ehjay Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Well, PK had an off-year last season, that's true. He responded to the Slump by trying to do too much and seemed confused at times as the PP point man. I said at the time that I thought the coaches whispering in his ear all the time ('don't do this! Don't do that! Don't follow your instincts!' etc.) seemed to be gumming up his game a bit. That said, the guy is a top-5 defenceman in the NHL, one of the top players of his generation. He is that rarest of players, a guy who can change a game single-handedly. He is also a playoff beast. You only had to listen to the media discussion about him when the trade rumours were flying to see that he is widely viewed as a superstar, not just in Montreal, but all over the league. I've said many times that - notwithstanding his sub-par 2015-16 - in my opinion PK Subban is UNDER-rated. E.g., he gets criticized for 'high risk' plays when in fact these plays are NOT really risky when he's the guy doing them. They're risky plays for Tom Gilbert, not PK Subban. He's been a victim of the constipated, frightened culture of NHL coaching which simply does not know what to do with a special player. (That and subliminal racism, but y'know, you're not allowed to say that, apparently). Anyway, he is now in an environment where the coach understands modern NHL hockey and allows his players to generate offence and be creative. I'll be surprised if he does not absolutely dominate. EDIT: 'he did not let a loss bother him' - oy vey. Yet another example of a guy not playing by the constipated NHL rule-book. :bonk:You mean, he remains up-beat and energetic after a loss??? Better trade him. I love reading your post on Sundays CC, I love 'em!! Preach My brother, Preach!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commandant Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 I love reading your post on Sundays CC, I love 'em!! Preach My brother, Preach!!! i have said many times CC is the smartest guy on this board. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalhabs Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 I am also not so happy about this trade but until I see the Pierre Turgeon for Shayne Corson result I will at least wait until after next season before I start whining every day about it. This is the first thing MB did that I didnt agree at all on but I think we have to wait and see what happens before preaching about inpending doom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 I am also not so happy about this trade but until I see the Pierre Turgeon for Shayne Corson result I will at least wait until after next season before I start whining every day about it. This is the first thing MB did that I didnt agree at all on but I think we have to wait and see what happens before preaching about inpending doom. Wait really? So you agreed with: - Signing Danny Briere - Giving Alex Emelin his contract extension - Trading DSP for Matteau ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalhabs Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Wait really? So you agreed with: - Signing Danny Briere - Giving Alex Emelin his contract extension - Trading DSP for Matteau ? Its not comparable to what previous gms have done. I was more angry about Ellers contract than Emelins at the time because at the time Emelin was playing good until he tried to hit Lucic and got injured. Dsp for Matteau was trading a bottom 6 player for another. Briere... Yes, that is a bad signing but not end of the world bad. And he did do some good trades too. Vanek and Petry is nice and I like the signing of Radulov. The Dale Weise trade was also great when we got him. The two bad things in my opinion is Therrien hired as coach and possibly the Subban trade. Andrew Shaw? Could be a great trade and signing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott462 Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 I honestly hope both Subban and Weber absolutely dominate this year which could very likely happen. I think both players are studs and will make their teams better. I also think subban will be a better player once he matures a little more man I could see him being a big force in the next couple of years. I do worry about the Nashville D in the west though they are going to get banged up real good with Weber gone. Here is hoping that Montreal can get it done this year I'm feeling really optimistic this year and it seems like Price is super happy to have a guy like Weber infront of him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Its not comparable to what previous gms have done. You said the Subban trade was the first thing you didn't agree with. Not Bergevin's good moves vs. bad moves (he's made a lot of good moves) or Bergevin vs. other GMs. Just that this was the first since 2012. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illWill Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Hope Weber can fit right in and I really like the idea of a Weber Carey duo I think they fit better than Carey PK but only time will tell. There definitely is something tantalizing about those two playing together. Don't forget that Weber was logging big minutes in Sochi, tying for second in team scoring in front of Price, who himself put up out of this world numbers. That being said, any compliment towards Weber isn't a slight towards PK. But maybe these two will have better on ice chemistry which will yield better results. Hockey is the ultimate team sport like no other. Sometimes it's not about who has the more talented players, it's about who plays together the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalhabs Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 You said the Subban trade was the first thing you didn't agree with. Not Bergevin's good moves vs. bad moves (he's made a lot of good moves) or Bergevin vs. other GMs. Just that this was the first since 2012. No, I said it was the first thing I didnt agree with AT ALL... That means that its the first trade I really dont like. The other deals and trades are not so horrible at the time they were done. And as I also wrote it is a bit early to totally dismiss it as a total failure like some previous of our gms trades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott462 Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 (edited) Well, PK had an off-year last season, that's true. He responded to the Slump by trying to do too much and seemed confused at times as the PP point man. I said at the time that I thought the coaches whispering in his ear all the time ('don't do this! Don't do that! Don't follow your instincts!' etc.) seemed to be gumming up his game a bit. That said, the guy is a top-5 defenceman in the NHL, one of the top players of his generation. He is that rarest of players, a guy who can change a game single-handedly. He is also a playoff beast. You only had to listen to the media discussion about him when the trade rumours were flying to see that he is widely viewed as a superstar, not just in Montreal, but all over the league. I've said many times that - notwithstanding his sub-par 2015-16 - in my opinion PK Subban is UNDER-rated. E.g., he gets criticized for 'high risk' plays when in fact these plays are NOT really risky when he's the guy doing them. They're risky plays for Tom Gilbert, not PK Subban. He's been a victim of the constipated, frightened culture of NHL coaching which simply does not know what to do with a special player. (That and subliminal racism, but y'know, you're not allowed to say that, apparently). Anyway, he is now in an environment where the coach understands modern NHL hockey and allows his players to generate offence and be creative. I'll be surprised if he does not absolutely dominate. EDIT: 'he did not let a loss bother him' - oy vey. Yet another example of a guy not playing by the constipated NHL rule-book. :bonk:You mean, he remains up-beat and energetic after a loss??? Better trade him. While I agree with most of what you are saying and you obviously have a lot of information regarding PK, I think you are being a little biased towards him. Which is not a problem I too think he is a top D man but has faults just like everyone even Weber who had a terrible game 7. I'm not trying to take a shot at PK here but it seems Weber isn't getting a fair chance around here either. In the end I am a habs fan and Weber is our man now let's get behind him There definitely is something tantalizing about those two playing together. Don't forget that Weber was logging big minutes in Sochi, tying for second in team scoring in front of Price, who himself put up out of this world numbers. That being said, any compliment towards Weber isn't a slight towards PK. But maybe these two will have better on ice chemistry which will yield better results. Hockey is the ultimate team sport like no other. Sometimes it's not about who has the more talented players, it's about who plays together the best. I agree man good points Edited July 10, 2016 by Scott462 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 i have said many times CC is the smartest guy on this board. Hey, thanks, Commandant. I've said the same thing about you many times, so clearly we both have sound judgement :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revvvrob Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Hey, thanks, Commandant. I've said the same thing about you many times, so clearly we both have sound judgement :) I'm thankful for both of you! I don't post that often anymore - but I'm always appreciative of the points you make. Some quality hockey minds here. And while I'm at it - thx dlbalr! I don't want to make a list of all my favorite admins or posters - but you, Brian, represent so much about why I've loved Habsworld since I found it (when Kovalev became a Hab). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Hey, thanks, Commandant. I've said the same thing about you many times, so clearly we both have sound judgement :) awww. might be overlooking that dlbalr fellow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXx..CK..xXx Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 I wasn't the hugest fan of the interview with Bergevin. Caught myself questioning a few answers... Especially the emulating the Chicago model section. I get the reason but I didn't like the transparency there for a few reasons. PK Subban CAN be a high risk player. I don't get how people can claim he's not. Isn't that part of the very reason people like him? He's not that robot who creates the orthodox, robotic play again and again? Did Kovalev not make a high risk play when he was the last one back in overtime against Glen Murray? I don't think stating that Subban is a high risk player necessarily has to have a negative connotation attached to it. Sometimes he'll skate circles around the opposing team in the offensive zone and score a goal all on his own and other times he will attempt a spin-o-rama as the last one back which gets turned over and in turn ends up in the back of our net. How that wouldn't be considered a high risk play is beyond me. Is the argument that he does high risk plays but is not a high risk player due to his skill? Seems like a reach when they once again end up in the back of your net from time to time. I understand that other players perhaps turn the puck over even when they do the conventionally correct play but that's besides the point here. Negative, positive or neutral how is Subban not high risk? I will agree that as a rookie, Subban managed to make up for his mistakes with youthful energy and blistering speed. While he is still quick, he's either decided to conserve energy due to higher minutes, or he's simply lost a step over the years and often doesn't make up for his mistakes as well as he used to. I hear that Weber is declining because of a terrible game 7 in the Conference Final and Subban simply had an off year in 2015-2016 which he will automatically bounce back from with a 70 point season in Nashville. When you have Subban and a wide open defensive partner at the offensive blue line, I guarantee that there is a larger chance of a "high risk" play than when you have Weber in the same situation. For better or for worse? Up for debate. Less risk and a different culture? Without a doubt. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Also; 4th in PP toi, 62shots on the pp, 2ppg for the ex-hab 17th in PP toi, 54shots on the pp 14ppg for the new hab, should be a nice improvement and for sure will make Muller's job a bit easier to get all the PP guys on the same page. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stogey24 Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 awww. might be overlooking that dlbalr fellow Amen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chicoutimi Cucumber Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 Amen True dat - Brian is the glue that holds this whole thing together IMHO. The indispensable man. Anyone remember Wamsley01? I still mourn his departure from this board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machine of Loving Grace Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 @pucksnlife #Habs Molson: "When Marc said he wasn't shopping Subban, it was the truth. But a Shea Weber is a once in a lifetime opportunity." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCHabnut Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 Wamsley was a great poster. I've seen a few of his articles on sports net over the years. But I've also seen Berkshire, so maybe that isnt saying much. Haha. I like to read and argue with people who bring new viewpoints and make you reconsider your old assumptions. It's what makes you a more educated person. This oard has been good for that over the years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott462 Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 Wamsley was a great poster. I've seen a few of his articles on sports net over the years. But I've also seen Berkshire, so maybe that isnt saying much. Haha. I like to read and argue with people who bring new viewpoints and make you reconsider your old assumptions. It's what makes you a more educated person. This oard has been good for that over the years. ? I'm a new poster but a long time reader of these forums and I have found it to be a pretty insightful and educational. Not to mention a pretty respectful community which is pretty hard to find nowadays. I decided to bite the bullet and become a member 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meller93 Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 Forum love <3 Lol ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DON Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 I'm a new poster but a long time reader of these forums and I have found it to be a pretty insightful and educational. Not to mention a pretty respectful community which is pretty hard to find nowadays. I decided to bite the bullet and become a member Welcome, next 6 weeks will likely be relatively quiet here...barring more trades. But of course more people to 'debate' or express opinions is always welcome. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meller93 Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 Welcome, next 6 weeks will likely be relatively quiet here...barring more trades. But of course more people to 'debate' or express opinions is always welcome. Cheers Aw come on, no more stirring the pot from you? Hahah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott462 Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 Gotta love the debates around here and I can't wait for September looking forward to see what this club can do. Thanks Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habs rule Posted July 11, 2016 Share Posted July 11, 2016 DON: loves to stir the pot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.