JMMR Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 Who knows? Hopefully he puts up big offensive numbers and remains healthy "knock on wood" and earns a big contract. The Habs will have to keep him maybe the cap will be 50 million by then haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 On TSN, they say that it's 4.75M$/year for 3 years. Glad that he's staying, but that's a lot of money for a guy is qualiber Another long-term hit on our cap Honestly, I have mixed fillings about this contract. BG won't be too active on the UFA market this summer....unless Theo gets traded... Agreed. Gainey has proven to be a little generous when signing contracts. He doesn't deserve over 4M for sure. But then again, he's our captain and has been for years. But man, that was a hit to the cap. We won't have room to sign anyone new because Koivu got so much. Gainey better have something up his sleeve because I believe that this was one of Gainey's worst moves so far. Not Gainey bashing by the way, I'm still a fan of his. :hlogo: The leafs just signed Kaberle for 5 years at 4.25 million/season. Maybe saks is underpaid? JFJ is an idiot. With Sundin and Belfour getting paid like Kings, they might not be able to resign McCabe. But then again, Allison, Czerkawski and Lindros are on 1-year deals. I'll laugh if JFJ resigns Czerkawski. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortcat1 Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 I don't understand the relative values of all these players in the league. In the end, it seems so subjective and so fluid that it's almost impossible to give a realistic financial response to situations like these. In so far as I understand, Koivu is a leader and our team needs leaders. He's an positive role model and our team needs positive role models. Also, strict 'business' considerations aside, it would be good to see this man play his whole career behind the CH crest. Our sport is too full of monetarily motivated movement. (In the way it always has been but not near as much as it is right now. By the way, baseball is an extremely bad example of this display of lack of loyalty.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbhatt Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 Watching Koivu half-ass it for most of that game tonight, and seeing him take yet another stupid penalty in the offensive zone, I have to wonder why he got that contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 I don't understand the relative values of all these players in the league. In the end, it seems so subjective and so fluid that it's almost impossible to give a realistic financial response to situations like these. In so far as I understand, Koivu is a leader and our team needs leaders. He's an positive role model and our team needs positive role models. Also, strict 'business' considerations aside, it would be good to see this man play his whole career behind the CH crest. Our sport is too full of monetarily motivated movement. (In the way it always has been but not near as much as it is right now. By the way, baseball is an extremely bad example of this display of lack of loyalty.) Hey, you're back! Anyways, I'm starting to dislike this contract more and more. Koivu gets worse and worse every game. Hopefully it's just a slump. To all you guys who say we trade Theodore and then jump on the UFA market well Huet is proving to be a legit (and very good) starter and Danis will be ready to be a back-up next season. Heck, Danis is also almost ready to become a starter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PMAC Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 Hey, you're back! Anyways, I'm starting to dislike this contract more and more. Koivu gets worse and worse every game. Hopefully it's just a slump. To all you guys who say we trade Theodore and then jump on the UFA market well Huet is proving to be a legit (and very good) starter and Danis will be ready to be a back-up next season. Heck, Danis is also almost ready to become a starter. BTH, as to your other post its not about what we think Koivu "deserves" it has to do with what he can get on the open market. There are plenty of teams that would be happy to have SK at this price. All of these supposed " first- line centres" everyone is always blathering about(not necessarily you) make between 5-7 million per year. The continuity of the organization is key. I'm sure Bob will continue to turn over a small number of players each season as he builds the Habs towards the goal of being perrenial contenders. Give Koivu time... you don't get over a flu in two days. If it wasnt such a crucial game he proably wouldnt even have played. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaos Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 Wow, I think this contract is a little too generous for a guy who is always hurt, and doesn't put up a point a game. This contract is really going to hurt in a few years time. Just eats up too much cap room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 BTH, as to your other post its not about what we think Koivu "deserves" it has to do with what he can get on the open market. There are plenty of teams that would be happy to have SK at this price. All of these supposed " first- line centres" everyone is always blathering about(not necessarily you) make between 5-7 million per year. The continuity of the organization is key. I'm sure Bob will continue to turn over a small number of players each season as he builds the Habs towards the goal of being perrenial contenders. Give Koivu time... you don't get over a flu in two days. If it wasnt such a crucial game he proably wouldnt even have played. I don't think any GM in his right mind would offer Koivu $5.7M. If that's what first-line centers get than Koivu must not be a first-line center. He's a little closer to a second-line center or a 1b. The problem is we don't have a 1a. I really doubt that Koivu would have even gotten 4.75M on the open market or even 4M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 I may have misunderstood (as I was enjoying some tasty beer) but on the news lastnight they were talking about this signing. It seems that saks will only make 5 million per season. The .75 (750,000) is an incentive bonus. I do not know what the target is to get the bonus. Probably points or games played. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 Koivu is making 4.5M per season with a 250K signing bonus during each of those years. He also has a no-trade clause. Pretty much he<s making the same amount as Kovalev and both contracts end at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smon Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 Koivu deserves a no-trade clause. I'd have to agree that the cap value of the contract seems excessive, however. Perhaps it's a good thing that Gainey is not spending much on UFAs here; it was him who in Dallas enormously overpaid for Donald Audette, Pierre Turgeon and Phillippe Boucher. He managed to dump Audette on us, but Turgeon was a Star till this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 Gotta roll my eyes at half the crap written in here. Koivu, when surrounded by proper personnel (meaning he gets first line wingers, not second line guys - the only way to get Ribs to do anything useful was to give him the Russian pair, and having a REAL second line behind him), will bring you at least a point-per-game. It can be argued, of course, but Gainey obviously believes it, and frankly, I think it's pretty damned evident. But what Koivu brings to the table doesn't stop there. I laughed at whomever said that Koivu played half-assed last night - because his style of play and what he brings to each shift is a huge element in the $$ figure that Gainey gave to him. Koivu is a Gainey type of player. He brings it every shift. He's a heart-and-soul guy and if you look around the NHL, I think you'd have a *very* hard time finding more than a handful of that type of player. You have to build your team around someone, so why not someone with skills who has your team tattooed on his heart? But even that isn't the full story. Gainey was the captain of this franshise for a good number of years, and you'd think he'd have a pretty good idea of what type of player and person would make a great leader. Now, I kow the French media absolutely *love* to show their abject ignorance and fervent wish that Ribeiro be recognized as the Number One Player In Hockey as he so obviously is (someone please collect my eyes, they rolled right out of my head), but I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest to the fans that perhaps we should be listening to what Gainey is saying with regards to hockey, and not what Demers and Pedneault are bellowing. (Anyone else getting a little tired of Pedneault praising Ribs for every tiny little thing he does while slapping Koivu for even a marginal play? Thanks for the unbiased commentary you waste of food for starving people in Africa.) This kind of leadership - the heart tattooed with the CH and the consistently high calibre of play - is a rare gem in hockey, and it most definitely factors into the dollar figure that Koivu is getting? Now, add to that the fact that the cap is going up by quite a bit (potentially to $46M) and the number makes perfect sense. It's exactly the same as signing him for $4 million under the current cap rules, which most of the whiners seemed to agree was at the top of the "fair" scale for resigning him. Perhaps the best news of all in this signing is that we finally get to keep a class act and solid player in Montreal rather than having him run out of town by the French media and drunken boo-birds. And a no-trade clause to boot; brilliance. Maybe all those people who think Ribs should be the King (read: Queen) of the Universe will cease to be fans when Ribs leaves via the front door over the summer (can't get rid of Bonk with his salary/talent combo (and who also has size), Plex is a kid with upside - and Gainey said we'll win with the kids, and that means that when Gainey goes looking for another centre, it will be Ribs taking the fall, bu-bye) and we can therefore enjoy the Habs without listening to the nonsense rhetoric from the uneducated boors who try to run the team from their TV's (hello 110% and RDS) and on their backs at the top of the stands (hic). This is *by far* the best move Gainey has done since stepping in and proves once and for all that he's committed to winning in Montreal, and not letting the wannabe's rule the show from the sidelines. In fact, I'd go as far as to say this is the most refreshing news to come out of Montreal in a good long time. (Anyone else have a good laugh at RDS who couldn't even mention it until the very end of the second intermission, while the resignings of Ribeiro and Theodore were highlight quality stuff? "How dare they resign that non-French captain who isn't half as good as Ribeiro and can't even hold Theo's Propecia-covered cap!" (And what idiot, by the way, wears a HAT when they're worried about losing hair! Hey Theo, here's yer sign.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fanpuck33 Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 Koivu deserves a no-trade clause. I'd have to agree that the cap value of the contract seems excessive, however. Perhaps it's a good thing that Gainey is not spending much on UFAs here; it was him who in Dallas enormously overpaid for Donald Audette, Pierre Turgeon and Phillippe Boucher. He managed to dump Audette on us, but Turgeon was a Star till this season. Check out Boucher's numbers. Decent offensive numbers, but great +/- in his time in Dallas, even last season, when the Star really struggled. And when you talk about Turgeon, you have to look at the role he played. Most of the time, he was playing on the 3rd line, so he wasn't exactly playing tons of offense. As for Koivu, I'm glad to have him signed. Not many guys these days stay committed to a team for this long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smon Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 True, but with the salary Turgeon was getting paid..the performance didn't really equate. And on Boucher, that's correct, he is a solid contributor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalHab Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 Gotta roll my eyes at half the crap written in here. Koivu, when surrounded by proper personnel (meaning he gets first line wingers, not second line guys - the only way to get Ribs to do anything useful was to give him the Russian pair, and having a REAL second line behind him), will bring you at least a point-per-game. It can be argued, of course, but Gainey obviously believes it, and frankly, I think it's pretty damned evident. But what Koivu brings to the table doesn't stop there. I laughed at whomever said that Koivu played half-assed last night - because his style of play and what he brings to each shift is a huge element in the $$ figure that Gainey gave to him. Koivu is a Gainey type of player. He brings it every shift. He's a heart-and-soul guy and if you look around the NHL, I think you'd have a *very* hard time finding more than a handful of that type of player. You have to build your team around someone, so why not someone with skills who has your team tattooed on his heart? But even that isn't the full story. Gainey was the captain of this franshise for a good number of years, and you'd think he'd have a pretty good idea of what type of player and person would make a great leader. Now, I kow the French media absolutely *love* to show their abject ignorance and fervent wish that Ribeiro be recognized as the Number One Player In Hockey as he so obviously is (someone please collect my eyes, they rolled right out of my head), but I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest to the fans that perhaps we should be listening to what Gainey is saying with regards to hockey, and not what Demers and Pedneault are bellowing. (Anyone else getting a little tired of Pedneault praising Ribs for every tiny little thing he does while slapping Koivu for even a marginal play? Thanks for the unbiased commentary you waste of food for starving people in Africa.) This kind of leadership - the heart tattooed with the CH and the consistently high calibre of play - is a rare gem in hockey, and it most definitely factors into the dollar figure that Koivu is getting? Now, add to that the fact that the cap is going up by quite a bit (potentially to $46M) and the number makes perfect sense. It's exactly the same as signing him for $4 million under the current cap rules, which most of the whiners seemed to agree was at the top of the "fair" scale for resigning him. Perhaps the best news of all in this signing is that we finally get to keep a class act and solid player in Montreal rather than having him run out of town by the French media and drunken boo-birds. And a no-trade clause to boot; brilliance. Maybe all those people who think Ribs should be the King (read: Queen) of the Universe will cease to be fans when Ribs leaves via the front door over the summer (can't get rid of Bonk with his salary/talent combo (and who also has size), Plex is a kid with upside - and Gainey said we'll win with the kids, and that means that when Gainey goes looking for another centre, it will be Ribs taking the fall, bu-bye) and we can therefore enjoy the Habs without listening to the nonsense rhetoric from the uneducated boors who try to run the team from their TV's (hello 110% and RDS) and on their backs at the top of the stands (hic). This is *by far* the best move Gainey has done since stepping in and proves once and for all that he's committed to winning in Montreal, and not letting the wannabe's rule the show from the sidelines. In fact, I'd go as far as to say this is the most refreshing news to come out of Montreal in a good long time. (Anyone else have a good laugh at RDS who couldn't even mention it until the very end of the second intermission, while the resignings of Ribeiro and Theodore were highlight quality stuff? "How dare they resign that non-French captain who isn't half as good as Ribeiro and can't even hold Theo's Propecia-covered cap!" (And what idiot, by the way, wears a HAT when they're worried about losing hair! Hey Theo, here's yer sign.) Great read Colin.....Couldn't have said it better myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazy26 Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 ...This is *by far* the best move Gainey has done since stepping in and proves once and for all that he's committed to winning in Montreal, and not letting the wannabe's rule the show from the sidelines. In fact, I'd go as far as to say this is the most refreshing news to come out of Montreal in a good long time. (Anyone else have a good laugh at RDS who couldn't even mention it until the very end of the second intermission, while the resignings of Ribeiro and Theodore were highlight quality stuff? "How dare they resign that non-French captain who isn't half as good as Ribeiro and can't even hold Theo's Propecia-covered cap!" (And what idiot, by the way, wears a HAT when they're worried about losing hair! Hey Theo, here's yer sign.) Anyone that thinks that wearing a hat causes baldness is, in fact, an old wife. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonus Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 i dunno... i know a lot of bald guys who wear hats Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strummerman Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 Dont like it Koivu has won nothing neither has Theo, just for past performance Kovy should get his millions- Theo had one MVP and it looks like it was horseshoe year- Koivu is injured every year big mistake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 i dunno... i know a lot of bald guys who wear hats Yeah bald guys tend to wear hats or a toupee! Did anyone see the political cartoon of Theo pulling his hair out. If someone has it could they post it on this thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vaness_habs Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 Saku 3 more years in Mtl !! Oh yeah It's a lot of money but i think he deserves it !! He's just to great We just can hope that he wont be wounded haha Go Captain Koivu !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 Welcome Vaness. Member 1250 nice round number. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 Dont like it Koivu has won nothing neither has Theo, just for past performance Kovy should get his millions- Theo had one MVP and it looks like it was horseshoe year- Koivu is injured every year big mistake And Detroit should NEVER EVER have resigned that forward guy who was their captain - he never did win a damn thing... what was his name? Quiet guy, did all his talking in his play... hmmm.. Steve Yzerman? OH WAIT! He did win eventually when they put quality around him! And suddenly, he was also called one of the best leaders in the game! And you know who else is injured every year? Yeah, half the talented players in the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoZed Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 And Detroit should NEVER EVER have resigned that forward guy who was their captain - he never did win a damn thing... what was his name? Quiet guy, did all his talking in his play... hmmm.. Steve Yzerman? OH WAIT! He did win eventually when they put quality around him! And suddenly, he was also called one of the best leaders in the game! And you know who else is injured every year? Yeah, half the talented players in the game. Actually, Yzerman was good even when Detroit had a so-so team. Same goes for his clone (Sakic). Both could actually make winners of their respective teams. They are true franchise players, because they could carry their franchise even when they had little support around them. We're talking about top-end players who could score goals all by themselves if they had to. Can't compare Saku with those two future Hall-of-Famers. Saku is more like a Doug Weight/Doug Gilmour type of player. Can't really do much damage unless he has goal-scorers to feed... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 Actually, Yzerman was good even when Detroit had a so-so team. Same goes for his clone (Sakic). Both could actually make winners of their respective teams. They are true franchise players, because they could carry their franchise even when they had little support around them. We're talking about top-end players who could score goals all by themselves if they had to. Can't compare Saku with those two future Hall-of-Famers. Saku is more like a Doug Weight/Doug Gilmour type of player. Can't really do much damage unless he has goal-scorers to feed... You mean like when Saku played for the AHL Canadiens a couple of years back and made everyone so good that the team actually made the playoffs? You remember the stellar talent, right? Juha Lind? Johan Witehall? Yzerman and Sakic never had it that bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoZed Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 You mean like when Saku played for the AHL Canadiens a couple of years back and made everyone so good that the team actually made the playoffs? You remember the stellar talent, right? Juha Lind? Johan Witehall? Yzerman and Sakic never had it that bad. ???? Lind and Witehall? That was 2000-2001. Habs finished 7th to last that season and picked Komisarek that season! Never made the playoffs. You must be thinking of 2001-2002... when Koivu had cancer and played a grand total of 3 regular season games. You know, the season where Theodore got Hart and Vezina? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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