Anyone still defending Samsonov?

[C-Love]

Fair enough but Sammy already had one foot in the grave as far as I'm concerned because I had seen him a lot even before Gainey signed him and he has sucked ever since leaving Boston. Maybe Boston management had a feeling that his best days were behind him like Gainey had abiout Theodore and they got rid of him. At any rate, Sammy got 1 and 3/4 feet in the grave. It's going to take some kind of voodoo to get him back now.

EXactly

This will sound crazy but.....why the #$@%! hasn't Carbo changed the lines?

CArbo doesn't have the balls to switch up the lines because Kovalev and Samsonov don't want to be broken up.

I'm just happy people are starting to talk about Samsonov and not blame others for his lack of production.

[jordi]

EXactly

CArbo doesn't have the balls to switch up the lines because Kovalev and Samsonov don't want to be broken up.

I'm just happy people are starting to talk about Samsonov and not blame others for his lack of production.

So what you really mean is that you're happy people are blaming Samsonov for the recent Habs losses?

[kaos]

EXactly

CArbo doesn't have the balls to switch up the lines because Kovalev and Samsonov don't want to be broken up.

I don't agree with that at all. Carbonneau doesn't really have any choice. He can't break up the 1st or 3rd lines as they are really the only ones producing, or playing well. So thats leaves the choice of demoting Samsonov to the fourth line and replacing him with who??? Maybe Latendresse, that might work, if he was willing to shoot the puck...provided Kovalev would pass it too him. Don't even mention Begin, Murray or Downey as a second line forward.....thats not an option at all. And since They don't have room under the cap too keep minor leaguers up the choices are limited.

The only thing left to try is moving Higgins to second line centre and latendresse back to the 1st line. Carbo should atleast try it

[MAK]

The only thing left to try is moving Higgins to second line centre and latendresse back to the 1st line. Carbo should atleast try it

I would love to see (at least a for couple of games) samsonv playing with koivu and latendresse.

obviously, ryder has alot of trouble following the pace of the game and maybe some press box duty would light a fire under his arse. samsonov could use a lesson on how to drive to the net.

[Easy Ryder]

Patience is a luxury we had when the team was winning.

Now that we lost a few patience is gone and we want some offensive contribution from big bucks players.

And Samsonov is not producing on PP at 3.5 million.

The only way we can get rid of him is pick up some heavy cost garbages from other teams.

[ShortHanded]

I don't agree with that at all. Carbonneau doesn't really have any choice. He can't break up the 1st or 3rd lines as they are really the only ones producing, or playing well. So thats leaves the choice of demoting Samsonov to the fourth line and replacing him with who??? Maybe Latendresse, that might work, if he was willing to shoot the puck...provided Kovalev would pass it too him. Don't even mention Begin, Murray or Downey as a second line forward.....thats not an option at all. And since They don't have room under the cap too keep minor leaguers up the choices are limited.

The only thing left to try is moving Higgins to second line centre and latendresse back to the 1st line. Carbo should atleast try it

Except the first line ISN'T producing or really playing well right now. And I'd have to say that I think it's time to break up the third if it means improvements for the rest of the team too...

[Mont Royale]

Do you remember when we first acquired Kovalev from the Rangers? He couldn't buy a goal for the longest time, in fact I think his first and only goal for a while was an empty netter. Eventually he came around, but not before half the fans (yes, on this board too) whined about losing Marcel Hossa (who?) and were ready to ship "washed up" Kovy out for a bag of pucks.

Good players eventually come around, and even when he's slumping, you can see that there's too much talent to keep Sammy down for too long.

With Kovalev, the goal scoring drought you're referring to as the 'longest time' was 12 games. He got going when the playoffs started. (Incidentally, it was Balej we gave up for Kovy - an even bigger "who?" than Hossa.)

Sammy's slump has lasted 41 games now (42 played, less that one big game against Boston!). I'm all for having patience with a player, and maybe he will come around... but man oh man, it's painful to watch. I think virtually any one of the rookies would have outperformed him to this point if given his minutes, and with his salary, it's painful to think about, too.

I had doubts about Sammy right from the beginning, but have tried to remain optimistic (I've kept 'Mont Royale' instead of changing to 'SamsonovSucks', for example). I've gone from optimistic to hopeful to praying to tolerating, barely. I really wish he would do something (anything) to justify his paycheque. It scares me to think that we may not have enough cap room to sign both Souray and Markov because we're saddled with Sammy for another season...

[Chris]

I will defend him slightly, he does hustle every night, he alos is one of about 4 forwards not in the minus category. However he was brought here to produce and create offense which he really hasn't. Why can't Carbo break up the lines? The first line is pathetic, for whatever reason they don't catch much heat on this board, they are over a minus 20 combined, that is the team worst.

[Athlétique.Canadien]

"Our expectations need to be: Where is he going to be in February?" Gainey said of Samsonov.

"He will need time to adjust"

CBC article

Sorry about the subject of the article.

So, what part of:

"Our expectations need to be: Where is he going to be in February?"

...don't we understand?

But, nevermind BOb. Why do we go on and on about "Trust In Gainey or Bob"? (SARCASM)

Edited January 8, 2007 by ATHLÉTIQUE.CANADIEN

[Mont Royale]

So, what part of:

"Our expectations need to be: Where is he going to be in February?"

...don't we understand?

Of course we trust Bob. But all of us, even Bob, sometime need input from anonymous hockey forum posters to make important decisions.

[JMMR]

I will defend Samsonov he is trying out there when I watch him he wants to score and wants to make great plays, but as we all know he is not getting the bounces or the support it seems on way to many nights him and Kovalev are on a different page.

Samsonov is a +3 over the last month and has started to shoot the puck a lot more. He is not going to get traded this season and when the Habs make the playoffs I am going to go out on a limb here and say he is top three in points for Canadiens forwards and has 4 or 5 goals in the first round. (right or wrong. after the first round I will search for this post)

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

As others have noted, we can't trade him. No one will give us anything for him, or even take on his salary.

Putting him on the fourth line would serve no purpose other than to lower his production even further and possibly humilate/infuriate him to no good end.

He MUST be motivated, since he signed a 2-year deal specifically with the intention of re-establishing himself as an elite player, so as to cash in really big two years on.

And I've never heard a bad word said about his work ethic or commitment, in all his years in the NHL.

At 28 he's unlikely to be 'washed up,' at least physically.

Therefore, we can only ride this out and hope he gets better. But I agree that it won't happen until he gets new linemates.

(It may turn out to be simply a bad signing: not because Sammy sucks, but because he's the wrong 'fit', one too many players in the Koivu/Kovalev mode of smooth-skating playmakers. However, I think if he were to play with, say, Higgins or even Ryder, a turnaround might follow).

[Athlétique.Canadien]

...top three in points for Canadiens forwards and has 4 or 5 goals in the first round.

Yeah, I agree. It's amazing how many people forget that he once gave us playoff palpitations when he was with the B's. You can't teach that skill!

Anyone remember Petrov-Gilmour and Zednik in 2002? Petrov was shifty and dangerous. The type of player to cause havoc and he did.

Who does Petrov remind me of on the current roster, let me see? Sammy maybe? No?

So, who is going to start the dumpKovalev thread now?

PS. I'd like to see him play with Latendresse. Why not attempt to bring back the Sammy-Thornton attack? Lat's isn't Thornton but still, he's big and Sammy has set him up at least once already this year

Edited January 8, 2007 by ATHLÉTIQUE.CANADIEN

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

PS. I'd like to see him play with Latendresse. Why not attempt to bring back the Sammy-Thornton attack. Lat's isn't Thornton but still, he's big and Sammy has set him up at least once already this year

I second that emotion. It would be a worthwhile experiment, possibly great for both players.

[ShortHanded]

As others have noted, we can't trade him. No one will give us anything for him, or even take on his salary.

Putting him on the fourth line would serve no purpose other than to lower his production even further and possibly humilate/infuriate him to no good end.

He MUST be motivated, since he signed a 2-year deal specifically with the intention of re-establishing himself as an elite player, so as to cash in really big two years on.

And I've never heard a bad word said about his work ethic or commitment, in all his years in the NHL.

At 28 he's unlikely to be 'washed up,' at least physically.

Therefore, we can only ride this out and hope he gets better. But I agree that it won't happen until he gets new linemates.

(It may turn out to be simply a bad signing: not because Sammy sucks, but because he's the wrong 'fit', one too many players in the Koivu/Kovalev mode of smooth-skating playmakers. However, I think if he were to play with, say, Higgins or even Ryder, a turnaround might follow).

Completely agreed with everything you said.

PS. I'd like to see him play with Latendresse. Why not attempt to bring back the Sammy-Thornton attack. Lat's isn't Thornton but still, he's big and Sammy has set him up at least once already this year

Completely agreed with what you said too. We should try this. and we're stuck with the guy, so there's no point in trying to trade him, even for a bag of pucks...

[redondo]

With Kovalev, the goal scoring drought you're referring to as the 'longest time' was 12 games. He got going when the playoffs started. (Incidentally, it was Balej we gave up for Kovy - an even bigger "who?" than Hossa.)

Sammy's slump has lasted 41 games now (42 played, less that one big game against Boston!). I'm all for having patience with a player, and maybe he will come around... but man oh man, it's painful to watch. I think virtually any one of the rookies would have outperformed him to this point if given his minutes, and with his salary, it's painful to think about, too.

I had doubts about Sammy right from the beginning, but have tried to remain optimistic (I've kept 'Mont Royale' instead of changing to 'SamsonovSucks', for example). I've gone from optimistic to hopeful to praying to tolerating, barely. I really wish he would do something (anything) to justify his paycheque. It scares me to think that we may not have enough cap room to sign both Souray and Markov because we're saddled with Sammy for another season...

You're right, my bad, it was Balej + 1st. My point is that Samsonov's always been a streaky player, and as a few people pointed out he did fairly well in the playoffs last year, so I really don't think the book on him here is quite closed yet. Plus he has creativity - something I think we sorely lacked in the playoffs last year after Koivu went down.

This is a big part of why Gainey signed him - would he like to have that move back right about now? Possibly, probably, especially seeing how well our rookies have been doing. I hear your frustration, and I got some of my own, but I still have hopes for him to deliver on the promise, he's historically too good of a player not to.

[koivu-11]

You're right, my bad, it was Balej + 1st. My point is that Samsonov's always been a streaky player, and as a few people pointed out he did fairly well in the playoffs last year, so I really don't think the book on him here is quite closed yet. Plus he has creativity - something I think we sorely lacked in the playoffs last year after Koivu went down.

This is a big part of why Gainey signed him - would he like to have that move back right about now? Possibly, probably, especially seeing how well our rookies have been doing. I hear your frustration, and I got some of my own, but I still have hopes for him to deliver on the promise, he's historically too good of a player not to.

.....umm where Did u get Balej and a first..it was a second...

OK NOW THIS IS TO ALL SAMSONOV DUMPHIM PPL.

You know nothing about hockey NOR do you know anything about players nothing is all about stats. yes hes getting paid mayybe a lil to much BUT WHO CARES...hes doing what hes here to do, Insane stickhandleing and makes penalties against the other team, he creats chances and not to mention he can pass pretty nicely at the same time.

Hes got great vision and like i said before KOVALEV and PLEKANEC! are not JOE THORNTON

Samsonov hasn't givin up on the team he had that little stink when he was demoted but for how hes playing its been alright maybe a little more pressure on their players when he plays might be a little more effective.

in the end hes a good player we have him shut up and deal wit it.

[Tony]

There is a bit more than just his performance on the ice. This also has somewhat to do with a little UFA politics.

What kind of message does it send to all potential UFA guys that Bob will try to get this summer if he were to deal Samsonov? Sounds like an instant turn off for some guys.

[justintb]

Like so many others have said, I dont know why the F*ck Carbo has changed the lines!!!

It should be this!

Lats-Koivu-Kovalev

Samsonov-Higgins-Ryder

Perezhogin-Plekanek-Johnson

Streit-Lapierre- ?

It's obvious that the chemistry is not there between Samsonov and Kovalev. A little pet peeve of mine regarding Samsonov is that he doesn't make himself available in the spaces the little guys are supposed to. When Kovalev receives the breakout pass, Samsonov should be cutting across the red line to get a pass (for those of you who try to complain that it could lead to a suicide pass...Deal with it..these guys get paid to risk it all). He also is not strong enough to battle down low in the corners with the big defenders of other times, it results in too many turnovers. Therefore, the lines stated above would make the most sense since Lats and Ryder love doing the nitty gritty along the boards. My report card grades on Samsonov don't begin until April. Let's just pray that Carbo has the brains to think like all of us wanting the lines to be this way!

GO :hlogo: GO

[Athlétique.Canadien]

yes hes getting paid mayybe a lil to much

To the people who say we overpaid Sammy I say, "Ah, yeah that's what happens with UFA's, they take the highest bidder".

Of course he's overpaid & who cares?

[CoRvInA]

Like so many others have said, I dont know why the F*ck Carbo has changed the lines!!!

It should be this!

Lats-Koivu-Kovalev

Samsonov-Higgins-Ryder

Perezhogin-Plekanek-Johnson

Streit-Lapierre- ?

It's obvious that the chemistry is not there between Samsonov and Kovalev. A little pet peeve of mine regarding Samsonov is that he doesn't make himself available in the spaces the little guys are supposed to. When Kovalev receives the breakout pass, Samsonov should be cutting across the red line to get a pass (for those of you who try to complain that it could lead to a suicide pass...Deal with it..these guys get paid to risk it all). He also is not strong enough to battle down low in the corners with the big defenders of other times, it results in too many turnovers. Therefore, the lines stated above would make the most sense since Lats and Ryder love doing the nitty gritty along the boards. My report card grades on Samsonov don't begin until April. Let's just pray that Carbo has the brains to think like all of us wanting the lines to be this way!

GO :hlogo: GO

I would be content with Samsonov playing like Martin St louis was playing at the beginning of the season...

Yes St louis thats what he should be like.. I agree He's the speedy forward on that line .... He should be doing what Grabovsky was acheiving in two nights in a row!

I've almost given up on samsonov and ###### if it will scare other future UFA... he has screwed us on the fact his trade value right now is SHITZEL ... package him with Ryder and a prospect for a on the down (proven) centre

[Prime Minister Koivu]

As Far as I'm concerned it doesn't really matter what line Samsonov is playing on. I just want the guy moved, first line or third line.

He plays hard, skates fast and is anything but a slouch.

I will agree with Kaos in the fact that at a time there wasn't another position for him as the other lines were kicking ass. Things are obviously different now with Ryder, Higgins, Johnson and Perezhogin (what ever their role is) just aren't putting up the points.

This is Carbos problem, his first real challenge this season as the Habs head coach.

[CoRvInA]

Has Samsonov played another position before? I'm sure he should be able to play RW no?

[Hicks-Rated73]

Samsonov looks horrible on the ice this season, and how can you blame his linemates? The Samsonov i remember that played with Boston awhile ago was a high speed dynamic at times player who'd score some highlight reel goals and help create offense for his linemates!.....Sure he's on a line with Kovalev who loves to hang onto the puck himself maybe sometimes too much, but where does Samsonov be? Kovy could put the puck on his stick every single time if he was in the right spot, and then when he does pass it to Sammy he must be thinkin why the hell did i give him the puck, he flicks it at the goalie far worst then a pee wee player would.....He's suppose to be a speedster in this new NHL, but wheres the Speed? I dont see half the speed that he's shown in the past! IMO when he's trying to skate up the ice it looks like he's killing himself like someone who's not in shape!...This guy really has to turn it around and prove us all wrong, and i hope he does, He definitely Could be a great player for us......

Go HABS Go!.... :hlogo:

And come on Samsonov before i :puke:

[KoZed]

There is a bit more than just his performance on the ice. This also has somewhat to do with a little UFA politics.

What kind of message does it send to all potential UFA guys that Bob will try to get this summer if he were to deal Samsonov? Sounds like an instant turn off for some guys.

I was about to add that. You nailed that one right on the head.