Commandant Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 Make the second 2024 (we dont have one and the player will be ready sooner, which as you noted Hughes likes) and Im good with it. While i would do the trade the problem for both edmonton and montreal means you cant trade your 2026 first rounder as its tied up in these conditions and then you end up with something like the Monahan trade conditions if you want to make a move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted January 13 Author Share Posted January 13 9 hours ago, Commandant said: Make the second 2024 (we dont have one and the player will be ready sooner, which as you noted Hughes likes) and Im good with it. Montreal doesn't have their own second but they do have Colorado's second rounder this year from the Lehkonen/Barron trade. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted January 13 Author Share Posted January 13 19 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said: ok, in the realm of improbable trade partners, just to have some fun; here is a trade proposal: To OTT: One of the Habs 2025 1st round pick, Joel Armia ($3.4M/2025) and Jake Allen ($3.85M/2025) To MTL: Drake Batherson ($4.975M/2027) and Vladimir Taransenko ($5.0M/2024) I think you've identified the one core forward that Ottawa would move (Batherson) but they would need a core player back; I don't see them wanting draft picks at this point. Not that they're going for it this season but I don't think the new management team wants to embark on another rebuild. Allen isn't a great fit for them with Korpisalo and Forsberg both signed through next season as well. (Yes, Forsberg is on LTIR for now but longer-term, they'd have a very expensive third-string goalie.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 12 minutes ago, dlbalr said: I think you've identified the one core forward that Ottawa would move (Batherson) but they would need a core player back; I don't see them wanting draft picks at this point. Not that they're going for it this season but I don't think the new management team wants to embark on another rebuild. Allen isn't a great fit for them with Korpisalo and Forsberg both signed through next season as well. (Yes, Forsberg is on LTIR for now but longer-term, they'd have a very expensive third-string goalie.) I had Harris there but I didn’t want to get shot down on the forum for yet again putting him on a trade proposal. Also Batherson is a late rouser that may be overachieving early in his career and may just fall down to earth later. Reading about him, I saw that he had been terrible on the defensive side of the puck. So Itonned it down. I believe that Armia would do great in OTT. If not him, Evans would be another player who would thrive in Ottawa. As for Allen. OTT’s goalie prospects are two years away from requiring waivers. Watching some of them against the Rocket didn’t show me they are knocking on the NHL yet, Korpisalo-Allen would work well for a couple of years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 Don’t forget OTT lost a first round pick because of the Dadonov no-trade fiasco their prospect pipeline looks empty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 24 minutes ago, dlbalr said: Montreal doesn't have their own second but they do have Colorado's second rounder this year from the Lehkonen/Barron trade. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 Just now, alfredoh2009 said: Don’t forget OTT lost a first round pick because of the Dadonov no-trade fiasco their prospect pipeline looks empty. They have been bad for so long, the pipeline is the furthest thing from empty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 4 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said: I had Harris there but I didn’t want to get shot down on the forum for yet again putting him on a trade proposal. Also Batherson is a late rouser that may be overachieving early in his career and may just fall down to earth later. Reading about him, I saw that he had been terrible on the defensive side of the puck. So Itonned it down. I believe that Armia would do great in OTT. If not him, Evans would be another player who would thrive in Ottawa. As for Allen. OTT’s goalie prospects are two years away from requiring waivers. Watching some of them against the Rocket didn’t show me they are knocking on the NHL yet, Korpisalo-Allen would work well for a couple of years Batherson has been succeeding in the NHL for several years... the fact he is a late rounder is no longer relevant. Hes proven to be a top6 worthy forward. This isnt a small sample size and hes gonna crash down to earth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted January 13 Author Share Posted January 13 1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said: I had Harris there but I didn’t want to get shot down on the forum for yet again putting him on a trade proposal. Also Batherson is a late rouser that may be overachieving early in his career and may just fall down to earth later. Reading about him, I saw that he had been terrible on the defensive side of the puck. So Itonned it down. I believe that Armia would do great in OTT. If not him, Evans would be another player who would thrive in Ottawa. As for Allen. OTT’s goalie prospects are two years away from requiring waivers. Watching some of them against the Rocket didn’t show me they are knocking on the NHL yet, Korpisalo-Allen would work well for a couple of years Putting Harris in a trade proposal makes some sense but he's not a core guy. They'll want better than that (think a top three d-man, top six F) in a similar age range for Batherson, not a group of lesser pieces. Armia might work in Ottawa but the fact remains that fit or not, he's a negative-value player because of his contract. They're not going to willingly take him on without being compensated to do so. How does Allen help bridge the gap to Ottawa's prospects? He's signed through 2024-25, so is Forsberg, their current backup. Adding him just means that they have three veteran goalies instead of two and are in the same situation the Habs are in now except one of them isn't a cheap youngster. They have their bridge plan to Sogaard in place already, adding Allen wouldn't change that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 Forsberg was a waiver pickup ( I believe) and his career save percentage is low. Allen was and still is a good veteran backup with the ability to steal the odd game. I believe they have one AHL goalie that may need waivers next season and the two other the season after. They have three goalies in the minors and can make a better assessment on that situation if three have a good backup for Jorpisalo. Harris is better than most of the current OTT Ds although his ceiling is not as high as some of the Sens’ prospects.He would plug some holes or them this season. Armia to OTT makes sense, specially with some dead cap coming off the books for them this summer. He or Evans would help them be more tight defensively late in the game. I don’t want to push too much this trade proposal, I agree there are too many IFs Just exaining my reasoning Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted January 13 Author Share Posted January 13 12 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said: Forsberg was a waiver pickup ( I believe) and his career save percentage is low. Allen was and still is a good veteran backup with the ability to steal the odd game. I believe they have one AHL goalie that may need waivers next season and the two other the season after. They have three goalies in the minors and can make a better assessment on that situation if three have a good backup for Jorpisalo. Harris is better than most of the current OTT Ds although his ceiling is not as high as some of the Sens’ prospects.He would plug some holes or them this season. Armia to OTT makes sense, specially with some dead cap coming off the books for them this summer. He or Evans would help them be more tight defensively late in the game. I don’t want to push too much this trade proposal, I agree there are too many IFs Just exaining my reasoning Forsberg was a waiver pickup but so was Montembeault so I'm not sure what can be gleaned from that. The fact is that they're paying him $2.75 million and it's not to be a third-stringer. Even if Allen is a small upgrade, is that the best use of another million and change in cap space? I don't think it is. If they were to trade for Allen (and I don't think they will), they'd need to offload Forsberg's contract in the trade. Sogaard is the goalie prospect of note, Mandolese and Merilainen are lower-end pieces. Sogaard is waiver-eligible in 2025-26 which is when Forsberg's contract expires and that's by design. The succession plan is in place. If you're moving a core player like Batherson, getting someone who plugs a hole on the third pairing behind Chychrun and Sanderson doesn't feel like it's worth doing. Is that the best use of a top-six guy, to get a #5 blueliner? And yes, I know the first rounder was in there but their prospect pool is still pretty strong and they're not looking to rebuild. If they don't get an impact piece, they have no reason to move him. Armia to Ottawa as an unrestricted free agent after a buyout makes some sense. Trading for him at $3.4 million makes no sense for them or anyone else. He will clear waivers next year so why would a team trade anything of value for him? For a team that's capped out (they have six or seven roster spots to fill with ~$12M of cap space next season), that's not a good use of a big chunk of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted January 13 Share Posted January 13 I think we have beaten this one to death. Go Habs Go! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 Dreger has reported that a condition of Monahan’s signing his contract was the promise that we’d trade him to a contender at the deadline. I’m surprised this hasn’t been bandied about on this site, so I’m throwing it on here. Such a trade would not rule out re-signing him as a UFA, of course, but usually once guys leave, they stay gone. This report, if true, definitely clarifies that Monahan has no special fondness for Montreal and will not take a “hometown discount” to stay here, as a few fans have (implausibly) hoped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 13 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: Dreger has reported that a condition of Monahan’s signing his contract was the promise that we’d trade him to a contender at the deadline. I’m surprised this hasn’t been bandied about on this site, so I’m throwing it on here. Such a trade would not rule out re-signing him as a UFA, of course, but usually once guys leave, they stay gone. This report, if true, definitely clarifies that Monahan has no special fondness for Montreal and will not take a “hometown discount” to stay here, as a few fans have (implausibly) hoped. the fact that he seldom gives interviews and that he has not been visible in Montreal in the off season had suggested to me he was not that "fond" of staying in MTL. Unlike Harris, PK, Caufield, Montembeault, Gallagher, ... there are quite a few players past and present that make it a point to show how much they enjoy MTL. Monahan is not one of them. I hope he fetches a great return for the team. He has been very consistent for the Habs and has never complained. A great professional Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 35 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: Dreger has reported that a condition of Monahan’s signing his contract was the promise that we’d trade him to a contender at the deadline. I’m surprised this hasn’t been bandied about on this site, so I’m throwing it on here. Such a trade would not rule out re-signing him as a UFA, of course, but usually once guys leave, they stay gone. This report, if true, definitely clarifies that Monahan has no special fondness for Montreal and will not take a “hometown discount” to stay here, as a few fans have (implausibly) hoped. HuGo was asked about this during their mid season presser and they were also asked about re-signing Monahan. I found Hughes answer to resigning Monahan to be interesting. He said that anything is possible IF Monahan is re-signed BEFORE March deadline. Maybe I’m reading too much into that but my impression is that Monahan isn’t coming back. I guess perhaps if Hughes can’t find a trade partner then they would consider re-signing. IDK 🤷♂️ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 50 minutes ago, Prime Minister Koivu said: HuGo was asked about this during their mid season presser and they were also asked about re-signing Monahan. I found Hughes answer to resigning Monahan to be interesting. He said that anything is possible IF Monahan is re-signed BEFORE March deadline. Maybe I’m reading too much into that but my impression is that Monahan isn’t coming back. I guess perhaps if Hughes can’t find a trade partner then they would consider re-signing. IDK 🤷♂️ Why would Monahan resign if the Habs could not honour his wish to play for a contender ? he would be waisting his time with the Habs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 3 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said: Why would Monahan resign if the Habs could not honour his wish to play for a contender ? he would be waisting his time with the Habs If Hughes can’t trade him or changes his mind and decides that he wants to keep Monahan, I can see it being beneficial for both sides. Habs want him because of his skill and versatility. Marty uses Monahan in every situation and he is important to the team. Monahan wants to because maybe he likes it here and the contract is good? Yeah probably not. I do expect Monahan traded at anytime but likely in March. AND that magnificent Monahan is going to get us TWO first rounds pics 🎉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted January 16 Author Share Posted January 16 1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: Dreger has reported that a condition of Monahan’s signing his contract was the promise that we’d trade him to a contender at the deadline. I’m surprised this hasn’t been bandied about on this site, so I’m throwing it on here. Such a trade would not rule out re-signing him as a UFA, of course, but usually once guys leave, they stay gone. This report, if true, definitely clarifies that Monahan has no special fondness for Montreal and will not take a “hometown discount” to stay here, as a few fans have (implausibly) hoped. It was mentioned in the rumour thread, actually. I weighed in on it on the main site the other day as well: https://www.habsworld.net/2024/01/habs-weekly-a-sluggish-attack-proves-costly/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 51 minutes ago, dlbalr said: It was mentioned in the rumour thread, actually. I weighed in on it on the main site the other day as well: https://www.habsworld.net/2024/01/habs-weekly-a-sluggish-attack-proves-costly/ if you are right, it will be underwhelming to a few fans. I believe you are right but was hoping for a late 1st: Quote I suspect they will involve what’s likely to be a late second-round pick (these will be contending teams going after him, after all) and a secondary piece (think a mid-round pick two or three years out) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 1 hour ago, Prime Minister Koivu said: I do expect Monahan traded at anytime but likely in March. AND that magnificent Monahan is going to get us TWO first rounds pics 🎉 If you are including the 1st round pick we got for taking on his contract then you might be right. It's always hard to predict how much crack the contending GM's will smoke at the trade deadline, sometimes they go crazy outbidding each other, sometimes not so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 25 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said: If you are including the 1st round pick we got for taking on his contract then you might be right. It's always hard to predict how much crack the contending GM's will smoke at the trade deadline, sometimes they go crazy outbidding each other, sometimes not so much. Yeah I was counting the ridiculously convoluted first round pick from Calgary. I think Monahan will be in demand. His versatility, PP, PK, faceoffs, Play wing, play centre. But I agree that it’s impossible to predict just how much Monahan will get. Hopefully another first Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 3 minutes ago, Prime Minister Koivu said: I think Monahan will be in demand. His versatility, PP, PK, faceoffs, Play wing, play centre. I agree, I think he will get a 1st but I was more confident of Chiarot getting a 1st because tough as nails, dependable, hard grinding defensemen who can play big minutes are always very valuable at playoff time. I think a lot of teams would come calling if Savard didn't have another year left on his contract. Even with the extra year I think there will be some interest and if the Habs retained 50% (doubtful) on the last year of his contract then there would a lot of interest BUT they only have 1 retention spot left so they have to be careful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted January 17 Share Posted January 17 8 hours ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said: I agree, I think he will get a 1st but I was more confident of Chiarot getting a 1st ... Really? I thought was overpay for Chiarot and a 1st for him was a big surprise for me. dlbalr already looked at contenders with 1st round picks and guessed Monahan return will be more like a late 2nd & 3rd picks or thereabouts (if i recall correctly) Allen also may get a 2nd from someone am guessing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted January 17 Share Posted January 17 50 minutes ago, DON said: Really? I thought was overpay for Chiarot and a 1st for him was a big surprise for me. dlbalr already looked at contenders with 1st round picks and guessed Monahan return will be more like a late 2nd & 3rd picks or thereabouts (if i recall correctly) Allen also may get a 2nd from someone am guessing. Of course it was an overpay, that's what GM's usually do (not always) at the trade deadline, they overpay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted January 17 Share Posted January 17 here is a more plausible trade proposal, but still not a perfect fit: to TBL: Monahan ($1.985M) and Nicolas Beaudin (AHL), with some salary retention to make the trade work for TBL to MTL: Isaac Howard (19yr old, 2022 31st overall) Montreal send Monahan to a contender, gets a late 1st rounder with decent offensive potential; this seems like the 2nd round pick reported on rumors TBL gets a very good forward that will help them in the playoffs. They also get a depth LD fo bolster their depleted LD pool. Beaudin asked for a trade and this should make him happy. He has more value than Norlinder would have, the move clears a contract slot for the Habs although it brings TBL to 46 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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