Habs UFA Thread

[alexstream]

Boy if we thought we were small before! I need more size in this lineup.

we were small and somewhat feisty, with a bit of "i don't care". (e.g. Higgins interviews)

we are smaller, but WAY FASTER, and feisty like no one else. those guys are as feisty as koivu, but they are 3. (and the worst of them is arguably as talented as koivu)

the key there is speed. for real this time.

before that we only pretended to be fast.

[haber]

we were small and somewhat feisty, with a bit of "i don't care". (e.g. Higgins interviews)

we are smaller, but WAY FASTER, and feisty like no one else. those guys are as feisty as koivu, but they are 3. (and the worst of them is arguably as talented as koivu)

the key there is speed. for real this time.

before that we only pretended to be fast.

Yeah, now that I think of it...I cant find a faster line up than those three! But the line still reminds me of Timbits hockey.

BTW, your avatar scares me.

[KoZed]

Boy if we thought we were small before! I need more size in this lineup.

Small is the new Big!

Attack of the Angry Atoms!

Montreal's Mighty Mices!

Speedy Smurfs Squad!

[KoZed]

The Lightning Latin Line!

[alexstream]

BTW, your avatar scares me.

i think it's awesome.

[Nilan]

Mean it?

It's not a personnal opinion, it's a societal observation.

Language is a real barrier for lot of fans, especially the older generations, who will have never heard Koivu talk to them in a language they can understand. They dont hate him, some might see it as a lack of respect, but some might even like him regardless. In all cases, without that direct connection through communication, dont expect lots of emotion.

Especially given the fact that strictly hockey-wise, Koivu never reached star/elite status and never brought playoffs success either. And he didnt have that super opened sunshine personality like Rusty Staub, Gary Carter or PK Subban that just goes over the communication issues.

So for Joe Bleau from Francoville QC who had seen Richard, Beliveau, Lafleur or Roy, stars they could identify and connect with, Koivu wont stir much emotions in them. He's not much different to them than Mats Naslund.

Again, not my personnal opinion but simply things as they are.

I was taken aback by your "didnt try" comment earlier. I agree that he wasnt joe personality, but frankly, I'm glad he never tried to be.

Not for nothing, but don't you think it's a bit provincial to think that "the voice" of habs fans is the uniligual star gazer who is only impressed by big teeth or historical franco glory? i have to think that the "average" habs fan is able to recognize the brilliance of a muller, green, maholvlich, robinson or (eek) gainey....

i won't say another word about this tonight. but i didnt want the comment to go by untouched. i, for one, will miss koivu immensely. he was so easy to cheer for during tough times. habs fans, french, english, or finish, are worse off without him on our team. he, was a montreal canadien.

[sakiqc]

Looks like Gionta's nickname is Gio:

Here's Gionta's farewell thread on the devils #1 fan forum

http://www.njdevs.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46530

[sakiqc]

The Gomez trade makes more sense now with Gionta's signing. Let's up they will have the same chemistry than when they were last playing together, 2005-2006

# Player Name Birthdate Age Pos. GP G A Pts PIM +/- GP G A Pts PIM

14 Brian Gionta 1979-01-18 26 R 82 48 41 89 46 18 9 3 4 7 2

23 Scott Gomez 1979-12-23 25 C 82 33 51 84 42 8 9 5 4 9 6

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/leagues...0000512006.html

[Koivu11]

Nilan! well said

Good Luck Saku, my fav player of all time!

You deserve better from this province!

We will miss the Finnish Flash Saku Koivu!...A true Canadien :hlogo:

[KoZed]

I was taken aback by your "didnt try" comment earlier. I agree that he wasnt joe personality, but frankly, I'm glad he never tried to be.

Not for nothing, but don't you think it's a bit provincial to think that "the voice" of habs fans is the uniligual star gazer who is only impressed by big teeth or historical franco glory? i have to think that the "average" habs fan is able to recognize the brilliance of a muller, green, maholvlich, robinson or (eek) gainey....

I think I did a long ass post months ago about the different generations of Habs fans. An example: my dad is cosmopolite (speaks 4 languages), educated (graduated from Polytechnique at 19), well-traveled (went everywhere), modern (worked for Telus), etc. He's nothing but provincial, unilingual star gazer. But he grew up in the 50's, was a teen in the 60's during the Revolution Tranquille, was a full-fledged Habs fan in the 70's. To him and people of his generation/social/status/etc, ie. educated self-made white-collar baby-boomer who followed the Habs from the 50's to the 80's; that some player would come over from Finland, and be given millions AND the extremely priviledged social status of Montreal Canadiens Captain and not make the effort to learn and talk French; it's a form of gross underachievment. It's as if your father had sent you to Harvard, paid all your crap for years; and you ended up flipping burgers until you were 40.

Then take another example: my uncle: old man built like a rock, hair still slicked back like the Rocket, survived through the Great Depression, WW2, followed the Habs before Richard; saw this supernova athlete dominate not just the sport; but dominate the ruling class; blue-collar man who worked 14 hours shifts in a copper mine for 40 years, the only small piece of glory he ever could identify with was his Habs, hard-working guys like him, who spoke like him, went to church like him, had no education like him, would go to the same barbers and taverns as him. Follows the team passionately in from the 30's to this day... and he sees this guy being given millions and named captain of his team and he can't understand a word he's saying. He still loves the little captain, he brasses himself every time the little captain goes in the corner with a guy 6 inches taller and 40 lbs heavier, he jumps off his couch when the little captain scores... but after the game, when the little captain is on TV my uncle feels left out, almost betrayed, because he can't understand what the guy is saying. It's not his Habs anymore, he can't identify with someone he can't understand. It's all going through the filter of the person who has to translate. For him it's like being brought back 60 years in the past when all the bosses and foremen were talking english and he had to ask for translations to know what the hell was going on. You think he feels sad that Koivu's gone today? Can you blame him?

Those, my friend, are the silent average fans that dont go on hockey forums on the Net or call sports shows or burn cops cars or fill up La Cage aux Sports every Tuesday. They're the average fans that buy newspapers, cable TV, beer, cars, corporate boxes, company seats, Desjardins REER's and tickets to the shows at the Bell Centre. Remember, in politics as in sports, the majority, the average, is always silent but listens a whole lot.

Looks like Gionta's nickname is Gio:

Here's Gionta's farewell thread on the devils #1 fan forum

http://www.njdevs.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46530

And Gomez's is Gomer.

Eh, Gomer Pyle!

[KoZed]

Anyways. Long day. Pain killers are kicking in so I'm off to bed.

Finally quite satisfied with Gainey's day. Didnt do an half-assed job but went all the way.

[Sir_Boagalott]

The Gomez trade makes more sense now with Gionta's signing. Let's up they will have the same chemistry than when they were last playing together, 2005-2006

# Player Name Birthdate Age Pos. GP G A Pts PIM +/- GP G A Pts PIM

14 Brian Gionta 1979-01-18 26 R 82 48 41 89 46 18 9 3 4 7 2

23 Scott Gomez 1979-12-23 25 C 82 33 51 84 42 8 9 5 4 9 6

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/leagues...0000512006.html

I was thinking the exact same thing. They both lit it up that year. Gomez isnt a bonified #1 C so I didnt really like that acquisition, and I'm not super high on Gionta signing either. However if Gionta is on Gomez's wing and if they can put up similar numbers to their 05-06 season I'll be quite pleased with both of them for sure. They had wicked chemistry that year. This is probably why Bob got Gomez, he must have know somehow that Gionta would be available if the Habs had Gomez. The Gomez trade didnt make a whole lot of sense until Bob signed Gionta.

[alexstream]

The Gomez trade makes more sense now with Gionta's signing. Let's up they will have the same chemistry than when they were last playing together, 2005-2006

# Player Name Birthdate Age Pos. GP G A Pts PIM +/- GP G A Pts PIM

14 Brian Gionta 1979-01-18 26 R 82 48 41 89 46 18 9 3 4 7 2

23 Scott Gomez 1979-12-23 25 C 82 33 51 84 42 8 9 5 4 9 6

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/leagues...0000512006.html

actually, it's the other way around.

the signing of Gionta makes a lot of sense with Gomez trade.

This was a M@#$@#F@#$@ big trade... Gainey knew it. He couldn't screw this up.

Sammy came here, tried to joined a team taht wasn't meshing, etc. it failed.

So Gainey traded for a Center. That was part 1 of the master plan.

Whoever that center would have been, part 2 of the master plan would have been different (e.g. if Cammalleri is the Center, you keep Tangs to feed him)

So Gomez it was.

Gomez is american, is a playmaker.

Gomez had success with speedy feasty wingers (e.g. Gionta)

Gomez didn't mesh so well with highly talented european versatile wingers (Zherdev, Jagr)

Who are you gonna call?

Havlat or Cammalleri?

Kovalev or Gionta?

Any day, talent wise, one on one, etc, I prefer Havlat and Kovalev.

HOWEVER, and Gainey mentionned it minimum 20 times in his press conference, C H E M I S T R Y was key.

In his opinion, and in my opinion too, if it matters, Gomez can play way better with Gionta and Camm than with Kovalev and Havlat.

So it was all a question of SURROUNDING Gomez with matching talent, make a set up for chemistry to happen.

I also like the fact that they are all signed through 2014 and the older will be 35... i.e. WE HAVE A CORE, we have an IDENTITY. For the next 5 years, our prospects can grow up and see what they can live for. see what they will join. learn what they will have to become to deserve to wear the CH.

I wanted a big in your face identity, but I REALLY like the actual new quick feisty one. I don't have any problem with it. I'm pretty sure those 3 gringos will have fun together and will help forge the new Habs.

[Wamsley01]

Anyways. Long day. Pain killers are kicking in so I'm off to bed.

Finally quite satisfied with Gainey's day. Didnt do an half-assed job but went all the way.

Yes, he certainly went balls deep, but the question is whether he wakes up tomorrow morning with coyote arm.

[alexstream]

I think I did a long ass post months ago about the different generations of Habs fans. An example: my dad is cosmopolite (speaks 4 languages), educated (graduated from Polytechnique at 19), well-traveled (went everywhere), modern (worked for Telus), etc. He's nothing but provincial, unilingual star gazer. But he grew up in the 50's, was a teen in the 60's during the Revolution Tranquille, was a full-fledged Habs fan in the 70's. To him and people of his generation/social/status/etc, ie. educated self-made white-collar baby-boomer who followed the Habs from the 50's to the 80's; that some player would come over from Finland, and be given millions AND the extremely priviledged social status of Montreal Canadiens Captain and not make the effort to learn and talk French; it's a form of gross underachievment. It's as if your father had sent you to Harvard, paid all your crap for years; and you ended up flipping burgers until you were 40.

Then take another example: my uncle: old man built like a rock, hair still slicked back like the Rocket, survived through the Great Depression, WW2, followed the Habs before Richard; saw this supernova athlete dominate not just the sport; but dominate the ruling class; blue-collar man who worked 14 hours shifts in a copper mine for 40 years, the only small piece of glory he ever could identify with was his Habs, hard-working guys like him, who spoke like him, went to church like him, had no education like him, would go to the same barbers and taverns as him. Follows the team passionately in from the 30's to this day... and he sees this guy being given millions and named captain of his team and he can't understand a word he's saying. He still loves the little captain, he brasses himself every time the little captain goes in the corner with a guy 6 inches taller and 40 lbs heavier, he jumps off his couch when the little captain scores... but after the game, when the little captain is on TV my uncle feels left out, almost betrayed, because he can't understand what the guy is saying. It's not his Habs anymore, he can't identify with someone he can't understand. It's all going through the filter of the person who has to translate. For him it's like being brought back 60 years in the past when all the bosses and foremen were talking english and he had to ask for translations to know what the hell was going on. You think he feels sad that Koivu's gone today? Can you blame him?

Those, my friend, are the silent average fans that dont go on hockey forums on the Net or call sports shows or burn cops cars or fill up La Cage aux Sports every Tuesday. They're the average fans that buy newspapers, cable TV, beer, cars, corporate boxes, company seats, Desjardins REER's and tickets to the shows at the Bell Centre. Remember, in politics as in sports, the majority, the average, is always silent but listens a whole lot.

yup, that's the "couene dure", the "tricoté serré", etc.

I must add about our 3 gringos,

I like the fact that the 3 of them are all of the same nations.

way better than the ex united nations used to.

no racism intended...

If we had got 3 russian, I would have preferred that too. or 3 Czech. or 3 finns.

we got 3 american. alright

As long as it's not

1 french canadian, 1 finn, 1 russian, 1 czech

hey, don't wonder why the UN is bogus

of course, your dad and my dad would have preferred 3 Tremblay (hey they can buy a 15 pack for 15 bucks... )

I personally don't mind, but I like the fact that these guys are from the same background and can work together, in the same direction and create some sort of team spirit.

I think Martin will heavily rely on them for that, and I'm more and more certain that by October 5, Gomez will have a C on his Jersey. French or no french.

[Fanpuck33]

The Gomez trade makes more sense now with Gionta's signing. Let's up they will have the same chemistry than when they were last playing together, 2005-2006

# Player Name Birthdate Age Pos. GP G A Pts PIM +/- GP G A Pts PIM

14 Brian Gionta 1979-01-18 26 R 82 48 41 89 46 18 9 3 4 7 2

23 Scott Gomez 1979-12-23 25 C 82 33 51 84 42 8 9 5 4 9 6

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/leagues...0000512006.html

Well, that's not entirely accurate. Their last season together was 2006-07:

# Player Name Birthdate Age Pos. GP G A Pts PIM +/- GP G A Pts PIM

23 Scott Gomez 1979-12-23 26 C 72 13 47 60 42 7 11 4 10 14 14

14 Brian Gionta 1979-01-18 27 R 62 25 20 45 36 -3 11 8 1 9 4

Gionta hasn't scored more than 25 since that 48 goal year, which implies that was a fluke season. I find it absurd that we're now paying a 70-75 point player over 7 million and a 55-60 point player 5 million. The only way Bob comes out on top this offseason is if Gomez and Gionta can magically recreated that 05-06 magic.

[Sir_Boagalott]

I must add about our 3 gringos,

I like the fact that the 3 of them are all of the same nations.

way better than the ex united nations used to.

no racism intended...

If we had got 3 russian, I would have preferred that too. or 3 Czech. or 3 finns.

we got 3 american. alright

Just 1 thing I should let you know aboot your 3 Gringos: 1of them is from Richmond Hill Ontario. Cammalleri isnt American.

[JLP]

I find it absurd that we're now paying a 70-75 point player over 7 million and a 55-60 point player 5 million. The only way Bob comes out on top this offseason is if Gomez and Gionta can magically recreated that 05-06 magic.

It's the old misdirection trick -- fans would be calling for Gainey's head after Komi was allowed to go to our chief rival for nothing; but this flurry of trades and signings directs the attention onto our new players -- desperation IMHO, shake it up and see what happens. We barely made the playoffs last season, same same this season no? Anyone seriously see us as contenders?

Let's face it the five-year plan failed miserably.

[BCHabnut]

taken from that new jersey thread

"LOL AT HABS FIRST LINE Gio (5m) Gomez (7.5m) Cammalleri (6m)

Average height: 5'9

This first line may be leaps and bounds better than the old one. Gio and Gomer should play well with Martin's system. It's up to Camelleri to fit in.

[JLP]

... I'm more and more certain that by October 5, Gomez will have a C on his Jersey. French or no french.

Looked around and I found one source that says Gomez speaks some Spanish and understands it well; another source that says he doesn't speak Spanish. Anyone know for sure? Much easier to pick up conversational French is you already have some Spanish (much easier than coming from unilingual English, infinitely easier than coming from Finnish)

taken from that new jersey thread

"LOL AT HABS FIRST LINE Gio (5m) Gomez (7.5m) Cammalleri (6m)

Average height: 5'9

A 7,5 meter Gomez !!!! Watch out for the jumbotron Scott!Facebook has him at 100kg/220lbs, he's a beefy little bugger. Could that make him a bit tougher? Boullion used his low center of gravity well . . .

[JoeLassister]

A 7,5 meter Gomez !!!! Watch out for the jumbotron Scott!Facebook has him at 100kg/220lbs, he's a beefy little bugger. Could that make him a bit tougher? Boullion used his low centre of gravity well . . .

Would it be nice if Kovy pulls a Kariya and sign for 1,8M$ ?

[JLP]

Would it be nice if Kovy pulls a Kariya and sign for 1,8M$ ?

We can pray! Actually I think we could probaby clear a bit more space and Kovy is a class guy who might want to stay on as Captain then bow out in Montreal, it's not like money would be his only concern at this point in his career.

[MFT77]

Would it be nice if Kovy pulls a Kariya and sign for 1,8M$ ?

That's what i'm still hopin for.

If he really wants to stay in Montreal, it's probably his only choice.

[Sir_Boagalott]

I find it absurd that we're now paying a 70-75 point player over 7 million and a 55-60 point player 5 million. The only way Bob comes out on top this offseason is if Gomez and Gionta can magically recreated that 05-06 magic.

Exactly, its a huge risk really at those prices. Separately neither pick up is good so they have to work out together or its going to hurt, big time. We could have just witnessed DagRibs x2 only this time its for many years and for huge money. If this doesnt go well I can only imagine most of us will be Laff fans by 2014.

Were they on the same line after that year though? Elias only played 38 games in 05-06 and because he missed 39 games from hepatitis A. I think they were put together because Elias was out and I think they semi went back to their regular lines that year when Elias came back and they werent reunited for prolonged periods after that year. Were they not a 1 year wonder like the Habs Higgs, Plex, A Kosts line?

[JLP]

Those, my friend, are the silent average fans that dont go on hockey forums on the Net or call sports shows or burn cops cars or fill up La Cage aux Sports every Tuesday. They're the average fans that buy newspapers, cable TV, beer, cars, corporate boxes, company seats, Desjardins REER's and tickets to the shows at the Bell Centre. Remember, in politics as in sports, the majority, the average, is always silent but listens a whole lot.

KoZ you are right and I mostly agree, but let me play devil's advocate. I think what some posters are arguing is that the stubborn French preference makes Québecois Habs fans look like hicks or even racists. The idea being that an argument like yours could also be used to justify keeping a monolingual Russian or Korean player out of Columbus.

In response I'd say if a Russian pro-athlete came to English NA to work there for ten years he would almost certainly learn basic English, as would a Korean or a Québecois. Maybe most NA people simply see English as "the local language," but it isn't so in one place: Québec. So yeah the French issue is different but equal to the English issue in other NA cities. A distinction is that in other cities, language is regarded as an issue of "communication" (practical is good) whereas in Québec it is often portrayed as an issue of "culture" (clannish is bad). It's just perspective IMHO.

I love Saku but I believe that given his position he should have picked up enough French to do post-game interviews where let's face it the vocabulary and grammar are not terribly complex.