Neech Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 6 hours ago, illWill said: Beaulieu, McCarron and a 1st for Duchene In what world would this be enough for Duchene? That's a dollar for three quarters. Seeing as our pick will probably be in the 20's, Beaulieu's the most valuable asset going back, and there's no way Colorado would let go of Duchene for that kind of package. The fact that Montreal's been rumoured to be in everything leads me to believe that Bergevin is willing to deal Sergachev for a top forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 34 minutes ago, Neech said: In what world would this be enough for Duchene? That's a dollar for three quarters. Seeing as our pick will probably be in the 20's, Beaulieu's the most valuable asset going back, and there's no way Colorado would let go of Duchene for that kind of package. The fact that Montreal's been rumoured to be in everything leads me to believe that Bergevin is willing to deal Sergachev for a top forward. In all fairness.... Stu Cowan recently suggested the Beaulieu, McCarron + 1st package for Duchene recently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illWill Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 7 hours ago, Neech said: In what world would this be enough for Duchene? That's a dollar for three quarters. Seeing as our pick will probably be in the 20's, Beaulieu's the most valuable asset going back, and there's no way Colorado would let go of Duchene for that kind of package. The fact that Montreal's been rumoured to be in everything leads me to believe that Bergevin is willing to deal Sergachev for a top forward. The world where the reported ask is a young roster player, a prospect and a pick. Keep in mind Sakic is overstating what he wants for him so there is room to negotiate down a bit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habsfan1989 Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 Forget about him we don't have the prospects or talent to make a big trade like that. I say MB does nothing big at trade deadline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 1 hour ago, Habsfan1989 said: Forget about him we don't have the prospects or talent to make a big trade like that. I say MB does nothing big at trade deadline. Well he does seem to be able to fiddle while the team burns down, a la last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 34 minutes ago, habs rule said: Well he does seem to be able to fiddle while the team burns down, a la last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 5 hours ago, illWill said: The world where the reported ask is a young roster player, a prospect and a pick. Keep in mind Sakic is overstating what he wants for him so there is room to negotiate down a bit I look at it from a fan/marketing perspective. Duchene is one of the faces of that franchise. Can you really trade him for a so-so roster player (in this case, Beaulieu) who may never become much more than he is right now? If you think N8 has real potential to become a #2 d-man, an impact guy, that's one thing. But if you think of him in the way that many on this board seem to - i.e., as a guy who may never be more than a #4 - then it's gonna be really hard to sell that to the fan-base. Maybe McCarron can satisfy the fans as a prospect, because of his freakish size; maybe you can sell that. But man, if Bergevin made the equivalent trade - a 60-point FW for Beaulieu, McCarron and a low first-round pick - would WE be happy? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 52 minutes ago, DON said: Stop that Don you are going to hurt yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 In the three years we were a playoff team Bergevin added Ryder Vanek Petry In addition to depth moves. To say he wont make an impact move and only fiddles at the edges isnt exactly true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illWill Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 55 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: I look at it from a fan/marketing perspective. Duchene is one of the faces of that franchise. Can you really trade him for a so-so roster player (in this case, Beaulieu) who may never become much more than he is right now? If you think N8 has real potential to become a #2 d-man, an impact guy, that's one thing. But if you think of him in the way that many on this board seem to - i.e., as a guy who may never be more than a #4 - then it's gonna be really hard to sell that to the fan-base. Maybe McCarron can satisfy the fans as a prospect, because of his freakish size; maybe you can sell that. But man, if Bergevin made the equivalent trade - a 60-point FW for Beaulieu, McCarron and a low first-round pick - would WE be happy? Of course us Hab fans wouldn't be happy to trade a 60 point player right now because we consider us to be a group of 8-10 teams that have a shot at the cup. It's never a good feeling when your team trades away a high end player, especially for young players that an opposing fan base may not have heard of. The only way to spin that positively is to sell the idea of tearing it down and rebuilding. I can't even tell you who Toronto got for Phil Kessel, but that's how they spun that transaction. I don't recall Leaf fans being all that outraged about the deal because it gave them hope for the future, which at the time was very bleak. Colorado is in a position now where they have missed the playoffs 5 out the last 6 years, so their fan base must be getting frustrated with the current situation, sitting dead last in the league by a mile. I think if they can acquire an NHL ready defenseman, draft a stud with the #1 or #2 pick, plus insert whatever players they get for the players they have available, that will speed up their rebuild significantly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 1 hour ago, Commandant said: In the three years we were a playoff team Bergevin added Ryder Vanek Petry In addition to depth moves. To say he wont make an impact move and only fiddles at the edges isnt exactly true. Yes those were good signings, they may not have worked out the way we wanted but good cheap signings. Mind I was speaking about last year........ Ithink we should go after Brian Boyle, a great big center who can go to the net hard, and wins faceoffs. He should be cheap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDriveFor25 Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 The Habs have the prospects to get Duchene if MB wishes to do so.. Sergy, Juuls, Lindgren .. All nice prospects. Duchene is the exact type of player that Montreal has been missing for years. If you can add him without subtracting much from the team, you give yourself a mighty good chance at the ultimate goal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted February 10, 2017 Author Share Posted February 10, 2017 16 minutes ago, habs rule said: Ithink we should go after Brian Boyle, a great big center who can go to the net hard, and wins faceoffs. He should be cheap I don't think he'll be cheap. Personally, I think he fetches one of the bigger returns of any rental player between now and the deadline. He's showing a nice scoring touch, is good on the draw, can play C or the W, is big, and is cheap. There aren't a lot of top six guys available which will up the price on the higher end bottom six guys like Boyle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted February 10, 2017 Share Posted February 10, 2017 2 hours ago, illWill said: Of course us Hab fans wouldn't be happy to trade a 60 point player right now because we consider us to be a group of 8-10 teams that have a shot at the cup. It's never a good feeling when your team trades away a high end player, especially for young players that an opposing fan base may not have heard of. The only way to spin that positively is to sell the idea of tearing it down and rebuilding. I can't even tell you who Toronto got for Phil Kessel, but that's how they spun that transaction. I don't recall Leaf fans being all that outraged about the deal because it gave them hope for the future, which at the time was very bleak. Colorado is in a position now where they have missed the playoffs 5 out the last 6 years, so their fan base must be getting frustrated with the current situation, sitting dead last in the league by a mile. I think if they can acquire an NHL ready defenseman, draft a stud with the #1 or #2 pick, plus insert whatever players they get for the players they have available, that will speed up their rebuild significantly. I agree, but I have trouble seeing N8, Big Mac and a #22 overall pick which (probabilities suggest) will not amount to anything great as cornerstones of a great rebuild. That trade gives you one useful secondary piece, a probable bottom-6 grinder, and an X-factor. That's why, if I'm Colorado, I ask for Sergachev straight up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Toronto gave up Kessel and Phaneuf for nothing to clear cap space. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huzer Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 19 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: I look at it from a fan/marketing perspective. Duchene is one of the faces of that franchise. Can you really trade him for a so-so roster player (in this case, Beaulieu) who may never become much more than he is right now? Even Avs fans are ready for him to be traded, honestly. People will be more upset about Landeskog being gone. McKinnon, Rantanen, and Zadorov are about all anyone cares about. Duchene seems to get the Plekanec treatment, he gets the rotating cast of wingers, and as such his value is diminished to the casual fan here that thinks he should be able to turn Matt Nieto into a 30/30 guy. I'm overstating just a little, but most people are ready for the team to be blown up. Denver is about to have a year of no playoffs for any of the 4 sports teams, and 3 of the 4 have been nearly dead last in their leagues for a while now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 1 hour ago, huzer said: Even Avs fans are ready for him to be traded, honestly. People will be more upset about Landeskog being gone. McKinnon, Rantanen, and Zadorov are about all anyone cares about. Duchene seems to get the Plekanec treatment, he gets the rotating cast of wingers, and as such his value is diminished to the casual fan here that thinks he should be able to turn Matt Nieto into a 30/30 guy. I'm overstating just a little, but most people are ready for the team to be blown up. Denver is about to have a year of no playoffs for any of the 4 sports teams, and 3 of the 4 have been nearly dead last in their leagues for a while now. So what would seem 'fairest' to you from both sides; Duchene for Beaulieu, Gallagher, 1st Duchene for Gallagher, McCarron, 1st Duchene for Gallagher & Sergachev Duchene for 1st, Sergachev + Desharnais simply for salary Duchene for Beaulieu, 1st, McCarron + Desharnais for salary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 1 hour ago, DON said: So what would seem 'fairest' to you from both sides; Duchene for Beaulieu, Gallagher, 1st Duchene for Gallagher, McCarron, 1st Duchene for Gallagher & Sergachev Duchene for 1st, Sergachev + Desharnais simply for salary Duchene for Beaulieu, 1st, McCarron + Desharnais for salary Realistically #2. I'd hope for #5 #1, 3, 4 are overpayments by Habs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neech Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 12 minutes ago, Commandant said: #1, 3, 4 are overpayments by Habs. How is a pick in the 20's and last year's #9 an overpayment for a first-line center? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 20 minutes ago, Neech said: How is a pick in the 20's and last year's #9 an overpayment for a first-line center? We've been over this... I wouldn't give Sergachev 1 for 1 for a guy who is less than elite talent. Duchene is a 60 point guy, he's not a franchise centre. If I include an elite, blue-chip level prospect in any package, i want more than a 60 point guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huzer Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Duchene is th expendable one since they'll most likely have Tyson Jost in the lineup next year. That said, the team is weak everywhere, and the Kroenkes are basketball fans, and not terribly interested in the hockey team. I'm not sure how meddling Josh Kroenke is when it comes to Sakic's work, though. Their D is pathetic, the wings are equally bad, and they have a tiny bit of center depth. They don't have any G depth, but don't seem to be looking for anything beyond Varly anyway. It'll take some combination of D+W for Duchene. Beaulieu/Emelin + potential top 6 winger Gallagher/Scherbak + pick(s). They are particularly weak on RW, which the Habs aren't very deep at either. I kind of envision a multi-year tank job by the Avs hoping for a few high picks. I don't see a lot of their players being able to be traded for high picks, Landy and Duchene being it, really. They should be able to get 1st rounders back in any deal for them. It doesn't seem like a deep draft, so I'd almost see Sakic deferring to 2018 picks to keep the tank alive next year, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 Also when these types of players get traded (Seguin, Spezza, Kessel, Heatley, etc... etc....) the return is almost always underwhelming. I don't see a lot of teams giving up top 10 picks for them in recent years. Maybe Jeff Carter to Columbus being the only one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 1 hour ago, Commandant said: We've been over this... I wouldn't give Sergachev 1 for 1 for a guy who is less than elite talent. Duchene is a 60 point guy, he's not a franchise centre. If I include an elite, blue-chip level prospect in any package, i want more than a 60 point guy. Would you trade Gally + Sergachev for Duchene and 'pretty good' defensive prospect? I keep toying with this sort of scenario, where we give up Sergachev but get a top-4 D prospect back, and give up a good FW for a higher-scoring one. Seems balanced in principle, but I have no idea if it could actually work, or if Colorado has such a prospect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 I dont think colorado has the prospect to do it. I.also think changing galchenyuk for Duchene is a small upgrade but it doesnt address the true issue of adding another top 6 c Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 9 minutes ago, Commandant said: I dont think colorado has the prospect to do it. I.also think changing galchenyuk for Duchene is a small upgrade but it doesnt address the true issue of adding another top 6 c I meant Gallagher. I don't think Duchesne is a huge upgrade on Galchenyuk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.