2023 draft, Pick 5: David Reinbacher

[tomh009]

Let's do separate threads for each pick.

[tomh009]

And for some insight into why the Habs might have been very high on Reinbacher, it's worth reading Thibaud Chatel's blog entry. His company tracks the teams in the Swiss National League, and he believes that Reinbacher was by far the best D-man in the draft. Not only that, he thinks that Reinbacher's ceiling is an elite defenceman, top 10% (ie top 18) in the league, so a very solid #1.

 

Quote

We think he is a modern case of a rounded defenseman, so mature that he was worth a top10 pick in any given year. Like Nemec and Jiricek were last year. Or Seider before them, who caught some fire for Detroit selecting him so high.

 

It's worth reading:

https://thibaudchatel.substack.com/p/what-montreal-sees-in-david-reinbacher?utm_source=profile&utm_medium=reader2

[alfredoh2009]

I am really happy about this pick. I looked at the projected line-up for the 2024-2025 season and the Habs seem to be trending towards a competitive and exciting team.

 

What is there not to like with Barron, Mailloux, Reinbacher and Kovacevic on RD? If they continue to develop, Habs are set for a while on RD.

 

 

[alfredoh2009]

yes, I remember the reactions then:

 

I will say this:

I was LIVID when the Habs picked Price instead of Gilbert Brulé LOL!

Ironically, everyone then was like "WHY?! we already have Theodore"

...sounds kinda familiar.

— HABSGIFS® (@HabsGifs) June 29, 2023

 

[GHT120]

From the Journal de Montreal ... some first-hand observations about the Habs' top pick (tweaked to smooth out linguistic differences).
 

Quebecer Éric Faille has played with David Reinbacher for two years in Switzerland, with the Kloten organization. Until now, he had refused virtually all media requests to provide his opinion on the potential draftee.

 

He changed his mind when Reinbacher was selected fifth overall by the Montreal Canadiens on Wednesday. He witnessed a wave of negative reactions from disappointed fans, who were not ready to give the pick a chance, too upset at having seen Kent Hughes pass on Matvei Michkov.

 

"I hope everyone in Montreal will calm down a little and appreciate David for the player he is," Faille said in an interview with the TVASports.ca. “I hope the fans will see the big picture, the player he can become. It's sad to see a young person being drafted in Montreal and receiving this kind of reaction..."

Reinbacher is not Michkov. Two players couldn't be more different. But in his own way, he is a prospect with very high potential, recalled Faille. 

 

The Austrian was hardly on the radar of National League teams last year. His rise has been meteoric and there is no indication that he is about to stop.

"He's such an underrated player," said Faille, former member of the Acadie-Bathurst Titan and Toronto Marlies, among others. “He has come a long way; we're talking about a guy that people saw coming out around the third round last year. He is now fifth overall. I've been around him in the last two years and I've seen an incredible progression. At 17-18 years old, he was playing against men and he was our best defender. In my book, Canadians did not make a mistake with their choice."

 

As Reinbacher rose to each challenge posed to him, Kloten's staff then increased his responsibilities. His development continued throughout the year. Reinbacher was always asking for more.

 

"All year, he took a step, he took a step, he took a step," Faille said. We fed him, we fed him, we fed him and he always wanted more."

The main criticisms directed at Reinbacher revolve his offensive skills.

 

"He was the one who quarterbacked our powerplay at 18 years old," replied Faille when confronted with that criticism.” Against men, in one of the best leagues in Europe. His offensive potential, it's there. He even has a certain flair."

 

…

 

Faille had a little discussion with his teammate about <the Montreal media/fanbase after there was criticism of his performance at the Draft Combine>. 

 

"I told him, 'Big guy, it is like that in Montreal. You're going to have to ignore it. Perform on the ice and they're going to be on your side.'"

Reinbacher is shy/reserved. But he is a man on the ice and he should not be distracted in the great metropolis of Quebec.

 

"He's very, very humble," Faille said. “He's a down-to-earth guy, he's not going to think he's someone else. He puts on his gear and he works hard. He's humble, but he's a confidant on ice."
 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

2 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

I am really happy about this pick. I looked at the projected line-up for the 2024-2025 season and the Habs seem to be trending towards a competitive and exciting team.

 

What is there not to like with Barron, Mailloux, Reinbacher and Kovacevic on RD? If they continue to develop, Habs are set for a while on RD.

 

 

I can't say that I am happy or unhappy with the pick, maybe surprised more than anything. I will have a better idea in a couple years. I went into this draft hoping to get a stud centre to play with Suzuki.  Either Hughes thought differently or the price to move up was too high. If Dach develops into the center we hope he does and Reinbacher becomes a shut down 1st pairing defenseman then it was a good pick. I definitely see the potential for an excellent defense with Mailloux quarterbacking the power play and hopefully Reinbacher being the shut down guy on the right side. Potentially Reinbacher and Hutson might be a good pairing. 

[huzer]

The Habs selected the player I thought they would. My personal "in my head" mock draft, had them moving to 7 to do it. I went with the consensus and figured they would get 7/22, and had them selecting Sale with 22. Obviously a trade down meant Arizona taking Reinbacher, which forced their hand the stay put. Hughes did shoot himself in the foot a little with the "if he was lefty" comment. The immediately screams need no matter how hard he tries to backpedal.

 

Of course, I say all of that, and my selections are basically based on various projections and scouting lists. I'm not a scout, and I watched a handful of various JR games this year, so my "mock" is worth absolutely zero. 

 

 

[alfredoh2009]

57 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

I can't say that I am happy or unhappy with the pick, maybe surprised more than anything. I will have a better idea in a couple years. I went into this draft hoping to get a stud centre to play with Suzuki.  Either Hughes thought differently or the price to move up was too high. If Dach develops into the center we hope he does and Reinbacher becomes a shut down 1st pairing defenseman then it was a good pick. I definitely see the potential for an excellent defense with Mailloux quarterbacking the power play and hopefully Reinbacher being the shut down guy on the right side. Potentially Reinbacher and Hutson might be a good pairing. 

 

I think that Newhook is the type of forward they wanted, already an NHL top-9 that will probably become a mainstay on the Habs top-6.

 

They didn't need to drop to get Reinbacher, probably because the offers were not that great for their 5th pick, so they used the pick to draft the player they wanted.

 

Overall I am happy because they got a young NHL player still developing and the best RHD available in the draft. That is very good for the team.

[REV-G]

1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

yes, I remember the reactions then:

 

 

Actually that was exactly my reaction when they drafted Price. Not livid, but very disappointed. But that turned around pretty quickly in the following years. Let's hope that this will be the same scenario with "The Doctor".....DR! 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

I’m glad to see the next-morning commentary has cooled down a little.

 

I also appreciate the point about what effect the hysterically negative reaction (not primarily on this site, but from Habs fans throughout the internet) might have on an 18-year-old’s psyche. He is probably nervous enough about the way his life is about to blow up. Now he has to deal with the thought that he is Public Enemy Number One in a city that should be embracing him.

 

Two more thoughts:

 

(1) On the BPA thing: I think Hughes let the cat out of the bag that they drafted him BECAUSE he is RHD. 

 

On reflection, though, ‘drafting for position’ can take on a different inflection depending on why it’s done. One scenario is: you lack talent at a certain position in your system, so you draft with that in mind. The other is: you recognize that it is exceptionally difficult to find impact players at a certain specific position, and so you take advantage of an opportunity to do it at the draft. 

 

The latter is more defensible than the former. If there is a shortage of high-end RHD throughout the hockey world, then a GM who drafts one is giving himself a structural competitive advantage. Bumping a RHD a 2-3 spots up the draft board is analogous to picking a C over a W, because he’s a C. The position has value as such.

 

I still don’t agree, but drafting for a position of league-wide shortage is at least more defensible than drafting for position in the more straightforward (or simple-minded) manner of “filling organizational holes.”

 

(2) Does this pick say anything about how the organization views Mailloux? On the one hand, they may be seeing Mailloux as a second-pairing guy, with Reinbacher the top-pairing stud RHD. On the other, it might mean that they are lukewarm about Mailloux altogether and decided they need to supercede him in the RHD prospect pool. Just wondering.

 

 

[alfredoh2009]

56 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

I’m glad to see the next-morning commentary has cooled down a little.

 

I also appreciate the point about what effect the hysterically negative reaction (not primarily on this site, but from Habs fans throughout the internet) might have on an 18-year-old’s psyche. He is probably nervous enough about the way his life is about to blow up. Now he has to deal with the thought that he is Public Enemy Number One in a city that should be embracing him.

 

Two more thoughts:

 

(1) On the BPA thing: I think Hughes let the cat out of the bag that they drafted him BECAUSE he is RHD. 

 

On reflection, though, ‘drafting for position’ can take on a different inflection depending on why it’s done. One scenario is: you lack talent at a certain position in your system, so you draft with that in mind. The other is: you recognize that it is exceptionally difficult to find impact players at a certain specific position, and so you take advantage of an opportunity to do it at the draft. 

 

The latter is more defensible than the former. If there is a shortage of high-end RHD throughout the hockey world, then a GM who drafts one is giving himself a structural competitive advantage. Bumping a RHD a 2-3 spots up the draft board is analogous to picking a C over a W, because he’s a C. The position has value as such.

 

I still don’t agree, but drafting for a position of league-wide shortage is at least more defensible than drafting for position in the more straightforward (or simple-minded) manner of “filling organizational holes.”

 

(2) Does this pick say anything about how the organization views Mailloux? On the one hand, they may be seeing Mailloux as a second-pairing guy, with Reinbacher the top-pairing stud RHD. On the other, it might mean that they are lukewarm about Mailloux altogether and decided they need to supercede him in the RHD prospect pool. Just wondering.

 

 

 

I thought Mailloux had higher projected point productions than Guhle, Harris.

... on par with Barron? not sure there.

 

 

[GHT120]

27 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

I thought Mailloux had higher projected point productions than Guhle, Harris.

... on par with Barron? not sure there.

 

Mailloux's projections when drafted were difficult because he had played only 4 OHL games at that point ... comparing their "after-drafted" seasons not much more useful ... Mailloux only got in 12 games (sitting out half the season until re-instated and then injured shortly thereafter) with 3 goals and 6 assists in 12 games; Baron missed much of the season and went 33-8-23 ... Mailloux certainly has a breakout season last year but no direct comparison possible as Barron was in the AHL in his second year after drafted.

[Colin]

There are those out there that project Reinbacher to be the second best player in the draft. If you have doubts, or if you think they drafted positionally instead of BPA, consider that info. 

[alfredoh2009]

6 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

Mailloux's projections when drafted were difficult because he had played only 4 OHL games at that point ... comparing their "after-drafted" seasons not much more useful ... Mailloux only got in 12 games (sitting out half the season until re-instated and then injured shortly thereafter) with 3 goals and 6 assists in 12 games; Baron missed much of the season and went 33-8-23 ... Mailloux certainly has a breakout season last year but no direct comparison possible as Barron was in the AHL in his second year after drafted.

I am sure I saw a report on Mailloux, somewhere. Consensus was that he was freewheeling and looking to score most of the time and that his defensive game had to be built since he had not played much. I thought his production potential was always high.

I have not checked Barron's numbers, but if I remember correctly, he was seen as having less point production potential than Mailloux.

but heck, you are probably right

[GHT120]

Just now, alfredoh2009 said:

I am sure I saw a report on Mailloux, somewhere. Consensus was that he was freewheeling and looking to score most of the time and that his defensive game had to be built since he had not played much. I thought his production potential was always high.

I have not checked Barron's numbers, but if I remember correctly, he was seen as having less point production potential than Mailloux.

but heck, you are probably right

The current reports I've seen have been that Mailloux's defence definitely needs to "catch up" to his offence ... going forward I have lower offensive expectations for Barron than Mailloux based on all reports.

[dlbalr]

1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

(2) Does this pick say anything about how the organization views Mailloux? On the one hand, they may be seeing Mailloux as a second-pairing guy, with Reinbacher the top-pairing stud RHD. On the other, it might mean that they are lukewarm about Mailloux altogether and decided they need to supercede him in the RHD prospect pool. Just wondering.

 

The concern with Mailloux is that he might be one of those offence-first, defence-optional players.  The raw tools are there for him to have success as an offence-first player but they often have limitations.  Internally, he might be viewed as a third-pairing option at the moment.

 

38 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

I thought Mailloux had higher projected point productions than Guhle, Harris.

... on par with Barron? not sure there.

 

Mailloux, if he pans out, should be higher than those players for point totals.

[alfredoh2009]

Just now, dlbalr said:

 

The concern with Mailloux is that he might be one of those offence-first, defence-optional players.  The raw tools are there for him to have success as an offence-first player but they often have limitations.  Internally, he might be viewed as a third-pairing option at the moment.

 

 

Mailloux, if he pans out, should be higher than those players for point totals.

thanks, that is what I remembered

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

1 hour ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

 

Two more thoughts:

 

(1) On the BPA thing: I think Hughes let the cat out of the bag that they drafted him BECAUSE he is RHD. 

 

On reflection, though, ‘drafting for position’ can take on a different inflection depending on why it’s done. One scenario is: you lack talent at a certain position in your system, so you draft with that in mind. The other is: you recognize that it is exceptionally difficult to find impact players at a certain specific position, and so you take advantage of an opportunity to do it at the draft. 

 

The latter is more defensible than the former. If there is a shortage of high-end RHD throughout the hockey world, then a GM who drafts one is giving himself a structural competitive advantage. Bumping a RHD a 2-3 spots up the draft board is analogous to picking a C over a W, because he’s a C. The position has value as such.

 

I still don’t agree, but drafting for a position of league-wide shortage is at least more defensible than drafting for position in the more straightforward (or simple-minded) manner of “filling organizational holes.”

 

(2) Does this pick say anything about how the organization views Mailloux? On the one hand, they may be seeing Mailloux as a second-pairing guy, with Reinbacher the top-pairing stud RHD. On the other, it might mean that they are lukewarm about Mailloux altogether and decided they need to supercede him in the RHD prospect pool. Just wondering.

 

 

 

Some good points. Did Hughes let the cat out of the bag that they drafted him because he is a RHD?  Yes and no. He said that if he was a LHD they might not have been as interested which makes perfect sense because the Habs are stacked with young LHD. There is a log jam there. It would make no sense to draft another one with your first pick unless it's Bobby Orr. He said previously that if it was close between prospects than positional need would break the tie as it did in this case. 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

19 minutes ago, Colin said:

There are those out there that project Reinbacher to be the second best player in the draft. If you have doubts, or if you think they drafted positionally instead of BPA, consider that info. 

 

Who thinks this, though? The scouting reports I saw online generally had him listed in the 7-11 range. If he was the 2nd best BPA, wouldn't he have been ranked more highly?

[dlbalr]

3 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

Who thinks this, though? The scouting reports I saw online generally had him listed in the 7-11 range. If he was the 2nd best BPA, wouldn't he have been ranked more highly?

 

The 2nd-best player in the draft comment probably comes from here: https://thibaudchatel.substack.com/p/what-montreal-sees-in-david-reinbacher

[Prime Minister Koivu]

It’s another swing for the fences type pick - just like Slafkovsky was. 
 

Imagine a franchise cornerstone Dman as effective as Weber was in his prime. We would be set for 15 years at a position that’s tough to fill. 
 

Both Slafkovsky and Reinbacher picks will be judged in a few years. 
 

Im good with the swing for the fences picks. 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

2 hours ago, Prime Minister Koivu said:

It’s another swing for the fences type pick - just like Slafkovsky was. 
 

Imagine a franchise cornerstone Dman as effective as Weber was in his prime. We would be set for 15 years at a position that’s tough to fill. 
 

Both Slafkovsky and Reinbacher picks will be judged in a few years. 
 

Im good with the swing for the fences picks. 

 

Wouldn't Michkov have been the true "swing for the fences" pick? He's the guy that many scouts seem to see as a potential superstar. 

[alfredoh2009]

3 hours ago, Prime Minister Koivu said:

It’s another swing for the fences type pick - just like Slafkovsky was. 
 

Imagine a franchise cornerstone Dman as effective as Weber was in his prime. We would be set for 15 years at a position that’s tough to fill. 
 

Both Slafkovsky and Reinbacher picks will be judged in a few years. 
 

Im good with the swing for the fences picks. 

 

a bit premature to be comparing David... [*] to Weber, isn't it

 

[Prime Minister Koivu]

2 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Wouldn't Michkov have been the true "swing for the fences" pick? He's the guy that many scouts seem to see as a potential superstar. 

While true, Michkov comes with baggage. Contract/Getting screwed by Putin plus there are strong questions about his level of cherry picking.  
 

Too much risk 

 

 

39 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

 

a bit premature to be comparing David... [*] to Weber, isn't it

 

 

Sure, at this point it’s just hope but if you never swing for the fences then you will never get a home run. 
 

Let’s reevaluate in 3-4 years

[Habsfan89]

Can't believe they're people not liking this pick SMH. Last five team's to win the cup all had big strong two way Dman on the there D.  We draft a big need that's hard to come by, a big strong RHD.

 

  Goal scorers are easy to draft, trade for, sign in free agency.  

 

Man our D is going to be one tough Dcore in the next few years maybe the best we have ever had in the last 30 years.

 

Guhle  /  Reinbacher 

Hutson / Xhekaj 

Harris  /  Barron

 

That's a solid Dcore