Neech Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 I'd love to take a flyer on Kakko as a two-way middle-6 winger. He'll probably never live up to his draft position but it seems like he has a lot of positive qualities that will eventually result in production. Sort of like how Lekhonen seemed snakebitten for years until things came together (obviously I'd hope Kakko would be better offensively than Lekky). Maybe we could get him in exchange for Monahan and a 2nd? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 8 hours ago, Neech said: I'd love to take a flyer on Kakko as a two-way middle-6 winger. He'll probably never live up to his draft position but it seems like he has a lot of positive qualities that will eventually result in production. Sort of like how Lekhonen seemed snakebitten for years until things came together (obviously I'd hope Kakko would be better offensively than Lekky). Maybe we could get him in exchange for Monahan and a 2nd? The Rags boards seem to agree that Kakko is a good player defensively and strong along the boards. This suggests that, although he is a bust relative to his draft position, he can bring value to a team. He has been hampered by injury and failed to find his groove. Then there is the MSL factor. He’s still 22, young enough to benefit from a new environment. I’d consider him good return for a rental like Monahan, but what do I know. Anyway, it won’t happen if Drury is too busy acting like a princess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 10 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: The Rags boards seem to agree that Kakko is a good player defensively and strong along the boards. This suggests that, although he is a bust relative to his draft position, he can bring value to a team. He has been hampered by injury and failed to find his groove. Then there is the MSL factor. He’s still 22, young enough to benefit from a new environment. I’d consider him good return for a rental like Monahan, but what do I know. Anyway, it won’t happen if Drury is too busy acting like a princess. I really have no idea if he is a good fit for us. I am just starting to try and understand what advanced stats mean and how to interpret them but his stats don’t look great to me. He seems to be a player that we already have many of. Perhaps some folks that are smarter than me can add context to his stat card: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 Remember that these are all relative to the rest of the league. So its all percentiles. If you are at 0 you are in the worst players in the league in that category. If you are at 100 you are best in the league at that category (or tied for best) Offence is hurt due to lack of playmaking ability. We are talking Josh Anderson level of passing when he has the puck in the offensive zone. 0% primary assists... thats the problem. A little better passer on the rush. Goal scoring is fine though. Offensively he is better on the rush than in the zone at goals too. Defensively is very good 5v5. Is average on PK, not as good as he is 5v5. Still at 51% so above league average as a pker but nothing special. Is involved in forecheck but doesnt throw hits. Good at getting puck out of his zone with possession, not as good at gaining opposition blue line with possession. Shot is slightly above league average. Doesnt shoot enough though. Skating speed is on the slower end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 For comparison, here is Armia, a player we have now, on a roughly similar contract--and who attracts lots of complaints from the Habs fans. His PK is 59% (I don't know how the percentile is determined for PP and PK since not all players play on special teams). Data is from three years ago, though, I can't find a current one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neech Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 5 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: Anyway, it won’t happen if Drury is too busy acting like a princess. Is it Drury or is it Gorton bringing his personal grudges with him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Minister Koivu Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 1 hour ago, Commandant said: Remember that these are all relative to the rest of the league. So its all percentiles. If you are at 0 you are in the worst players in the league in that category. If you are at 100 you are best in the league at that category (or tied for best) Offence is hurt due to lack of playmaking ability. We are talking Josh Anderson level of passing when he has the puck in the offensive zone. 0% primary assists... thats the problem. A little better passer on the rush. Goal scoring is fine though. Offensively he is better on the rush than in the zone at goals too. Defensively is very good 5v5. Is average on PK, not as good as he is 5v5. Still at 51% so above league average as a pker but nothing special. Is involved in forecheck but doesnt throw hits. Good at getting puck out of his zone with possession, not as good at gaining opposition blue line with possession. Shot is slightly above league average. Doesnt shoot enough though. Skating speed is on the slower end. Thanks for the explanation. As I explore advanced stats I’m amazed at how well they pull a player apart like this. Although the different methods confuse me a bit! Considering that Kakko is in year 5 of his NHL career, I wonder how much room he has to grow? Not sure this is the player that we need. He kind of sounds like a slow Ylonen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 Yeah, if an Armia/Ylonen is all that he is, then forget it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 2 hours ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: Yeah, if an Armia/Ylonen is all that he is, then forget it. I think he's better than Armia, but is he a LOT better? I think Ylonen is/will be better than Armia as well, and he's cheaper--and doesn't cost us any assets. So, it doesn't make a lot of sense to get another player at the Armia/Ylonen level, I think. Or can St-Louis get Kakko to the next level? I'm not sure ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 (edited) So perhaps not finalized ... but FINALIZED it adds value to Monahan if Lindholm is off the market ... **could** add some urgency for teams interested to get a Monahan deal done. Edited February 1 by GHT120 Update Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 So often people say that teams won't trade within a division--and yet, here we are, the two teams are very much in the same division. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 9 minutes ago, tomh009 said: So often people say that teams won't trade within a division--and yet, here we are, the two teams are very much in the same division. In thus day and age, you make the best trade possible ... regardless ... unless perhaps if you are Chris Drury 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 Hunter Brzustewicz Defense -- shoots R -- [19 yrs. old] Height 6.00 -- Weight 188 [183 cm/85 kg] Drafted by Vancouver Canucks - round 3 #75 overall 2023 NHL Entry Draft Points leader amongst OHL defencemen Joni Jurmo Defense -- shoots L -- [21 yrs. old] Height 6.03 -- Weight 207 [191 cm/94 kg] Drafted by Vancouver Canucks - round 3 #82 overall 2020 NHL Entry Draft Andrei Kuzmenko Left Wing -- shoots R -- [27 yrs. old] Height 5.11 -- Weight 194 [180 cm/88 kg] $5.5M AAV through 2024-25 2022-23 Vancouver 81 39 35 74 8 9 2023-24 Vancouver 43 8 13 21 6 -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlbalr Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 32 minutes ago, tomh009 said: So often people say that teams won't trade within a division--and yet, here we are, the two teams are very much in the same division. It's the second one in recent weeks, Zadorov went to Vancouver as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 Was Kuzmenko a salary cap dump because last season was a fluke or did the Flames acquire a real asset ... only time will tell ... Flames may simply be higher on Kuzmenko than were the "Nucks. Hunter Brzustewicz certainly looks like he may be a good RD offensive prospect (albeit not a goal scorer) ... one of our more informed posters may be able to offer insights about Joni Jurmo. With Lindholm off the market, Hughes has more leverage in talks with other teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomh009 Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 Brzustewicz has been outstanding for Kitchener in the OHL this year. With Lindholm off the market ... it may also mean that the trade will happen sooner rather than later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 Maybe good for both teams? Canucks add a Swede, hope he helps them in the playoffs. Need someone to cheer for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurdBurglar Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 About a week ago I saw a report saying Monahan was probably the most desirable center on the market because of his skill mixed with his cap hit. Skill wise Lindholm was the clear front runner, but many contending teams didn’t have cap space for him. Now Lindholm is off the market, especially this early, Monahan should get a nice little value boost. I don’t think a 1st or equivalent is out of the picture for him now. Would be nice to end up with 2 1st, or equivalent, and almost 2 years of service for a cap dump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 1 hour ago, TurdBurglar said: About a week ago I saw a report saying Monahan was probably the most desirable center on the market because of his skill mixed with his cap hit. Skill wise Lindholm was the clear front runner, but many contending teams didn’t have cap space for him. Now Lindholm is off the market, especially this early, Monahan should get a nice little value boost. I don’t think a 1st or equivalent is out of the picture for him now. Would be nice to end up with 2 1st, or equivalent, and almost 2 years of service for a cap dump. I think they can get more than just a first ... but unless the plan is to move the pick(s) obtained for Monahan as part of a deal for a legit Top 6 forward, or a significant move up in the draft, I would prefer a top prospect rather than a pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfredoh2009 Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 Just now, GHT120 said: I think they can get more than just a first ... but unless the plan is to move the pick(s) obtained for Monahan as part of a deal for a legit Top 6 forward, or a significant move up in the draft, I would prefer a top prospect rather than a pick. based on the CGY-VAN trade it should fetch three pieces: a late first, a good prospect (better than Beck ) and a salary cap on an expiring contract Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GHT120 Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 6 minutes ago, alfredoh2009 said: based on the CGY-VAN trade it should fetch three pieces: a late first, a good prospect (better than Beck ) and a salary cap on an expiring contract I would prefer the TOP prospect to the late first and good prospect as teams may now be more desperate with Lindholm off the table ... but time will tell. And only Craig Conroy et al know whether the Flames value Kuzmenko as a legit Top 6 forward or took him because they had to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 I suspect the Habs will be prioritizing a prospect/young player rather than a pick for Monahan. You can't keep rebuilding forever and Suzuki is entering his prime years. Look for an already-marinading prospect or a Newhook type to come back the other way IMHO...someone in the 20-23 age range. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sim.on Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 On 1/31/2024 at 10:16 AM, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: Anyway, it won’t happen if Drury is too busy acting like a princess. What happened between these two? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 Just now, sim.on said: What happened between these two? Didnt see eye to eye, but is likely not huge hurdle and business is business. Is my guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurdBurglar Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 47 minutes ago, The Chicoutimi Cucumber said: I suspect the Habs will be prioritizing a prospect/young player rather than a pick for Monahan. You can't keep rebuilding forever and Suzuki is entering his prime years. Look for an already-marinading prospect or a Newhook type to come back the other way IMHO...someone in the 20-23 age range. I agree. At this point of the rebuild they are looking for players closer to ready or ready to be in the NHL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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