2023 NHL Entry Draft

[GHT120]

6 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

Just a couple of more losses , not a full sabotage 

A few OTs with Chris Tierny, Michael Pezzetta and Jonathan Kovacevic taking the opening faceoff?

[DON]

13 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

I just hope they do not add insult to injury

Players and coaches try and win.

Not sure what 'realistically' could/should of done to be worse.

They already removed 1/2 the team to sick bay and still won the odd game.

28th was my wildass preseason guess at Habs finish and they were 28th.

[DON]

https://www.habsworld.net/2023/06/2023-draft-profile-zach-benson/

 

Benson seems a nice option, if traded down.

 

"Benson’s impressive hockey IQ and compete levels make him an interesting prospect that should challenge for an NHL job immediately. Add in that he’s described as defensively responsible, and he has all the makings of a Nick Suzuki in my opinion."

[alfredoh2009]

1 hour ago, GHT120 said:

A few OTs with Chris Tierny, Michael Pezzetta and Jonathan Kovacevic taking the opening faceoff?

or Drouin, Pitlick and Wideman for the full OT

[alfredoh2009]

55 minutes ago, DON said:

Players and coaches try and win.

Not sure what 'realistically' could/should of done to be worse.

They already removed 1/2 the team to sick bay and still won the odd game.

28th was my wildass preseason guess at Habs finish and they were 28th.

if I went back and looked at the game logs, I am sure I would fine at least half a dozen games that could have been easily lost.

We cannot change the past, I just don't want the Habs to give assets to remedy a situation they put themselves in. That would be such a dumb move. Imagine trading Harris, Mesar and a this years 5th overall pick to go up one or two notches?!

[Commandant]

Players and coaches don't intentionally lose games. 

 

You do realize that their contracts depend on individual performance?

 

Whining that the players didn't intentionally lose just shows a lack of understanding of how this works. 

[Commandant]

1 hour ago, DON said:

https://www.habsworld.net/2023/06/2023-draft-profile-zach-benson/

 

Benson seems a nice option, if traded down.

 

"Benson’s impressive hockey IQ and compete levels make him an interesting prospect that should challenge for an NHL job immediately. Add in that he’s described as defensively responsible, and he has all the makings of a Nick Suzuki in my opinion."

 

I would be fine taking Benson at 5

 

Would Not be my first choice (I've got him ranked 6th) but not something I would be upset about. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

2 hours ago, DON said:

https://www.habsworld.net/2023/06/2023-draft-profile-zach-benson/

 

Benson seems a nice option, if traded down.

 

"Benson’s impressive hockey IQ and compete levels make him an interesting prospect that should challenge for an NHL job immediately. Add in that he’s described as defensively responsible, and he has all the makings of a Nick Suzuki in my opinion."

 

On another Habs board I read they are many there who absolutely love Benson. 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

Some Benson highlights, the play starting at about the 50 second mark is just phenomenal. A lot to like here. 

 

 

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

3 hours ago, alfredoh2009 said:

if I went back and looked at the game logs, I am sure I would fine at least half a dozen games that could have been easily lost.

 

 

And what kind of message would that send to the rest of the team?  The goal is to build a winning culture. Sabotaging a team's effort to win does not do that. 

[alfredoh2009]

15 minutes ago, Habs Fan in Edmonton said:

 

And what kind of message would that send to the rest of the team?  The goal is to build a winning culture. Sabotaging a team's effort to win does not do that. 

I just don't want them to sacrifice a prospect or pick this season to move up. I would prefer that they move down and package something for immediate help in the top-4 RD

A Dach-type of player coming back

[alfredoh2009]

New signature, hoping that HughGort does great at the draft:

Ode to 2023 draft:

    All is fair in war, in love,

    but tanking for Bedard

    wasn't how Habs rolled!

 

    Draft day is coming,

    fifth overall to pick,

    don't screw up the rebuild,

    let's go for the 25th!

Edited June 16, 2023 by alfredoh2009
added signature in message

[Commandant]

1 hour ago, alfredoh2009 said:

I just don't want them to sacrifice a prospect or pick this season to move up. I would prefer that they move down and package something for immediate help in the top-4 RD

A Dach-type of player coming back

 

Because the team didn't intentionally lose games, you don't want to move up?

 

I'm not sure that makes a lot of sense. 

 

You can't change what happened during the season. 

 

Any trade should be evaluated on the trade itself, not on the fact they have to trade up because they won too many games. 

 

5th + __________ for 2nd, has to be evaluated based on what the blank is.   

 

If Anaheim says, sure 5th and Kidney for 2nd, we should not sacrifice that because they didn't tank enough?

[DON]

top ten talk 

 

[Sir_Boagalott]

Moving up in a regular draft is costly, and this is not a regular draft year so the price would be way too crazy.

 

Has anybody seen this breakdown of what it typically costs to move up?

 

Somebody researched it and made a cool chart:

 

 

Source:  https://montrealhockeynow.com/2022/06/06/nhl-draft-the-cost-of-moving-up-in-the-nhl-draft/

 

 

[Prime Minister Koivu]

There was major speculation and rumours about Habs trading for #2 pick last season and nothing happened. 
 

I'm not expecting another top 4 pick this year either 

[DON]

 After being unable to move up last year from 26th, will Hughes be more aggressive this year (assume he offered 26th & one of 2nd rounders)?

Wonder who he had targeted to try and move up for last year? Snuggerud?

 

 

https://www.habseyesontheprize.com/habsent-minded-david-reinbacher-nhl-draft-preview-national-league-analytics/

""I'm not the draft expert, but I would be really excited to have him in Montreal because I really think you have a cornerstone in your defence for the next 10 to 15 years..."

 

https://www.habseyesontheprize.com/will-smith-2023-nhl-draft-prospect-profile-scouting-report-rankings-stats-highlights-usntdp-centre/

 

Another bit on Smith.

[Habs Fan in Edmonton]

11 hours ago, Prime Minister Koivu said:

There was major speculation and rumours about Habs trading for #2 pick last season and nothing happened. 
 

I'm not expecting another top 4 pick this year either 

 

I agree. I think Hughes is trying to move up but the price will be too high.  They will get a really good player at 5. 

[Commandant]

22 hours ago, Sir_Boagalott said:

Moving up in a regular draft is costly, and this is not a regular draft year so the price would be way too crazy.

 

Has anybody seen this breakdown of what it typically costs to move up?

 

Somebody researched it and made a cool chart:

 

 

Source:  https://montrealhockeynow.com/2022/06/06/nhl-draft-the-cost-of-moving-up-in-the-nhl-draft/

 

 

 

Considering no one has moved a top 2 or 3 pick at the draft since before the salary cap was a thing, I dont know how applicable this is.  The cap changed everything

 

Yes the leafs pick for seguin went to boston, the sens got a pick from SJ, etc... but these were traded long before we knew they were top 5. 

 

 

[DON]

 

Nice look at Dvorsky's game, doubt would be a #5 pick, but top 10 sounds likely.

[Sir_Boagalott]

On 6/17/2023 at 9:07 PM, Commandant said:

 

Considering no one has moved a top 2 or 3 pick at the draft since before the salary cap was a thing, I dont know how applicable this is.  The cap changed everything

 

Yes the leafs pick for seguin went to boston, the sens got a pick from SJ, etc... but these were traded long before we knew they were top 5. 

 

 

 

The chart is definitely based on outdated data.  It was made in 2011 and is based on info from 88-97.  However, it is an interesting idea and somebody should try to remake it with more current info.  Unfortunately, there probably isnt enough data to recreate it.  

 

Apparently, there are rumours that Hughes is trying to draft up and I believe he wants Will Smith.  That could potentially be a great idea considering Hughes coached him.

 

           Despite being from Boston, he does have a deep connection to the Canadiens, thanks to general                           manager (GM) Kent Hughes, who had a significant impact on the development of the young center. 

“He (Hughes) was my youth coach for a couple of years. Now he is the general manager of the Canadiens, which is pretty funny. I think he’s probably my best and favorite coach I had growing up. So I think he kind of made my game to what it is. Teaching me how to play the game the right way. And making sure I know that if you don’t play the right way, then at the next level, it’s just going to get harder and harder. So I think as a coach, he definitely let us know if we were doing something wrong or what we could work with. But I mean, he was great encouraging everything like that.”

 

I imagine that a big part of Hughes interest in him is that he likely thinks that after his ECL is up he will be able to get him to sign a contract like Cole's.  Numerous of the players in the top 5 and possibly even top 10 will have post ECL contracts that start with a 9 or higher.  It would be fairly huge if the Habs can draft another elite player that will sign a long term contract that starts with a 7.  

 

Plus, Smith has recently commented that he wants to play with Cole.  

[DON]

Or trade down?

https://awinninghabit.com/2023/06/19/montreal-canadiens-trading-habs-looking-trade/

 

"If the Coyotes offer the 6th pick and Habs 2024 second rounder, it would be wise of the Canadiens to move back. The Capitals could also offer the 8th pick and the 40th overall pick in this year’s draft to move up to 5th.

Or, perhaps the Capitals really want to get rid of Anthony Mantha’s contract and offer up the 8th pick and their first round pick in 2024 and Mantha to move up to fifth. If any of those kinds of offers come across Hughes desk, he should hang up on the Ducks and Sharks and pull the trigger on a trade that moves the Canadiens down a few spots."

[alfredoh2009]

35 minutes ago, DON said:

Or trade down?

https://awinninghabit.com/2023/06/19/montreal-canadiens-trading-habs-looking-trade/

 

"If the Coyotes offer the 6th pick and Habs 2024 second rounder, it would be wise of the Canadiens to move back. The Capitals could also offer the 8th pick and the 40th overall pick in this year’s draft to move up to 5th.

Or, perhaps the Capitals really want to get rid of Anthony Mantha’s contract and offer up the 8th pick and their first round pick in 2024 and Mantha to move up to fifth. If any of those kinds of offers come across Hughes desk, he should hang up on the Ducks and Sharks and pull the trigger on a trade that moves the Canadiens down a few spots."

Only if the Caps take Armia to clear salary

 

the Yotes deal? if we can dump Hoffman there, on that trade, that would be great! Don't know how to make this work though

 

 

[alfredoh2009]

Reinbacher, RHD eh?!

I would trade down to get him, dump salary and get another pick in the draft

 

Le casse-tête des défenseurs et le spectre de 2018 https://t.co/juO5YkaoVE

— Guillaume Lefrançois 🟦🇨🇿 (@glefrancoisLP) June 19, 2023

 

[The Chicoutimi Cucumber]

On 6/16/2023 at 12:44 PM, Commandant said:

 

Because the team didn't intentionally lose games, you don't want to move up?

 

I'm not sure that makes a lot of sense. 

 

You can't change what happened during the season. 

 

Any trade should be evaluated on the trade itself, not on the fact they have to trade up because they won too many games. 

 

5th + __________ for 2nd, has to be evaluated based on what the blank is.   

 

If Anaheim says, sure 5th and Kidney for 2nd, we should not sacrifice that because they didn't tank enough?

 

On tanking, I don’t really get the argument that the Habs ‘failed’ to tank last season. We iced a team with a ridiculous proportion of raw rookies on the blueline and required Sam Montembault (widely regarded as a #3-4 goalie) to take significant starts. Most of our FW unit was a grab-bag of unproductive-to-middling veterans and marginal players, leavened with two genuinely excellent young guns (Suze and CC).

 

So why did we finish ‘only’ 5th last? Because the kids surpassed expectations in the first half. Many of the D played very well before going down with injury. CC was on fire. Montembault took a huge step forward to establishing himself as a legit NHL starter.

 

It’s easy to say in retrospect that we ‘should not have’ been dressing, say, WiFi because he was ‘too good’ to play on a tanking team. None of that was obvious at the start. And while I myself prefer to allow kids to marinade in the minors, it would have been pretty ridiculous to yank them out of the NHL in December on the grounds that they had been playing excellently up to that point.

 

Since, as you say, players and coaches do not tank, I don’t see any real grounds for criticizing the organization. We iced a terrible team that surpassed expectations for the first seven weeks or so. That’s how it goes.