Prime Minister Koivu Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 I’m assuming that Harris is out and a Laval call up is imminent. Hopefully we get a favourable update on Harris and he won’t miss much time. Such a great game against Boston last night and I hope we continue tonight. Newhook - Suzuki - Anderson Caufield - Dvorak - Slafkovsky Pearson - Monahan - Gallagher Pezzetta - Evans - RHP Matheson - Barron Guhle - Kovacevic Xhekaj - Laval call up Allen Go Habs Go 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 The Laval call-up is Lindstrom but it hasn't been registered yet. To officially bring him up, they'd need to open a roster spot, either by Harris to IR or someone to Laval. Considering Harris is a game-time decision, the IR option isn't happening. So if Harris can't go, watch for Armia to be sent down (Harvey-Pinard and Slafkovsky are the other exempt options). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 Carrying three G is definitely limiting our flexibility. I hope for an Allen trade to EDM, but it doesn't seem to be in the cards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 31 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: Carrying three G is definitely limiting our flexibility. I hope for an Allen trade to EDM, but it doesn't seem to be in the cards Their cap situation makes it all but impossible ... unless Holland can pull off a Christmas MIRACLE and trade Campbell ... besides, frankly, I don't think Allen has the value that many hope for in a trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 15 minutes ago, GHT120 said: Their cap situation makes it all but impossible ... unless Holland can pull off a Christmas MIRACLE and trade Campbell ... besides, frankly, I don't think Allen has the value that many hope for in a trade. I agree that, if we were to trade Allen with an eye to a quality young FW or FW prospect, it would likely need to involve more than Allen - and therein lies the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 The Canadiens make a pair of roster moves | Montréal Canadiens (nhl.com) +/-, one player is standing out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 Damn...it's only 10 games, but Guhle's basic stats look suspiciously like those of a #1 D-man. Here's hoping he can both stay healthy, and keep it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 Wonder what Guhle's offensive upside will be? My 1 and only worry for him, is his self-preservation awareness, after already suffering couple leg/knee injuries and a concussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurdBurglar Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 1 hour ago, GHT120 said: Their cap situation makes it all but impossible ... unless Holland can pull off a Christmas MIRACLE and trade Campbell ... besides, frankly, I don't think Allen has the value that many hope for in a trade. Edmonton can trade Foegele any other two-way roster player for Allen and it should work cap-wise. With the savings from Campbell about $1m, Picard no longer on the NHL roster, $2.7m (closer to $2.2m prorated) from Foegele, they are about $500k from making it work. Hence a two-way roster player. They are carrying 14 forwards according to cap friendly, so no need to worry about a callup. Foegele is on an expiring contract as well. This trade would be more about the two-way contract player than Foegele for Montréal. Currently Lavoie, Holloway could fit the money aspect and some or all of the value, Holloway more so. Montréal could target Bourgault as the value piece of the trade too and take any two-way contract from the roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 1 hour ago, TurdBurglar said: Edmonton can trade Foegele any other two-way roster player for Allen and it should work cap-wise. With the savings from Campbell about $1m, Picard no longer on the NHL roster, $2.7m (closer to $2.2m prorated) from Foegele, they are about $500k from making it work. Hence a two-way roster player. They are carrying 14 forwards according to cap friendly, so no need to worry about a callup. Foegele is on an expiring contract as well. This trade would be more about the two-way contract player than Foegele for Montréal. Currently Lavoie, Holloway could fit the money aspect and some or all of the value, Holloway more so. Montréal could target Bourgault as the value piece of the trade too and take any two-way contract from the roster. Except they lose that cap space for another roster spot for a while. They have two extra skaters right now, that move would drop them to one. One extra spot to last five months is asking for trouble once the midseason lingering injury woes start to kick in. It's way too early to say they don't need to worry about a recall. Chances are they're going to need to bring someone up between now and the end of April and a move structured like that makes that quite difficult barring it being a long-term injury. They have $21,000 in cap space. This move adds $3.168M, subtracts $2.89M (Foegele + Pickard), net increase of $278K, meaning they have to drop a forward off the roster. Being capped at 21 players is hard to navigate this early. And they're not moving Holloway to get Allen while Lavoie is someone who they could have had for free a month ago; he has next to no trade value for the Habs. Quite honestly, if the Habs were moving Allen to Edmonton, I think Pickard would be the two-way current roster player they'd target since they will need a goalie in return. If the move to make the money work and make Montreal say yes is Bourgault, Foegele, and Pickard (while sending Lavoie down), why are the Oilers doing it? That's a lot for not much of an improvement. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 2 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: I agree that, if we were to trade Allen with an eye to a quality young FW or FW prospect, it would likely need to involve more than Allen - and therein lies the problem. I agree. Allen has value but not the kind of value that gets us a higher end prospect or pick by himself. It would definitely require other pieces to be moved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurdBurglar Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 59 minutes ago, dlbalr said: Except they lose that cap space for another roster spot for a while. They have two extra skaters right now, that move would drop them to one. One extra spot to last five months is asking for trouble once the midseason lingering injury woes start to kick in. It's way too early to say they don't need to worry about a recall. Chances are they're going to need to bring someone up between now and the end of April and a move structured like that makes that quite difficult barring it being a long-term injury. They have $21,000 in cap space. This move adds $3.168M, subtracts $2.89M (Foegele + Pickard), net increase of $278K, meaning they have to drop a forward off the roster. Being capped at 21 players is hard to navigate this early. And they're not moving Holloway to get Allen while Lavoie is someone who they could have had for free a month ago; he has next to no trade value for the Habs. Quite honestly, if the Habs were moving Allen to Edmonton, I think Pickard would be the two-way current roster player they'd target since they will need a goalie in return. If the move to make the money work and make Montreal say yes is Bourgault, Foegele, and Pickard (while sending Lavoie down), why are the Oilers doing it? That's a lot for not much of an improvement. I'm afraid I'm not following this. If I'm wrong below, please let me know why because I really don't understand why it wouldn't work. Pickard goes to Bakersfield with Campbell and Rodrigue, saving $627k. Campbell doesn't play often, all reports is he will be bought out. Foegele ($2.2m) plus a two-way contract, say Lavoie ($719k) goes to Montreal. The savings for all 3 is $3.5m compared to the $3.1m coming in from Allen. Edmonton actually increases their available cap space by about $400k. I was just working on cap space. As for value the two-way contract going to Montreal could be changed as long as it's a roster player for Edmonton, other than that any non-roster player or picks could be exchanged to even it out. As for Montreal needing a goalie in return, they are shopping a goalie because there's 3 on the roster that won't clear waivers. So I'm confused as to why Montreal would be looking at Pickard in return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 1 hour ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said: I agree. Allen has value but not the kind of value that gets us a higher end prospect or pick by himself. It would definitely require other pieces to be moved. I can’t see Allen netting anywhere more than a 3rd or equivalent player on his own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir_Boagalott Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 1 hour ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said: I agree. Allen has value but not the kind of value that gets us a higher end prospect or pick by himself. It would definitely require other pieces to be moved. I'm not 100% sure about that but I agree that under normal circumstance what you say would be true. However, the Oilers current situation isn't a typical scenario because they are supposed to be contender and so far they are looking like they wont make the playoffs. i.e. they want to reconcile this season asap and are desperate for that outcome. i.e. they might be willing to sell their long term success for a short term gain. I would never expect Allen to nab a 1st round pick (ex: Halloway) but that could be the legit outcome for the Oilers current situation. I'm not sue how realistic it would be to get Halloway but that is who I would want in a straight up trade for Allen. Halloway was a 1st rnd 14th pick in 2020 and he's an ex-Badger that played with Cole so it could be interesting if Hughes could get him. He may not turn out to be elite but he should be a decent addition. Currently, he plays on the Oilers 4th line so he doesn't appear to be high on their depth chart especially considering how bad they are doing. i.e. if the Oilers held him in high regard that could make a difference for them then he wouldn't be a 4th liner. With the cap issues the Habs would have to retain Allen's salary to get Halloway, so would that be worth doing? Getting a 1st rnd prospect would be an incredible return for Allen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 15 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said: I can’t see Allen netting anywhere more than a 3rd or equivalent player on his own. I think that is about right. Maybe a late 2nd from a team that is desperate. He has never been a goalie that can carry a team as a #1 but can certainly provide great veteran support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habs Fan in Edmonton Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 8 minutes ago, Sir_Boagalott said: I'm not 100% sure about that but I agree that under normal circumstance what you say would be true. However, the Oilers current situation isn't a typical scenario because they are supposed to be contender and so far they are looking like they wont make the playoffs. i.e. they want to reconcile this season asap and are desperate for that outcome. i.e. they might be willing to sell their long term success for a short term gain. I would never expect Allen to nab a 1st round pick (ex: Halloway) but that could be the legit outcome for the Oilers current situation. I'm not sue how realistic it would be to get Halloway but that is who I would want in a straight up trade for Allen. Halloway was a 1st rnd 14th pick in 2020 and he's an ex-Badger that played with Cole so it could be interesting if Hughes could get him. He may not turn out to be elite but he should be a decent addition. Currently, he plays on the Oilers 4th line so he doesn't appear to be high on their depth chart especially considering how bad they are doing. i.e. if the Oilers held him in high regard that could make a difference for them then he wouldn't be a 4th liner. With the cap issues the Habs would have to retain Allen's salary to get Halloway, so would that be worth doing? Getting a 1st rnd prospect would be an incredible return for Allen. I would love to get Holloway but it will take more than Allen straight up to get it done. I agree the Oilers are desperate but Holland would get absolutely crucified for making that trade. If they are looking at including Holloway then they are looking for a better piece than Allen and would likely include several pieces. The Oilers need to do something soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 1 hour ago, TurdBurglar said: I'm afraid I'm not following this. If I'm wrong below, please let me know why because I really don't understand why it wouldn't work. Pickard goes to Bakersfield with Campbell and Rodrigue, saving $627k. Campbell doesn't play often, all reports is he will be bought out. Foegele ($2.2m) plus a two-way contract, say Lavoie ($719k) goes to Montreal. The savings for all 3 is $3.5m compared to the $3.1m coming in from Allen. Edmonton actually increases their available cap space by about $400k. I was just working on cap space. As for value the two-way contract going to Montreal could be changed as long as it's a roster player for Edmonton, other than that any non-roster player or picks could be exchanged to even it out. As for Montreal needing a goalie in return, they are shopping a goalie because there's 3 on the roster that won't clear waivers. So I'm confused as to why Montreal would be looking at Pickard in return. Let me answer these out of order. They need another goalie for Laval that can be recalled in case of injury. Primeau was supposed to be the other option down there but since he can't get there, they need a body. That's why Montreal would probably want Pickard (who would then be sent down) in the return as Dobes isn't ready for even spot NHL duty. Now, let's look at your proposal. Edmonton currently has 14 forwards, 6 defence, 2 goalies. They lose two forwards in the trade (Foegele and Lavoie) and don't gain any in return while Allen takes Pickard's place (whether he's in the trade or sent down, same effect). Now they're at 12 forwards, 6 defence, 2 goalies, and while your version has them saving money, they still don't have enough cap space to call anyone up ($21K + ~$400K in savings is still below the recallable threshold). That's the definition of asking for trouble. They're going to have injuries and are now deliberately putting themselves in a situation where they can't afford a recall. The Rangers tried that with Kane last year and the NHL then vetoed their request for cap-exempt recalls. They can't afford to do that, especially for a marginal upgrade in net. They need to move a pricier piece than Foegele to make it work realistically so that they can still afford to call someone up when all is said and done. That's why Allen to Edmonton isn't happening; if they're moving a decent piece for a goalie, they're going to want a more proven goalie than Allen. And with the coaching change, that tells me they're not doing anything goalie-wise for a while. Instead, they'll let the new coach have some time to try to turn things around. Meanwhile, Harris is in the warmup as is Lindstrom so Harris is a true game-time decision. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted November 12, 2023 Share Posted November 12, 2023 Harris is officially in tonight: https://www.nhl.com/scores/htmlreports/20232024/RO020224.HTM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 21 minutes ago, dlbalr said: ... They need to move a pricier piece than Foegele to make it work realistically so that they can still afford to call someone up when all is said and done ... And the only players pricier than Foegele who don't have NMC/NTCs are Ekholm, Bouchard and Ceci ... and moving any of the 2/3/4 highest TOI of their D is not a practical solution to improving their GAA ... so you are correct in saying "Allen to Edmonton isn't happening". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 Canuckleheads' superior talent starting to come through toward the period's end - we need to get out of it and regroup Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted November 13, 2023 Author Share Posted November 13, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 7 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: Canuckleheads' superior talent starting to come through toward the period's end - we need to get out of it and regroup Yeah, it was a bit shaky at the end but that period reminded me a bit of last night. A lot of pace (not as much zone time) and very few whistles to boot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 Well, no early goal against at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Puck Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 Jumping offside is starting to be a habit for Caufield. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted November 13, 2023 Share Posted November 13, 2023 20 minutes ago, Peter Puck said: Jumping offside is starting to be a habit for Caufield. I hate the coach's challenge but yeah, pretty frustrating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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