Disgusted with game tonight and 75% of habs this season.

[hab29RETIRED]

Well with all the people who were thrilled about Martin and the system he was bringing on, can you please tell me how the habs have improved???? I hated the signing, said so at the time and kept reading of the great system he would bring.

Can somebody please tell me what the system is??? We have ONE regulation win for cripes sake!!!! I think the Leafs now have more wins in regulation!!!

Defensively we still suck!! Yes Markov is gone and unfortunately went down in the first game. However, didn't Martin keep on going on how how he wanted a no name six man defence that played a good system??? What is the system he is trying to institute, having 5 guys running around like chickens with their head cut off and leaving their goalies hanging out to dry??????? Other then Hamrlik some nights (who looked bad tonight as well), this defence has looked terrible. There is no system. Yes its early, but this team's defence had only played well enough to win ONE game in regulation for god's sake.

Offensively, we have one line creating chances - but really not being able to finish - haven't we seen this show before???? Pleks putting on a one man show without really any support and despite playing harder on a more consistent basis then Gomez, he really gets no one to play with, other then the 2nd line PP.

As usual, we have a coach who instead of being able to get more out of his young guys, and other then Pleks, the other three guys (Kosty, Lats and Laps) that needed to progress have regressed, like all of our young players have during the past few years. Why the hell can't this team develop their young talent????? Why have the Kosty brother been Martin's whipping boys, when for most of the season, Lats, Laps, Pacs and that poor excuse of a pylon Bergeron for the most part keep getting regular shifts???? Yes Lats and Laps, had some time reduced tonight to around 5-6 minutes, but they have sucked most of the year. And Bergeron makes Brisbois look like Doug Harvey. It is mind boggling to me that Kosty has seemed to take the brunt of Martin's and the media's wrath. There are some idiots who wanted Lapierre named captain for cripes sake????

IMO, Pax, should be sent down otherwise the habs are going to ruin him like they probably have ruined Lats. Pax needs a chance to gain confidence as a goal scorer and dominate at some level, so he plays with more confidence. Yes he has played better, but only good enough to be a 3rd/4th liner.

I know this is going on to a long rant after another crappy game, but, IMO, the habs should go with the following lineup:

Cams-Pleks-Giontta

Lats - Gomez- Kostitsyn

Moen Metro - White

Pyatt- Lapierre- Bergeron

Hamrlik Spacek

Carle Mara

Gorges Leach

While neither goalie has been consistent, I don't think you can really blame the goalies this year, let them play until they lose.

Keep Bergeron as a PP specialist and occasional role on the 4th line. If Leach and Carle don't work, give Belle another chance. Let Weber and Subban develop in Hamilton. Up front, I think White and Pyatt have looked alright, but eventually the adrenaline will probably wind down, and their play will probably drop off, if and when that happen give some of the other guys in Hamilton a shot, but keep Pax in the AHL until he starts producing consistently for at least a month.

I know that some may argue that we don't have the depth to send Pax down, but if we want him to progress, i think he needs to be in an environment where he can score. The guy really has not scored much at the AHL or NHL level. Give someone else in Hamilton a chance to come up and really the best bet there is Sergei, yes he has acted like a spoilt brat, but really there was no reason for Martin to single him out as a whipping boy. I think in another week or two, if he is producing, he should be brought up.

If we make a trade we need to pick up some secondary scoring. My biggest fear is the habs are going to give away a guy like Kosty for a bag of pucks. While I love effort Metro and Moen have given. You can't expect Metro to continue scoring by taking shots from behind the net and we are NOT going to succeed this year long term, if Metro is going to be on the 2nd PP unit.

At the end of the day though, it does't matter who we have in the lineup, we need the coach to start getting through an motivating the players. I'd also like to see the so-called system Martin was supposed to bring in.

Edited November 8, 2009 by hab29RETIRED

[johnnyhasbeen]

Well with all the people who were thrilled about Martin and the system he was bringing on, can you please tell me how the habs have improved???? I hated the signing, said so at the time and kept reading of the great system he would bring.

Can somebody please tell me what the system is??? We have ONE regulation win for cripes sake!!!! I think the Leafs now have more wins in regulation!!!

Defensively we still suck!! Yes Markov is gone and unfortunately went down in the first game. However, didn't Martin keep on going on how how he wanted a no name six man defence that played a good system??? What is the system he is trying to institute, having 5 guys running around like chickens with their head cut off and leaving their goalies hanging out to dry??????? Other then Hamrlik some nights (who looked bad tonight as well), this defence has looked terrible. There is no system. Yes its early, but this team's defence had only played well enough to win ONE game in regulation for god's sake.

Offensively, we have one line creating chances - but really not being able to finish - haven't we seen this show before???? Pleks putting on a one man show without really any support and despite playing harder on a more consistent basis then Gomez, he really gets no one to play with, other then the 2nd line PP.

As usual, we have a coach who instead of being able to get more out of his young guys, and other then Pleks, the other three guys (Kosty, Lats and Laps) that needed to progress have regressed, like all of our young players have during the past few years. Why the hell can't this team develop their young talent????? Why have the Kosty brother been Martin's whipping boys, when for most of the season, Lats, Laps, Pacs and that poor excuse of a pylon Bergeron for the most part keep getting regular shifts???? Yes Lats and Laps, had some time reduced tonight to around 5-6 minutes, but they have sucked most of the year. And Bergeron makes Brisbois look like Doug Harvey. It is mind boggling to me that Kosty has seemed to take the brunt of Martin's and the media's wrath. There are some idiots who wanted Lapierre named captain for cripes sake????

IMO, Pax, should be sent down otherwise the habs are going to ruin him like they probably have ruined Lats. Pax needs a chance to gain confidence as a goal scorer and dominate at some level, so he plays with more confidence. Yes he has played better, but only good enough to be a 3rd/4th liner.

I know this is going on to a long rant after another crappy game, but, IMO, the habs should go with the following lineup:

Cams-Pleks-Giontta

Lats - Gomez- Kostitsyn

Moen Metro - White

Pyatt- Lapierre- Bergeron

Hamrlik Spacek

Carle Mara

Gorges Leach

While neither goalie has been consistent, I don't think you can really blame the goalies this year, let them play until they lose.

Keep Bergeron as a PP specialist and occasional role on the 4th line. If Leach and Carle don't work, give Belle another chance. Let Weber and Subban develop in Hamilton. Up front, I think White and Pyatt have looked alright, but eventually the adrenaline will probably wind down, and their play will probably drop off, if and when that happen give some of the other guys in Hamilton a shot, but keep Pax in the AHL until he starts producing consistently for at least a month.

I know that some may argue that we don't have the depth to send Pax down, but if we want him to progress, i think he needs to be in an environment where he can score. The guy really has not scored much at the AHL or NHL level. Give someone else in Hamilton a chance to come up and really the best bet there is Sergei, yes he has acted like a spoilt brat, but really there was no reason for Martin to single him out as a whipping boy. I think in another week or two, if he is producing, he should be brought up.

If we make a trade we need to pick up some secondary scoring. My biggest fear is the habs are going to give away a guy like Kosty for a bag of pucks. While I love effort Metro and Moen have given. You can't expect Metro to continue scoring by taking shots from behind the net and we are NOT going to succeed this year long term, if Metro is going to be on the 2nd PP unit.

At the end of the day though, it does't matter who we have in the lineup, we need the coach to start getting through an motivating the players. I'd also like to see the so-called system Martin was supposed to bring in.

It is the first week of November!!! We are a month into a new season with a new coach, half a new team, and our top d-man down. PANIC!!!!! FIRE THE COACH!!!!! FIRE THE GM!!!! TRADE THE WHOLE TEAM!!

THE KIDS AREN'T FULLY DEVELOPED YET, SEND THEM DOWN!!! SELL THE TEAM WE NEED A NEW OWNER!!!! RUN DOWN ST CATHERINES STREET BREAKING WINDOWS AND BURNING CARS!!! No wait, we only do that when we win a cup.

Give me a break. Go get drunk or sober up, which ever you happen to need. Your long winded post was a pile of bunk.

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

Well, the D is worse than I thought it would be, I'll grant you. But habs29 is indeed probably being premature. We saw a few games there where the team surrendered about 20 shots per game - take that as a promissory note of what Martin's system *could* look like. I think, though, that falling behind throws a lot of things out of whack, as a general rule.

More worrisome to me is that our "BIG" acquisitions are on pace for statistically mediocre seasons. Gomez, for instance, is on schedule for a 53-point season. Ditto Gionta. OUCH!!! I know stats aren't everything but - if present trends continue, that will at face value constitute an outrageous waste of cap space. However, the emergence of a second line would absolutely rectify a lot of that.

Boone reiterated recently that his official deadline for beginning to panic about les Habs is the 20-game mark. This raises a good question: at some point, we have to stop using the newness of everything as an excuse.

So, OK everybody: any thoughts about when that should be? Habs29 obviously thinks NOW is the time. Other views? How long before you personally start sh*tting bricks about this new team?

(Note, also, that everybody still forgets about the Markov injury and what it means for the whole club. Does anyone *really* think we'd be 8-9 with Markov back there? I'd say, somewhat arbitrarily, that he's worth at least two more wins - and thus 10-7 record and a much more relaxed fan base... The realistic goal is to stay within striking distance of the playoffs without him, nothing more; from that standpoint, there really isn't cause to panic so far).

[Colin]

More worrisome to me is that our "BIG" acquisitions are on pace for statistically mediocre seasons. Gomez, for instance, is on schedule for a 53-point season. Ditto Gionta. OUCH!!!

And yet, if Gionta has a two-goal game next time out, he's on pace for 41 goals. WAY too premature to use stats to look at the overall picture.

[Wamsley01]

Well, the D is worse than I thought it would be, I'll grant you. But habs29 is indeed probably being premature. We saw a few games there where the team surrendered about 20 shots per game - take that as a promissory note of what Martin's system *could* look like. I think, though, that falling behind throws a lot of things out of whack, as a general rule.

More worrisome to me is that our "BIG" acquisitions are on pace for statistically mediocre seasons. Gomez, for instance, is on schedule for a 53-point season. Ditto Gionta. OUCH!!! I know stats aren't everything but - if present trends continue, that will at face value constitute an outrageous waste of cap space. However, the emergence of a second line would absolutely rectify a lot of that.

Boone reiterated recently that his official deadline for beginning to panic about les Habs is the 20-game mark. This raises a good question: at some point, we have to stop using the newness of everything as an excuse.

So, OK everybody: any thoughts about when that should be? Habs29 obviously thinks NOW is the time. Other views? How long before you personally start sh*tting bricks about this new team?

(Note, also, that everybody still forgets about the Markov injury and what it means for the whole club. Does anyone *really* think we'd be 8-9 with Markov back there? I'd say, somewhat arbitrarily, that he's worth at least two more wins - and thus 10-7 record and a much more relaxed fan base... The realistic goal is to stay within striking distance of the playoffs without him, nothing more; from that standpoint, there really isn't cause to panic so far).

Pray for .500 until February. If things fall apart in the next 6 weeks, look towards next season asap.

The playoffs meant something to me last season because I thought it was an important goal for the core,

but that was before I realized that Gainey was going to dump the core.

I have lost a ton of confidence in Gainey over the last 9 months.

[Trizzak]

Honestly? I am just watching hockey until the halfway mark. Then I'll see which direction the team is going.

[BTH]

We're waiting on Gomez more than on anyone else. It's his salary that prevents us from adding a secondary scorer (Sharp, Frolov) and he just isn't playing like a big time player. I don't expect him to earn his salary, but I do expect him to stand out.

He's played well - maybe even like an okay 1st liner - but not good enough for a team that counts him as one of its top three forwards.

Most people said they'd wait 20 games before panicking. It's been 17 games and we have 1 win in regulation (against the measly Islanders). That's just awful. Fortunately, all the OT/SO wins have kept us in the playoff race, but we can not expect this streak to last forever. Price can save us by morphing into Luongo, yet I find a more realistic scenario is Gomez morphing into 84-point Gomez of the Devils.

Our BIGGEST problem is scoring. Often people will say that we don't need superstars if we have a plethora of productive scorers instead. Well, we have neither. For a team relying on pseudo-first liners, we have very little scoring depth. i.e. with or without Markov, we're going nowhere fast unless Gomez or Price digivolves, or a bunch of guys playing like 3rd liners (Latendresse, Pacioretty, Kostitsyn) start playing like second liners.

......And as I've said a hundred times, this will possibly be the BEST edition of the Montreal Canadiens during the Scott Gomez era (given our very real cap issues). We may be a competitive team by the end of the season but I have my doubts that we'll be able to sustain even that level of success beyond this year.

[Fanpuck33]

RUN DOWN ST CATHERINES STREET BREAKING WINDOWS AND BURNING CARS!!! [/b]No wait, we only do that when we win a cup.

Correction: they only do that when they win a 1st round playoff series.

[Habsy]

Correction: they only do that when they win a 1st round playoff series.

Those were not fans, I repeat, those were not fans. That's old news. None of them attended the game, they were scrubs just looking for trouble.

[johnnyhasbeen]

Pray for .500 until February. If things fall apart in the next 6 weeks, look towards next season asap.

The playoffs meant something to me last season because I thought it was an important goal for the core,

but that was before I realized that Gainey was going to dump the core.

I have lost a ton of confidence in Gainey over the last 9 months.

So I assume you would have been happy with him if he had signed the core last year and we were dealing with Kovy and Saku who are on pace for 40 pnt seasons as our top line? I respect your opinion Wamsley, but I am finding this BG bashing abit much at this juncture. I think he did the best he could to improve this team during the off season. He dumped a bunch of deadwood which he didn't offer contracts to because he didn't want them in his lockerroom any more. I think that was a great response to the pathetic effort these guys put in last year.

It seems like only last week when I was reading on here about how our coach situation is so much better than last season. How we now have someone with a system. Now we lose a couple and the world is falling apart. I don't get this attitude.

We are all fans, and want the team to do well, but to jump to these doomsday feelings from excitement over the changes so quickly is beyond me.

Like Trizzak, I will hold my judgement until mid season. If we have the playoffs within reach once Markov is back I am happy. If the goaltending continues to improve, which I feel it is, I am happy. If the call ups continue to show that they are almost ready, I am happy. If the D gets a grip on the new system they are learning, I am happy. If we start to get some consistant secondary scoring, I am more than happy. If any deal made involves players that the GM feels are bad apples or future career underachievers and gets decent value for them, I am happy. If half or more of these things happen, I am ecstatic!!!

I just feel that it is way too early to get down on this NEW team. I know we are into the season now, but I really didn't expect to see them doing much before solstice. That was before the Markov injury. I was honestly hoping to be .500 with a healthy core! I don't see it being that dismal yet. The team seems to be in better mental state then we were in last season, although that is a comment from my armchair on the eastcoast, I don't have the uptight and personal I would have if I had the advantage of seeing team skates. (Jeez I miss the Vee's!).

I love Martin in Ottawa, envied the wifes Hens for having him. He does "have" a system, and it "could" work wonders with our lineup. I am talking about what he implimented while winning with Ottawa. Fast transitional game with crisp passing and utilizing your speed. Our problem is mostly defensive, which is not only our coverage in our end, but holding the line in the ofensive zone and transition. The team was transitioning better a week ago than we were in the last few games and I can't help but wonder how many of our current team are playing with injuries. Spacek for one was hurt a couple games ago, we thought on here he would be out but he has played every game and I would expect is not 100%.

As Montreal fans we are all overly judgemental of our team. It has always been that way, especially in the Forum / Bell. We lived and die by our teams moments and us older guys are really not used to so many straight cupless years. We all want to win now. Believe me, #23 wants it even more. If any of you believe he isn't doing his best you are nuts. Maybe there are better GMs out there, but nobody springs to my mind that is available and could do better. No other GM I can think of would be as dedicated to this organization.

I know alot of people like to throw the Ribs deal in against Capt Bob, but what if there was a Ribs or Saku situation? Rift in the room, one had to go situation? What if Saks had gone instead and had been on a winning team last year while Ribs lead the party all over town? Do you ever think that it was just a "He has to go" situation? I give Mr Gainey the respect of believing he did what had to be done and brought us the best of who was willing to come here and let go what he thought had to go, either for $ sake or for betterment of the team.

In Bob I Trust!!!

Edited November 9, 2009 by johnnyhasbeen

[fromage]

Well, Gomez Cams and Gionta's contracts are for the next 4-5 years. They are the new core.

I'm not expecting a winning season/deep playoff run for at least 2 years.

Edited November 9, 2009 by fromage

[Chips]

Honestly, our top line is being checked and their efforts are being nullified; having said that in almost every game I've watched this season, they are buzzing and some nights could and should have scored a pile of goals. * BUT THEY HAVEN'T! yes I get that.

Therefore, yes we need secondary scoring. Plex is not that big centre but he is playing big this season; thank God! Metro has been a wonderful surprise, will it last? I hope it does...

Will others step up and surprise., I hope so, they better step up or there will be a revolving door to the AHL. or else a trade maybe looming.

Don't get me started on the Defense; from injuries to the bone headed plays that I have come to call "pulling a MAB" or "not another MAB".

Leadership! wow this is yet another mystery, We need a leader in the dressing room, on the bench and on the ice, the role does not need to be filled by the same person.

So lots of questions and there is only three answer for me at this point. MORE TIME! MORE TIME! MORE TIME!

Looking at this young season, I for one am pleasantly surprised that we have keep it near the .500 mark;

And that on any given night we could have won and we could have had multiple goals scored FOR.

I'm happy that Cammy & Gio choose to join the Canadiens as Free Agents! I hope they continue to put up points and create a buzz every time they touch the puck! Gomez needs to live up to potential of his contract, I like that he can move the puck but unhappy that he can give it up and be moved off the puck just as easily. ( NOT WHAT IS EXPECTED FROM A NUMBER ONE centre, he can be a game breaker, he better act like it and SOON please... )

I'm happy that the scoring chances have been jump out of my seat style exciting.

I'm happy that Martin does not take any excuses.

I'm happy that our goalies are both showing signs of being a number one and that they have most of the time stopped the first shot and any that they can see clearly, without deflection.

I'm happy that given the complete change to the teams make up and chemistry that SOME players are playing like we give a damn and like professionals with respect for the fans.

I'm happy we are competing and continue to improve. ( I hope this is because we are learning a new system )

I'm happy that we have not lost any more of our top players to injury; and yes I'm keeping my toes crossed as I typed this thought cause around the league TOP SIX players are falling into injury on a nightly basis.

Well that was a very liberating exercise in getting things off my chest! (who's next)

Lets see, now all we need to do is give our beloved Canadiens, MORE TIME! I've been giving them MORE TIME since 1993 and I think I'm ok with giving them even MORE TIME. I guess you can say that I've had lots of practice and I'm getting very good at being patient.

I WISH THE HABS more time to prove to us fans that our trust and faith in them is not wasted.

GO HABS GO! GO HABS GO! GO HABS GO!

ps. MORE TIME!!!

[saskhab]

Until Price is ready, we're a middling team, though with a healthy Markov we should be a playoff team every year. Really, we're getting a little lucky with all these OT/SO wins with our record right now... the Leafs now have two more regulation wins than we do. Our opponents are 9-1-7 against us.

Markov would bring secondary scoring to this team, and he'd also bring a more productive PP unit.

I'd like to see our top line split up and see if that could help our scoring and ability to draw more penalties (we seem to be taking more penalties than our opponents, which I think is a key reason for the games generally being turning slightly in favour of our opponents).

Our D... man, I can't help but think the guys that are our core/regular D have been nothing short of heroic in Markov's absence, and with the other injuries as well. It's the bandaid solutions of Bergeron and our string of callups that look like they don't belong to some degree. And while they've had lapses, our veterans have generally played as well as could ever be expected from them. Hell, Hamrlik is having his best season since he was an Islander (he was an All-Star defender back then).

[JoeLassister]

Did I say we were going to live with Andrei Kostitsyn or die with him ? He is our secondary scoring. Yesterday, we saw that we could live with him...

[KoZed]

You know what type of team we are?

We're a team on anti-depressants. Rid of all the lows, but also of all the highs. We're sort of flat. Not "dead-flat", but "average-flat". That's why we've had so many 1-goal losses and OT-SO wins.

When you think about it, it's a big departure from the Dr. Jekyll/Mr. Hyde stuff from past season when we could look like a powerhouse one night and a pee-wee team the next. There's one thing that still lacks: an emotional sparkplug. Someone you notices on the ice because he's all over the place and in everybody's face. A Begin-type, but who's not an injury-waiting-to-happen.

Maybe Ryan White can grow into that role. I thought Laps would be it, but given his role he can't afford to take too many penalties. It should come from a 4th liner who has limited ice time so his motor is roaring every shift.

[BCHabnut]

I'm sorry, but I'm startingt to believe Milbury might be right. The Oompa Loompa line is awesome against young scared defense. As soon as they face a team with a strong big defensive core, they are done. I agree with hab29retired on a lot of what he is saying. The season is nearly 1/4 over, and they stink. Stink like a mountain of moose shit! From the first line C to the goalie, there are five or six players that are playing to expectation. Halak, Hammer, Metro, Plek, Cammy. Gionta is on the edge right now for me. So 5 or 6 players out of 20 are playing to expectation. I won't get to excited or bitter until the 3/4 mark of the season, but as it stands right now. THE 2009/2010 MONTREAL CANADIENS SUCK! Bergeron better start putting the puck in the net, otherwise you might as well call up Weber.

[KoZed]

Bergeron better start putting the puck in the net, otherwise you might as well call up Weber.

Glad you bring that up. Because one of the main reason the Habs "suck" is because the PP is atrocious; one of the reasons for that being the inability to set up point shots. Cammy might be alright, but on the PP he takes lot of crappy decisions, trying to do too much alone. Gomez is a bit the same.

I know the loss of Markov hurt, but there's enough talent left that makes it criminal for them to be unable to "install" their PP in the offensive zone, move the defensive box around and open shooting lanes for Bergeron. You have a guy with a howitzer at the point: USE HIM! I'm already so freaking tired of seeing the same little shitty unsuccessful plays down low: low-percentage shots and passes. F*CK!

It'd be so freaking simple. Gomez on the left point, Cammy on the left board, Gionta behind the net/ right faceoff circle, Lats/Laps/Pac/Moen/Price/Muller/Whoever in the crease, and Bergy on the right point. Gomez and Camm exchanges passes and either feed Gio in the slot/right circle/ when he's opened; or try to collapse the box to set Bergy for one-timers. How freaking complicated would that be?!

Second unit you tell Kost to hang out in Brett Hull's yard (smack dab in the slot, between the circles), Plex on the right side, Metro on left side, Hammer/Spacek at the point. Goal is for Metro (who's a pretty good passer) to set up Kosty in the slot or Plex near the net. If you can't do it, just try to collapse the box and have Hammer/Spacek pinch in the back door.

DO IT JACQUES!

[Chris]

There are many reasons the habs "suck" as many of you point out.

I'll start with the good:

I like the top line just fine, they are still al little snake bit but still get some good chances most every night.

I like the Pacioretty Metro Moen line

I think they play harder for laonger periods of time

I like the goaltending, can they be better? Sure, However they may have 0 wins without top end goaltending on some nights.

I like Martin calling people out, sitting people but i'm not understanding they defensive system, it looks exactly like the last 5 coaches.

Dont Like:

Defnsive zone, they are really bad. Forwards, defenders, it's all bad.

No physical play, only the smurfs drive the net and win battles. Moen and Pacioretty use the body. The rest of the BIG players are play like women.

They have no checking line, know one to shut down the other team.

No secondary scoring

The PK and PP are pathetic

They have an uncanny ability to do something well, followed immediately by a series of dumb panalties and brain cramps, killing all momentum

Numerous underachieivers making themselves trade bait, Lats, Lapierre, Kosty bros, Laraque, Gorges, Chipchura and i'm sure i'm misssing a few. Maybe thye are just over rated or don't care but either ay Martin won't put up with it. (Hopefully)

Other then that i guess maybe if they continue to suck they'll draft a top 6 forward with a top 3 pick.

[RJP]

Totally agree with Habs29Retired, unfortunately guys like Johnnyhasbeen don't get it, and guess what? There are many similar views out there that don't get to this board. So let's not dismiss this with it's "early in the season" rebuttals. Watching the game against Tampa I realize we could sneak into the playoffs and the same thing would happen. The opposition brings its "A" game and we don't have one. Be honest - there are games we've played where we just couldn't play any better right now and it's not good enough. What does that say? One guy is going to make a difference when he returns? Markov? Let's give our collective heads a shake. Guys can't seem to clear the zone, can't take care of the opposition in front of the net, get in each others' way trying to clear the puck, pucks deflected by our own guys into our net, no secondary scoring, shots from the point that hit the shins of the opposition forward covering the point, shots from the point that miss the net, power play that doesn't work, penalty kill that doesn't work (both in the bottom 1/3 of the league I believe), the best scoring line being mauled and intimidated in front of the opposition net, etc., etc., etc..

Yes, it's early in the season maybe, totally agree they need time to get an identity and gel, but that's not my issue. It's the fact that over 20% of the season has passed and we have 1 solitary win in regulation. More often than not, the coaching staff don't seem to get our guys ready for games or more importantly, to react and step it up when it's obvious the opposing team is far more aggressive and intense than we are. Tampa was by far the harder working team on Saturday, and it boggles my mind that we don't react to that. Bad luck? BS!, there's a bigger problem here. It's our mental side of the game, the motivational side, DURING games? Sorry, never liked Martin. I live in Toronto, saw him a lot. He had a pretty darn good team in Ottawa, maybe it wasn't him. Unfortunately, this team needs a passionate, intense, motivator DURING games. Bottom line is I still feel this team is good enough but it's between the ears that's the problem, and IMO that's the coaching staff's area, that's where the problem is.

[ForumGhost]

Piss piss, moan moan. Where are the Habs fans? :hlogo:

As usual, I'm more disgusted with the so called 'fans' waaay more than the team. Makes me envious of Leafs fans.

Edited November 9, 2009 by ForumGhost

[brobin]

In my opinion we need our 2nd line to score and be a threat. Our top line is good, but it is checked into the ground because they are the only consistent threat. I am sure the plan was to have AK progress this year and if he had we would not be struggling to score so much. There were be two good lines coming at them with that hardworking bastard named Metro giving their 3rd and 4th lines fits..

Our defensive woes start and end at injuries. Our PP would not be awesome, but it would not be embarrassing if we had Markov back. That alone would move us up a few points in the standings.

Our goaltending is pretty average right now. Both goalies are capable of putting up a fantastic game, but most of the time they put up an average game and only look good if the D is close to perfect. That is not realistic.. they need to make a few more of those unstoppable saves if they want to be considered above average goalies.

It is too early to tell how we will do overall, but it could be worse. If our kids don't start getting better in a hurry, I think we are not even a playoff team. If they could step it up, then we are probably a playoff team, but not deep. If they all get better and one of our goalies get hot (and I mean HOT!), then we could be a playoff wildcard.

If I was putting money on this team, I would suggest a 8th to 11th finish. I don't think we are that much better then most bottom rung teams. We can win when we play great, but we don't have the talent to win when we don't. Pitts has won a pile of games this year while playing like crap. Fleury keeps them in it, then they have the talent to put in a good 5 minutes and take it. We are not even close.

[hab29RETIRED]

Piss piss, moan moan. Where are the Habs fans? :hlogo:

As usual, I'm more disgusted with the so called 'fans' waaay more than the team. Makes me envious of Leafs fans.

I think part of the problem in Montreal now is that people want Habs "fans" to be stupid sheep like the leafs fans have been for the last 40+ years. Cheering on a mediocore crappy team, no matter how well they do. Repeatedly uttering stupid "In Bob we Trust" gibberish despite the fact that the team is regressing rather then progressing.

Excuse me of growing up and cheering with a team where winning was an expectation, not a Russian five year plan. Because that is all that Bob's got - a friggin Russian five year plan, that keeps on being extended without reaching the desired goal.

Last year it was the crappy players who didn't give a damn that go the coach fired. Well we turned over the roster and now have a #1 centre who is making over 3 times what koivu is earning and guess what he has 11 points to koivu's 9. Hmmm, that is a BIG upgrade for the next FIVE FRIGGIN years!!!!

As I've said before, Gainey was an exemplory player an exemplory captain and a class act, but lets face it, he sucks as a GM.

The only two trades he has made which I applauded when he made them were the Kovolev and Rivet trades. IMO the only trade I hated when he made it that has worked out is the Huet trade, and that was more of a fluke. I hated going after an overpaid Bonk for Garon, since Huet was able to stop the bleeding of Theo's play receding with his hairline, that move turned out to be alright.

What about his other moves????

-I hated ribeiro, but the little twerpshould have fetched way more then Ninnima. Yeah, yeah, yeah, addition by subtraction. It seems there has been a lot of subtraction under Gainey, but not a hell of a lot of addition.

-How do you give up Higgins, Mcdonough AND the rights to Valentenko for Gomez a player the Rangers have been trying to unload since the year after they signed him ?????

-Living in Calgary, I saw why the Flames didn't want to anyting to do with Tanguay, so Gainey gives up a 1st r& 2nd rounder for him. This after Tangauy floated through a 58 point year. Great price to pay for a one year rental.

-What kind of idiotic GM has a stupid policy of not negotiating during the year when that is really the only leverage he has with impending free agents. He was lucky as hell that Markov resigned, otherwise at the end of the season, otherwise, how many players are going to forego free agency AFTER the season has already ended, and they have nothing to lose??? Is there any other GM who has allowed as many free agents to walk without a return???? I can' t think of anyone managing their assets this poorly other then Mike Milbury, who must have had something on Wang to have a job as long as he did.

-Who cares if it was a centenial year, the team sucked going into the trade deadline and Komi should have been moved or signed. Komi had been trying to get Bob to sign him long term for the past couple of years and Bob probably could have signed him cheaper had he done so earlier. If things didn't work out and had he signed Komi earlier to a more reasonable contract, he still would have been an asset that could have been moved.

-Souray should have been moved or signed.

-Streit should have been signed and SAID THAT HE WOULD have signed for under $3M during the season but Gainey wasn't interested.

-Ryder should have been dumped.

-Koivu gone, yep we got a MUCH better player for the next FRIGGIN FIVE YEARS at $7.25M a year then the $2.2M that Koivu would have costed.

-Kovolev gone - no return. Again, if he wanted to retain Kovy, why wait the weak before the guy is a free agent before tendering an offer??????

Again how many teams let that MANY free agents walk away for nothing????? If you sign guys earlier on at the right price, you can always move them. Much better then losing them for nothing, or signing guys for stupid contracts that you actually have to find someone stupidier to take it off your hands. Sather must have been laughing after he got off the phone with Gainey after he unloaded GOmez.

We have blown up the team, what are issues now?????? Team that can't clear its zone, no system, no team defence, a top line that buzzes around a lot but has trouble finishing....... Hmmmm. haven't we heard this record before??????

Bob has always overpaid for players going back to his dallas days, and while i like Gionta, $5M for a 20 goal scorer????

We now have $18.25M tied up for the next 5 or 6 years on three guys, and of those three guys Cammilari is really the only guy that will probably EARN what he is getting paid.

Lets talk about player development under Gainey.

-Other then Gainey the REST OF THE LEAGUE and anyone with eyes and a brain - I don't think it necessarily even had to be a hockey fan - could see that Carey Price did not belong in the nets at end of last year, but IN BOB WE TRUST kept throwing him to the wolves, then after fans Boo Price, he calls the fans rude???? Isn't the GM's job to protect a young player by putting him in a position to succeed????

-Lats will probably never amount to anything other then a 3rd/4th liner because he was brought up to quickly (unless he gets traded to a team that knows how to develop and turns players around), so what does Bob do, he puts Max Pac in the same position and is doing his utmost to turn him into a 3rd/4th liner.

Because of Bob, Price probably doesn't want anyting to do with Montreal once he gets a shot at free agency and I'm fairly confident that we will lose our best player this year (Pleks), just like we have lost every other free agent that preceded him. We'll probably also see the Kostitsyn brother be 40 goal scorers or conisisent 70-90 point guys somewhere else. Great job by Martin singling out Sergei and demoting hiim after 1 exhibition game, especially since he was about the only guy who showed any life or spunk in that game. Yeah, he acted like a pampered twerp afterwards, but the guy is 22 years old. Hell Gainey seemed to be a wet nurse and changed Kovolev's diapers the entire time he was in Montreal.

Lets talk about coaching moves. Hiring Carbo after the habs have had nothing but rookie coaches since Jacque Demers. hiring Martin, who not only couldn't win in the playoffs, yeah he had success in Ottawa, but he also inherited a lot of talent. What did the guy accomplish in Florida??????

But hey, we are all habs fans, we should cheer them on lose, lose or lose, just like the stupid sheep in TOronto. Because as fans we should accept mediocrity because we have the privelage of cheering and supporting a team that hasn't put together any consistent progression since Roy was traded for players that would be cheered wildly by leafs fans.

I've been a habs fan for 35 years - which is when I discovered Hockey and sports. I'm sorry if i don't fit the blind stupid mentality of a leaf fans that some habs fans think the Habs should have supporting them.

I WANT the Habs to win, I expect the Habs to win and I will not stand by and watch my beloved habs losing - and not just losing but looking like losers in disgusting barber pole costumes that reeks of what else.... Leafs marketing.

Edited November 9, 2009 by hab29RETIRED

[ForumGhost]

I've been a habs fan for 35 years -

There's the problem. It's that sense of entitlement that makes you think we should be a cup contender every year. Well the cold, hard truth is that's we aren't entitled to shit. Just because we've had success in the past, it doesn't mean we ought to be better than the 29 other teams in the league. In the cap era, it's a leveled playing field all around and there are no more dynasties. The state of which teams in the NHL are competitive is in a constant flux. The Avalanche started out this decade as a strong team, but then, as time goes by, key players get old, free agents leave, and then since your past success has limited you to late draft picks, you will probably spend the next couple years in the gutter until you can accumulate enough strong picks to build around. That's exactly what happened to the Blackhawks, the Pens and the Caps. It's what's happening to the Lighning and Canes now. Detroit is next on the list.

We have not been bad enough to consistently be in the gutter for any extended period of time, thus we haven't picked high very often. Then people complain that we aren't as competitive as the Pens or the Caps? Well newsflash, we don't have any Crosbys or Ovechkins and personally, I don't wanna spend the next couple years in the basement in order to get them. I wanna see the Habs succeed in the big picture, but first and foremost I wanna see them win games. If that means not bombing at the expense of possible franchise players in the future, than so be it. I would rather be sitting on the playoff bubble then be where the Canes are dreaming about Hall or whoever. Gainey has done a damn good job with the assets under his control and if we can crack the top 8 (which we can), then that's all I can ask for because once the playoffs starts, it's a reset for everyone.

[rafikz]

We suck

We lack depth

Hey, we're 3 pts behind the Division leader

Man the NE division is weak

[johnnyhasbeen]

Hey 29, you are right, The Habs should win every year. They should still have the rights to every PQ player coming into the league, and if they don't want them on the big team they should create a PQ league and stick them there so no other team gets them. That is the brutal truth behind every single cup banner but 2. The NHL brought an end to this with expansion and since then we have had to draft like everyone else and nobody can expect a winning team every year with that sort of sytem. There will be ups and downs. Explain to me how this lineup is worse in anyway shape or form than what we had when Bob took over. Sorry to pull seniority , but since your 35 yrs means so much to you as a fan I happen to have 41 years as a fan in my mid forties.

KNow what that means? Nothing! It is moot.

So now please tell us all, who do you want as coach and gm of this team? Who do you think a different GM could have brought in when it is very obvious that most UFAs hate the PQ taxes? You are spouting alot of hatred and are not offering any sort of solution. Gainey built the cup winning team in Dallas, that is more than most GMs have ever accomplished. Man he sucks.

Just don't be on here praising these same people when and if they turn it around.

How much would you have paid Komo, Kovy and CaptSmurf to stay? Oh and we should have kept Lang too, right? Do you really think that mid season we would not have had to sign them for as an estimate, Saku 4mil, Kovy 6.5mil, Komo 6mil, Lang 2.5mil. There goes a wasted 19mil over 5years. Nice move! Kovalenko will never play outside of russia so he was no loss. Higgins will be a career 4th liner, and McDonaugh is 4-5 years away from anyone knowing if he develops or not. We got Gomez for a song and a long shot, BECAUSE his contract is too high.

Sorry to go off on you, but I believe you are just wrong, as are all the other love the team when they are up hate them when they are down fans. How many points did you expect the team to have mid season this year? I think most people that know hockey beyond their jerseys expected this to be at best a team battling for the last playoff spot. I hope for more as I always do, but in honesty if we make the playoffs this year we are doing great. No change of GM is going to bring the class of talent here you are looking for at the price you would want to pay. The taxes are just too high. Get used to it.

Edited November 9, 2009 by johnnyhasbeen