hab29RETIRED Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 No way I'd move a guy ready to break out, in favour if a guy who is going to start his decline over the next year or two. That goes for Pleks and Sharp. We have been dying for two big centres, and with Eller and Galchenyuk, we finally have them. I don't get the desire to move a guy who was our most productive centre in the playoffs. I'd move DD, before Eller. No way do I move youth for a guy who had a career year at 31. I think this year's move so far have been more addition by subtraction. Moving Gorges and letting Murrey and Bouillon go allow us to give our kids more if a chance. Having said that, I really wish we had packaged Gorges with pleks to get a big, skilled winger. Hell, even though we are unlikely trading partners, with Spezza wanting out, I wish we would have checked with the Sens about a bobby Ryan for pleks/gorges. The other guy, I wish we would have made a play for is Kane. I'm not a parenteau fan, and don't like the extra year, but Briere was useless the way he was being used and that wasn't going to change this year. As much as everyone is in love with MB, I really wish Nill had said yes to the Habs. It's amazing what he has done in Dallas. I'd sacrifice Eller anyday if we can keep Plekanec for 3-4 more seasons. I made it pretty clear on July 1st, I don't believe that we upgraded our roster one bit this summer. At any position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 We were lucky last year and are lucky again this year by just how weak the east has become. The only team that really improved are the lightning. Really? I would think we are more balanced at d, Parenteau may do much better then Briere(?) and the kids are all older and a young LH d will make the roster in Oct, maybe 2? And Price has convinced every last person I can think of that he is one of top goalies in league, no question. So seems a bright future and deep playoff run should be goal, unlike last fall when I (and vast majority of Habfans) thought they would battle just to make playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoRP Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Although Sharp would look good as a Hab, he is getting on in his career, and I wouldn't trade Plekanec or Eller in on him, too much lost at center in case of injury,like someone mentioned. If it was Beaulieu and a 1st, yeah I'd probably do that because we have defense depth, and a good young core, but to give up Eller or Plek is taking away too much from the middle, and we can't afford it. Maybe for a player with Kane's potential and talent(with a brain transplant) it might be a different story. I don't agree the team was not improved this off season, the addition by subtraction idea from 29Retired is bang on if ya ask me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stogey24 Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 No way I'd move a guy ready to break out, in favour if a guy who is going to start his decline over the next year or two. That goes for Pleks and Sharp. We have been dying for two big centres, and with Eller and Galchenyuk, we finally have them. I don't get the desire to move a guy who was our most productive centre in the playoffs. I'd move DD, before Eller. No way do I move youth for a guy who had a career year at 31. I think this year's move so far have been more addition by subtraction. Moving Gorges and letting Murrey and Bouillon go allow us to give our kids more if a chance. Having said that, I really wish we had packaged Gorges with pleks to get a big, skilled winger. Hell, even though we are unlikely trading partners, with Spezza wanting out, I wish we would have checked with the Sens about a bobby Ryan for pleks/gorges. The other guy, I wish we would have made a play for is Kane. I'm not a parenteau fan, and don't like the extra year, but Briere was useless the way he was being used and that wasn't going to change this year. As much as everyone is in love with MB, I really wish Nill had said yes to the Habs. It's amazing what he has done in Dallas. Are you serious? M.B just took this team to the conference finals and was also a finalist for G.M of the year. Just because you can make a couple blockbuster trades, doesn't make you a good G.M. Look at the youth coming up in this organization. Its finally a time where we can be excited for the future of this team. M.B has a strategy, and its fairly realistic- build within. It may not be the most exciting way, but it creates a well balanced organization, where you don't have to rely on 2-3 guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeLassister Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Really? I would think we are more balanced at d, Parenteau may do much better then Briere(?) and the kids are all older and a young LH d will make the roster in Oct, maybe 2? And Price has convinced every last person I can think of that he is one of top goalies in league, no question. So seems a bright future and deep playoff run should be goal, unlike last fall when I (and vast majority of Habfans) thought they would battle just to make playoffs. Who cares if Parenteau do much better than Brière ? Parenteau will most likely play in Vanek's spot, not Brière's. Will Malhotra do better than Brière. Cuz this is the real question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 I didn't say MB is doing a bad job - compared to Gainey/gauthier he is Sam pollack. But I don't think he has been ruthless enough. We got where we did because the Eastern conference is pretty weak. Nill came and dumped Ribeiro, despite not having much depth at centre and brought in a FRANCHISE centre who will be a star for the next 10 year. He added another big centre this year, without giving up a lot. He now has arguably the best one two punch at centre in the league. He's made one mistake (gonchar). Are you serious? M.B just took this team to the conference finals and was also a finalist for G.M of the year. Just because you can make a couple blockbuster trades, doesn't make you good G.M. Look at the youth coming up in this organization. Its finally a time where we can be excited for the future of this team. M.B has a strategy, and its fairly realistic- build within. It may not be the most exciting way, but it creates a well balanced organization. Where you don't have to rely on 2-3 guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Nill has done a great job in Dallas, though his defence is still incredibly suspect and there's very little options on the free market for the next three years. He's going to have to start moving some of his prospects or forwards to get the defence he needs to contend in the West. Montreal is strong in all three positions. They just need to look at how they can get even stronger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICEWATER77 Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 any trade involving our future for Patrick sharp is ludicrous. he may have another 78 point season...and then what? a slow and steady decline. you just don't sell the farm for a 31 year old that's had one decent season. no thanks bud, and besides, we're already pretty set at lw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted July 15, 2014 Author Share Posted July 15, 2014 any trade involving our future for Patrick sharp is ludicrous. he may have another 78 point season...and then what? a slow and steady decline. you just don't sell the farm for a 31 year old that's had one decent season. no thanks bud, and besides, we're already pretty set at lw. One decent season? He has eclipsed the 60 point plateau 5 times in the last 7 years (one of the years he didn't was the lockout-shortened 2012-13 season). In the last six full seasons, he has had 25 or more goals in each. That's far from having just one decent season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 You get Sharp you get a first rate first line forward. To acquire a first rate, first line forward like Sharp, you need to give up something the Chicago Blackhawks would want more than Patrick Sharp. What do they want? Cap space and to keep being a Cup contender. What does a team have to provide them? A player or collection of players with less of a cap hit but the potential to be what Sharp was to Chicago. I also think Sharp will still have two years playing at first rate, first line quality before dropping off. I'd have zero issue letting go of Eller to get Sharp, but I'd be weary on Eller and Beaulieu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICEWATER77 Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 You get Sharp you get a first rate first line forward. To acquire a first rate, first line forward like Sharp, you need to give up something the Chicago Blackhawks would want more than Patrick Sharp. What do they want? Cap space and to keep being a Cup contender. What does a team have to provide them? A player or collection of players with less of a cap hit but the potential to be what Sharp was to Chicago. I also think Sharp will still have two years playing at first rate, first line quality before dropping off. I'd have zero issue letting go of Eller to get Sharp, but I'd be weary on Eller and Beaulieu. eller will give you another 10 years..and a smooth skating defenseman like beaulieu, maybe 20..granted we don't know exactly how good either player will become, but i'd be a little more patient with both. and its quite possible that sharps better days may be behind him. scott gomez had similar numbers and age when we traded for him. lets not make that mistake again..you don't make trades just for trades sake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 eller will give you another 10 years..and a smooth skating defenseman like beaulieu, maybe 20..granted we don't know exactly how good either player will become, but i'd be a little more patient with both. and its quite possible that sharps better days may be behind him. scott gomez had similar numbers and age when we traded for him. lets not make that mistake again..you don't make trades just for trades sake. I don't see any guarantee in 10 years of Eller, much like I never saw 10 years in Andrei Kostitsyn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICEWATER77 Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 I don't see any guarantee in 10 years of Eller, much like I never saw 10 years in Andrei Kostitsyn. yes, but eller was never a lazy slob though. the guy was our best forward in playoffs. I think he's ready to bust out this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 But all of Eller & Beaulieu's stuff you talk about is wishful thinking and fingers crossed fantasy stuff. Sharp is top notch right now and signed for 3 years @ $5.9m isn't same as Gomer boat anchor of a contract. Habs have plenty of d-prospects and might be able to deal Eller with little offensive impact? Aint happening, but as Vanek did, an impact forward can make a big difference in production and add depth to allow loading up 3 good lines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stogey24 Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 But all of Eller & Beaulieu's stuff you talk about is wishful thinking and fingers crossed fantasy stuff. Sharp is top notch right now and signed for 3 years @ $5.9m isn't same as Gomer boat anchor of a contract. Habs have plenty of d-prospects and might be able to deal Eller with little offensive impact? Aint happening, but as Vanek did, an impact forward can make a big difference in production and add depth to allow loading up 3 good lines. Montreal gave up nothing for Vanek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Personally, I think this organization really needs Beaulieu to become at the very least a top-4 defenceman. Markov is nearing the end, and we'll need another rushing D-man - preferably an affordable one - pretty soon. That's Beaulieu. Trading him for Sharp seems like a "WIN NOW!!" kind of move, and I'd prefer to see the Habs building to be an elite team for years, not shipping out key parts of the future for a 1-2 year window. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovett's Magnatones Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Montreal gave up nothing for Vanek He gave up nothing, and I doubt he would let Eller or a first go for a rental. There's always the option of getting a rental next year. The team is shaping up well, ready to enter the first tier, but I don't think we'll see them go "all in" like Pittsburgh last year until the 15/16 deadline at the very earliest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Montreal gave up nothing for Vanek 2nd and Collberg aint nothing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stogey24 Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 2nd and Collberg aint nothing Its a lot less than Eller, Beaulieu and a first for Sharp. I know Colleberg is young, but he's undersized. I could be wrong, but I doubt we'll miss him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Not sure how you even compare or why you would try and compare the 2 deals? I don't get it? Totally different situations. But the pick they gave away is a big USA d-man who you will see at world juniors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stogey24 Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Not sure how you even compare or why you would try and compare the 2 deals? I don't get it? Totally different situations. But the pick they gave away is a big USA d-man who you will see at world juniors. You said adding an impact player can make the difference and I agree. There is a difference when you acquire an impact player for a prospect and a conditional second round pick. Compared to trading a top 6 centre(Eller), a potential top 4 D-man with a high ceiling(Beaulieu), and a first round pick; as you had said you would trade for sharp. That's a crippling trade for Montreal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Crippling is a bit much and I don't see it like that at all, but you could be somewhat correct, but got to roll the dice sometimes. All I really disagreed with is trading couple spare parts for a Rental (Vanek) vs trading for an borderline All-Star forward for 3 more years, not even same ballpark (as I see it). But, by my count I also see Habs with 15 forwards (if count Sekac), of course depth is nice but cant have 4 players in pressbox (with 7th-d also) all year can you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard09 Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Personally, I think this organization really needs Beaulieu to become at the very least a top-4 defenceman. Markov is nearing the end, and we'll need another rushing D-man - preferably an affordable one - pretty soon. That's Beaulieu. Trading him for Sharp seems like a "WIN NOW!!" kind of move, and I'd prefer to see the Habs building to be an elite team for years, not shipping out key parts of the future for a 1-2 year window. I agree, just look how good Montreal's D would be if bone headed Gomez deal was not made. Gomez did nothing for the team, and now the Habs will pay for years. I don't think that they should help the Chicago by helping them with cap space, give them a top 9 forward and a top d prospec, for a guy that is 32 and will only play a few more season and most likely will not be as productive. If MB makes that deal he should resign. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard09 Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 You said adding an impact player can make the difference and I agree. There is a difference when you acquire an impact player for a prospect and a conditional second round pick. Compared to trading a top 6 centre(Eller), a potential top 4 D-man with a high ceiling(Beaulieu), and a first round pick; as you had said you would trade for sharp. That's a crippling trade for Montreal. I agree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICEWATER77 Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Crippling is a bit much and I don't see it like that at all, but you could be somewhat correct, but got to roll the dice sometimes. All I really disagreed with is trading couple spare parts for a Rental (Vanek) vs trading for an borderline All-Star forward for 3 more years, not even same ballpark (as I see it). But, by my count I also see Habs with 15 forwards (if count Sekac), of course depth is nice but cant have 4 players in pressbox (with 7th-d also) all year can you? don, are u even old enough to remember the chelios for savard fiasco? that trade had a laaaasting affect on the organization in the most negative way possible! chelios went on to win a few Norris trophies, several Stanley cups, and played almost 20 more seasons! what the hell did we get outta savard? zip..so believe me, because it's the last time i'm going to comment on it : the habs are done making "quick fix" deals. you don't sacrifice the future for somebody that may give you a year or 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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