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Permanent Trade Proposal Thread


dlbalr
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22 minutes ago, PMAC said:

 Now if they offered Petry, two 2nds and a prospect not listed in the previous proposal say, Mailoux, it might be ok for Montreal, Jersey not so much. 

 

On another site there was an article on trading for New Jersey's 2nd and Mailloux was part of the deal. That makes sense to me for a few reasons;

1) Hughes  says character is extremely important and I think he is not completely sold on Mailloux being here although he won't say that publicly

2) Mailloux showed in his very short season with London that there is a lot of potential and skill  there and he might have significant  value in a deal

3) If would be much better for Mailloux to be away from the media glare in Montreal

 

It wouldn't shock me to see Mailloux traded if the right deal came along. 

 

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2 hours ago, DON said:

But, if dlbalr thinks 0% this happening, id buy that. Just idea someone else floated out there, as who knows what kind of splash new mgmt willing to make.

 

NJ has said they're willing to entertain offers for the pick which is basically what everyone says.  But for a deal to make sense for the Devils, they need a core player with four or five years of team control.  Someone in the Hughes/Hischier age bracket that fits the timeline of their core.  Kevin Fiala's name is out there speculatively but that makes no sense for New Jersey; even if he signed a long-term deal, Slafkovsky's upside is probably about the same as Fiala's current production so why trade seven cheaper years for six or seven above-market years at a similar level of production?  It needs to be a core 20-23-year-old to worth doing and Montreal doesn't have any of those they're willing to part with.  Few teams (if any) do.

 

38 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

On another site there was an article on trading for New Jersey's 2nd and Mailloux was part of the deal. That makes sense to me for a few reasons;

1) Hughes  says character is extremely important and I think he is not completely sold on Mailloux being here although he won't say that publicly

2) Mailloux showed in his very short season with London that there is a lot of potential and skill  there and he might have significant  value in a deal

3) If would be much better for Mailloux to be away from the media glare in Montreal

 

It wouldn't shock me to see Mailloux traded if the right deal came along. 

 

I don't think it would shock anyone.  But Mailloux's value hasn't been built up high enough to be viewed as a primary asset in a trade for the second-overall pick.  Independently, his max trade value is probably an early 2nd which reflects where he was drafted, the lack of playing time, and all of the other stuff going on.  Before the draft, there were reports that around half the teams in the league had him at DND status which doesn't help in terms of maximizing trade value either.  His inclusion in a package isn't going to yield a top asset. 

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9 minutes ago, dlbalr said:

... Slafkovsky's upside is probably about the same as Fiala's current production so why trade seven cheaper years for six or seven above-market years at a similar level of production?  ...

I am not arguing any of the proposed deals would work ... but the unknown that relates to the above is how patient NJD ownership is willing to be ... 5 playoff games in 10 years ... Fitzgerald may be on a short leash.

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19 minutes ago, dlbalr said:

I don't think it would shock anyone.  But Mailloux's value hasn't been built up high enough to be viewed as a primary asset in a trade for the second-overall pick.  Independently, his max trade value is probably an early 2nd which reflects where he was drafted, the lack of playing time, and all of the other stuff going on.  Before the draft, there were reports that around half the teams in the league had him at DND status which doesn't help in terms of maximizing trade value either.  His inclusion in a package isn't going to yield a top asset. 

 

I wasn't saying he would be the primary asset in a trade for a second overall pick only that it wouldn't surprise me if he was traded or included as part of a larger deal.  I think his value based on what he has shown in his limited play with London is higher than that of an early second round pick. 

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9 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

I am not arguing any of the proposed deals would work ... but the unknown that relates to the above is how patient NJD ownership is willing to be ... 5 playoff games in 10 years ... Fitzgerald may be on a short leash.

 

Fair point, the fact that they advertised they are willing to trade the 2nd overall pick indicates they are willing to accelerate the rebuilding process.  But again, it will be expensive and likely not going to happen. 

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12 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

I am not arguing any of the proposed deals would work ... but the unknown that relates to the above is how patient NJD ownership is willing to be ... 5 playoff games in 10 years ... Fitzgerald may be on a short leash.

 

I certainly think there's some level of impatience with how long they've been out of the playoffs but they didn't take the plunge on firing the coach so I think there's a bit of patience remaining.  If it was all about winning now, they'd be among the teams trying to hire Trotz and looking for the quick fix.

 

6 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

I wasn't saying he would be the primary asset in a trade for a second overall pick only that it wouldn't surprise me if he was traded or included as part of a larger deal.  I think his value based on what he has shown in his limited play with London is higher than that of an early second round pick. 

 

I hope you're right about his value but 12 games is a really small sample size, even if they were mostly good games.  That's less than a month worth of playing time.  I look at it as he's a very raw prospect who has hardly played in two years and thus his development is well behind where it should be relative to a high-picked player coming off his D+1 year.  That usually hurts trade value, not helps it, especially with what happened before which also absolutely affects his value.  Now, if he has a few good months to start next season and shows that it's not just a small sample size variance, then his value will start to go in the right direction.  If I'm another GM interested in him, I need to see more before committing to trading for him.

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3 hours ago, DON said:

But, if trade Habs 1st next year. The whole tank thing for another year goes away and we can all pull for Habs to do as well as possible.

Sens at 7 i heard may be willing to move pick, but seem in same boat as Habs, so non starter.

 

But, if dlbalr thinks 0% this happening, id buy that. Just idea someone else floated out there, as who knows what kind of splash new mgmt willing to make.

We don’t need to TRY and tank next year. We’ll probably easily be at least a bottom 10 team next -  likely worse than that.

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16 minutes ago, dlbalr said:

 

I certainly think there's some level of impatience with how long they've been out of the playoffs but they didn't take the plunge on firing the coach so I think there's a bit of patience remaining.  If it was all about winning now, they'd be among the teams trying to hire Trotz and looking for the quick fix.

 

 

I hope you're right about his value but 12 games is a really small sample size, even if they were mostly good games.  That's less than a month worth of playing time.  I look at it as he's a very raw prospect who has hardly played in two years and thus his development is well behind where it should be relative to a high-picked player coming off his D+1 year.  That usually hurts trade value, not helps it, especially with what happened before which also absolutely affects his value.  Now, if he has a few good months to start next season and shows that it's not just a small sample size variance, then his value will start to go in the right direction.  If I'm another GM interested in him, I need to see more before committing to trading for him.

 

No question he is raw and needs a lot more development. I also remember reading quotes from anonymous scouts who saw him play in London saying things like "he could be another Brett Burns"  , "he is Montreal's best prospect". 

 

Obviously still a lot of question marks with Mailloux but I think his potential is intriguing and he has certainly been noticed by other teams. 

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2 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

We don’t need to TRY and tank next year. We’ll probably easily be at least a bottom 10 team next -  likely worse than that.

Probably easily be bottom 10... likely worse than that.

Not sure how you live in such a sea of negativity.:1vomit:

You could be correct (likely are), but without knowing what happens over next 4 months, is putting cart before horse.

 

Caufield/Suzuki likely do better, Wright should be good for 15-20g, Edmundson should be healthy in October, Guhle-Harris-Barron-Schueneman should be interesting group...Gallagher-Armia cant do worse can they? Trade or not Petry or his replacement should be upgrade on Petry version 21-22.

 

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29 minutes ago, DON said:

Probably easily be bottom 10... likely worse than that.

Not sure how you live in such a sea of negativity.:1vomit:

You could be correct (likely are), but without knowing what happens over next 4 months, is putting cart before horse.

 

Caufield/Suzuki likely do better, Wright should be good for 15-20g, Edmundson should be healthy in October, Guhle-Harris-Barron-Schueneman should be interesting group...Gallagher-Armia cant do worse can they? Trade or not Petry or his replacement should be upgrade on Petry version 21-22.

 

I think our offence will be better than this year (if it wasn’t for DD, I think we would have at least 40 to 50 more goals). But I wouldn’t be penciling in Wright for 15-20 goals. No idea how ready he is.

 

the issue is the D. Even with a Petry resurgence or upgrade. We have a crap D that needs to be rebuild. Maybe Guhke, or someone else surprises, but we still have a scary D. A scary D with two aging  goalies making around $13m that haven’t been able to stay healthy, doesn’t leave room for much optimism.

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1 hour ago, hab29RETIRED said:

 But I wouldn’t be penciling in Wright for 15-20 goals. No idea how ready he is.

 

the issue is the D. Even with a Petry resurgence or upgrade. We have a crap D that needs to be rebuild. Maybe Guhke, or someone else surprises, but we still have a scary D. A scary D with two aging  goalies making around $13m that haven’t been able to stay healthy, doesn’t leave room for much optimism.

Wright will bump Dvorak/Evans down at some point, i think all #1 picks, forwards, have started same year in the NHL. 15g for Wright, with his smarts and shot should be good guess.

 

Petry-Savard-Romanov-Edmundson are fine and add in Guhle-etc..isnt a crap defense.

 

Goalies need a healthy roster in front of them and should do "better'.

Simply hope Price finds out sooner than later if career is toast.

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1 hour ago, DON said:

Wright will bump Dvorak/Evans down at some point, i think all #1 picks, forwards, have started same year in the NHL. 15g for Wright, with his smarts and shot should be good guess.

 

Petry-Savard-Romanov-Edmundson are fine and add in Guhle-etc..isnt a crap defense.

 

Goalies need a healthy roster in front of them and should do "better'.

Simply hope Price finds out sooner than later if career is toast.

I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree about the Defence.  I see three declining players and one hood young player, who we still don’t know if he is a legit first pair, or will top out as a second pairing dman on a GOOD team.

 

I hope Wright does better, but I think Hughes only scored 6 or 7 goals in his first year. Weight physically looks more mature, but we don’t know even know how good he will be compared to Hughes.

 

I also hope we have more clarity on Price sinner rather than later, but even if he is back,  with his injury history, I think it’s a lot to hope for in expecting him to make up for the D (which you obviously have more confidence in). You watch the teams in the playoffs, and all of the teams with the exception of Edmonton have a solid D. I’d give up any player on our roster for Makar.

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48 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said:

... I’d give up any player on our roster for Makar.

Id like to disagree and say Caufield or Suzuki; but cant.

What very little i seen of Makar, he does seem pretty awesome (180pts 178gms).

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2 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

...  I’d give up any player on our roster for Makar.

 

1 hour ago, DON said:

Id like to disagree and say Caufield or Suzuki; but cant.

What very little i seen of Makar, he does seem pretty awesome (180pts 178gms).

 

Thankfully Guhle isn't "on the roster" ... LOL

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To SEA: CGY's 1st round pick, Armia ($3.4M/2025) and Mailloux and a 3rd pick to sweeten the deal.

To MTL: SEA's 1st round pick, Tanev ($3.5M/2025)

 

MTL gets a fiery middle-6 LW that may play with Suzuki and Caufield if healthy. His contract is very close to Armia's but has the fire-in-the-belly that Armia lacks. The SEA pick would allow them to try to get Nemec

 

SEA get's a healthier and younger forward than Tanev that can play in their middle-6. He has been hurt often lately, but he is just a salary swap. Getting Mailloux provides the Kraken with a talented RD prospect in a market that would be more forgiving than MTL. They also get a chance to draft Connor Geekie (brother Morgan is a with SEA) of with the pick from the Habs. The extra 3rd round pick would give SEA a chance to fill their empty prospect cupboard

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13 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree about the Defence.  I see three declining players and one hood young player, who we still don’t know if he is a legit first pair, or will top out as a second pairing dman on a GOOD team.

 

I hope Wright does better, but I think Hughes only scored 6 or 7 goals in his first year. Weight physically looks more mature, but we don’t know even know how good he will be compared to Hughes.

 

I also hope we have more clarity on Price sinner rather than later, but even if he is back,  with his injury history, I think it’s a lot to hope for in expecting him to make up for the D (which you obviously have more confidence in). You watch the teams in the playoffs, and all of the teams with the exception of Edmonton have a solid D. I’d give up any player on our roster for Makar.

 

Sigh. We pick third overall and get Galchenyuk and Kotkaniemi. Avs pick fourth overall and get Makar 🙄

 

Anyhow: I agree with you, even if I like Edmundson more than you do. No matter how we slice it, that D sucks.

 

First of all, unless we count Wideman as a regular, we only have 4 guys with NHL experience. Right away that is a huge flashing red. Secondly, we only have one guy (Petry) who can move the puck. I like both Barron and Harris and have hopes that they can become top-4 puck-movers, but right now the D has this huge imbalance between proven vets who can’t move the puck and raw rookies who we hope will be able to do so at the NHL level eventually. It’s a complete mess, structurally speaking.

 

Now, put a healthy Price behind that D and the team has a chance to muddle through despite the patchwork defence. But I don’t think optimism about Price is warranted at this point.

 

The only good thing to say about the D is that if we were to add a legitimate, veteran, second-tier puck-mover, then it would likely look a lot better. So it’s not *that* far away from being a decent blueline. Right now, though, it’s thoroughly indecent.

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To CHI: Hoffman ($4.5M/2024) and MTL's 2nd

To MTL: Kubalik(RFA ~$4M/???)

 

CHI gets an oldish scoring winger, a role they hopped Kubalik would fill. His contract has less term than what Kubalik would get and a similar cap. CHI does not have a 1st round pick but this a good return from the 2nd round pick CHI was reportedly looking for:

https://www.secondcityhockey.com/2022/5/19/23079091/chicago-blackhawks-2021-2022-nhl-regular-season-recap-analysis-commentary-dominik-kubalik-struggles

 

MTL gets a young skilled LW that may flourish under St-Louis. A boom or bust deal that makes Drouin expendable but this trade gives the Habs options for LWs to play with Suzuki and Caufield

 

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13 hours ago, DON said:

Id like to disagree and say Caufield or Suzuki; but cant.

What very little i seen of Makar, he does seem pretty awesome (180pts 178gms).

 

Makar is the most dynamic defenseman in the NHL, no one else comes close.  He is not going anywhere. 

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1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

To SEA: CGY's 1st round pick, Armia ($3.4M/2025) and Mailloux and a 3rd pick to sweeten the deal.

To MTL: SEA's 1st round pick, Tanev ($3.5M/2025)

 

MTL gets a fiery middle-6 LW that may play with Suzuki and Caufield if healthy. His contract is very close to Armia's but has the fire-in-the-belly that Armia lacks. The SEA pick would allow them to try to get Nemec

 

SEA get's a healthier and younger forward than Tanev that can play in their middle-6. He has been hurt often lately, but he is just a salary swap. Getting Mailloux provides the Kraken with a talented RD prospect in a market that would be more forgiving than MTL. They also get a chance to draft Connor Geekie (brother Morgan is a with SEA) of with the pick from the Habs. The extra 3rd round pick would give SEA a chance to fill their empty prospect cupboard

 

I don't see Seattle trading the 3rd pick as I think their plan is to build through the draft.  I do see someplace far away like Seattle being a landing spot for Mailloux should Hughes decide to trade him.

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24 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said:

To CHI: Hoffman ($4.5M/2024) and MTL's 2nd

To MTL: Kubalik(RFA ~$4M/???)

 

CHI gets an oldish scoring winger, a role they hopped Kubalik would fill. His contract has less term than what Kubalik would get and a similar cap. CHI does not have a 1st round pick but this a good return from the 2nd round pick CHI was reportedly looking for:

https://www.secondcityhockey.com/2022/5/19/23079091/chicago-blackhawks-2021-2022-nhl-regular-season-recap-analysis-commentary-dominik-kubalik-struggles

 

MTL gets a young skilled LW that may flourish under St-Louis. A boom or bust deal that makes Drouin expendable but this trade gives the Habs options for LWs to play with Suzuki and Caufield

 

If anyone picks up Hoffman it's going to be a contending team. Chicago is not looking to add vets but trade the ones they have. Look at team's like

 

Florida 

Toronto 

Dallas 

Pittsburgh 

Washington 

Nashville 

 

To be the type of team's to make a trade for Hoffman.

 

Edmonton 

Colorado 

Calgary 

Blue's 

Carolina 

Also depends on how they're playoff runs go.

 

But these would be the team's I would look at that would be interested in guys like Hoffman, Petry, Gallagher, Armia, Drouin, Byron. 
 

With that being said , I can see a team like Nashville going after Hoffman especially if they lose Forsberg.

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one last with regards to trying to get a high first round pick if Nemec falls.

 

to MTL: CHI 1st round pick from CBJ and Voracek($8.5M/2024)

to CBJ: CGY 1st from Montreal, Mailloux, Norlinder and Drouin($5.5M/2023)

 

MTL gets a crack at Nemec and gets a better LW fit for Suzuki and Caufield

CBJ gets a 1st this year, a scoring NHL winger and two good prospects. They also get cap space to resign their core

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2 minutes ago, Habsfan89 said:

If anyone picks up Hoffman it's going to be a contending team. Chicago is not looking to add vets but trade the ones they have. Look at team's like

 

Florida 

Toronto 

Dallas 

Pittsburgh 

Washington 

Nashville 

 

To be the type of team's to make a trade for Hoffman.

 

Edmonton 

Colorado 

Calgary 

Blue's 

Carolina 

Also depends on how they're playoff runs go.

 

But these would be the team's I would look at that would be interested in guys like Hoffman, Petry, Gallagher, Armia, Drouin, Byron. 

 

yeah, I realized while posting that that the CHI 1st is held by CBJ.

 

So I modified for a hockey trade. Hoffman makes sense if Kane and Toews remain with CHI, which is accepting to go for a last kick at the can but with a "transition" team like tha Habs last year. They need a goalie

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29 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

I don't see Seattle trading the 3rd pick as I think their plan is to build through the draft.  I do see someplace far away like Seattle being a landing spot for Mailloux should Hughes decide to trade him.

Yup, i think Francis likely looking to build through draft.

 

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1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

To CHI: Hoffman ($4.5M/2024) and MTL's 2nd

To MTL: Kubalik(RFA ~$4M/???) ...

 

My fear is that it might well take a 2nd rd pick to get many teams to consider taking on Mike "I work hard on looking like I'm working hard" Hoffman for two more seasons ... but I definitely wouldn't mind seeing how Kubalik would mix with MSL on a 1-2 year deal.

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2 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

To SEA: CGY's 1st round pick, Armia ($3.4M/2025) and Mailloux and a 3rd pick to sweeten the deal.

To MTL: SEA's 1st round pick, Tanev ($3.5M/2025)

 

Seattle is getting a lesser forward and drops a ton in the draft with only getting Mailloux and a 3rd in return.  They need core pieces to build their franchises around, not a collection of lesser assets.

 

1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

To CHI: Hoffman ($4.5M/2024) and MTL's 2nd

To MTL: Kubalik(RFA ~$4M/???)

 

Chicago basically tried to give Kubalik away at the trade deadline because of his qualifying offer and didn't have any interest.  Because of their cap situation, the expectation is that they will non-tender him and let him walk for free this summer unless they can agree on a contract that's considerably below his qualifying offer.  The Blackhawks need to free up cap space for Jones' extension so Hoffman isn't the type of player they'd want to add.  I'm pretty sure that in a scenario like this, Montreal would non-tender Kubalik as well, essentially paying the 2nd to avoid a buyout of Hoffman.  Kubalik has struggled considerably the last two years and it looks like his strong rookie season was a bit of a mirage.

 

1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

one last with regards to trying to get a high first round pick if Nemec falls.

 

to MTL: CHI 1st round pick from CBJ and Voracek($8.5M/2024)

to CBJ: CGY 1st from Montreal, Mailloux, Norlinder and Drouin($5.5M/2023)

 

MTL gets a crack at Nemec and gets a better LW fit for Suzuki and Caufield

CBJ gets a 1st this year, a scoring NHL winger and two good prospects. They also get cap space to resign their core

 

Columbus has plenty of cap space so the savings are irrelevant to them on that front (and the Habs need to free up money themselves, not add).  What's better for them, a potential top-pairing defenceman or a series of lesser assets, two of which have seen their value drop lately (Norlinder/Drouin)?  If Nemec is still on the board in this scenario, they'd benefit a whole lot more from taking him over the pieces from the Habs.  They're trying to rebuild a strong young nucleus so they will value quality over quantity.

 

If the shoe was on the other foot, what would you do?  If the Habs had a pick at the back of the top-10 and a potential top piece fell to them, would you rather they took the potential top player or a quantity for quality deal?

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