BCHabnut Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Its not fair to judge Cunneyworth after one game. We need to give him 10 to 15 games to see what he will do. That said, this is not a good team. Bowman couldn't turn this mess into a contender. I was joking. Nobody will make a silk purse from a cow's ear. This team is a cow's ear right now. I like some of the youth, but the vets are all junk this year. Cole is the only one playing well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted December 18, 2011 Author Share Posted December 18, 2011 That's the risk of promoting an assistant who also played under martin. Are we really seeing any change???? It's something I plan to discuss in a bit of detail in the HW Recap tomorrow but it's going to be a little while before we see any real changes. Certainly longer than one practice after just getting hit with the news. One change we did see was Cammalleri coming off the penalty kill at least so some tweaks are at least being looked at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lovett's Magnatones Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Like traded or Lokomotiv style? I think a major move is coming. Way too many defensemen in the pipeline, cap issues for next year, the team blows, all these are good reasons for a trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 seeing a carryover of the same shit as under Martin. Darche with more ice time then AK46, Cole, Leblanc, MaxPac, Cole, DD, Cammy and Eller. Yeah he played a 5 minutes or so SH, but that should mean he gets less even strength time. That's the risk of promoting an assistant who also played under martin. Are we really seeing any change???? :lol: So now when Cunneyworth loses it's Martin's fault!!! Like I said ad nauseum, those who quarreled with specific moment-to-moment decisions under Martin will NEVER BE HAPPY under any new coach because that coach will ALSO make specific moment-to-moment decisions they don't like. Get used to it. In any case, I didn't like what I saw tonight - less structure than under JM - but the road trip will be the real crucible in which Cunneyworth instils his system and we start to get a read on how things will turn out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 I'm specifically referring to the use of darche. That was something I thought would change - HAD TO CHANGE with any new coach even one who had been an assistant and captain under Martin. Can ANYONE see us bein successful when Darche gets the 2nd most minutes of any forward (pleks had the most). If matheau friggin Darche continues to get the 2nd most ice time among forwards, we WILL calling for 15th or 16th in the conference. :lol: So now when Cunneyworth loses it's Martin's fault!!! Like I said ad nauseum, those who quarreled with specific moment-to-moment decisions under Martin will NEVER BE HAPPY under any new coach because that coach will ALSO make specific moment-to-moment decisions they don't like. Get used to it. In any case, I didn't like what I saw tonight - less structure than under JM - but the road trip will be the real crucible in which Cunneyworth instils his system and we start to get a read on how things will turn out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 :lol: So now when Cunneyworth loses it's Martin's fault!!! Like I said ad nauseum, those who quarreled with specific moment-to-moment decisions under Martin will NEVER BE HAPPY under any new coach because that coach will ALSO make specific moment-to-moment decisions they don't like. Get used to it. In any case, I didn't like what I saw tonight - less structure than under JM - but the road trip will be the real crucible in which Cunneyworth instils his system and we start to get a read on how things will turn out. I've been harsh on the longer passes on the breakout... but in fairness the team has only had one morning skate and 0 full practices with it. I do think it will be a little better when they work on it and the passes are crisper. In fairness to Darche, he actually had a good game tonight. Very good on the PK (which accounted for a lot of his minutes) and was in front of the net on Eller's goal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Should he be getting the 2nd most minutes among forwards?????? I've been harsh on the longer passes on the breakout... but in fairness the team has only had one morning skate and 0 full practices with it. I do think it will be a little better when they work on it and the passes are crisper. In fairness to Darche, he actually had a good game tonight. Very good on the PK (which accounted for a lot of his minutes) and was in front of the net on Eller's goal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 No as I said in the other thread... 19+ minutes is far too much. He should be around 14 or 15 though given who is dressed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Dismal third period. Here's my review. http://aconcernedfan.com/?p=77 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTH Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 I'm specifically referring to the use of darche. That was something I thought would change - HAD TO CHANGE with any new coach even one who had been an assistant and captain under Martin. Can ANYONE see us bein successful when Darche gets the 2nd most minutes of any forward (pleks had the most). If matheau friggin Darche continues to get the 2nd most ice time among forwards, we WILL calling for 15th or 16th in the conference. Didn't Carbonneau and Gainey also use Darche on the powerplay? He must be the biggest suck up in the Canadiens locker room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Didn't Carbonneau and Gainey also use Darche on the powerplay? He must be the biggest suck up in the Canadiens locker room. Darche didn't sign with the Habs until Martins first season. Even then he didn't make it to the big club until half way through that year. It was Smolinski who Carbo used to put on the PP and drove me nuts. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Darche didn't sign with the Habs until Martins first season. Even then he didn't make it to the big club until half way through that year. It was Smolinski who Carbo used to put on the PP and drove me nuts. He was the only forward with a right shot at the time I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMMR Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 No as I said in the other thread... 19+ minutes is far too much. He should be around 14 or 15 though given who is dressed. Disagree Lets say you play the entire game ES that would mean 180 mins for forwards to play which is never the case. Here are guys that should be getting to 20 mins well before Darche. I never wish for injuries but if anyone here wants the Habs to make the playoffs they will wish for Darche to go OFS Plekanec 20+ Cammalleri 20+ Eller 20+ Leblanc 20+ Kostitsyn 20+ Pacioretty 20+ Cole 20+ On the bright side if he plays 19ish mins the Habs will lose a lot maybe enough for dead last (I dream of this) Decharnais 20+ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illWill Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Over 19 minutes for Darche????? FIRE CUNNEYWORTH!!!!!!! Lol, just kidding.........but not really Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 this was exactly the point I was making. It makes ZERO sense for Darche to get the second most minutes among forwards. It's only Cunneyworth's first game, but his use of Darche is pretty damning in judging his competence. I get he needs time to make adjustments, but other then Martin, name me one other coach in the league that would give Douche more time then Maxpac, Cole, DD, AK46, Eller, Cammy, or even a rookie like Leblanc???? You often hear the expression about players having all the tools, but no toolbox, that's the way I feel about a lot of the decisions from the Habs coaching staff the past couple of years. Disagree Lets say you play the entire game ES that would mean 180 mins for forwards to play which is never the case. Here are guys that should be getting to 20 mins well before Darche. I never wish for injuries but if anyone here wants the Habs to make the playoffs they will wish for Darche to go OFS Plekanec 20+ Cammalleri 20+ Eller 20+ Leblanc 20+ Kostitsyn 20+ Pacioretty 20+ Cole 20+ On the bright side if he plays 19ish mins the Habs will lose a lot maybe enough for dead last (I dream of this) Decharnais 20+ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyhasbeen Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 I am living in fear that we lose Cole for 2-3 for his hit to the head. Any word on possible discipline? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyhasbeen Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Over 19 minutes for Darche????? FIRE CUNNEYWORTH!!!!!!! Lol, just kidding.........but not really LOL I was going to start a fire Cunneywothless thread! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted December 18, 2011 Author Share Posted December 18, 2011 I am living in fear that we lose Cole for 2-3 for his hit to the head. Any word on possible discipline? Early reports suggest there will be no supplemental discipline for Cole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Won't be holding my breath given what has been suspendable. I think we end up losing Cole and lucid gets a free pass like phaneuf did. Early reports suggest there will be no supplemental discipline for Cole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyhasbeen Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Early reports suggest there will be no supplemental discipline for Cole. Hope that sticks. Lose Cole for 3 and we won't win until after Christmas.... Very surprised by this, as he did smoke him in the head. You could tell Eric was crapping his pants in the penalty box. He realized the possibilty I think and knew where it would leave the team. Darche on the second! Lose Cole for 3 now and I may join the "we are doomed" camp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 On this Drache thing...I agree that he is a marginal NHLer, but there is also a wider pattern of coaches on this team using such players on the PP and in offensive situations. Carbo used Smolinski and Metropolit on the PP; this was one of the key things that generated fan outrage and was widely cited in his firing. Then Gainey came aboard as coach, and eventually started using Metropolit on the PP again. Next, there was JM and his (occasional and grossly exagerrated) 'over-use' of Darche and Moen. Now Cunneyworth. To me, what this suggests is not that all our coaches are drooling hockey-ignorant idiots, but rather that the coaches have information or concerns of which we fans are not aware. In the first place, fans who rave about player X being used instead of player Y often are utterly oblivious to context (e.g., whether player Y was just on the shift before, that sort of thing). Beyond that, my own guess is that the coaches are going with the player who actually does what the coach wants. I will bet money, for instance, that when JM used Moen or Drache in offensive situations it was because those were the only guys who were actually driving to the net or going to the dirty areas in the way he was demanding. As a coach, at that point you have a choice: accept that the players aren't listening and let them do whatever they want and probably lose as a result, or go with the guys who are listening. I guarantee you that 99% of the angry fans would choose the latter if they were in the coach's shoes. This is why the incessant bitching about specific coaching decision X or Y is just tiresome noise IMHO. It lacks the necessary context to make sense of the decisions in question, and then blames the coach for that. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 On this Drache thing...I agree that he is a marginal NHLer, but there is also a wider pattern of coaches on this team using such players on the PP and in offensive situations. Carbo used Smolinski and Metropolit on the PP; this was one of the key things that generated fan outrage and was widely cited in his firing. Then Gainey came aboard as coach, and eventually started using Metropolit on the PP again. Next, there was JM and his (occasional and grossly exagerrated) 'over-use' of Darche and Moen. Now Cunneyworth. To me, what this suggests is not that all our coaches are drooling hockey-ignorant idiots, but rather that the coaches have information or concerns of which we fans are not aware. In the first place, fans who rave about player X being used instead of player Y often are utterly oblivious to context (e.g., whether player Y was just on the shift before, that sort of thing). Beyond that, my own guess is that the coaches are going with the player who actually does what the coach wants. I will bet money, for instance, that when JM used Moen or Drache in offensive situations it was because those were the only guys who were actually driving to the net or going to the dirty areas in the way he was demanding. As a coach, at that point you have a choice: accept that the players aren't listening and let them do whatever they want and probably lose as a result, or go with the guys who are listening. I guarantee you that 99% of the angry fans would choose the latter if they were in the coach's shoes. This is why the incessant bitching about specific coaching decision X or Y is just tiresome noise IMHO. It lacks the necessary context to make sense of the decisions in question, and then blames the coach for that. A shame, but probably true. If only the players we need to play well wanted the NHL as much as does Darche... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brobin Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Not a huge fan of Darche either, but don't forget Moen is out. While everyone loves their young kid of choice, the fact is all of them are the same. Small, inexperienced. If Moen was playing, Darche would get a lot fewer minutes. Okay, some are not small, but frankly most of them are "skill players", not grinders. Frankly, this team really needs a grinding, nasty 3rd or 4th line that other teams hate to play against. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 Not a huge fan of Darche either, but don't forget Moen is out. While everyone loves their young kid of choice, the fact is all of them are the same. Small, inexperienced. If Moen was playing, Darche would get a lot fewer minutes. Okay, some are not small, but frankly most of them are "skill players", not grinders. Frankly, this team really needs a grinding, nasty 3rd or 4th line that other teams hate to play against. I hate to point out that we had that guy in Maxime Lapierre. I just don't understand why this organization has been in such a rush to toss away perfectly good 3rd/4th liners. It's puzzling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazy26 Posted December 18, 2011 Share Posted December 18, 2011 I hate to point out that we had that guy in Maxime Lapierre. I just don't understand why this organization has been in such a rush to toss away perfectly good 3rd/4th liners. It's puzzling. I agree, but wasn't Max's problem that he wanted to be more than a 4th liner? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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