Habs vs. Avalanche | Game Thread

[han_dyl]

walmsley i usually agree with except about bob but I see no way you say Price did not play well tonite. those were fluke goals man.

I don't think he is saying Price didn't play well. More along the lines of he needs to stand on his head for this team to have a chance. Because they can't score.

Edited October 16, 2009 by han_dyl

[habs rule]

I don't think he is saying Price didn't play well. More along the lines of he needs to stand on his head for this team to have a chance. Because they can't score.

now that i agree with.

[han_dyl]

Is it just me or does it seem like the 3rd line has regressed a bit. They seem lost out there. Really rushing things.

[Wamsley01]

walmsley i usually agree with except about bob but I see no way you say Price did not play well tonite. those were fluke goals man.

I didn't blame Price. I said they need better than adequate goaltending.

The first goal is one that is easy to say "deflection", but the fact is he didn't have his stick on the ice.

If he covers his 5 hole or plays it paddle down it is not a goal. What he did tonight was adequate, not bad, not great.

If he plays like he did tonight the Habs are going to have to outplay the opposition the majority of nights to win,

I am not sure I have the confidence that they can right now. So he needs to be a difference maker, an All-Star

and I don't think he is an All-Star at this point in his career.

I think Price will be an All-Star in the future, but he isn't right now.

I don't think he is saying Price didn't play well. More along the lines of he needs to stand on his head for this team to have a chance. Because they can't score.

Bingo

[brobin]

Right now we have two average goalies.. they are not going to carry the team this year. They will steal a few games each, they will be decent most nights, but Price is not our star player right now. I am not sure we have one.. we need a complete team effort and more from everyone make the playoffs...

[bar]

Goaltending aside we really should have been up 3-0 after the first period and didn't finish the chances we had.

[han_dyl]

Right now we have two average goalies.. they are not going to carry the team this year. They will steal a few games each, they will be decent most nights, but Price is not our star player right now. I am not sure we have one.. we need a complete team effort and more from everyone make the playoffs...

We do, it just sucks that he's out for at least 4 months.

[Wamsley01]

We do, it just sucks that he's out for at least 4 months.

It is too true

I am praying for .500 until he comes back and anything more will be gravy.

Look at the Pens without Gonchar and the Ducks without Niedermayer in 2007.

For a team like the Habs who rely on speedy forwards to create off the rush, it was

devastating to lose the outlet abilities of Markov.

Now they are forced to either carry the zone with speed (which plays into a team like the Avs

plan) or take the puck away on the boards. That is not a recipe for success.

My guess is that most of the damage they do over the next 4 months will be on the PP or

off neutral zone turnovers.

Edited October 16, 2009 by Wamsley01

[Toronthab]

It is too true

I am praying for .500 until he comes back and anything more will be gravy.

Look at the Pens without Gonchar and the Ducks without Niedermayer in 2007.

For a team like the Habs who rely on speedy forwards to create off the rush, it was

devastating to lose the outlet abilities of Markov.

Now they are forced to either carry the zone with speed (which plays into a team like the Avs

plan) or take the puck away on the boards. That is not a recipe for success.

My guess is that most of the damage they do over the next 4 months will be on the PP or

off neutral zone turnovers.

That sure sounds like pretty good analysis to me! I am not that good at analyzing, but I liked quite a bit of the game tonight. I am posting because it occurred to me that we don't have here much of the same team we had last year, ready to slip into familiar rhytms and patterns of interaction.

In short, naturally impatient though I am with the bad start, and missing Markov a whole bunch (God grant that his tendon not be a career ender) , this is a team of relative strangers this year, and there 's a lot of good stuff in the room that just might emerge and gel into rivers of excitement.

Go Bob Go!

[habs rule]

I didn't blame Price. I said they need better than adequate goaltending.

The first goal is one that is easy to say "deflection", but the fact is he didn't have his stick on the ice.

If he covers his 5 hole or plays it paddle down it is not a goal. What he did tonight was adequate, not bad, not great.

If he plays like he did tonight the Habs are going to have to outplay the opposition the majority of nights to win,

I am not sure I have the confidence that they can right now. So he needs to be a difference maker, an All-Star

and I don't think he is an All-Star at this point in his career.

I think Price will be an All-Star in the future, but he isn't right now.

Bingo

i don't know but that 1st goal actually deflected twice and as former goal tender you have a hard time with those even if it is only going 3 mph

I actually thought he should have had the 3 rd goal but he overplayed it and left his feet, but hey it was still a toughie. he ain't letting in any softies .

ya know pricey has not played badly this year. he won 2 games they should have lost. halak could have gotten 1 goal in calgary and they would be winners price got burned on some shite deflections in edmonton. It is hockey it happens and it will turn around give the guy a break for crying out loud.

[Wamsley01]

i don't know but that 1st goal actually deflected twice and as former goal tender you have a hard time with those even if it is only going 3 mph

I actually thought he should have had the 3 rd goal but he overplayed it and left his feet, but hey it was still a toughie. he ain't letting in any softies .

ya know pricey has not played badly this year. he won 2 games they should have lost. halak could have gotten 1 goal in calgary and they would be winners price got burned on some shite deflections in edmonton. It is hockey it happens and it will turn around give the guy a break for crying out loud.

It deflected twice, but he knows he should have had his blade down. If he does have his stick in the proper position

nobody recognizes it as a big save. It was a bad break, but they are tiny technical mistakes that can lead to

unnecessary goals.

Just like puck tracking. It is his job to follow the puck cross crease and maintain square regardless of whether

there is a player waiting there, but if he doesn't and it takes a crazy bounce it looks like he did not make a mistake.

In reality if he commits to tracking the puck properly it hits him in the chest and looks like an amazing save. A simple

technical adjustment that will go totally unnoticed.

There are a ton of small things that can be shrugged off, but those are the things that seperate the elite goaltenders

from the average ones. Halak makes a lot of these little mistakes STILL and one of the reasons why I think Price is better

regardless of their statistics. Halak still relies on reflexes and I am skeptical that he will ever figure out the technical flaws

in his game. I watched Cam Ward make all the same mistakes Price is making for 2 full seasons before

he finally figured everything out last season and now he is arguably the best in the game.

He has not radically regressed like his stats would suggest. He is making progress, but he still has the tendency

to take the easy way out. Unfortunately the Habs are not strong enough to mask those breakdowns.

As for the 3rd goal, he made a huge save on the first shot and that is his job, he should not be left alone like that.

[habs rule]

my only argument here wamlsey my boy is that you state the habs will only progress when they get adequate goaltending. They are getting adequate goaltending. They aren't getting any goals. not many games are won by the team with 2 goals. We could argue all day on the technical details of tending goal but the team has to support price as well. 2 deflections off his own guys and being left alone with no help is not support. Watching that 3rd goal again he really had not much chance. Bad breaks are going against the habs right now but that will change. To blame Bob for this is silly. oh hell lets just fire him. :hlogo: I mean we dont have Carbo to kick around anymore and we have to fire someone.

[Colin]

Unsurprisingly, I came here expecting to see oodles of negativity, and I was rewarded (sic). And I only read the last page. Montreal was less aggressive in the second and therefore allowed Coloradolorodo to get the jump on them, but other than that, Montreal was the better team. Two of the three goals were complete flukes. I guess if they'd gone in on Brodeur, the world would have said they were unstoppable, but against Price, they should have been saved; something about paddle down and tracking.

Price had his paddle down on the first, went to make the save angling his stick to deflect it in the corner, then got burned on... not one, but TWO deflections. Yeah Carey. Save that you dope.

Second goal is a deflection off a skate on a hard pass across the crease. Would go in on any goalie, but apparently we need an All-Star goalie to be 40 feet wide. Sure, in the days when Garth Snow wore a TV box in his back and Patrick Roy had a wing span of 8 feet because of his jersey, there may have been a shot at a save, but common.

I was very disappointed with Benny Brunet believing that Gomez hadn't been railroaded into the boards. Last season, without a doubt, that's a penalty. Also last season, the Habs don't score their second goal because.... it went OUT OF BOUNDS.

All in all, I thought it was a very entertaining game and it augers well for the future. I thought Belle stepped in and did an excellent job, being out of position only a couple of times - I didn't think he looked out of place in the least.

Perimeter Panty-Waist Plex has gone hibernating and we finally have the real Plex back. No more learning games from our "beloved" Russkie. Even Kosty looked like he gave a hoot - and played his best game this year by far.

Little disappointed in the French Connection (Laps and Lats) who weren't on as usual, though I still feel they can really hastle a team down low. MaxPax, on the other hand, continues to look better and better and was arguably the hardest worker on the team - that last goal aside (his man, or Gionta's?).

Anyhow, I know I'm totally wrong here because we lost and therefore doom and gloom and fire Gainey and trade these useless dorks, but my unqualified eye saw that game in a very positive light and, quite frankly, we deserved better. I assume that's what Martin said to the players after the game - but I'm probably dreaming, because he called them out for being useless, particularly Price who should be able to save all the shots......

......even when Halak is in net.

[KoZed]

MaxPax, on the other hand, continues to look better and better and was arguably the hardest worker on the team

He had more hustle, but a lot of that hard work becomes necessary because he doesnt work well. Lot of missed cues on the forecheck, not knowing where to go to support the puck-carrier. That's why you see him bump in his linemates so often. Not really helpful when he does that. Once he calms down mentally and gets more experience, he'll become much more efficient.

Chipchura, on the other hand... He's not very good at anything and so much facets of his game needs polish, he'll take a lot of time to become a useful NHL regular. In the meantime, he's only there because of the waivers. Never thought in my life I'd have to say that I miss Glen Metropolit.

[Wamsley01]

my only argument here wamlsey my boy is that you state the habs will only progress when they get adequate goaltending. They are getting adequate goaltending. They aren't getting any goals. not many games are won by the team with 2 goals. We could argue all day on the technical details of tending goal but the team has to support price as well. 2 deflections off his own guys and being left alone with no help is not support. Watching that 3rd goal again he really had not much chance. Bad breaks are going against the habs right now but that will change. To blame Bob for this is silly. oh hell lets just fire him. :hlogo: I mean we dont have Carbo to kick around anymore and we have to fire someone.

I said they wouldn't progress with ONLY adequate goaltending, they need MORE than adequate goaltending.

I agree 100% that they do not support Price, I have been saying that for 6 months, but at the same time I

don't gloss over goals that were preventable. It was a bad break that there was two deflections, but as much

as Colin wants to convince himself that Price had his paddle down, he wasn't even set with his stick square to

the original shooter. Did I say it was a bad goal? No. I said that it was preventable and a goaltender in the zone

makes that save.

[han_dyl]

Maybe it's time to call up Sergei.

[JoeLassister]

Still shocked that the final rush did not provide a goal. Heard there were 7 habs on the ice, is it true ??

[han_dyl]

Still shocked that the final rush did not provide a goal. Heard there were 7 habs on the ice, is it true ??

I heard the same thing. Don't know for sure.

The one thing I do know is it was one of the worst most inconsistent officiated games I have ever seen. Between the phantom/non calls on both sides, the puck going out of play before the habs second goal. 7 guys being allowed on the ice at the end wouldn't surprise me.

[habs rule]

Unsurprisingly, I came here expecting to see oodles of negativity, and I was rewarded (sic). And I only read the last page. Montreal was less aggressive in the second and therefore allowed Coloradolorodo to get the jump on them, but other than that, Montreal was the better team. Two of the three goals were complete flukes. I guess if they'd gone in on Brodeur, the world would have said they were unstoppable, but against Price, they should have been saved; something about paddle down and tracking.

Price had his paddle down on the first, went to make the save angling his stick to deflect it in the corner, then got burned on... not one, but TWO deflections. Yeah Carey. Save that you dope.

Second goal is a deflection off a skate on a hard pass across the crease. Would go in on any goalie, but apparently we need an All-Star goalie to be 40 feet wide. Sure, in the days when Garth Snow wore a TV box in his back and Patrick Roy had a wing span of 8 feet because of his jersey, there may have been a shot at a save, but common.

I was very disappointed with Benny Brunet believing that Gomez hadn't been railroaded into the boards. Last season, without a doubt, that's a penalty. Also last season, the Habs don't score their second goal because.... it went OUT OF BOUNDS.

All in all, I thought it was a very entertaining game and it augers well for the future. I thought Belle stepped in and did an excellent job, being out of position only a couple of times - I didn't think he looked out of place in the least.

Perimeter Panty-Waist Plex has gone hibernating and we finally have the real Plex back. No more learning games from our "beloved" Russkie. Even Kosty looked like he gave a hoot - and played his best game this year by far.

Little disappointed in the French Connection (Laps and Lats) who weren't on as usual, though I still feel they can really hastle a team down low. MaxPax, on the other hand, continues to look better and better and was arguably the hardest worker on the team - that last goal aside (his man, or Gionta's?).

Anyhow, I know I'm totally wrong here because we lost and therefore doom and gloom and fire Gainey and trade these useless dorks, but my unqualified eye saw that game in a very positive light and, quite frankly, we deserved better. I assume that's what Martin said to the players after the game - but I'm probably dreaming, because he called them out for being useless, particularly Price who should be able to save all the shots......

......even when Halak is in net.

my god colin we agree completely thank you I kinda thought I was on my own here

[habs rule]

I said they wouldn't progress with ONLY adequate goaltending, they need MORE than adequate goaltending.

I agree 100% that they do not support Price, I have been saying that for 6 months, but at the same time I

don't gloss over goals that were preventable. It was a bad break that there was two deflections, but as much

as Colin wants to convince himself that Price had his paddle down, he wasn't even set with his stick square to

the original shooter. Did I say it was a bad goal? No. I said that it was preventable and a goaltender in the zone

makes that save.

and we still only got 2 goals that will not win a lot of games.

Maybe it's time to call up Sergei.

what exactly do you want to call him? oh up forget that.

[Sir_Boagalott]

I agree with Wamsley and brobin. Theres no reason why Price didnt stop that one. It could have reflected off every player 10 times and if a goalie doesnt have his 5 hole closed and you can slide a curling rock through it how are all the deflections a legitimate excuse for not doing 1 of the most basics goalie moves and resembling swiss cheeze? Every goalie in the AHL probably would have stopped that, and most in the ECHL probably would have to. Think aboot it. Price is down on his knees on the ice, sure the puck deflects twice, but the pucks not that high off the ice ice and somehow it goes right through Price so the deflections are and excuse? It reminds me of last year when 2 Habs laid down to block a shot and somehow the puck slid right under both of them and in. :puke:

Halak should be playing. Sure Halak hasnt been stellar yet, but he never is immediately anyway. Every time Halak gets stretches of games the first few arent great but he keeps getting better and better. Lets give that a chance.

Price literally scares me now. I've noticed something for a while now and I have yet to see it happen since I 1st realized it and its an extremely scary trend. I will most likely get flamed even more for this "crazy" epiphany because nobody will like it but here it goes: Price is absolutely inept at backing his teammates up after somebody makes a mistake. I cant recall off the top of my head a single save Price has made that has bailed out a teammates mistake. Even when the puck gets intercepted in the other teams zone and they go on a breakaway its pretty much a goal every time. Remember Gorges goof in his 1st year when he coughed the puck up, Price was a sieve, Booo Gorges - that goal ws stoppable, but Price basically floppes around like a fish out of water at times. There seems to be something wrong with him between the ears in situations like that because he seems to choke almost every time. In the Van game several of the 1st 3 goals were stoppable, but not Prices fault, somebody made a mistake. Seriously its getting old. I swear that Price and all the Price lovers seem to be like Ricky from the Trailer Park Boys. i.e. its always somebody elses fault.

At some point Price has to start making saves that backup and cover for his teammates mistakes. If Price can only make saves from his positioning and size than the Habs need to call up Missean.

[sakiqc]

Still shocked that the final rush did not provide a goal. Heard there were 7 habs on the ice, is it true ??

yes there were 7 players on the ice. check the recap video on rds.ca

[sakiqc]

at the end of the players introduction, it seems as if Markov said "Nous sommes les Canadiens" but the mic was off. Stupid awkward moment for Markov

[Prime Minister Koivu]

I want Gomez and Plekanec to switch spots for a game (regardless of the Gomez-Gionta history).

Patches needs to go to Hamilton. He is looking better and he gives all the effort in the world but he has little to no hockey sense. He simply has no idea where to go or what he should be doing.

[Colin]

as Colin wants to convince himself that Price had his paddle down, he wasn't even set with his stick square to

the original shooter. Did I say it was a bad goal? No. I said that it was preventable and a goaltender in the zone

makes that save.

Just watched the goal another few times. Square to the shooter and paddle down. Shifted left and would have had it. Then the second deflection. Vis-a-vis the first shift left: for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, for him to rapidly fire out his left pad to stop the deflection, something had to go to the right or he's on his right side flailing his pads. Only viable choice? Right arm, which he shifts out WHILE keeping his paddle on the ice. Puck goes around the stick and through the wickets.

I suppose if he were Tretiak with the fabled bionic knee, he would have had that.

DAMN YOU CAREY PRICE FOR NOT BEING FABLED VLADISLAV TRETIAK!

Edit: spelling

Edited October 16, 2009 by Colin