gainey, I am sympathetic to the original poster's idea, though not in complete agreement.

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What to do with PLekanec?????? Jesus wept. Friggin sign him.

:lol: !!!!!

well I guess it was HIS party yesterday, He will cry if He wants too, cry if He wants, You would too if...

I guess we loose Plecks!

But no worries I will be on the parade route crying too!!!!!!!!

Sorry if it offends you or others but that was funny :lol::lol::lol:

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Plek has the Markov attitude. I'm really not worried.

He is gonna sign in Montreal for under 6M (shit that's steep!! I still don't know if he's for real! can he be that good over some years??) for 4-5 years.

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For one of those very rare times, we draft and develop two players who rise to be elite (Plex) and highly overachievers (Halak).

Do all it takes, within reasonable limits, to keep them. Trade other players to make room for their new contracts, if need be. Plekanec has become everything expected of Saku Koivu 15 years ago... minus all the injuries and healthy issues. The little guy should be the face of the franchise right now. He's been our MVP since October. He does it all. To make room for his new contract, I wouldnt hesitate a second to move a bunch of marginal non-core players to make it happen. Plex is that damn vital now. He's our Datsyuk. If Gainey can't keep Plekanec in Montreal, Bob should just step down. Plain as that.

Halak is a bit more complicated because of all the hopes put into Price. Since Price's contract isnt an issue, since Price is so young and still inconsistent, I think the best possible scenario right now would be to give Halak a true test drive. Not a 5 games, you-wont-start-for-a-month-if-you-lose test. I mean make him your de facto number one and just see how far he can carry you. The players seems to prefer to play for him than Price right now anyway. Price still have tons of things to work on anyway, mostly on the mental aspect of the game. It'd be a blessing in disguise, IMHO, to draw Price away from the spotlight and work his ass out in practice and extra practice and round out his technique for real. Give him starts now and then. Price could definitely benefit from that sort of mental challenge. Make him a little bit tougher mentally.

I can't help but compare Price-Halak to Belfour-Hasek. Belfour was the high-profile, hyped goalie on which all of Chicago's hopes rested. Hasek was the late-drafted unknown Euro goalie backup. We all know what happened later. I wouldnt want to repeat history and trade the goalie who turns out the most dominant for little because I never gave him a real long hard look down the stretch and in the playoffs. And even if Halak flaters for a couple of games, come back with him later. Like a true number 1.

Really, there's no other real choices right now. It would also send a huge signal to everyone else --NHL, AHL and prospects-- in the organization: "Work your ass off and we'll reward you by putting you front and center". What kind of signal would trading them would send? "Work your ass off and we'll ship you out of town." Depressing...

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For one of those very rare times, we draft and develop two players who rise to be elite (Plex) and highly overachievers (Halak).

Do all it takes, within reasonable limits, to keep them. Trade other players to make room for their new contracts, if need be. Plekanec has become everything expected of Saku Koivu 15 years ago... minus all the injuries and healthy issues. The little guy should be the face of the franchise right now. He's been our MVP since October. He does it all. To make room for his new contract, I wouldnt hesitate a second to move a bunch of marginal non-core players to make it happen. Plex is that damn vital now. He's our Datsyuk. If Gainey can't keep Plekanec in Montreal, Bob should just step down. Plain as that.

Halak is a bit more complicated because of all the hopes put into Price. Since Price's contract isnt an issue, since Price is so young and still inconsistent, I think the best possible scenario right now would be to give Halak a true test drive. Not a 5 games, you-wont-start-for-a-month-if-you-lose test. I mean make him your de facto number one and just see how far he can carry you. The players seems to prefer to play for him than Price right now anyway. Price still have tons of things to work on anyway, mostly on the mental aspect of the game. It'd be a blessing in disguise, IMHO, to draw Price away from the spotlight and work his ass out in practice and extra practice and round out his technique for real. Give him starts now and then. Price could definitely benefit from that sort of mental challenge. Make him a little bit tougher mentally.

I can't help but compare Price-Halak to Belfour-Hasek. Belfour was the high-profile, hyped goalie on which all of Chicago's hopes rested. Hasek was the late-drafted unknown Euro goalie backup. We all know what happened later. I wouldnt want to repeat history and trade the goalie who turns out the most dominant for little because I never gave him a real long hard look down the stretch and in the playoffs. And even if Halak flaters for a couple of games, come back with him later. Like a true number 1.

Really, there's no other real choices right now. It would also send a huge signal to everyone else --NHL, AHL and prospects-- in the organization: "Work your ass off and we'll reward you by putting you front and centre". What kind of signal would trading them would send? "Work your ass off and we'll ship you out of town." Depressing...

+1

IMO the Pleks we have the pleasure of watching right now is the real deal. As I've been saying for the past few weeks, its one thing for a guy to suddenly get hot and scoring for a strech a la John Druce or Jason Blake, or go on a tear playing with a guy like Gretzky (Bernie Nicholls),. Its also common for a skilled floater to have a year where he finally puts in an effort, have a big year and then go back to floating or making poor decisions or decisions with the puck to just padd their stats. Its quite another for a guy who has ALWAYS had a strong never quit work ethic, is a solid two way player who has always shown great hockey sense and is a guy who spent the first 10-15 games playing with zombies and still produce while Gomez played with Cammy and Gionta. You don't consistently make saucer passes and finding guys cross ice in the open like Pleks does by fluke. IMO, we may have found the closest thing to our Datysuk or Zetterberg. As I've stated before Pleks ONLY issue in the past has been his confidence in himself. Now he knows what he is capable of and is producting. His production also is in line with the age a lot of guys start putting things together.

I've been saying the same thing about Halak going back three years when Halak put the habs into a position to squeak into the playoffs. How did he get rewarded, Carbo started Huet in the critical last game of th season against the leafs when that game's outcome would determine the playoff fate.

Two years ago he got screwed over in the Philly series, and at that time people kept saying you have to still go with Price becuase of the season he had. The Huricanes won a cup because they had the balls to switch goalies when their #1 starter Gerber wasn't getting the job done. Cam Ward and Koivu's injury took the Hurricanes to the cup.

I don't think anyone with the exception of Gainey (or his misguided worshippers), would disagree that Halak also got screwed over last year.

The only area I disagree with is annointing Halak as the #1 right away. If i'm Martin/Gainey, I call both guys in the room and aslo tell the team (formally) that the habs have two real good goalies and they are both going to get long strecthes of carrying the workload based on their results. I'd like to see how both respond to the challenge. I don't think there is anything wrong with Healthy competition, as long as both get an equal shot of showing what they can do. WHile Martin has given Halak more of a chance this year, I think he still has shown a lot more patience when Price makes mistakes, then he has with Halak. I think it should be clear to both the goalies and the team that the quality of the starts alone will determine who gets the nod.

The only way i'd deveiate from this strategy is if someone made an offer that can't be turne down, or if someone came forward willing to take Gomez's salary of the books along with a goalie. Having said that, I really don't have confidence in Gainey to make such a deal. Other then trying to cover his own butt with the fans and media, it made no sense at all to me when he said that he didn't think it was realistic to get a top 6 forward for Halak given that he only got a 2nd rounder for Huet. Huet, Halak and Price are in different situations. Huet pretty much had reached the height of his potential and was going to be a UFA. Halak and Price, while having shown at times they may be solid #1 goalies, still have untapped, undetermined potential that raises their value.

Edited by hab29RETIRED

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+1

IMO the Pleks we have the pleasure of watching right now is the real deal. As I've been saying for the past few weeks, its one thing for a guy to suddenly get hot and scoring for a strech a la John Druce or Jason Blake, or go on a tear playing with a guy like Gretzky (Bernie Nicholls),. Its also common for a skilled floater to have a year where he finally puts in an effort, have a big year and then go back to floating or making poor decisions or decisions with the puck to just padd their stats. Its quite another for a guy who has ALWAYS had a strong never quit work ethic, is a solid two way player who has always shown great hockey sense and is a guy who spent the first 10-15 games playing with zombies and still produce while Gomez played with Cammy and Gionta. You don't consistently make saucer passes and finding guys cross ice in the open like Pleks does by fluke. IMO, we may have found the closest thing to our Datysuk or Zetterberg. As I've stated before Pleks ONLY issue in the past has been his confidence in himself. Now he knows what he is capable of and is producting. His production also is in line with the age a lot of guys start putting things together.

I've been saying the same thing about Halak going back three years when Halak put the habs into a position to squeak into the playoffs. How did he get rewarded, Carbo started Huet in the critical last game of th season against the leafs when that game's outcome would determine the playoff fate.

Two years ago he got screwed over in the Philly series, and at that time people kept saying you have to still go with Price becuase of the season he had. The Huricanes won a cup because they had the balls to switch goalies when their #1 starter Gerber wasn't getting the job done. Cam Ward and Koivu's injury took the Hurricanes to the cup.

I don't think anyone with the exception of Gainey (or his misguided worshippers), would disagree that Halak also got screwed over last year.

The only area I disagree with is annointing Halak as the #1 right away. If i'm Martin/Gainey, I call both guys in the room and aslo tell the team (formally) that the habs have two real good goalies and they are both going to get long strecthes of carrying the workload based on their results. I'd like to see how both respond to the challenge. I don't think there is anything wrong with Healthy competition, as long as both get an equal shot of showing what they can do. WHile Martin has given Halak more of a chance this year, I think he still has shown a lot more patience when Price makes mistakes, then he has with Halak. I think it should be clear to both the goalies and the team that the quality of the starts alone will determine who gets the nod.

The only way i'd deveiate from this strategy is if someone made an offer that can't be turne down, or if someone came forward willing to take Gomez's salary of the books along with a goalie. Having said that, I really don't have confidence in Gainey to make such a deal. Other then trying to cover his own butt with the fans and media, it made no sense at all to me when he said that he didn't think it was realistic to get a top 6 forward for Halak given that he only got a 2nd rounder for Huet. Huet, Halak and Price are in different situations. Huet pretty much had reached the height of his potential and was going to be a UFA. Halak and Price, while having shown at times they may be solid #1 goalies, still have untapped, undetermined potential that raises their value.

Backup goalies, that still have untapped, undetermined potential, have very little value. It's the very nature of unknown that gives them a low value. And please, can we all stop with comments like Gainey worshippers. I have mega respect for Mr. Gainey, as does the entire hockey world. If he screws up Pleks/Halak he should step down or be fired. But since I respect him, am I a worshipper? It takes away from your post, when you call somebody a fanboy, or worshipper.

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Backup goalies, that still have untapped, undetermined potential, have very little value. It's the very nature of unknown that gives them a low value.

That can be true, as it can be false. Goalies are the hardest commodity to trade, since they're such a fickle bunch. Bryzgalov's situation in Anaheim wasnt too disimilar from Halak and he was picked off waivers. Kipprusoff was traded for a 2nd rounder; but Toskala (and Bell) fetched a 1st, 2nd and 4th; Vokoun a 1st and two 2nd; Mike Smith was the big piece sought after TB in the Richards deal. Trading goalies is very much a matter of timing and marketing.

And please, can we all stop with comments like Gainey worshippers. I have mega respect for Mr. Gainey, as does the entire hockey world. If he screws up Pleks/Halak he should step down or be fired. But since I respect him, am I a worshipper? It takes away from your post, when you call somebody a fanboy, or worshipper.

Been guilty of it, and I understand the irritation that comes with the label. Irritation probably similar to seeing Gainey's reputation used as a rebuke to every critic. Respect is one thing, credit another. You can respect the man, his attitude and all; and not appreciate his work. No cow should be so sacred as to have me drink their sour milk without cringing.

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You got it Kozed. The reason I'm an avid reader of this site, is intelligent hockey discussions. I put fanboy and worshipper on the same level as "plan the parade route" and "bandwagon jumper".

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That can be true, as it can be false. Goalies are the hardest commodity to trade, since they're such a fickle bunch. Bryzgalov's situation in Anaheim wasnt too disimilar from Halak and he was picked off waivers. Kipprusoff was traded for a 2nd rounder;

Been guilty of it, and I understand the irritation that comes with the label. Irritation probably similar to seeing Gainey's reputation used as a rebuke to every critic. Respect is one thing, credit another. You can respect the man, his attitude and all; and not appreciate his work. No cow should be so sacred as to have me drink their sour milk without cringing.

+1

growing up, after Dryden, Lafleur and Robinson, Gainey was my favourite player. I also had high hopes and felt a sense of relief when he became GM. However, while he has been a major step up frm the dark Houle years (which frankly a chmpanzee could have accomplished), IMO, Gainey the GM has been a disapointment. It doesn't take away anything as Gainey being a key cog of the habs past success, as a great former captain and a hall of famer. But as a GM in the post salary cap era he seems to be blundering along, and I'm tired of reading the blind "in Bob We trust" defenses and rebukes of any criticsm directed toward Gainey. Other teams like NJ were much worse positioned coming out of the lockout, but smart GM's like Lou adopted their approach and dumped their bad signings - even if it meant demoting them. Good GM's would not have signed Samsonov (after he disappeared in the Oilers cup run), Laraque (1.5M for an enforcer???) or traded for the worst salary in the NHL. He also wouldn't have let as many assets fo for nothing, mismanaged young players by fast tracking the likes of Ribeiro, Lats and I'm afraid that the habs are going to turn MaxPax into a career 3rd liner as well.

As far as Halak goes, Kipper didn't have the same success as halak has had. When Calgary picked him up, Sutter picked him up as a known commodity from his time in SJ, and he was mean to back up Turek. I think Toskala is a better comparasion. Having said that, given how badly Toskala has worked out for Toronto, could shy people away from Halak.

Personally, I'd like to see how he does as a starter in the Olympic before considering moving halak or price.

Edited by hab29RETIRED

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Gainey cant trade Plekanec. Not just because of the holiday freeze, but also because Montreal apprears to be getting hot. Markov is back. Gionta should be on his way, and Montreal has won 3 straight.

No way Gainey will rock the boat and mess with the teams chemistry that is just now seeming to mesh.

So Gainey probably tries to sign him. If he does, he probably now overpays, considering he probably could have had him for less last season than he could now. Or Plekanec walks at the end of last season for $5 + million

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Gainey cant trade Plekanec. Not just because of the holiday freeze, but also because Montreal apprears to be getting hot. Markov is back. Gionta should be on his way, and Montreal has won 3 straight.

No way Gainey will rock the boat and mess with the teams chemistry that is just now seeming to mesh.

So Gainey probably tries to sign him. If he does, he probably now overpays, considering he probably could have had him for less last season than he could now. Or Plekanec walks at the end of last season for $5 + million

What worries me is if Gainey flows his usual process of waiting until the end of the year.

He really needs to try and lock up his young guys earlier. That's why i think that whichever goalie we settle on, we should lock them up longer term - overpaying this summer, but becuase of longer term, end up with a lower cap hit over the longer term.

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When Plekanek filed for arbitration, most people on this board were right up with

the same opinion, the guy was a b*tch to ask for more than he deserved. Let him

play one year and in one year a centre Maxwell or Lapierrre will develop as a second centre.

And the concesus was to trade him at the end of the line or let him walk.

Maybe have this thread revisited would be interesting...

The guy has a career year, it's great...maybe we'll make the playoffs.

I say for Plekanek sign him now. He deserves it, the underdog overachieved.

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First off, I'm a Plekanec fan and love what he's doing this year. However, I am a little uneasy about the notion of signing him to a huge deal for alot of years. I'm surprised that nobody is talking about him "playing for a contract", as he is UFA at the end of the year. This sort of thing happens all the time. A player dedicates himself to the game and plays the absolute best he can in order to get the most money on the open market. If Plekanec could produce for years to come how he is producing now, then a big payday is justified. I just can't forget his pathetic 39 points last year, eventhough he had 69? the year before.

It is a huge problem in hockey these days when GM's throw a bunch of money at a player who has a breakout year which "coincedentally" is also a contract year. People are too quick to say "lock him up long term". Those are usually the same people who are complaining about his contract a couple years down the road when they are underperforming. A prime example is Jason Blake getting 40 goals in a contract year as a +30 year old player. Leafs sign him to a big deal and expect him to get 40 every year which is so unrealistic. And when he doesn't they call for his head.

I would love to resign Plekanec but only for the right deal. He is comparable to a Marc Savard in skill and ability and Savard just signed for 4.2m/per long term. The only difference is that Savard has consistently put up good numbers for a long time so he deserves such a contract. If Plekanec wants any more than 5m/per, I thnk the best thing to do is trade him at the deadline no matter if we are in the playoff hunt or not. Hopefully he will take a hometown discount and actually want to stay around. I also hope that he isn't just playing for a contract and that it's just his development coming along at this time. It's too bad Gomez will never live up to his contract and I just hope Plekanec doesn't follow suit.

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First off, I'm a Plekanec fan and love what he's doing this year. However, I am a little uneasy about the notion of signing him to a huge deal for alot of years. I'm surprised that nobody is talking about him "playing for a contract", as he is UFA at the end of the year. This sort of thing happens all the time. A player dedicates himself to the game and plays the absolute best he can in order to get the most money on the open market. If Plekanec could produce for years to come how he is producing now, then a big payday is justified. I just can't forget his pathetic 39 points last year, eventhough he had 69? the year before.

It is a huge problem in hockey these days when GM's throw a bunch of money at a player who has a breakout year which "coincedentally" is also a contract year. People are too quick to say "lock him up long term". Those are usually the same people who are complaining about his contract a couple years down the road when they are underperforming. A prime example is Jason Blake getting 40 goals in a contract year as a +30 year old player. Leafs sign him to a big deal and expect him to get 40 every year which is so unrealistic. And when he doesn't they call for his head.

I would love to resign Plekanec but only for the right deal. He is comparable to a Marc Savard in skill and ability and Savard just signed for 4.2m/per long term. The only difference is that Savard has consistently put up good numbers for a long time so he deserves such a contract. If Plekanec wants any more than 5m/per, I thnk the best thing to do is trade him at the deadline no matter if we are in the playoff hunt or not. Hopefully he will take a hometown discount and actually want to stay around. I also hope that he isn't just playing for a contract and that it's just his development coming along at this time. It's too bad Gomez will never live up to his contract and I just hope Plekanec doesn't follow suit.

Great post. Wamsley is quite right that Pleks has never been an elite offensive player and has never been projected to be an elite offensive player. That doesn't mean that this season is a mirage...it might not be. But a certain caution is called for here. More than $5 mil is an enormous stretch, and I agree that if he's looking for more, he should be shipped out at the deadline. I don't really care - except that losing him for nothing as a UFA will be just cause for firing Gainey.

In a really fair universe, Pleks would be signed to a 2-year deal at $5 mil and if he's still producing at current clip, then re-signed for a longer term at more money. The fact is, he has proven very little as yet.

Edited by The Chicoutimi Cucumber

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Great post. Wamsley is quite right that Pleks has never been an elite offensive player and has never been projected to be an elite offensive player. That doesn't mean that this season is a mirage...it might not be. But a certain caution is called for here. More than $5 mil is an enormous stretch, and I agree that if he's looking for more, he should be shipped out at the deadline. I don't really care - except that losing him for nothing as a UFA will be just cause for firing Gainey.

In a really fair universe, Pleks would be signed to a 2-year deal at $5 mil and if he's still producing at current clip, then re-signed for a longer term at more money. The fact is, he has proven very little as yet.

This is my position on Plex as well. Kozed makes good points too.

Is Plex a 40 point guy or an 80 point guy?

As Colin pointed out in another thread, this situation is a no win for Gainey. There are landmines all around Plekanec.

Glenn Healy (I know the guy is a tool) said last night that if Halak isn't traded this season he will not re-up next year (he is RFA) but will play in the KHL instead. This worries me. If we loose Halak for nothing and potentially loose Plekanec for nothing... :puke:

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Well even if he goes to KHL, we still retain his rights. So we aren't technically losing him.

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I still think Gainey has a rare opportunity here. Pleks and/or Halak could surely yield truly elite talent back. (I love those Jeff Carter rumours). But he has to play his cards right this time. No more squandered assets.

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