Would you trade Souray?

[habs_25th]

Souray and Markov the backbone of the D? Awesome tandem and a solid core that you can count on for years to come. I like that idea.

[BCHabnut]

OK, maybe we can't trade him... haha. I just watched Souray score his 20th. WOOOT

[sbhatt]

His price just keeps on going up.

[beliveau1]

I was talking about Jetssniper an admitted Habs hater as for the glint in my father's eye I remember seeing Beliveau play and your a disgrace using his id and dishing on Souray.

Glad you did - I think he was the classiest player and the finest gentleman this game has ever known. And I go back well past that era too.... I was old enough to be a Canadiens fan when he was still playing in Quebec City. So I still was probably there before the glint came into his eye?

And for the record, I like Souray. I know what he contributes to this team and have an appreciation for what he brings to the table. I happen to disagree on your appraisal of his value as far as a trade goes. As a fan of this team I appreciate what he has contributed in his time here. One side of me would like to see him stay - with a better defensive cast I think he would be a valuable asset on the powerplay which has become such a major part of the new NHL? But if he's about to leave and management senses this, then I hope they milk him for every ounce of talent they can get in return. I say amen if some sucker overpays for him!

However I see him as a good second pairing defenseman, not a top 2 on any team, and he is out of his element in Montreal on the top unit. I'm not a blindly led fan with rose coloured glasses. I have a long background as a coach and manager in high level competitive hockey, so that is not a part of my approach to the game. I've learned to never over rate a players true talent or contributions to any team. Yes I am passionate about the Canadiens, but I don't over estimate the value of a player. Nor am I blind to the weaknesses this team might have like many fans are.

So plain and simple, I'm not dissing Souray in any way. Never was my intention.

Obviously we simply disagree on what he might get in return - so be it. I can live with that. Hopefully you can too?

As for my being a disgrace to Beliveau... if I wrote down in this post what I'm thinking about you for that insinuation about my character right now I'd be banned!!!!! Therefore I'll leave my thoughts unexpressed like a gentleman should.

My apologies for the comment about 'Habhater' - I didn't pick up the fact that it was apparently directed at one individual? Your post seemed to say otherwise. My misunderstanding, so apology extended for that.....

I'm a Canadiens fan thru & thru my man.

[beliveau1]

Trolling HFBoardsman strikes again.

Yeah seems like there have been a few of these around the past couple of days?

[Strummerman]

Glad you did - I think he was the classiest player and the finest gentleman this game has ever known. And I go back well past that era too.... I was old enough to be a Canadiens fan when he was still playing in Quebec City. So I still was probably there before the glint came into his eye?

And for the record, I like Souray. I know what he contributes to this team and have an appreciation for what he brings to the table. I happen to disagree on your appraisal of his value as far as a trade goes. As a fan of this team I appreciate what he has contributed in his time here. One side of me would like to see him stay - with a better defensive cast I think he would be a valuable asset on the powerplay which has become such a major part of the new NHL? But if he's about to leave and management senses this, then I hope they milk him for every ounce of talent they can get in return. I say amen if some sucker overpays for him!

However I see him as a good second pairing defenseman, not a top 2 on any team, and he is out of his element in Montreal on the top unit. I'm not a blindly led fan with rose coloured glasses. I have a long background as a coach and manager in high level competitive hockey, so that is not a part of my approach to the game. I've learned to never over rate a players true talent or contributions to any team. Yes I am passionate about the Canadiens, but I don't over estimate the value of a player. Nor am I blind to the weaknesses this team might have like many fans are.

So plain and simple, I'm not dissing Souray in any way. Never was my intention.

Obviously we simply disagree on what he might get in return - so be it. I can live with that. Hopefully you can too?

As for my being a disgrace to Beliveau... if I wrote down in this post what I'm thinking about you for that insinuation about my character right now I'd be banned!!!!! Therefore I'll leave my thoughts unexpressed like a gentleman should.

My apologies for the comment about 'Habhater' - I didn't pick up the fact that it was apparently directed at one individual? Your post seemed to say otherwise. My misunderstanding, so apology extended for that.....

I'm a Canadiens fan thru & thru my man.

I hope you think as little of me as I think of you. As for Souray being a second line or third line defenceman, you are obviously lost in the old NHL. Look at tonight's game. What made the difference? the Powerplay? Souray is invaluable as a powerplay quarterback with a lethal shot. That is why you would never be hired in the new NHL as even a waterboy. Defencemen with 20 goals are few and far between

Anyways other than that have a good night.

Edited February 18, 2007 by Strummerman

[Chris]

Yep, he is also minus 16 or 17. and has like 8 more points then i do when he plays against the same amount of people.

He looked great on those 2 turnovers that led directly to goals.

[Strummerman]

Yep, he is also minus 16 or 17. and has like 8 more points then i do when he plays against the same amount of people.

He looked great on those 2 turnovers that led directly to goals.

The magic word is powerplay, the Hurricanes had 2 powerplay goals. In the new NHL powerplay execution is what counts.

At the end of December the Canadiens had a minus overall in +- and were fourth overall in their Division. It was their powerplay that made the difference and one Sheldon Souray

Edited February 18, 2007 by Strummerman

[Peter Puck]

I like Souray and would like to keep him. But he needs to be signed. If we can't sign him we should trade him. Even though there has been lots of dissing of Souray here, the fact remains that there are a few teams with a shot at the cup that would give up a prospect and a pick at least for him. Maybe quite a bit more when teams start to get desperate at the deadline.

I can only see 2 reasons why we wouldn't trade him:

1) Gainey thinks he makes the difference in making the playoffs or missing them or else he thinks Souray will allow us to go deep in the playoffs.

2) We have a good chance to resign him but Gainey thinks that by trading him now we substantially damage our chances of resigning him.

Given that we haven't been able to resign him all season I don't think (2) is true.

Maybe Souray is willing to stay but if so why won't he sign now. If he is willing to resign but not until after the season we can still trade him and resign him in the summer.

(1) doesn't seem very likely either. The way the team is playing now, Souray might make the difference in the Habs making the playoffs but I wouldn't count on it. It certainly doesn't look like we are going to go deep in the playoffs.

Given his limited value to us over the next 2 months versus the value of the prospects we could get for him I think we have to trade him.

[beliveau1]

I hope you think as little of me as I think of you. As for Souray being a second line or third line defenceman, you are obviously lost in the old NHL. Look at tonight's game. What made the difference? the Powerplay? Souray is invaluable as a powerplay quarterback with a lethal shot. That is why you would never be hired in the new NHL as even a waterboy. Defencemen with 20 goals are few and far between

Anyways other than that have a good night.

oh my -I'm devastated by your lack of love for poor little old me.... I'll never be able to go out in public again now that I've been exposed for the worthless rag I am?

[Habitforming]

I love Souray, he is clutch and the ONLY habs this year with any consistency. Not to mention he will drop the gloves. The option of trading him HAS to be fully explored.

If I were Gainey I would talk to Sheldon and see what his intentions were in the offseason. If he wants to come back to the habs then get an idea of the money he is looking for and ask to trade him and resign him in the summer.

If he says he will look at options on the west coast, then move him outright to the highest bidder no matter of their location.

The way I see it he ABSOLUTELY HAS TO BE MOVED for the better of the team (centre, prospects/pick)

I just pray that he will comeback next year!

[Fanpuck33]

Absolutely trade him. His 20 goals don't make up for his many, many, many defensive blunders. He is bascially an upgraded version of Andy Delmore: all offense and no defence.

[Habsy]

For those without RDS, or the Journal de Montreal, seems Martin Brodeur has weighed in on the Souray issue. They're close friends, and he says Souray loves Montreal, but is looking forward to being an unrestricted free agent. With that in mind, Jacques Demers thinks he's gonzo at the end of the year. I think he MUST be traded, or else we get nothing for him.

[hab29RETIRED]

I like souray - if it wouldn't cost more then $4.5M to sign him.

I do think that the habs have to either sign him before the deadline or trade him. He is the only guy we can get a decent return for - despite being a UFA at the end of the year. I also think we can get even more if we trade him to where he wants to go (i.e. Anahiem or SJ), since they would have first crack at re-signing him.

As much as i respect Gainey and think he is the best GM we have had in 3 decades (no i was never a big fan of Savard), I think if Souray walks at the end of the year and we get nothing, he should lose his job for a decision like that. If we were a serious contender (top 2-3 in the conferance), i would say keep Souray and bring in another UFA like Guerin to help us in the playoffs. As it is though, we don't have the defence, a consitant offence (don't point to the first half of the year, bcoz we still sucked 5 on 5).

You have to get something for him or sign him. But you cannot let him walk and get nothig back. This team really does not have any defensive prospects ready to step in next year (maybe emelin), and despite good prospects up front, there is really no blue-chip can't miss first liner from our offensive prospects. I think you have to move Souray to get a blue-chip first liner up front and/or blue chip defensive prospect. I still like Bernier and Carle. No, there is no way that SJ would trade them for Souray alone, but you may be able to get them and another prospect if you package Souray with Ryder/Bonk or another one of our dead weight defencemen like Bouillon or Dandenault.

Edited February 19, 2007 by hab29RETIRED

[Habitforming]

I like souray - if it wouldn't cost more then $4.5M to sign him.

I do think that the habs have to either sign him before the deadline or trade him. He is the only guy we can get a decent return for - despite being a UFA at the end of the year. I also think we can get even more if we trade him to where he wants to go (i.e. Anahiem or SJ), since they would have first crack at re-signing him.

As much as i respect Gainey and think he is the best GM we have had in 3 decades (no i was never a big fan of Savard), I think if Souray walks at the end of the year and we get nothing, he should lose his job for a decision like that. If we were a serious contender (top 2-3 in the conferance), i would say keep Souray and bring in another UFA like Guerin to help us in the playoffs. As it is though, we don't have the defence, a consitant offence (don't point to the first half of the year, bcoz we still sucked 5 on 5).

You have to get something for him or sign him. But you cannot let him walk and get nothig back. This team really does not have any defensive prospects ready to step in next year (maybe emelin), and despite good prospects up front, there is really no blue-chip can't miss first liner from our offensive prospects. I think you have to move Souray to get a blue-chip first liner up front and/or blue chip defensive prospect. I still like Bernier and Carle. No, there is no way that SJ would trade them for Souray alone, but you may be able to get them and another prospect if you package Souray with Ryder/Bonk or another one of our dead weight defencemen like Bouillon or Dandenault.

I still think people are too easily discounting Souray's worth on the trde market right now.

He would return either a roster player and a first rounder or a top prospect and a first rounder.

Yes that much even though he is a UFA at years end. Ask yourself, who has his shot that is available and cheap from here on out? Better yet who has 20 goals from the blueline?

You can thank Forsberg for that market.

[hab29RETIRED]

I still think people are too easily discounting Souray's worth on the trde market right now.

He would return either a roster player and a first rounder or a top prospect and a first rounder.

Yes that much even though he is a UFA at years end. Ask yourself, who has his shot that is available and cheap from here on out? Better yet who has 20 goals from the blueline?

You can thank Forsberg for that market.

I agree that you can probably get a first rounder and a prospect and perhaps even a 3rd liner. But if i'm making a trade with a playoff contender (i.e. Anaheim or SJ), i'd rather try and get 2 or 3 solid prospects the a first rounder, since the first rounder will be a late round choice anyway. There are three solid prospects on SJ (Carle, Vlasic????, Bernier), and one on Anaheim (Ryan). the only thing is if anaheim or SJ would have been willing to move them for a rental, they probably would have done it for Forsberg. That's why i think you have to offer someone else as well.

Personally, I'd like to see the habs try and get Marleau and one of Carle/Vlasic. I think if the habs offered somethig like Souray, Ryder and Bonk and Bouillon, they may be able to pry both Mareleau and a solid defensive prospect from SJ - which would address both of the Habs most pressing needs. I would hate to see the habs move Souray for someone like Paveleski - the type of player the habs already have in their system.

[Aebischer4life]

This summer we let go of Souray and save the money to sign another good center to form a 1-2 punch with Koivu. Let Bonk go as Pleks can take his place. Ship away Samsonov as well.

Higgins Koivu Lats

Ryder Center Kovalev

Perez Pleks Johnson

WTV

On the pp...instead of using Souray at the point to unload his slap shot we'll use Kovalev.

Ryder Koivu Higgins

Markov Kovalev

Remember... Kovalev was often used at the point on the pp in Pittsburgh when he scored 30+ goals 3 years in a row in the old nhl.

[MAK]

This summer we let go of Souray and save the money to sign another good center to form a 1-2 punch with Koivu. Let Bonk go as Pleks can take his place. Ship away Samsonov as well.

Higgins Koivu Lats

Ryder Center Kovalev

Perez Pleks Johnson

WTV

On the pp...instead of using Souray at the point to unload his slap shot we'll use Kovalev.

Ryder Koivu Higgins

Markov Kovalev

Remember... Kovalev was often used at the point on the pp in Pittsburgh when he scored 30+ goals 3 years in a row in the old nhl.

he was on the PP with a dude named jagr

do you really want to keep a 3rd line player at 2M ??(johnson)

[Aebischer4life]

he was on the PP with a dude named jagr

do you really want to keep a 3rd line player at 2M ??(johnson)

What does Jagr have to do with Kovalev? Kovalev has one of the best slap shots in the league and since Souray will leave we should put him there.

By the way in 2002-03 Jagr wasnt on Pittsburghs team anymore and still Kovalev scored over 30 goals.

Edited February 19, 2007 by Aebischer4life

[JoeLassister]

I can't wait to see Kovy on the 2nd PP unit at D. Rivet WTF !!!!

No WTV on the 4rth Begin- Lapierre for sure Kots will also make the team, I hope...

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Nice plan, but don't bank on any high-powered UFAs signing here. Arnott and Shanahan both told us to f**k off, and that was when the organization looked promising, BEFORE this season's awful meltdown.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

There was also that Pierre-Marc Bouchard rumour out of Minnesota...thoughts on that?

[hab29RETIRED]

There was also that Pierre-Marc Bouchard rumour out of Minnesota...thoughts on that?

i like him, but i think we should be able to do better. I think he is another 2nd line centre. I would rather try and get someone who has more #1 potential like Getzlaf or Marleau.

Although I doubt if we can get Getzlaf, because 1) if he was available, i'm sure Lowe would have got him in the Pronger trade (i was surprised that he didnt' get getlaf AND perry in that trade), and 2) i think the ducks are already stacked o defence, whereas San Jose NEEDS a guy like Souray. Straight up i can't see the sharks ever gong for SOuray for marleau, but if we were also offer other spare parts so they can be a top 2-3 contender in the West, we might be able to pry Marleau and a top defensive prospect out of SJ (i.e. Ryder, Bonk, Bouillon).

I think we have a lot of wingers that can become top scoreres, but they need the proper centermen to succeed. I also think we really need to re-build our defence - Komisarik is the only quality d-men we will have the rights to for a few years and I don't know if we can re-sign Markov.

[PB]

Nice plan, but don't bank on any high-powered UFAs signing here. Arnott and Shanahan both told us to f**k off, and that was when the organization looked promising, BEFORE this season's awful meltdown.

A dent on our track record would lessen our chances to attract....that's a given.

[Prime Minister Koivu]

This summer we let go of Souray and save the money to sign another good center to form a 1-2 punch with Koivu. Let Bonk go as Pleks can take his place. Ship away Samsonov as well.

Higgins Koivu Lats

Ryder Center Kovalev

Perez Pleks Johnson

WTV

On the pp...instead of using Souray at the point to unload his slap shot we'll use Kovalev.

Ryder Koivu Higgins

Markov Kovalev

Remember... Kovalev was often used at the point on the pp in Pittsburgh when he scored 30+ goals 3 years in a row in the old nhl.

I think your plan looks pretty good. I would like to see the Habs trade Souray away now and then try to resign him in the summer.