hab29RETIRED Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 4 hours ago, dlbalr said: Isn't he worth more than that to other teams as a rental player at the trade deadline? Or before the draft? Even if Dubois doesn't want to sign with an acquiring team, that team can still take him to arbitration and force a contract, taking him as a one-year rental. It's not without its risks but the centre market is terrible this year so I have to think there are teams that will view him as a better option than any UFA out there and pay a reasonably high price to do so. Big issue I see is Winnipeg will want dmen - and I wouldn’t want to live any of our young ones. A deal focusing around Anderson and Dvorak would be good for both teams (Anderson still has term, and given that most people would not willingly want to live in Winnipeg, having a guy with term would be appealing). Maybe add Edmondson and a in 2024? I defiantly don’t want to live any our young D (other than Guhle, unsure which ones will become an impact player yet), or forwards prospects like Beck and Roy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nihilz Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 11 hours ago, Commandant said: Hes gonna get traded for a 2nd rounder, mike Hoffman and a ham sandwich. Any leverage Winnipeg had is being taken away. Jets fans are delusional right now. They still think they'll get Beck FLA 1st and Harris. I feel bad for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 1 hour ago, nihilz said: Jets fans are delusional right now. They still think they'll get Beck FLA 1st and Harris. I feel bad for them. Why? Likley not too far off what it would cost, is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 Beck, Harris and a late 1st for a one-year rental, for a team that is not going to be contending? What sense would that make? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 38 minutes ago, tomh009 said: Beck, Harris and a late 1st for a one-year rental, for a team that is not going to be contending? What sense would that make? It is to get the (wink-wink) chance to sign him before he is a UFA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 3 hours ago, nihilz said: Jets fans are delusional right now. They still think they'll get Beck FLA 1st and Harris. 1 hour ago, DON said: Likley not too far off what it would cost, is it? Likely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 47 minutes ago, tomh009 said: Beck, Harris and a late 1st for a one-year rental, for a team that is not going to be contending? What sense would that make? Zero. We are not at the stage where we should be moving any picks and prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 2 minutes ago, hab29RETIRED said: Zero. We are not at the stage where we should be moving any picks and prospects. Not for 30+ yr-old veterans but a not-yet 25 yr-old is somewhat different ... PLD is ONE draft class earlier than Suzuki ... age-wise fits perfectly in a rebuild. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 3 minutes ago, GHT120 said: Not for 30+ yr-old veterans but a not-yet 25 yr-old is somewhat different ... PLD is ONE draft class earlier than Suzuki ... age-wise fits perfectly in a rebuild. If they have a commitment from him to sign an extension, maybe. As a rental, it makes no sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 Just now, tomh009 said: If they have a commitment from him to sign an extension, maybe. As a rental, it makes no sense. NOBODY is proposing it as a rental ... the assumption is that Hughes and Brisson may have had amicable chats during the CC negotiations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 35 minutes ago, GHT120 said: It is to get the (wink-wink) chance to sign him before he is a UFA. That is still WAY too much for a guy who supposedly wants to sign with us anyway. I could see sending them Beck, on the principle that with PLD and Slick Nick we’re set at C for a decade. But even then, my understanding of Beck is that he could make for a darned good #3C, which is also something we’ll need if we want to build a durable contender. If management’s assessment of Harris is that he’s likely to top out as a bottom pairing guy or a marginal #4, then I could see sending them Harris instead of Beck. But shipping out multiple valuable assets for an expiring PLD? Nope. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 6 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: That is still WAY too much for a guy who supposedly wants to sign with us anyway. "wants to sign" is not the same as "will only sign" Waiting until July 1, 2024 risks PLD being traded elsewhere and loving it, or free agency bidding driving up his contract ... *** IF *** they want him then a trade this summer makes sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 Just now, GHT120 said: "wants to sign" is not the same as "will only sign" Waiting until July 1, 2024 risks PLD being traded elsewhere and loving it, or free agency bidding driving up his contract ... *** IF *** they want him then a trade this summer makes sense. I agree with making some sort of trade to get him, but feel that the Habs need to keep a cool head about it. We have most of the leverage, Winnipeg doesn’t. A quality C prospect + a quality young D + a 1st is too much under those conditions IMHO. That’s why I suggest EITHER Beck or Harris as the nucleus of a deal, but not much more than that. If they like Anderson then that could be a better option in terms of the rebuild (although I love Anderson). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 53 minutes ago, GHT120 said: Not for 30+ yr-old veterans but a not-yet 25 yr-old is somewhat different ... PLD is ONE draft class earlier than Suzuki ... age-wise fits perfectly in a rebuild. That is a lot to give up for a guy who is a UFA in one year. im fine with moving a package of older guys like Dvorak, who would not be needed with PLD, or a guy like Anderson, who I can’t see staying healthy. But if we are going to build a legit contender, we not only need elite players, but we also are going to need young players on cheaper contracts who play above their cap hit. We also aren’t in any position to be moving D prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REV-G Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 Totally agree with moving Dvorak and Anderson but not trading away our young guys. Florida's 1st plus one of the above two would be my choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 12 hours ago, Commandant said: I thought the "ham sandwich" would have shown the sarcasm, my bad. I figured that part was sarcastic but thought you meant the part about Winnipeg's leverage being taken away. I don't think it is all that much. (This report isn't helping things by any stretch but they'll have lots of options if they want to move him.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 5 hours ago, nihilz said: Jets fans are delusional right now. They still think they'll get Beck FLA 1st and Harris. I feel bad for them. If it's a return structured like that, they'll have a few teams making offers in that territory (late 1st, good prospect, and something else). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nihilz Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 32 minutes ago, dlbalr said: If it's a return structured like that, they'll have a few teams making offers in that territory (late 1st, good prospect, and something else). I disagree. I think hes painted the Jets into a corner. Where nobody will pay value for him as they wont know what player they will get. Will he drag his ass. Will he demand a trade by game 30. Will a gm bring that into his locker? And will he give assets for such a question mark. Especially knowing it's for 1 year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 22 minutes ago, nihilz said: I disagree. I think hes painted the Jets into a corner. Where nobody will pay value for him as they wont know what player they will get. Will he drag his ass. Will he demand a trade by game 30. Will a gm bring that into his locker? And will he give assets for such a question mark. Especially knowing it's for 1 year. Can't some of these concerns be said about most rental players acquired at the deadline? You think they'll fit in but you can't be sure what you'll have after 20, 30 games. Heck, even Montreal doesn't know what version of Dubois they'd get as moody players always tend to be moody; that trait isn't going away even if he does wind up with the Habs. If a GM of a playoff-bound team thinks he needs centre help, he'll go after the best centre available. (At least, if he's doing his job properly, he will.) That player is Dubois. Do they care if he doesn't want to play there? In some instances at least, no as teams trade for guys they can't/won't keep all the time. They'll care that they're getting the best centre available and stopping their competitor from doing so. Dubois isn't dumb enough to tank his season and kill his value a year away from free agency and every team knows that. If he's not playing hard and on his best behaviour, he's not getting the big-ticket deal he wants from the team he wants to go to. Clearly, we're not changing each other's minds on this. We'll see what happens in the next few weeks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCHabnut Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 45 minutes ago, dlbalr said: We'll see what happens in the next few weeks. Hopefully nothing. Now if he was a right handed defenseman I'd be all over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 7 hours ago, hab29RETIRED said: Zero. We are not at the stage where we should be moving any picks and prospects. OK, so you are in the "Dubois..not with a ten foot pole" group then. He aint coming for free... this year at least. 3 hours ago, BCHabnut said: Hopefully nothing. Now if he was a right handed defenseman I'd be all over it. Yes, would be more interested in that also. 8 hours ago, tomh009 said: Beck, Harris and a late 1st for a one-year rental, for a team that is not going to be contending? What sense would that make? It would be painful, sure. But to add a proven top six centre/top 4 RH d-man it will hurt more than folks like to propose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 1 hour ago, DON said: ... It would be painful, sure. But to add a proven top six centre/top 4 RH d-man it will hurt more than folks like to propose. MOST significant trades end up with fans of at least one side, or both, feeling they gave up too much or didn't get enough (as appropriate). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hab29RETIRED Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 1 hour ago, DON said: OK, so you are in the "Dubois..not with a ten foot pole" group then. He aint coming for free... this year at least. Yes, would be more interested in that also. It would be painful, sure. But to add a proven top six centre/top 4 RH d-man it will hurt more than folks like to propose. I’m in the camp that if Winnipeg wants a sold 20 goal guy like Anderson(which to date what PLD is), a responsible 3rd line centre would go supposedly (I don’t see it, because t others like him), can move up like Dvorak, Edmondson and a second round pick for next year - sure. Even if they want Allen vxuse they will have to move Hellebuyck- sure. I do think having a guy like Anderson - size, skill, speed AND with a number of years of term, should be appealing to a team like Winnipeg m (don’t know if anyone would willingly wanting to live in Winnipeg if they have other choices!). but hey, if they want a Dach, Beck, Roy, or our young D. Than it’s a hard no for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 Defenceman Damon Severson is joining the Columbus Blue Jackets as part of a sign-and-trade (8-yrs, $50M) ... the Devils will receive the Flames' third-round pick in this month's NHL Draft (80th overall) from the Blue Jackets. Doesn't seem like a HUGE return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted June 9, 2023 Share Posted June 9, 2023 13 minutes ago, GHT120 said: Doesn't seem like a HUGE return. Is he much of a d-man? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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