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Habsfan89

6.5mil over 6 years for Gallagher

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6 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said:

 

Well, the good news is that - after years of ignoring problems, or conspicuously failing to address them even as he busily "solves" non-problems, he has FINALLY stepped up with a high-impact off-season that clearly leaves the team significantly improved. Better late than never.

I’m hoping so.  I’ve been optimistic since watching Suzuki and KK and that still has me more exited than the offseason moves - I only see the Taffoli one as good term/$ and the original Allen trade as non-risky.


There aren’t many teams handing out term like we did this offseason given all of the uncertainty.  Some of our signings and could have the same potential impact as buying pot stocks a their peak.

 

1 - Anderson - the term and $ scares the heck out of me.very high risk - high reward signing.

 

2 - our D upgrades - we still don’t have a clear top pairing guy for Weber. Not satisfied with D, unless Romanov takes a big step to be a top pairing, or at least top 4.

 

3 - Gallagher- on its own - great resigning.  However, with the number of guys signed into their mid-late 30’s (Weber. price, Petry, Byron) if a couple of guys fall off early we are in cap trouble.

 

4 - Allen extension- great to finally have stability and backup goalie for expansion draft exposure, but Allen has had consistency issues. Hopefully, he is more consistent as a backup than he was as a starter. If he sucks this year, don’t see Seattle taking him. With the number of wingers and dmen we have, we probably lose one of them anyways.


5 - resigning kids and UFA.  my biggest reason for optimism is Suzuki and KK.  If they play like I hope and the cap is flat, do we have the ability to resign our kids if they live up to hopes? KK and Romanov next year. Suzuki the year after.  Don’t see how we can resign Danault, hate to lose a centre for nothing. Not as concerned about letting Tatar walk or we are a playoff team - not much different than picking up an expiring contract at the deadline for the playoffs (which on the other hand Tatar has not done well in).

 

anyway, much more reason for hope and I can’t remember the last time I felt optimistic in the pre-season that we have a team that should make the playoffs.   but i do worry about the length of contracts and the return to size over skill fetish - particularly on the blueline and Anderson gamble.

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4 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

but i do worry about the length of contracts and the return to size over skill fetish - particularly on the blueline and Anderson gamble.

 

I think all the big guys we signed are pretty skilled and mobile, there is no McCarron in the bunch. :)

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4 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

I’m hoping so.  I’ve been optimistic since watching Suzuki and KK and that’s still has me more offseason Han the offseason moves - I only see the Taffoli one as good term/$ and the original Allen trade as non-risky.


There aren’t many teams handing out term like we did this offseason given all of the uncertainty.  Some of our signings and could have the same potential impact as buying pot stocks a their peak.

 

1 - Anderson - the term and $ scares the heck out of me.very high risk - high reward signing.

 

2 - our D upgrades - we still don’t have a clear top pairing guy for Weber. Not satisfied with D, unless Romanov takes a big step to be a top pairing, or at least top 4.

 

3 - Gallagher- on its own - great resigning.  However, with the number of guys signed into their mid-late 30’s (Weber. price, Petry, Byron) if a couple of guys fall off early we are in cap trouble.

 

4 - Allen extension- great to finally have stability and backup goalie for expansion draft exposure, but Allen has had consistency issues. Hopefully, he is more consistent as a backup than he was as a starter. If he sucks this year, don’t see Seattle taking him. With the number of wingers and dmen we have, we probably lose one of the anyways.


5 - resigning kids and UFA.  my biggest reason for optimism is Suzuki and KK.  If they play like I hope and the cap is flat, do we have the ability to resign our kids if they live up to hopes? KK and Romanov next year. Suzuki the year after.  Don’t see how we can resign Danault, hate to lose a centre for nothing. Not as concerned about letting Tatar walk or we are a playoff team - not much different than picking up an expiring contract at the deadline for the playoffs (which on the other hand Tatar has not done well in).

 

anyway, much more reason for hope and I can’t remember the last time I felt on the pre-season that we have a team that should make the playoffs.   but i do worry about the length of contracts and the return to size over skill fetish - particularly on the blueline and Anderson gamble.

 

Come on man, watch the first 3 sequences here and tell me you see a plug with size and no skill..

 

 

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4 hours ago, DON said:

 

 

Theres a clip of that interview:

 

 

34 minutes ago, tomh009 said:

 

I think all the big guys we signed are pretty skilled and mobile, there is no McCarron in the bunch. :)

 

For his size Anderson is quick and mobile.

 

21 minutes ago, Link67 said:

 

Come on man, watch the first 3 sequences here and tell me you see a plug with size and no skill..

 

 

 

Anderson's shot is impressive, he can score when there is nobody in between him and the net by blasting the puck right by the goalie.  When you watch the video of Toffoli's goals he seems equally capable of doing that too.   It's possible that they have the best shots on the Habs.  Suzuki is likely up there too, he's got a rocket of a shot with accuracy to boot. 

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It's funny to watch the clip of Gally's goals because the vast majority of his goals are scored within a few feet of the crease. 

  

 

On his 8 goal he beats the goalie with a shot from way outside of the crease.  Its fairly rare for Gally to shoot the puck into the net, most of his goals he taps, tips or deflects the puck in.  In that entire clip he has 4 goals that are shot into the net from more than 5 feet out. 

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1 hour ago, tomh009 said:

 

I think all the big guys we signed are pretty skilled and mobile, there is no McCarron in the bunch. :)

I agree know McCarron types, but they are all described as quick for a big man.  On the D, I would have liked a faster puck mover - the direction the game is going. 
 

Anderson will either be a brilliant move or a disaster. I don’t see any middle ground. It’s like buying a lottery ticket. Almost every sportswriter/talking head has said that the habs not only over paid in what they gave up, but are staggered at the term and $.  Hell Ottawa just signed a UFA that has a solid three years of production for $5m/3 yrs.  would have preferred a move like that.

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1 hour ago, Link67 said:

 

Come on man, watch the first 3 sequences here and tell me you see a plug with size and no skill..

 

 

Never said no skill. But do guys that score 1 goal usually get $5.5m/7 year deals?

 

how many guys are getting big bumps and term in the current environment?  Especially coming of a big injury and down year?

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4 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Never said no skill. But do guys that score 1 goal usually get $5.5m/7 year deals?

 

how many guys are getting big bumps and term in the current environment?  Especially coming of a big injury and down year?

 

 

Ok, so you don't like the contract, I won't deny that it doesn't come without it's risks if he remains injury proned. However, you can't say we are choosing size over skill, while we are in fact getting size AND skill. Anderson is a big top 6 forward with good skating, a big shot, and good hands around the net, trying to diminish his skill level just because he is big and has a contract you don't like, isn't very fair, or accurate, for that matter.

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5 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Never said no skill. But do guys that score 1 goal usually get $5.5m/7 year deals?

 

how many guys are getting big bumps and term in the current environment?  Especially coming of a big injury and down year?


This isn’t even the correct thread for this whiner opinion, gotta complain about something.

As if you have near the breadth of knowledge or research as the management team that does this for a living.

There is next to no concern about Anderson’s health and he provides exactly what Habs have been desperately missing.

The guys has wheel and can straight up beat goalies off the rush or in close, get off the negative nelly hormones or at least use the right thread to spew your negative bs. All kinds of league professionals see Anderson signing as a good move, but let’s stop and listen to some schmo who wants to shit on anything apparently.

Must suck to not even find joy in the Habs  moves this past month, feel bad for ya.

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8 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

Anderson will either be a brilliant move or a disaster. I don’t see any middle ground. It’s like buying a lottery ticket. Almost every sportswriter/talking head has said that the habs not only over paid in what they gave up, but are staggered at the term and $.  Hell Ottawa just signed a UFA that has a solid three years of production for $5m/3 yrs.  would have preferred a move like that.

 

I agree that the Anderson move will either be a brilliant move or a disaster but sometimes you have to take a chance to get ahead. Playing it safe all the time won't work. Look at it this way, he basically traded Galchenyuk for Anderson. Sure Dadonov's contract carries less risk at 3 years but he is 31,  Anderson is 26, that's big difference. Like Toffoli we will have him for all his prime years. Of course there is risk, but in life no risk = no reward. 

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He didn’t trade Galchenyuk for Anderson. He traded Domi, who is better than Anderson and Galchenyuk. 
 

And if elaboration is needed...


Galchenyuk for Domi = 👌

Domi for Anderson = 😐

 

Yes, not for everyone because we “filled a need.” Doesn’t mean we didn’t lose the better player. 
 

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8 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said: 
 

Anderson will either be a brilliant move or a disaster. I don’t see any middle ground. It’s like buying a lottery ticket. Almost every sportswriter/talking head has said that the habs not only over paid in what they gave up, but are staggered at the term and $.  Hell Ottawa just signed a UFA that has a solid three years of production for $5m/3 yrs.  would have preferred a move like that.

 

Columbus had a offer on the table for Anderson at 7 years/ 5 mil per, and for some reason he refused to sign. Here’s a team who drafted him, knows him well  injury wise, future potential and had no hesitation signing him long term! We paid half a mil more per year at same term. 

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3 hours ago, Link67 said:

 

 

Ok, so you don't like the contract, I won't deny that it doesn't come without it's risks if he remains injury proned. However, you can't say we are choosing size over skill, while we are in fact getting size AND skill. Anderson is a big top 6 forward with good skating, a big shot, and good hands around the net, trying to diminish his skill level just because he is big and has a contract you don't like, isn't very fair, or accurate, for that matter.


The amount of skill Anderson has is a matter of opinion.

 

It’s simply easy to say Anderson has skill, just wait and see. I’m also not defending the size vs skill debate because it is not something I brought up myself. With that being said, when one sees that Domi has a .67 career points per game average and Anderson has a .41 points per game average, it does not seem such a far fetched idea that we would have traded skill for size. 
 

In the end, points will be what matters, if size isn’t what we were going for. 
 

My personal viewpoint is simple, in that we traded  for someone the organization viewed as more of a “goal scorer”. That is where I personally hope to see Anderson’s improvement over Domi. We needed goals, and we have two new additions who can put the puck in the net, rather than just pass it. Even there, Anderson scores about 1 in every 4 games, whereas Domi is 1 in every 5.

 

What I wonder, is when facing Columbus how many times did people think about Josh Anderson heading into the match? Personally, I’d think about Foligno, Dubois, Jones, Werenski, Nyquist, Atkinson, Panarin when he was there, Dubinsky when he was there... maybe Anderson would come soon after.

 

The Habs last year? Price, Weber, Gallagher, Tatar, Domi. Stop these players. 

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53 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

He didn’t trade Galchenyuk for Anderson. He traded Domi, who is better than Anderson and Galchenyuk. 
 

And if elaboration is needed...


Galchenyuk for Domi = 👌

Domi for Anderson = 😐

 

Yes, not for everyone because we “filled a need.” Doesn’t mean we didn’t lose the better player. 
 

 

I know, he didn't trade Galchenyuk straight up for Anderson but that was the net result.  Just trying to put a bit of a positive spin on it.  I am still 50/50 on the trade, also believe Max is the better player but if he was not going to be happy on the wing then the trade for a winger with great potential (he still has some proving to do in my opinion) has some merit.

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9 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said:

  Almost every sportswriter/talking head has said

 

that the habs not only over paid in what they gave up,

but are staggered at the term and $.  

Too funny.

 

1 hour ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

I agree that the Anderson move will either be a brilliant move or a disaster but sometimes you have to take a chance to get ahead. Playing it safe all the time won't work. Look at it this way, he basically traded Galchenyuk for Anderson. Sure Dadonov's contract carries less risk at 3 years but he is 31,  Anderson is 26, that's big difference. Like Toffoli we will have him for all his prime years. Of course there is risk, but in life no risk = no reward. 

Trying to put positive spin on it is so cute.

Didnt you know that Habfans hate risk-taking GMs and also ones who dont spend to the Cap every year.:tigi:

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47 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

I know, he didn't trade Galchenyuk straight up for Anderson but that was the net result.  Just trying to put a bit of a positive spin on it.  I am still 50/50 on the trade, also believe Max is the better player but if he was not going to be happy on the wing then the trade for a winger with great potential (he still has some proving to do in my opinion) has some merit.


I understood what you meant but it depends on how Anderson plays, and to a lesser extent how Domi continues his career. 
 

What you are saying is somewhat true but it isn’t a positive if the trade sequence was as follows:

 

worst player -> best player -> second best player

 

That’s if we agree on the ratings, as I also think Galchenyuk is capable of more than Anderson offensively. Of course, others will argue that Anderson is the best player. That’s fine as well, in theory. 

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7 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:

... it depends on how Anderson plays, and to a lesser extent how Domi continues his career. ...

 

Think it depends entirely on how both play going forward ... and not just raw statistical data

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1 hour ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:


I’m also not defending the size vs skill debate because it is not something I brought up myself. With that being said, when one sees that Domi has a .67 career points per game average and Anderson has a .41 points per game average, it does not seem such a far fetched idea that we would have traded skill for size. 
 

In the end, points will be what matters, if size isn’t what we were going for. 
 

My personal viewpoint is simple, in that we traded  for someone the organization viewed as more of a “goal scorer”. That is where I personally hope to see Anderson’s improvement over Domi. We needed goals, and we have two new additions who can put the puck in the net, rather than just pass it. Even there, Anderson scores about 1 in every 4 games, whereas Domi is 1 in every 5.

 

What I wonder, is when facing Columbus how many times did people think about Josh Anderson heading into the match? Personally, I’d think about Foligno, Dubois, Jones, Werenski, Nyquist, Atkinson, Panarin when he was there, Dubinsky when he was there... maybe Anderson would come soon after.

 

The Habs last year? Price, Weber, Gallagher, Tatar, Domi. Stop these players. 

 

It wasn't exactly size over skill, thats just an added twist, but likely played a factor.  The Habs basically had to make a choice between Domi and Danault and trade a centre for a winger who can score 25+g/yr.  The guy they got happens to be big (looks mobile too).  Personally, I would have kept Domi over Danualt (trade him for a dman instead of Edmondson) and try to sign a UFA that can score, like Dadonov. 

 

You dont think about Anderson when the Habs played Columbus, but thats because you've never been hit by him.  Players that have likely watchout for him.  According to some poles, apparently players used to pay attention against the Habs after being hit by Emelin. 

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I don’t believe the only measure is points. So what if Domi got more points per year - hits matter, defensive responsibility matters, creating space matters, goals > assists. 
 

I don’t believe we lost the domi & 3rd for Anderson trade. Anderson is worth more because he is worth more. 

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48 minutes ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

... Personally, I would have kept Domi over Danualt (trade him for a dman instead of Edmondson) and try to sign a UFA that can score, like Dadonov ...

 

Domi over Danault would leave the 20/21 Habs with nobody defensively suited to play against Tavares/Matthews, Krejci/Bergeron, Eichel, Crosby/Malkin, McDavid/Draisaitl, MacKinnon, etc. ... in a season where MB may well feel he has to cleanly make the playoffs and not scramble for a wild card to retain his job.

 

Don't know that there would have been a defenceman much better than Edmundson available for Danault ... the few that have been dealt since the tournament that I would have wanted were dealt for draft picks, not contracts ... 

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37 minutes ago, revvvrob said:

I don’t believe the only measure is points. So what if Domi got more points per year - hits matter, defensive responsibility matters, creating space matters, goals > assists. 
 

I don’t believe we lost the domi & 3rd for Anderson trade. Anderson is worth more because he is worth more. 


We cannot say he is worth more until he actually plays games for the Habs. I admit that on my side of the argument as well. I’ve watched Anderson play just as much as most people on here and he will certainly bring his element to our team. This positive element will be further exasperated by the fact that we had been lacking that type of player and will make him look even better.

 

But from the posts on here, one would think that everyone had been scouting Anderson very closely for years and have been drooling over his positive attributes. 
 

I repeat, when we played Columbus, it had me thinking about Jones, Werenski, Foligno, Dubois, Atkinson... Now it will be Jones, Werenski, Domi, Dubois, Atkinson, Foligno.
 

If you are trying to convince me that over a 5 year period, Anderson will be a more successful player than Domi, this is where we will disagree. Domi was great in his first season and was only here for 2 years. There will be down periods for Anderson as well, and my bet is that there will be more than Domi’s. 


If we are not allowed to choose stats as a reasoning for why Domi is a better player, then I guess there is no way to prove it. Domi did not only bring points though. He brought speed, grittiness, was willing to drop the gloves, and possesses an elite vision. 

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40 minutes ago, revvvrob said:

I don’t believe the only measure is points. So what if Domi got more points per year - hits matter, defensive responsibility matters, creating space matters, goals > assists. 
 

I don’t believe we lost the domi & 3rd for Anderson trade. Anderson is worth more because he is worth more. 

 

Yes, goals and points are not the only metric, and neither is size.  There is way more to it that that, and both players have different strengths, and weaknesses.  I dont think the discussion should be about who is worth more, its really about who's talents are more valuable to the Habs.  The Habs have other Centres but they had no large wingers that hit and can potentially score 25-30g/yr, so in that sense its Anderson that is more valuable. 

23 minutes ago, GHT120 said:

 

Domi over Danault would leave the 20/21 Habs with nobody defensively suited to play against Tavares/Matthews, Krejci/Bergeron, Eichel, Crosby/Malkin, McDavid/Draisaitl, MacKinnon, etc. ... in a season where MB may well feel he has to cleanly make the playoffs and not scramble for a wild card to retain his job.

 

Don't know that there would have been a defenceman much better than Edmundson available for Danault ... the few that have been dealt since the tournament that I would have wanted were dealt for draft picks, not contracts ... 

 

I disagree with your Domi over Danault would leave the Habs with no one to play against other teams top guys comment.  i.e. Suzuki is 1stC, Domi could have been 2ndC, and KK could potentially be the the defensive role 3rdC.  However, thats a valid point about dmen, but I dont think MB was having talks about moving Danault so he wasn't talking to teams with strong d to entertain any potential deals.   

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20 minutes ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

 

Yes, goals and points are not the only metric, and neither is size.  There is way more to it that that, and both players have different strengths, and weaknesses.  I dont think the discussion should be about who is worth more, its really about who's talents are more valuable to the Habs.  The Habs have other Centres but they had no large wingers that hit and can potentially score 25-30g/yr, so in that sense its Anderson that is more valuable. 

 

I disagree with your Domi over Danault would leave the Habs with no one to play against other teams top guys comment.  i.e. Suzuki is 1stC, Domi could have been 2ndC, and KK could potentially be the the defensive role 3rdC.  However, thats a valid point about dmen, but I dont think MB was having talks about moving Danault so he wasn't talking to teams with strong d to entertain any potential deals.   


First of all, I agree with everything you said about Domi vs Danault. I’m a rare individual who has been on that page. 
 

With that being said, the center verus winger argument for Anderson vs Domi does not hold up in court.

 

1) Last year we had an abundance of wingers vs centers

 

2) It’s always overlooked that while Domi prefers center, he has openly said he is willing to play wing if that is where he is needed

 

3) The fact is that Josh Anderson is only a very slightly better Joel Armia. That’s it, that’s all. We already have Joel Armia. Sure, it’s better to have two, and this one is slightly better. It’s like Domi and Drouin though, we had two and one is slightly better.

 

4) I have faith in the kids, but it’s not proven that our strength up the middle is a strength. It is not 100% that our center formation is as proven as it seems in comparison to other elite teams in the league. We are relying on both Suzuki and Kotkaniemi, and to a certain extent Evans/Poehling. 

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4 minutes ago, xXx..CK..xXx said:


First of all, I agree with everything you said about Domi vs Danault. I’m a rare individual who has been on that page. 
 

With that being said, the center verus winger argument for Anderson vs Domi does not hold up in court.

 

1) Last year we had an abundance of wingers vs centers

 

2) It’s always overlooked that while Domi prefers center, he has openly said he is willing to play wing if that is where he is needed

 

3) The fact is that Josh Anderson is only a very slightly better Joel Armia. That’s it, that’s all. We already have Joel Armia. Sure, it’s better to have two, and this one is slightly better. It’s like Domi and Drouin though, we had two and one is slightly better.

 

4) I have faith in the kids, but it’s not proven that our strength up the middle is a strength. It is not 100% that our center formation is as proven as it seems in comparison to other elite teams in the league. We are relying on both Suzuki and Kotkaniemi, and to a certain extent Evans/Poehling. 

 

I find it odd because I dont believe that l I have seen anybody suggest KK as 3rd C (i.e. replacement for Danault), everybody seems to say KK as 2nd (and/or Habs need Danault - so Domi had to be the odd man out).  Its funny because the entirety of KK's 1st yr he was being cautious and highly defensive minded and was basically playing like a 3rdC.

 

The merits of the argument does hold up in court though, when the totality of the evidence is considered.  When you look at the jurisprudence of the Habs draft picks they have nobody in their system with that size, speed, skills and abilities.  Armia is certainly close in all of those regards, thats why I love him and want MB to resign him for as cheap and long as possible before he gets 50pts in a season and want 5+mil/yr.  However, the One Man Armia is not a hitting machine like BangBus is.  Anderson might always get less points than Domi but he increases the Habs size and is better defensively which makes them harder to play against, and thats more valuable than the 10 point differential that there might be between the 2. 

 

Domi did play wing, but had a bad season, but that could also be due to all the injuries, so its unknown why his #'s dropped.   Yes, the C position is questionable, but we need to keep the faith. 

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